Suggestions for CIA

[Drake_XIV]

There have been several plans to revamp the Card Ideas and Art section, but due to availability, it seems to have hit a snag in implementing the plans of both current and past Curators.

But as Forum members and [potential] card designers, what would you like to see different in the CIA?

Any suggestions should be different from the request to limit a designer's idea posts over a time period nor should it be a suggestion to simply remove the CIA [which does make up a bulk of forum activity].  Ultimately, any suggestions should be in the improvement of content of the CIA without reducing activity.

It should be noted that none of the ideas may be used [immediately], this is more of a gauge [for me] to see what the community really has issues with in the CIA and would like to see fixed since there are members of the community that don't exactly look favorably on this portion of the forums.

[iloveashley3]

maybe have a section for each element, like aether, earth etc, so its easier to navigate and find your favorite element.

[Elbirn]

^ Cards are in fact organized by element, just not before crucible. Ideas in presmithy or the like are kind of a free for all until they're submitted to the process.

Edit: Apologies, seems they're only organized by element in the crucible. After Stage 1 they're all mashed together. Which I find acceptable; if we were to only have voting per element for the whole process, we'd wind up with way too many cards accepted into the armory. By choosing the best of the best from the entire card pool, we're doing much better quality control.

Suggestions

1. I realize it has actually been this way for a very long time, but my God is the new format for submitting to crucible ugly. I much preferred posting links to the topic then posting poorly formatted card picture links. The former makes my OCD smile beams of sunshine upon the world; the latter makes me want to hang myself.

2. Several cards in armory/their respective threads seem to be missing card images; the offender appears to be the choice of host, imageplay, which I lazily conclude must either no longer be active, or deletes images from its database after some time passes. A fix would be nice.

I realize these suggestions don't amount to much and aren't quite what you're looking for, but at the moment I have no real comment on how the process could be improved. As it stands the best fix for CIA would be

- Higher quality ideas/posts
- More activity, particularly from the community, and especially where voting is concerned.

And that's a bit outside of the control of curators and is really on the shoulders of everyone. I suppose then, that this leads to a suggestion #3, and a rather open ended one at that.

3. Get more members involved in CIA

[andretimpa]

This is strictly my opinion (based on my impressions after being a semi-active member of this part of the forum for about an year), but the whole way the CIA is structured seems to make 'getting a card to the next level of voting' the main purpose of submitting said card, instead of providing interesting ideas that might get picked (no matter how slim these chances may be) or provide discussions of what the game is lacking, or about balance in general (discussing balance also gets old after a while).

I actually find the whole separation of the card base in levels (Crucible, Forge and Armory since you can't get to the Reliquary through voting alone) to be quite silly, since it creates the illusion that there is some kind of prize or that Zanz will pick your idea eventually if you make it to the Armory, while good ideas keep getting archived simply because people forgot about them (since getting to the Armory can take a really, really long time). There is also the whole problem of bias in the votes, which the card curators have been trying to solve for a while.

Given that, this is my suggestion: Abandon the current voting system and find another way to bring recognition to good ideas. I find that something like the 'Card Idea of the Month' in the newsletter is a much more relevant recognition than making it to the Forge, for example. A compromise between my suggestion and the current system would be for the card curators to choose what gets into the crucible and what doesn't, instead of the authors of the ideas submitting them to the crucible. This way, having a card in the Crucible would actually mean something, so it could even be possible to drop one of the levels of voting.

[TribalTrouble]

What exactly is the process of voting? I've never understood that.
"Cards advance by winning in polls." is all that the Read This First! Thread says. I've never really understood the voting system nor have I really considered it the best idea. One thing I don't understand is why CIA doesn't have overall community interaction in voting for a card idea.

[Rutarete]

One thing I don't understand is why CIA doesn't have overall community interaction in voting for a card idea.

Do you mean in the sense that what we have right now is individual?

[Elbirn]

I find the intent of giving the community a say in the choosing of card ideas admirable. If it were down to say only the curators being able to decide what is or is not a good idea, there's a whole lot of perspectives being lost. Granted the curators tend to have gotten their positions through knowledge of the game, familiarity with the card creation process, and so on, and are thus certainly qualified to judge what is or is not a good idea; But they're not the only ones who can recognize a good idea. And I think a lot of people would be angered, frustrated, and disheartened to have their voices silenced.

Therefore, while I agree with you Andre that the current system could probably be done away with, I would not support a system where only curators get to choose cards for crucible.

[EmeraldTiger]

This is adiscussion worth watching.

[Drake_XIV]

Annele was in the process of removing the current poll system and replacing it with one of her own, so you aren't alone in the sentiment that the polls needed to be radically changed and/or removed.

[Jyiber]

New, and perhaps simpler, voting system. Make it in such a way that it resparks interest in the voting process.

Oh, and making the Pre-Smithy it's own board and lining it up somehow in the process might be better for newcomers.

This last idea is a bit drastic, but create a limit to the number of ideas someone can submit (per week or per month or per voting period) This might have the duel benifits of:
A) encourageing people to spend more time refining ideas
and B) help to prevent clogging the Smithy

[Rutarete]

To put it in few words, voting is a hassle. Going to each different thread, looking at cards, back up to poll, back down to cards to finalize a choice, etc. One way to fix this is to have the polls be condensed. Another possible way is to post what you're voting for, although that takes away the anonymity.

[andretimpa]

@Elbirn Anything that would reduce crucible spam, different from limiting the amount of cards submitted in a period of time (which is already in place, it's 2 per week) would also be a huge step forward (I realize I'm being radical). The ratings in the card threads could actually play a role in the card being accepted, for example (though this also has issues). Maybe a mix of community and curator support would be closer to the ideal solution.

Another thought I had is that it needs to be stated in the submission thread that series of cards should be a separate thing. They don't work well in the current system and are barely submitted to the crucible (specially since it would take 6 weeks to submit the whole of it). There is actually a separate subsection for them. But it is 'hidden' in the Exhibition Hall, so there is probably a lot of people that don't know about it.