Elements Mafia 74 - by skyironsword

[Coffeeditto]

ok this too dumb for me. I LITERALLY MENTIONED IT IN PASSING IN LITERALLY THE POST I DUG UP TO PROVE YOU'RE NOT LISTENING mere minutes ago. Seriously, just not worth discussing anymore at this point, you pay absolutely 0 attention.

YOU EVEN QUOTED IT.

can you just like

explain

what this is about

[kaempfer13]

btw you still dont get how theresa works. At most he could have seen eor on moe, which means he is any of the eor roles or holding core of reason; it doesnt prove anything.

[kaempfer13]

ian vote was a pressure vote aka "do sth", moe i believed slipped, though I've recovered from that and rob i legitimately scumread to this day (and i stayed on ian when he became a legitimate wagon because shocks eod was towny and he was less usefull than either w3 and dc who i oth had no nonneutral read on), so my votes were not at all because I didnt know what to do with it.

yh I've read every post of link twice now and find zero reference to what I can find in the honkai wiki about theresa, the claims are all not serious aside from

"ccing" moe, but none of dc,oa,moe has shared a role that link could confirm, so this was talking about durandal

BTW these 2 quotes from ages ago address 2 of the very things that coffee is trying to scumread me based off. Him failing to read is one of the reasons why I dont actually want to engage with him atp.

I have repeated time and time again that you didn't break a tie and almost forced a NL when you had the ability to hammer onto either one of the bandwagons. did you think that in the minute and a half you had left before the timer ticked out that there was going to be a flip onto ian? and would you have rather had a nl than a lynch on dc or shock?

[kaempfer13]

Ironically the sirens make it less noteable lol

[Coffeeditto]

btw you still dont get how theresa works. At most he could have seen eor on moe, which means he is any of the eor roles or holding core of reason; it doesnt prove anything.

I get how it works. I don't know why you think I don't. I also see what you said, and although it doesn't hard prove anything, that doesn't explain why you didn't point it out. like i keep saying without getting addressed, you said yourself that you jump at the sight of a slip, and link pretty much had the same form of slip that you exclaimed moe had. did you claim to miss it or what

[TheonlyrealBeef]

also torb, can we talk about how you've done all of the defending for kae and he's raised the same points over and over without point out things he scumreads me for?

In order for me to vote kaempfer13, you need to convince me kaempfer13 is scum, what he thinks of it is irrelevant. He is free and encouraged to defend himself on the points raised, but in the end his opinion on the matter wouldn't change all that much, unless he's pointing out how you're blatantly wrong about something that I somehow missed.

He's free to point out the things he scum reads you for, but I see no reason for it. His only alternative is to vote for me, which I obviously discourage. It's definitely important for you if you intend to change his mind, but that does not interest me at all.

[Coffeeditto]

also torb, can we talk about how you've done all of the defending for kae and he's raised the same points over and over without point out things he scumreads me for?

In order for me to vote kaempfer13, you need to convince me kaempfer13 is scum, what he thinks of it is irrelevant. He is free and encouraged to defend himself on the points raised, but in the end his opinion on the matter wouldn't change all that much, unless he's pointing out how you're blatantly wrong about something that I somehow missed.

He's free to point out the things he scum reads you for, but I see no reason for it. His only alternative is to vote for me, which I obviously discourage. It's definitely important for you if you intend to change his mind, but that does not interest me at all.

My reasoning for you has pretty much been stated. Repeatedly not hammering onto his partner, his interactions with dc and andre until it became abundantly clear that they were scum to us, forcing a mass roleclaim to find the doctor and look towny because he knew a copied seele onto raiden would look scummy anyway, his solving being pushing on people with power roles consistently which has no basis in mechanics but is sus (rob, moe), and not defending himself with sound evidence for his lack of a hammer d1. i’m not sure what else i can say to you besides me rereading again

[Coffeeditto]

if kae were town, i would want him to offer explanation beyond poe of why i am scum. i know you say he doesn’t need to support his claims because you’re tunneling me torb but i still want to see it.

[kaempfer13]

Obv poe weighs the most, but now that i am no longer blinded by Sub acting ridiculously scummy I notice that you completely lost motivation the moment scum was starting to get lynched for realz at last, which is kind of the opposite of what a villager would feel like. then there is the way you decided to start posting barely before Subs inevitable lynch like you knew the game would go on while I assume torb felt just like me like "oof, do i really have to respond to that 2 hours from gameend?". Welp, turns out it wasnt over, but at that point your position in the poe had become pretty much indefensable anyway. Also the way you posted since the actual day started looks more like you are trying to find anything scummy you possibly can rather than actually solving. (forgetting that you have to convince torb, while it doesnt matter much what i say if you truly believed I was scum is another thing, but i realize that that is actually weird from a scumpov as well, if not more, so I'll put that as nai). I also see you completely refusing to believe anything that you can find no counterpoints for, even though its in black on white (ok dark theme, so grey on dark grey actually, but anyway dismissing the written word that anyone can look up won't get you anywhere)

[kaempfer13]

Also, the way you did reveal your role was actually really scummy. You completely ignored the issue and almost made TorB search your role out until you realized that at that point you would get lynched for sure, so had to claim. it would have been better to at least explain your position from a 3rd person perspective, before everyone got rallied up in a witchhunt. I let that slide at the time as i had 2 decent reasons to townread you and i wasnt as offended by the action itself as most people were, just the way you revealed.

[skyironsword]

Please note that this phase will end 24 hours earlier than the listed time unless votes for shortening the phase are removed.

The shortened timer is provided below for convenience.

Time's up.

[Coffeeditto]

Obv poe weighs the most, but now that i am no longer blinded by Sub acting ridiculously scummy I notice that you completely lost motivation the moment scum was starting to get lynched for realz at last, which is kind of the opposite of what a villager would feel like.
At that point it seemed to be an easy victory for us until Sub flipped town. I was hoping that it was just dc/andre/sub all in a row, so why wuold i continue to try to scumhunt and possibly muddy up the game?

 then there is the way you decided to start posting barely before Subs inevitable lynch like you knew the game would go on while I assume torb felt just like me like "oof, do i really have to respond to that 2 hours from gameend?". Welp, turns out it wasnt over, but at that point your position in the poe had become pretty much indefensable anyway. Also the way you posted since the actual day started looks more like you are trying to find anything scummy you possibly can rather than actually solving. (forgetting that you have to convince torb, while it doesnt matter much what i say if you truly believed I was scum is another thing, but i realize that that is actually weird from a scumpov as well, if not more, so I'll put that as nai).
At that point, i was both able to contribute to the game more than the prior night as my availability has been spotty (which i have noted) and the scumhunting was to cover bases and make sure i wasn't missing any glaringly obvious slips from you or beef before we went through on a sub lynch.

I also see you completely refusing to believe anything that you can find no counterpoints for, even though its in black on white (ok dark theme, so grey on dark grey actually, but anyway dismissing the written word that anyone can look up won't get you anywhere)
what do you mean

Also, the way you did reveal your role was actually really scummy. You completely ignored the issue and almost made TorB search your role out until you realized that at that point you would get lynched for sure, so had to claim. it would have been better to at least explain your position from a 3rd person perspective, before everyone got rallied up in a witchhunt. I let that slide at the time as i had 2 decent reasons to townread you and i wasnt as offended by the action itself as most people were, just the way you revealed.

Similarly to how TorB mentioned, i was not completely in favor of having my role available to possibly be tampered with, and if the main townreads were maf that had info on someone laying low, they could use that to coerce me into hitting important things or outing roles. as far as my timing, what would a better timing have been? i admit i should have done it before it was outwardly received so negatively but even after no one suggesting how i use my role, i thought i wouldn't be forced to out as a. noninvestigative and b. nondoc