Elements Mafia 76 - by serprex

[iancudorinmarian]

we could probably expect Espi to join the next one

Too busy being popular and famous
sorry pup

Also people who dont post (anything usefull) are kind of a -2 (if town) for town, since often a lynch has to be wasted on them, leading to another nk. Subbing in espi makes up for one noposter, but people like ian pretty much require an inforole to contribute.
Obv we are a casual community when it comes to mafia, so just banning people that often dont end up contributing is not the way to go. But maybe we can somehow adjust the rules such that its easier to contribute when you have no clue how the game works and that somehow make it easier to deal with inactives (dedicated subslots or faster modkills are the usual solutions, but necessarily make the player pool smaller).
Most mafias are daystart btw to circumvent the "killed before you could do anything"-problem, but we need the nightstart since here many people dont know to do anything at all until there are some hard facts.
Also it seems like even in the games that do get solved all the action comes lategame. It is kind of an inherent problem to mafia, but i think in this community its much more pronounced than in others. Perhaps its because it takes longer here for the average player to post enough to be evaluated fairly.

Yup
It's why I don't join these mafias
I did come up with a ruleset ages ago that fixed the problem by having people vote for a small change to the rules each day, in addition to who should be lynched. If done well it would get people talking, but I've lost that ruleset ages ago.

You know, maybe we could just play for fun instead of going for professional mafia rules on a dead forum.

[serprex]

Rules or something would be a bit much. But it isn't fun to try play a social deduction game where inactivity is an accepted meta. People get by barely voting

Voting is only one name of information: who you agree is scummiest (notice this is not who you think is scummiest)

If people could give one read list per day phase, it'd greatly improve the overall experience. It doesn't need to be a good read list, it just needs to be a "here are 1-2 people I think are townish, here are 1-2 people I'm unsure about, & wow talk about PlayerScuma amirite"

Personally I'm not a fan of the free for all discussion format. But it's the best one can do with the asynchronous forum medium. Best format I've played was 10 people sitting in a circle with one minute to have their say per day, everyone arguing in sign language. Alas, I moved away from Vancouver

Maybe some crazy idea where you gut posting to this thread, instead people PM the host their reads list & lynch vote, then host posts everyone's messages, then after 2-3 rounds of that (24 hours per round) the vote is final. Maybe round 1 is message & nominations, round 2 is message & vote. Proceed to nightphase where people send in actions & may discuss freely. It sounds pretty amusing having dayphase be when everyone has to be quiet. It'd also deal with players being demotivated to participate because "I don't feel like thoroughly reading 15 pages of Linkcat & kaempfer memeing"

Alternatively avoid modkill rules by allowing players to self police by having some mechanism allowing multiple lynch targets per day, such as ties lynching both

[MasterWalks]

I agree with everything listed, although I doubt having us PM votes and read lists will improve player engagement. The people who were not engaged this game were the people that have a history of it aside from maybe Root. Annele has never been a big poster, and Mathman is afk incarnate. Iancu was literally acting like the same iancu I've always seen, just maybe less shitposts. It's always the same people who engage the most, Link, Kae, Myself, Shock, and Torb. Link, Kae and Torb always die to mafia when they aren't mafia, and shock is killed due to him being shock. I'm never killed cuz I'm bad. The games have become predictable in a sense. If you wanna mix it up, have everyone create new Forum accounts with new unrelated names. I believe this will improve engagement. Now Annele could be super active without having to worry about "acting differently". I bet we would see an entirely new shock too.

[DoubleCapitals]

(...)

I did come up with a ruleset ages ago that fixed the problem by having people vote for a small change to the rules each day, in addition to who should be lynched. If done well it would get people talking, but I've lost that ruleset ages ago.

Would sound fun for a forum game in general, if not mafia

Honestly, I'm all for turning this forum into Mafia forum. The EtG game gives us a great backdrop for roles, lore, etc. Seeing as we got 13 this time, and we could probably expect Espi to join the next one, and maybe submachine and DC too, we could increase the number of players. If we held consistent Mafia games, I'm sure we would have regulars again. Now, I'm not saying to start the next mafia now, but how about not waiting an entire year to start it?

Eh, it's been too stressful for my liking these days, I saw this and kept tabs on the game but I don't think I'd have made the game much better by bein' around, sorry xD I'd personally pop in for other things maybe

[Annele]

I've been a low poster in the past because I always felt I needed to have something substantial to say that takes into account absolutely everything said previously if I'm going to say anything at all. (Also my first game I was mafia and was very paranoid about saying anything that would seem scummy.) I tried to work on that this time and post anyway, even if it only referenced something small and trying not to be too pedantic about what I said. I still feel I don't know enough about the meta to have much to add aside from trying to read people, but I will keep pushing myself to post more if we do play again.

I like the idea of having a night phase with no nk so we have a chance to use abilities and get info to discuss for d1.

[DoubleCapitals]

stuff

EBWOP where's Link gonna do his cast?

[serprex]

stuff

EBWOP where's Link gonna do his cast?

[Linkcat]

What I said about Annele was true, she played well on Day 3, so I believe that irl is what caused her to be inactive earlier. Being Graboid didn't help either. I'm considering removing the role because it reduces voting. Given this I have no big problems with her play this game. Root was less active than usual, but the only things he really lacked in were being gone D3 which was due to irl, and lack of contribution to the POE, which I believe was due to the very low amount of role interactions this game which is where his deductive strengths lie. Other than that he was passable. We had 7 active players, and 3 people who only have low post counts because they died early. There were only 2 people actually inactive the whole game. Mathman in recent years has been the most inactive player, I think he is overly optimistic about how much time he can put into things given his work situation. Not sure what can/should be done about this. Iancu has always been on the less active side, but this is the most inactive he's ever been. Never used his ability, never placed a real vote, never gave an actual read as far as I can tell. There's a difference between playing for fun and not playing at all. As serp said, everyone just giving a few reads and voting on one of them every day is enough.

One of the main problems here is that inactives have a much greater effect on a smaller game. With 18 players having a few inactive people isn't much of a problem because there will still be plenty of discussion, and by late game even those players will have developed to a readable point. This game, with math/iancu/Annele we had 3/12 for 25% inactive on D1, 3/10 for 30% D2, and iancu/Root were 2/8 for 25% on D3. It's unfortunate that the game only lasted 3 days, 13 players was a really awkward number.

I support no kill on N0, which probably would have extended this game by a day. It's possible to create roles that help with inactivity, and running the same setup for the fifth time wasn't helping because there's nothing to talk about regarding strategy.

[Espithel]

forced a no-lynch while he was trying to kill everyone as scum and got rewarded for it

lol

Don't know why that posted I didn't even press the enter key

You're trying to inflate your post count, I see right through you.

Remind me what game that was so I can delete the relevant posts.

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-72-by-ginyu/msg1291910/#msg1291910

[Espithel]

No lynching was actually correct that game tho

[worldwideweb3]

Guys don’t forget to vote (for me)! 

[Linkcat]

forced a no-lynch while he was trying to kill everyone as scum and got rewarded for it

lol

Don't know why that posted I didn't even press the enter key

You're trying to inflate your post count, I see right through you.

Remind me what game that was so I can delete the relevant posts.

http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-72-by-ginyu/msg1291910/#msg1291910

I was town, asleep at EoD, and the only one voting on a mafia. Either you have the wrong game or you're remembering it very incorrectly.