Elements Mafia 71 - by Submachine

[shockcannon]

The fact that you're all waiting on NO.obRanger is laughable at worst. Waiting to make a decision based on a random amount of information someone is choosing to give you is asking to lose. If you want my opinion, we should all really vote no lynch. You want to keep numbers as high as possible. Information gained from killing will already happen when mafia kills. Y'alls whole system of "town strategy" is to gather information during the night using the cover of numbers to keep the important roles hidden, and then reveal when there's another guaranteed info. Random lynching based off unfounded arguments and ridiculous reads on day 1 is literally the opposite of that. If you're going to play this boring meta "town-strategy" and lynch anyone who chooses not to adhere to that (idk maybe like me) then at least stick to your own freaking strategy for at least 1 day/night phase. Mafia's probably having a field day right now.

If you're really that keen on lynching someone I'm going to change my vote to someone I actually think is mafia later in the day. Feel free to join. Can't guarantee this vote will be 100% accurate. I'm less sure this game with more players and I need one more day/night to solidify some leads. Really should be voting no lynch for today. I didn't want to post this because I was having too much fun, but then I realized I also like winning and I'm really bad about staying quiet.

 

[MasterWalks]

My base for targeting Espi is the 'who tool' yes. It goes a bit beyond that tho. Firstly, he has not defended himself much at all really, more just deflection. He has held majority of the votes this day and hasnt really addressed any of it.
i understand how the base is kinda base-less. He saw a tool that can be used against the spirit of mafia and inquired about it. I think this is how most people are looking at it right?
last mafia was my first mafia. If i had a question about rules, and i had a lot of them, I pm'd Link. Whether or not he is allowed to confirm that, whatever, its what i did. I did not post it publicly. This included things that would not give my role away.
Its the fact he publicly asked about a tool that can be used against mafia. Its the fact that even after applied pressure, he has not said much of anything about getting voted on.
I do not know Espi, and i have heard is a bit weird, but something is just NOT sitting right with me. Do i have more information on this that i do not want to share? Yes. Its more than a gut feeling but thats all i have to use to convince yall to vote for him.

Ill come out with my gameplan rn.
If i get majority vote and its close to deadline, I will role reveal and target reveal. HOPEFULLY that will convince you to vote him.
If he gets lynched, I go back to Mafia 70 MasterWalks and lay low, giving out what info i can gather using my role until i have enough info to help more.
I ask everyone who is sus of me to go back and check one of the chat logs. Whichever one Linkcat was talking about me. He knows me quite well (a little too well tbh, i havent talked to him on a personal level that much, kinda weird) and knows how i would play.

[Coffeeditto]

I'm a little muffed by what is going on with the trusting root as town right now. I think that we are able to do this without the guidance of our unclear; however, that's not to say I scumread Root.

-

Shock is insane, but shock is town.
I was going to mention something about the possibility of well-orchestrated bussing between dd and shock, but I think shock is town so that's irrelevant now.

[mathman101]

Espithel (3) - MasterWalks, ddevans96, Linkcat
MasterWalks (2) - kaempfer13, JonathanCrazyJ
dawn to dusk (2) - iancudorinmarian, mathman101
JonathanCrazyJ (2) - moehrpi, RootRanger
shockcannon (3) - Calindu, shockcannon, Espithel
InsignificantWeeaboo (1) - InsignificantWeeaboo

I wanna throw some pressure on the one that chirps.
That's, and I dont really follow what the reasoning between all the other votes is. (I will try to read more thoughouly tonight when off phone and home at my laptop.)

[dawn to dusk]

Ch...chirp?

[ddevans96]

Y'alls whole system of "town strategy" is to gather information during the night using the cover of numbers to keep the important roles hidden, and then reveal when there's another guaranteed info. Random lynching based off unfounded arguments and ridiculous reads on day 1 is literally the opposite of that. If you're going to play this boring meta "town-strategy" and lynch anyone who chooses not to adhere to that (idk maybe like me) then at least stick to your own freaking strategy for at least 1 day/night phase. Mafia's probably having a field day right now.

The decoy Golden strategy and making a foundation lynch on someone d1 are not mutually exclusive or mutually detrimental plans. Also, I'd argue that none of our current lynch options are truly on the table because of failure to follow 'the meta'.

If you're really that keen on lynching someone I'm going to change my vote to someone I actually think is mafia later in the day. Feel free to join. Can't guarantee this vote will be 100% accurate. I'm less sure this game with more players and I need one more day/night to solidify some leads. Really should be voting no lynch for today. I didn't want to post this because I was having too much fun, but then I realized I also like winning and I'm really bad about staying quiet.

This is a good plan. I'll definitely consider joining you if you follow through.

Firstly, he has not defended himself much at all really, more just deflection. He has held majority of the votes this day and hasnt really addressed any of it.
...
Its the fact that even after applied pressure, he has not said much of anything about getting voted on.

True, but sometimes hard defending is not the play - he posed a lot of questions to me after I added pressure, prodding my logic. I will concede he didn't respond much to you, however, which is certainly notable.

I do not know Espi, and i have heard is a bit weird, but something is just NOT sitting right with me. Do i have more information on this that i do not want to share? Yes. Its more than a gut feeling but thats all i have to use to convince yall to vote for him.

Ill come out with my gameplan rn.
If i get majority vote and its close to deadline, I will role reveal and target reveal. HOPEFULLY that will convince you to vote him.
If he gets lynched, I go back to Mafia 70 MasterWalks and lay low, giving out what info i can gather using my role until i have enough info to help more.
I ask everyone who is sus of me to go back and check one of the chat logs. Whichever one Linkcat was talking about me. He knows me quite well (a little too well tbh, i havent talked to him on a personal level that much, kinda weird) and knows how i would play.

Ooh, interesting.

If anyone's opposed to MW doing reveals if he's about to be lynched, I recommend you come forward now.

I'm a little muffed by what is going on with the trusting root as town right now. I think that we are able to do this without the guidance of our unclear; however, that's not to say I scumread Root.

It's not about trusting Root specifically, it's just that Root's vote on jcj changed the dynamic of the round, and so it makes sense to ask him to reevaluate his opinion. Of course, we should be asking that of everyone, but because of the jcj vote, I'm most interested in Root's take on the reformed situation.

I was going to mention something about the possibility of well-orchestrated bussing between dd and shock, but I think shock is town so that's irrelevant now.

What potential bussing are you thinking about?

[Espithel]

Firstly, he has not defended himself much at all really, more just deflection. He has held majority of the votes this day and hasnt really addressed any of it.
...
Its the fact that even after applied pressure, he has not said much of anything about getting voted on.

True, but sometimes hard defending is not the play - he posed a lot of questions to me after I added pressure, prodding my logic. I will concede he didn't respond much to you, however, which is certainly notable.

You said something worth responding to. Walks hasn't.
Maybe if he roleclaims? Even then, I doubt it. I feel like he's trying to bait me.

I'm sure Root will give me some meat when he returns, even if he does happen to be scum.




I'm also against lynching Walks. As... Stubborn as he is, he is my hardest townread. I'm feeling 85%+ he's town. Mafia do not tunnel as much as he is right now.

[shockcannon]

Ian, your face is lame but you're a genius.

[ddevans96]

I'm also against lynching Walks. As... Stubborn as he is, he is my hardest townread. I'm feeling 85%+ he's town. Mafia do not tunnel as much as he is right now.

They can in four-mafia games, and/or games where there's a perceived talent advantage to mafia. What if the team (and just throwing out names of some experienced players, no scumreads and no shade if you aren't on this list) is, hypothetically, MW/Root/jcj/Link? I think it'd be a legitimate strategy for that team to have an aggro mafia.

But, regardless, I agree with you - I don't see MW as mafia here either.

Ian, your face is lame but you're a genius.

Translation*: dawn is mafia

*translation may not be 100% accurate

[dawn to dusk]

"Revealing your info before you get lynched" is kind of like what Shock did in Mafia 70. Sure it worked, but it was somewhat of a coinflip. Obviously this game is different because gathering information is harder, but that hasn't stopped Shock so far from gathering as much information as he can.

I ask that he doesn't say anything too drastic (like saying X person is GN, Y person is Graboid, Z person is Phoenix), but saying stuff like "I know who the role of X belongs to, and I know that they used their ability for Y", which allows that role to be claimed later.

Regarding Espi vs MW, I don't personally find Espi's defence to be scummy at all, and I personally wouldn't vote for him today. I think we can use this argument to get more information from both parties if we leave everyone alive. Since both of them are under scope, we could potentially start using some abilities on them to see what can stick. Mafia Dragonfly would be bad for this plan. Town Queen would be pretty good to target either of them, Warden is terrible. Don't use ability on either target, Warden, else we should assume you as mafia and kill on sight. Flayer on Espi is up for discussion, and generally comes down to whether the Flayer in question thinks of Espi as mafia or not. I don't agree with Flayer MW. (Yes I am aware that Shock claimed Flayer, but that means next to nothing considering how he generally plays, not to mention the possibility of a second Flayer.) Buffs should probably not be used on either? But I think this is also up to the discretion of the people who use the abilities.

As per usual, we should consider protecting the identity of Graboid with a few non-votes. 13 people have voted so far, of the 19 people who started playing this game. I personally would like to see at least 4 people abstain.

[Espithel]

I'm also against lynching Walks. As... Stubborn as he is, he is my hardest townread. I'm feeling 85%+ he's town. Mafia do not tunnel as much as he is right now.

They can in four-mafia games, and/or games where there's a perceived talent advantage to mafia. What if the team (and just throwing out names of some experienced players, no scumreads and no shade if you aren't on this list) is, hypothetically, MW/Root/jcj/Link? I think it'd be a legitimate strategy for that team to have an aggro mafia.

But, regardless, I agree with you - I don't see MW as mafia here either.

Oh?
I'm not aware of aggro mafia strategies. Please elaborate.

[InsignificantWeeaboo]

I think this would come down to playing similarly to shock in Mafia 70 except you're actually mafia. This would probably work better if some aggro town were previously lynched, but they'd have to make sure they start becoming aggro at the same time as a townie.