Poll

Please check all hours that would work for you as the deadline for each phase.

0 GMT
8 (5.7%)
1 GMT
7 (5%)
2 GMT
7 (5%)
3 GMT
7 (5%)
4 GMT
7 (5%)
5 GMT
4 (2.8%)
6 GMT
4 (2.8%)
7 GMT
4 (2.8%)
8 GMT
4 (2.8%)
9 GMT
5 (3.5%)
10 GMT
5 (3.5%)
11 GMT
4 (2.8%)
12 GMT
3 (2.1%)
13 GMT
2 (1.4%)
14 GMT
3 (2.1%)
15 GMT
4 (2.8%)
16 GMT
3 (2.1%)
17 GMT
5 (3.5%)
18 GMT
9 (6.4%)
19 GMT
9 (6.4%)
20 GMT
11 (7.8%)
21 GMT
9 (6.4%)
22 GMT
9 (6.4%)
23 GMT
8 (5.7%)

Total Members Voted: 16

Voting closed: August 09, 2020, 10:29:25 pm

Poll

What kind of setup do you want to see next?

Run the standard setup with minor adjustments.
7 (26.9%)
Run a closed setup designed by Linkcat.
8 (30.8%)
Run a game with all Fate Eggs.
7 (26.9%)
Run an even sillier game just to mess around.
4 (15.4%)

Total Members Voted: 13

Voting closed: August 09, 2020, 10:47:45 pm

Poll

What to do about Who's Online?

Allow free use of it.
9 (52.9%)
Ban use of it during the last couple hours of each phase.
3 (17.6%)
Ban use of it completely.
5 (29.4%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 09, 2020, 11:26:23 pm

Poll

Who played the best mafia?

Linkcat
1 (2.5%)
TheonlyrealBeef
16 (40%)
shockcannon
0 (0%)
PlayerOa
1 (2.5%)
iancudorinmarian
0 (0%)
worldwideweb3
1 (2.5%)
MasterWalks
0 (0%)
andretimpa
0 (0%)
dawn_to_dusk
0 (0%)
kaempfer13
6 (15%)
Submachine
0 (0%)
killsdazombies
0 (0%)
Coffeeditto
7 (17.5%)
rob77dp
3 (7.5%)
DoubleCapitals
1 (2.5%)
Calindu
0 (0%)
Naii_the_Baf
0 (0%)
moehrpi13
4 (10%)

Total Members Voted: 18

Voting closed: August 09, 2020, 10:51:45 pm

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Offline kaempfer13

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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299821#msg1299821
« Reply #276 on: July 09, 2020, 09:37:57 am »
Well shock is obviously bad at the game, which makes him a good policy lynch and i would vote him over dawn obviously (with the information i have at the time), but i do not agree that we should settle for him this early, killing wagonomics and part of the discussion.
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299822#msg1299822
« Reply #277 on: July 09, 2020, 09:53:01 am »
I'm always high (in mafia games) as of recently it seems. Actually, i do take meds that might slightly impair my judgement, it shouldnt be as bad as people claim though. But honestly, is what I am saying really more farfetched than sub making a scumread out of what he interprets as derpclear attempts from w3 for instance?
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299823#msg1299823
« Reply #278 on: July 09, 2020, 10:31:16 am »
Analysis of town vs scum motivation to target certain roles (in case of targeting blindly obviously take the average of all possible roles; not all of them way equally though)
Spoiler for Hidden:
Kiana Kaslana Time Fracture (EoR) Target a player. Their abilities can’t be used tonight, and they can’t vote on the following day. They will be notified. You can’t target yourself. (Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)Instantly learn the ability at the cost of votepower, which for scum isnt necessarily a drawback. also since we agreed this ability shouldnt be used, somehow observing its use might start a kiana hunt if she fails to report being affected by rosepetals

Raiden Mei Phantom Image (ER) Target exactly two players. Tonight, anything that targets the first player affects the second player instead, and vice versa. This includes the nightkill. You can’t target yourself. (This can cause abilities to be used on otherwise illegal targets, such as for abilities that can’t normally target the user. Note that this ability has very high priority.)
this is the start of a long slew of roles where you can make an educated guess about targets role by noone reporting to be affected by rose petals; very slightly more usefull for scum

Bronya Zaychik Charge Beam (Passive) Not voting increases your Voting Power by 1 the next time you do vote. This effect stacks. (This is checked at the end of the day. In other words, voting and then removing your vote later will simply count as not voting.)
see above
Himeko Murata Field of Blades (2U) Target a player. If they are targeted by at least two other role abilities this night, kill them. You can’t target yourself. (Passives, nightkills, and Honkai Core abilities do not count.)
very risky, but uses up a use for what is unlikely to result in a kill; if it does though its very bad for scum

Yae Sakura Consecrate Ground (EoR) Target up to three players. Other abilities targeting them will fail tonight. You can’t target yourself. (Nightkills are unaffected. Abilities that target a protected player will fail entirely even if their other targets are valid. Uses are refunded. EoR abilities don’t go on cooldown. Failed abilities always produce a notification.)
see kiana -learning the ability used+ being immune to other targeting

Theresa Apocalypse Spear of Judgement (ER) Target a player. If they are a Herrscher, you learn their Honkai Core’s ability type. Otherwise, you learn the ability type of their original role ability. You can’t target yourself. (The ability types are ER, EoR, Passive, and #U. Does not distinguish between Honkai Core abilities and role abilities.)
If rita has a honkai core it is the core of lightning or she is really risking it

Fu Hua Phoenix Rebirth (ER) Target player can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. You may target yourself, but you can’t target the same player twice in a row.
detracting protection from death from other target

Kallen Kaslana Red Thread of Fate (EoR) Target exactly two players. If one dies tonight, so does the other. You may target yourself, and if you’re a Herrscher, you must do so.
see above


Liliya Olenyeva Flash Counter (1U) You can’t be killed tonight, other than by a modkill. At the end of the night, kill all players who targeted you with an ability that would have killed you. If the nightkill is prevented this way, this automatically kills one Herrscher, preferring the living Honkai Core holder that appears earliest in the Honkai Core list. (Abilities that do not immediately kill you, or would not have killed you due to a condition not being met, will not trigger this effect.)
see above

Rozaliya Olenyeva Typhoon Cutter (2U) Kill target player. If they were a Valkyrie, lose all remaining uses of this ability. You can’t target yourself.
Suicide unless fu hua is scum.


Seele Vollerei Quantum State (Passive) You permanently gain a copy of the first role ability to target you. (Priority matters! You’ll receive a notification. The ability will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You still technically have the Quantum State ability.)
see above; actually i am not sure if this forces seele to get rosepetals

Durandal Break of Dawn (EoR) Target a player. At the start of the next day, whether they are a Herrscher will be revealed to you. They can’t be voted on that day. (There will be a public notification for this part.) You can’t target yourself.
This is outing if scum

Cecilia Schariac Abyssal Flower (ER) Target a player. If this is the first time you’ve targeted them with this ability, reveal your name and original role to them. If this is the second time you’ve targeted them with this ability, kill them instead. You can’t target yourself.
On the one hand this is preparing for suicide, on the other it immediately outs a role and if they knew that their target doesnt know who they were forced to target they would still be pretty safe.

Shigure Kira Idyllic Dreams (EoR) Target up to three players. If any of them targeted you tonight, you learn each other’s name and original role. You can’t target yourself.
narrowing it down to one target is a dickmove, but it also outs your role and guarantess success. obv it also outs kiras role.

Frederica Tesla Radio Wave (ER) Target any number of players. You learn how many abilities those players used tonight, in total. You can’t target yourself. (Includes Honkai Core abilities. You don’t learn the ability name or target. Players can use more than one ability each night.)
It is bad to use it on town tesla, but it also means that you cant use a honkai core. So rita probably doesnt have core of lightning or psion core in that case.

Lieserl Einstein Theory of Relativity (ER) Target a player. You receive a list of all ability names that targeted them tonight, other than this one. You may target yourself. (Player names are not revealed.)
redirecting this ability is slightly bad.

Emma Planck Atomic Signature (EoR) Name a role. You learn which player, if any, has that role. (This includes players who have gained that role, and players who are already dead. Honkai Cores are not roles.)
see above

Cocolia Surveillance Network (Passive) At the start of Night 0, you learn the role ability of three random other players. (If you’re a Herrscher, this won’t reveal roles of other Herrschers.)
see above
Sin Mal Soul Funeral (3U) Target a player. If they are lynched tomorrow, you permanently gain a copy of their original role ability if you do not already have it. You can’t target yourself. (You’ll receive a notification. Abilities will have all uses remaining, and will not be on cooldown. You may use multiple abilities in one night.
reduces the effect of that ability unless you intend to get lynched

Honkaicores:
Core of Reason Global Analysis (EoR) Target a player. Learn their original role.
Imo ritas ability isnt very impressive and def not durandals, thus I consider this an upside

Core of Void Black Hole (2U) Target a player. If they die tonight, their role is not revealed. (Honkai Cores will still be revealed.)

uses up a limited use and opens them up for lieserl or tesla to witness usage
Core of Lightning Chain Lightning (ER) Target a player. At the end of the night, you learn which players they targeted, and which players targeted them. (Ability names are not revealed.)
slightly good, as scum has no idea who rita is yet, so has limited information gain, but was probably going to use it anyway

Core of Death Rapid Decay (1U) Target player dies at the end of the next day phase. They will receive a notification immediately.
Immediately outs scum and uses up the ability. If rita dies from another ability it still makes this core unuseable

Core of Binding Binding Chains (Passive) When you are lynched, all role abilities are disabled for the following night. (Honkai Core abilities are unaffected.)
no effect
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Offline kaempfer13

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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299824#msg1299824
« Reply #279 on: July 09, 2020, 10:33:46 am »
EBWOP actually triggering core of reason is even better than i thought as rita, as they dont even learn who that ability belongs to
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299825#msg1299825
« Reply #280 on: July 09, 2020, 10:41:31 am »
so i dont agree with the target, but dont think town!rita using it is clearcut wrong and id imagine scum!rita to be scared to use it blindly. If cocolia is scum this might change things a little.
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299826#msg1299826
« Reply #281 on: July 09, 2020, 10:46:05 am »
What stands out is that the green that I mostly agree with, is either a cop-like role or a mafia only ability. Drawing cop-like roles onto yourself is bad for both alignments, however. You want to find mafia, not confirm town. shock is apparently a priority lynch regardless of alignment, so the potential to drag down cop with you sounds much better when put into that perspective.

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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299827#msg1299827
« Reply #282 on: July 09, 2020, 10:54:41 am »
eh, this as far as I go defending rita. I'm still pissed she targeted me after all.
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299828#msg1299828
« Reply #283 on: July 09, 2020, 11:43:11 am »
Didn't read kae's Rita-motivation but to address his burning question: I simply pointed out Oa as confirmed town, buddying him hard, when www3 published his rolls while i was typing. I appreciated the irony and added another line.

I also don't know anything about DC's alignment as Oa implied.


shock seems to defend NL as an idea and not himself by saying we might hit an important role. So I am not opposed to a lynch.

Other people who should feel the need to be more talkative are cal and kdz.

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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299829#msg1299829
« Reply #284 on: July 09, 2020, 11:50:35 am »
shouldnt that be softcounterclaiming then (in fact hard counterclaiming since it includes you)?
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299830#msg1299830
« Reply #285 on: July 09, 2020, 11:52:11 am »
This Rita/kae interaction is quite interesting and I think there are some conclusions we can draw from it.

There is almost certainly a Rita in the game and they indeed targeted kae.
Unless kae heavily hinted at his ability and I missed it, I don't think scum!Rita would blindly use this ability, it's too risky, so there are some scenarios in which I think that's possible:

  • Mafia has a Cocolia that learned the role of kae and knows it's not dangerous to them, or can make use of Yae Sakura to stop the ability if it's important, or use Fu Hua to take an use out of a vig ability.
  • Mafia does not have a Cocolia but can roleblock someone using Yae Sakura/Rita combo.
  • Kae is mafia and so they know the exact effect of using Rita (Why would mafia do this though?)

I don't see any reason town!Rita would do this though, but it does not have such a big, negative impact if gone wrong.
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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299831#msg1299831
« Reply #286 on: July 09, 2020, 12:26:16 pm »
It wouldn't surprise me if some town MW is going rogue again and randomly roleblocking people, even if it's somewhat soft roleblock.

Offline kaempfer13

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Re: Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=67869.msg1299832#msg1299832
« Reply #287 on: July 09, 2020, 01:04:15 pm »
Didn't read kae's ....but to address his burning question: I simply pointed out Oa as confirmed town, buddying him hard, when www3 published his rolls while i was typing. I appreciated the irony and added another line.
Welp you kinda said the opposite though, confirming means you know one or more of them is scum.
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