Poll

Who played the best mafia?

Submachine
1 (3%)
worldwideweb3
1 (3%)
PlayerOa
1 (3%)
serprex
2 (6.1%)
MasterNoob
9 (27.3%)
kaempfer13
8 (24.2%)
Pokechu
2 (6.1%)
andretimpa
0 (0%)
Naii_the_Baf
1 (3%)
rob77dp
3 (9.1%)
killsdazombies
1 (3%)
TheonlyrealBeef
0 (0%)
shockcannon
2 (6.1%)
skyironsword
2 (6.1%)

Total Members Voted: 14

Voting closed: August 12, 2021, 05:20:11 pm

*Author

Offline skyironsword

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306911#msg1306911
« Reply #1656 on: August 03, 2021, 06:00:59 pm »
I was going to give w3 the benefit of the doubt and wait for Link to tell him that he can't do that, but I suppose the cat's out of the bag now.

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306912#msg1306912
« Reply #1657 on: August 03, 2021, 06:05:17 pm »
I wonder if Link wouldnt tell him and just say the ability failed...

Yo sky if that was the case, you would've tricked w3 into failing a doc on conf!rob
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Offline skyironsword

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306913#msg1306913
« Reply #1658 on: August 03, 2021, 06:13:14 pm »
I wonder if Link wouldnt tell him and just say the ability failed...

Yo sky if that was the case, you would've tricked w3 into failing a doc on conf!rob
Don't worry, the host said he'd tell players if their night action is invalid.

Offline skyironsword

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306914#msg1306914
« Reply #1659 on: August 03, 2021, 08:07:47 pm »
As promised.

Spoiler for Kae Analysis:
Oozora Subaru
Good Cop Bad Cop (Passive) - If both effects of Oozora Police are applied to the same target, the player who applied the first effect learns who they targeted this Night.
Honestly i dont understand this one at all. if oozaro police crossfires the target shouldnt be able to use secondaries, right? So does Oozora learn who crossfired out of the family that can already communicate directly or does this one show who the target attempted to target (since the target that was crossfired already has secondaries disabled).

Uruha Rushia
Necromancy (1U) - Target a dead player, raise them as a zombie of your alignment. There is a public notification revealing which player is revived, and they do not count for parity. They may not talk in the thread or a pad and you control their ability uses. If you die, they die as well. Any changes to their abilities while they were alive still apply, including # of uses remaining.
Can the zombie be interacted with directly? (e.g. changing their ability, investigating, vigging)
Early in the game, kae asks about his own role and a few others, including w3's role but not mine or KDZ's. This isn't a strong indicator, however.

n+
skyironsword - claiming mafia never fails to irritate me, but the people that do that, do that whenever they feel like it. NAI. Who's Sera?
Anyway the n0 stuff is mostly reading into the hosts posts as if he were confirmed mafia and criticicing me for caring about mechanics (it's a common argument i hear on various mafiapads, but it simply doesn't apply to me, i always want to get the mechanics right (and I also got the vibe that she cares about mechanics too, just doesn't want to discuss them in public)).
Hm, come to think of it using angleshooting (like interpreting the hosts posts or monitoring peoples activity) is usually done by town looking for easier ways to solve the game. Let's give both Sub and sky a bump up.
The rest is sky calling out TorB on his lack of reasoning, which i feel is justified (i had the same questions), only backpaddling when TorB seemed to threaten to claim (which is unnecessary at this stage).

n (in no particular order)
w3 - shitposts and massclaim and no lynch, which I really hope are also shitposts

kdz- shitposts and discussing how to deal with inactives. I dont think I can form a read out of this.
I've cropped out everything from kae's Day 1 readlist except for myself and the mafia. To be fair, w3 and kdz were mostly coasting, so there's not much there. He does have a lot to say about my Night 0 behavior, though. Keep in mind that he pegged me at n+ here.

if info is what you want wouldn't torb be the best lynch? Not a fan of infolynches myself, though i dont really have a good lynch idea myself.
EBWOP: isnt that scenario kind of assuming TorB/serp are w/w, if Sub is town? Actually im not following the logic much at all. essentially what you're saying is any hardcore push this early involves at least 1 town, since bussing isnt very good early.
But why though? Also if its just one of them no way its serp, since TorB rushed to help him out.
Honestly, I'm currently debating whether you suggested that supposed infolynch because you could count on at least 2 people joining that wagon.
otherwise the vote I would be most ok with would be w3. He's in my n reads and him being concerned about whether people would know about targeting rubbed me a bit the wrong way (like he wants to be sneaky about sth). Then again he's right that he could just ask his scummates if applicable.
After recent games I'm also not so sure whether he actually does pick up the pace eventually, so he's probably not a big loss at least.
Kae was very opposed to my hard push for Sub, then accuses me of suspicious behavior, but he says he'd prefer a vote on w3. This is probably the weirdest thing kae's done up to this point.

No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
TheonlyrealBeef (1) - MasterNoob
serprex (1) - andretimpa
Submachine (3) - skyironsword, serprex, TheonlyrealBeef
worldwideweb3 (1) kaempfer13
may as well make it an actual vote
Puts his vote on w3. Note that there isn't much of a chance that w3 is actually voted off at this point.

No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
TheonlyrealBeef (1) - MasterNoob
Submachine (3) - serprex, TheonlyrealBeef, adrenatimpa
worldwideweb3 (2) - kaempfer13, skyironsword
shockcannon (1) - worldwideweb3
skyironsword (1) - Submachine
and here i was about to say that w3 cant be scum, if noone jumped to sub by now
Now that there's a little pressure on w3, he suddenly jumps to w3's defense.

Looks like I'll be forced to switch to Oa if the alternative is no lynch though.
For reference, at this point, serprex has moved his vote, leaving w3 as part of a tie. Kae makes no effort to convince people to vote for w3, despite saying it's the lynch he'd most prefer.

I guess votes should have been called when the 7 minutes timer ran out. This shouldnt influence our thinking about the game though. actually can people stop trying to read into Linkcat. The person that believed the most firmly she could rule of 3 his shitpost is the only one we can't tell with confidence is town.

Safe to say that shock and sky are not w/w, but we already knew that. He's right though, i should have noticed that sky is looking for an easy kill. This is a point actually worth looking at.

True about kdz, dont really remember anything there. This does seem like her usual playstyle though.
So speaking of sky, i still don't understand what the Sublynch achieved. As it stands, it looks to me like she just sheeped 2 townies, first under the pretense of an infolynch regarding TorB/serps alignement, which should have been out of the question before EoD and later as just "it makes sense to me".
I spend a good portion of an hour trying to figure out what even the logic behind her switch from "Sub probably town, but good infolynch" to "2 town who couldn't possibly have any information on Sub vote him, so Sub scum" was. But I could find absolutely no explanation.
Now she's looking to either get  aqua to kill shock or allow herself or any of her buddies to do so without having to explain themselves.
Trimmed everything not about myself or the mafia. (Kae actually went on for a few more posts, but I've cut them for the sake of brevity.) Here, kae tries to pin some more blame on me. Combined with the earlier messages, I'd say there's a pretty convincing argument that kae was the one looking for an easy mislynch. This is too much of a hard push to be scum distancing.

There is a demoralizing amount of greens voted on early, so before w3 train scum couldn't even possibly have felt threatened.  Given that Oa was ready to do w3 in I think at most 1 of them is scum, too. Submachine removed his vote too early to really pressure w3 enough for potential scumbuddies to feel the need to jump in, given that w3 hadn't even selfpressed yet. I'd still have a look at timpa if w3 flipped red.
Oa also never quite got out the "just selfpres and you'll be good"-zone either, so can't read too much into that either.
If it was town trains all the way through though ,we should look at the people that sat by idly or put one vote and left it at that (I'm aware of the irony).
Now here's some proper scum distancing. Kae never brings up the fact that he cheekily removed his own vote on w3.

Those near the end tallies give me a first impression vibe of sky\oa saving oa voting sub... www3 as only other viable train option at eod being avoided as www3 scum. But that's only a hot take from me who wasn't at eod and only read thread once  ;D
god damn you ninja sky
No Lynch (1) - shockcannon
TheonlyrealBeef (1) - MasterNoob
serprex (1) - andretimpa
Submachine (2) - serprex, TheonlyrealBeef
worldwideweb3 (4) - kaempfer13, Submachine, skyironsword, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - worldwideweb3
preceeded by a double bus? At first I was like that's absurd, but if w3 said in scumchat "its okay to bus me" and both sky and Oa immediately thought "dont mind if I do" that world actually makes sense.
w3 comes under fire (from rob, no less) and for the first time, we see a theoretical team from kae: w3/sky/Oa. We know Oa is town.

This is actually pretty much what I said in the voteanalysis. I've recovered from seeing you and Oa as w/w with sky as final partner, that wasnt my brightest moment. The other point (not quoted) is nonsense though going by the most recent game.
Backpedals hard just a few hours later, when he realizes a w3 lynch could actually happen. Despite tunneling me the whole time, there is no town support for lynching me, so he caves.

If timpa flipped town I'm actually inclined to think that w3 is town too, since conf!town is trying to vote timpa out and barely succeeding. And w/w trains sound too good to be true with how the game has been going so far.
Speaks for itself. Continues the trend of defending w3 despite w3 apparently being his top lynch the day prior. I just don't see him doing this if w3 is town.

I could see sky, Oa, kdz tbh. But I am nowhere near the teambuilding stage myself.
A new team. Still has myself/Oa, but now includes the other mafia member. This might be WIFOM, but would kae really include the entire mafia team in his theoretical team?

So day1 made w3/OA w/w unlikely and in case of w3 town points to OA and kdz due to relative apathy in face of all town trains.
I'm singling out w3 a bit here, since he's the unflipped one that was in the greatest danger yet on both days.

So wagonomics-wise it looks like kdz is a strong candidate for any team I'm considering, poke fits in any team also by sheer lack of associations and MW didnt strike me as suspicious at all.
Its unfortunate that it looks like at most 1 scum was ever in danger at all, makes it a bit hard to evaluate competing wagons and thus wagonomics help less overall than they usually would.
If no vig on mw then block oa & trident w3 & vote Oa if w3 town
That would lose in case rushia is scum and w3 town. then again scum having 2 vigs seems a bit much and Oa's scumequity goes way up if w3 town.
Continues to defend w3, this time by thinking of scenarios where using a vig on w3 doesn't work out. Kae never comes to my defense, by the way. Feel free to check.

So if we are gonna shoot, which I mostly prefer, out of the options given i would prefer OA over w3  and kdz out of kdz/poke.
Defends w3 and lightly busses KDZ. When KDZ is actually shot, kae doesn't react at all. Rob points out that w3's reaction to KDZ's death was lukewarm at best.

After this, Poke is lynched and kae largely falls silent, opting to avoid spewing rather than defending himself.

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306915#msg1306915
« Reply #1660 on: August 03, 2021, 10:21:41 pm »
So sky, you're conclusion is #Ishould'veShot'em, basically?

www3 what's your case? And did you ever REALLY angel anybody?

If it's www3 then timpa had 2\3 of the team in his for suspects upon his D2 lynch  :o

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Offline worldwideweb3

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306916#msg1306916
« Reply #1661 on: August 03, 2021, 10:25:12 pm »
Nurse's Touch (ER) - Target another player, the first time they would die this Night, they live instead. If they have an ability that was changed or disabled, restore the original ability. You can't target yourself or the same player twice in a row.

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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306917#msg1306917
« Reply #1662 on: August 03, 2021, 10:27:20 pm »
So sky, you're conclusion is #Ishould'veShot'em, basically?

www3 what's your case? And did you ever REALLY angel anybody?

If it's www3 then timpa had 2\3 of the team in his for suspects upon his D2 lynch  :o

(I'm Still not on computer until later today though)

is angel doc? i was only able to use it last night and that was on you
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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306918#msg1306918
« Reply #1663 on: August 03, 2021, 10:38:10 pm »
ok the amount of biasness in skys post is unreal. Ofc he wanted Oa dead over me, Oa was the town vig and could kill. Also, he picked kdz over poke, his mafia buddy so thats not indicative of anything. He tried to play a very town game throughout. if you know kae, you know he wouldnt go around defending his mafia team this much. Go ISO kdz who kept saying he thinks im scum and he votes me at crucial stage and all, idk how that keeps being ignored. Sky literally did nothing this game except make town vig other town. Not to mention, shared no info from her role at any stage, no breadcrumbs, nothing. There is nothing Ive done that makes me scummy. I asked for vig holster in early phases when we had next to no info as that leads to town death - and I was right. I basically told andre my role with the question post earlier. I was not hesitant to vote off kae, I targetted kdz with no cheating (tho I admit theres no way you can know that for sure as Oa did too).

I will go back and read up sky and his mafia buddys posts again if I can find some time.

"That would lose in case rushia is scum and w3 town. then again scum having 2 vigs seems a bit much and Oa's scumequity goes way up if w3 town."

Idk how thats in my defence, hes calling rushia possible scum, I am the freaking rushia.

Can we ask for an extension to this phase, seeing as rob will most likely die now and I would rather rob have the time to look over everything before dying. Idk why phase was reduced to 24 hours anyways at such a crucial stage.
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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306919#msg1306919
« Reply #1664 on: August 03, 2021, 10:38:54 pm »
24 hour extention (1) - www3
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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306920#msg1306920
« Reply #1665 on: August 03, 2021, 10:41:29 pm »
Rob, anything useful you can tell us before you get NK'd? I assume you'd like us to lynch w3 tomorrow if you die tonight.

kept on pushing my lynch even tho kae mEcHaNiCaLlY CoNfIrMeD
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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306921#msg1306921
« Reply #1666 on: August 03, 2021, 10:48:45 pm »
Are we assuming Subaru RBs Oa?

Wanted to give kae a reason to RB Oa so he didnt kill kdz...
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Re: Elements Mafia 77 - by Linkcat https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=68254.msg1306922#msg1306922
« Reply #1667 on: August 03, 2021, 10:48:59 pm »
I feel like NK on serprex suggests that Gura is mafia. Thoughts?

Ofc pushing a poke lynch from the outset
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blarg: