Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword

[Coffeeditto]

If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads” clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.

I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).

[andretimpa]

Didn't had time to post reads earlier, but here they are

Spoiler for Torb (v):

Only weird move I saw here was him moving his vote from ian to w3, right after ian's targets were revealed

But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...

Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?

No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?

And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.

For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB

o.O

iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13

That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again

still looks pretty minor to me, so I won't change my classification

Spoiler for Oa (v):

I see no reason to change Oa's read. He is as close as mechanicaly confirmed as we have

Spoiler for ian (n) UPDATED from n-:

The update is mostly due to mulling over his claim a bit. On one hand there are better things to claim than Red thread of Fate, on the other hand no repeating roles + the lynch all liars policy could make a counterclaim likely, even if not during EOD. Overall it seems more town than scum looking in retrospect (or so does my gut say )

Adding up on that, we can test ian's loyalty with Coffee, so I don't see a reason to push harder here

Also, this is a good point, even tho it was brought up after EOD

Could we use ian's ability to help control Coffee? If this is not a dumb idea I'd be willing to move my vote from him.

Sure, let mafia know ian is going to use his ability on Coffee and his next target.

Spoiler for w3 (n):

During EOD, he stayed for quite a bit on kdz, before starting the Naii train and staying there until EOD. He also suggests going for DC or Cal. Not 100% sure how to read this (self preservation again, like in EOD1?)

iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (1) - Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (4) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef, rob77dp
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (4) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13

Naiis vote on me is the only one i feel sketchy on my wagon. Cal and DC are other good targets imo.

Spoiler for MW (n-) UPDATED from n:

Low content on posts deserves a scum bump at this point, imo. Also, this post

I'm left to continue talking to myself for a bit longer before I have to leave again - luck you!

MW - what is this? You're scumreading me because Link was the NK?? That doesn't compute (trying to avoid WIFOM scenarios here, but eh)... you have no other stronger scumleans or suspiciouns at this point now that shock is dead whom you say you scumread for redirecting kae on N0 as now-flipped-town!Rita-shock? Then you don't really want to lynch either of moe or myself, your top two scumreads... What gives? Seems quite shaky to me... but it is certainly appreciated (or more) that you're putting things out there [alignment TBD].

You engaging in this much conversation is making me townlean you now. I do still feel iffy about you and the link NK but your engagement outweighs that.

That's got to be one of the worse reasons to tr rob, he always engages in conversation. Are you trying to deflect rob's scumlean on you with this?

Spoiler for kae (n):

imo the most relevant thing about kae so far is his read on DC (based on wagonomics)

Reminder that i still think day1 wagonomics make dc town

iancudorinmarian (2) - andretimpa, killsdazombies
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf
Naii_the_Baf (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (5) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi, kaempfer13, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (3) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto, TheonlyrealBeef

I didn't lynch voted shock last time to save DC, I lynch voted shock to prevent no lynch. So there we go, no issue with me.

In fact noone voted with intent to save dc

which will be interesting if we lynch DC, but so far just paints a correlation between the two for me.

During EOD he was on the MW wagon, then jumped to Naii

Spoiler for Sub (?):

AWOL, will get modkilled if this doesn't change

Spoiler for kdz (n-) UPDATED from n:

Putting him on n- until he cuts down on the breadposting

Spoiler for Coffee (n) UPDATED from v:

The whole Cecilia thing rubbed me a bit the wrong way. After thinking about it for a bit I still think he's more likely town than scum. Basicaly, the rest of his game makes little sense if this was a scum premeditated move. Why bother building town cred when that is known to be different than your usual play style, if you are just planning on doing something like this? Coffee could have just coasted, killed dawn and forced Emma to spend the ability to find him (unless he thought dawn would reveal him if he was just coasting).

Anyway, I'd be a bit cautious about him, until we get more information.

Spoiler for rob (n):

I don't see anything out of the ordinary here, rob being inquisitive and pushing his scumreads is his regular play (NAI) and there is no reason from mechanics to scumread him so far

Spoiler for DC (n):

I agree with kae here that EOD1 makes him look more towny, but I'd really want more content besides bread, before giving him a town bump

Spoiler for Cal (n-) UPDATED from n:

His lack of posting makes i difficult to get any read. I think this deserves a scum bump at this point of the game

Spoiler for moe (n+):

I'm liking his posts so far. They are a bit hard to follow, but still show his thought process

Wasn't again around for EOD.

TL;DR

town bumps: ian
scum bumps: MW, kdz, Coffee, Cal

[killsdazombies]

I'll never cut down on my bread posting. Sorry, hope you arent gluten intolerant.

[Coffeeditto]

I'll never cut down on my bread posting. Sorry, hope you arent gluten intolerant.

andre has hashimoto's disease and can't get this bread

[killsdazombies]

More for the rest of us then.

[TheonlyrealBeef]

Only weird move I saw here was him moving his vote from ian to w3, right after ian's targets were revealed

But then we would still not know whether ian actually used his ability, hrmmm...

Oh, I know! Couldn't Lieserl Einstein target ian while he uses his ability on two targets that are not himself?

No, because what if he just doesn’t use his ability?

And there comes the Coffee ninja post while I realize this.
And Frederica Tesla is moot in case he uses a Honkai Core instead.

For reference, I used by ability N1 on w3 and TorB

o.O

iancudorinmarian (3) - andretimpa, killsdazombies, PlayerOa
DoubleCapitals (2) - rob77dp, Coffeeditto
rob77dp (1) - MasterWalks
worldwideweb3 (2) - iancudorinmarian, Naii_the_Baf, TheonlyrealBeef
killsdazombies (1) - worldwideweb3
MasterWalks (3) - Calindu, DoubleCapitals, moehrpi
Submachine (1) - kaempfer13

That sounds better, now I'll let someone break ties again

Despite having read all the roles, I initially forgot scum Kallen cannot even target two people that are not themselves during the ian interrogation. Then I was like, why are you dragging me down along with a possible vig on w3? But if it's to down a scum-read along with a town-read, it's a good pro town story.

I guess it's a story mafia can make up when they have the Kallen role, but it felt legit at the time of posting, bumping my read on ian back to n, making me switch to a different n-.

[kaempfer13]

Oops I procrastinated so much I may as well wait for the flip till I post lynchlog

[rob77dp]

I mean, it reads almost like you already have it ready... if so why not post it?

Oops I procrastinated so much I may as well wait for the flip till I post lynchlog

[Coffeeditto]

If you have any decent scum reads, feel free to share. We’ve lost 4 towns so far, 5 after the night most likely. Our “scum reads” clearly haven’t been successful so far, and I do not want to put a kill in coffees hands at this stage, on a person that we are not sure if mafia or not.

I sort of agree for a roundabout reason: I don't want to put the capacity for a redirect off of an agreed Cecilia target into a mafia!raiden's hands if it does exist. In that same vein, like I mentioned earlier but we all missed because it was EoD madness, sky has pretty much confirmed that if a maf!Kallan exists (as ian) and raiden drives away from him the night we want to 'mechanically confirm' ian as town, it would show as ian not targetting himself and thus appear he is town. I'm still not sure what we all want to do, in this case. I think it would be better not to try and use both ian and I's abilities for some roundabout confirming stuff because there's too much potential for things to head south (worst case scenario is losing 2 town and not confirming anything other than possibly maf!raiden or ian town kind of).

okay we're like 2 hours out can anyone give any opinion

[kaempfer13]

lynchlog is not finished

I think Kallan and cecilia should use their abilities independently for now, as torb is right if we ever confirm or mostly confirm ian this way he's just getting nked anyway+ if we ever get a decent poe that combo can be put to good use then

[kaempfer13]

both abilities should be used whenever possible imo

[Coffeeditto]

both abilities should be used whenever possible imo

i disagree with mine being used whenever possible now because of the ability to drive me into any outed targets or for maf to drive me away from a 2nd hit on them but i agree that ian's has minor drawback as if he is maf he dies and if he is not we have the chance of hitting a maf (or 2 with my vig hit) anyway