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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293669#msg293669
« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2011, 02:02:02 am »
Everyone knows what post we are referencing.
Personally, I think was poisonking did was really funny.
It was the kind of thing that most of the forum appreciated, so he got karma for it (like Leaf Dragon aftwork, but different)


Honestly, the bigger problem is how people generally get karma, and different people who have karma. I compared my own to semi-well known to downright famous members of the forum (Posted enough for me to get a pretty good picture of their character), and I saw imbalances in lots of places.


The ones that I remember from me were:
One from Ess when I was a noob and trying to brainstorm AI3s
One for my personal text
One for a (joking) abusive comment where I told Pervepic to demolish SV in war 2.
A couple for being generally helpful.


My solution, which was apparent to me when I saw some members karmas (not you poisonking, it could only be done once, and you definetely got it :P ) - Ignore it altogether.
Fixing it would probably mean restricting it, or adding bonus ones, giveable by intelligent, thoughtful people. (Or minus ones by the same types of unnamed to prevent abuse people)

Offline Glitch

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293675#msg293675
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2011, 02:06:37 am »
But if you take away karma for silly posts, all my karmas will go away!!!

D=

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293680#msg293680
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2011, 02:10:55 am »
Like DD said, I think we all know what post it is...

Anyway, there is no real way to fix it. Stuff like that seem to happen once in a while, and as long as it doesn't get out of hand it really doesn't matter. Karma is pretty much just how many people appriciate something the user is/has done. But in the end, what is it? It's just a meaningless number that tells us nothing about what they did/accomplished.

Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293682#msg293682
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2011, 02:12:34 am »
Like DD said, I think we all know what post it is...

Anyway, there is no real way to fix it. Stuff like that seem to happen once in a while, and as long as it doesn't get out of hand it really doesn't matter. Karma is pretty much just how many people appriciate something the user is/has done. But in the end, what is it? It's just a meaningless number that tells us nothing about what they did/accomplished.
considering the poster of the thread himself came here to apologize, anyone that doesn't know should be ashamed....
to fix it: hire 4~5 karma moderators who sees every karma "transaction", and if the reason isn't legit, bam, gone goes the karma

(due to my successiveness in the past with sarcasm, I will point out that I am definitely not being sarcastic...)
(due to my fail to sarcastically say my post is sarcastic, I will hereby say that this is sarcastic..)

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293694#msg293694
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2011, 02:37:38 am »
Leave Karma as a Bench mark. But add below it a Helpful/ Not helpful buttons

Then add value to members according to their rank/position on board (IE: novice .5 to council member +6 (?)

The higher the rank the more value you get if they hit "helpful"

The same but in reverse would occur if "Not Helpful" was hit.

As far as I see now, Karma flows in only one direction. And in real life Karma is not a striate line.

EDIT: And one goes up 1 karma with a total of +6

EDIT EDIT: Note: Although I understand the need/reasoning behind karma, It is almost always the small continuous contributions that make a good poster, Not the single act of kindness, And for that reason, Karma holds little sway over me.

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293697#msg293697
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2011, 02:42:29 am »
I will reiterate what I said: karma should be mostly ignored.

If you do want to upgrade the system, the best way is that each forum member can give out a single karma point per 100 posts made. And I would reset the entire system once that change was made. ScaredGirl could be a singular exception, able to issue karma independent of post count.

Offline plastiqe

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293698#msg293698
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2011, 02:43:21 am »
SG already gives out cookies to well deserving members.

Setting some rules or high standards for giving karma is pointless, look at the qualifications you need to be able to give it.. 20 posts.  I see no reason to change it, Karma is just a frill that you can have fun with on the forums.

Something I've seen other forums do is have yearly awards like best new member for 2011, best post of 2011, best new deck of 2011; and they take nominations and then vote on them.  It might be fun to do around here, somebody remind me in December lol.

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293709#msg293709
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2011, 03:16:43 am »
Different Ideas

1)Have a certain "Rule Set" for karma. The karma mods would examine the reasons given for the karma and decide if it follows in the parameters. Some examples are
      a)If karma is given out for one thing already, multiple karmas to the same thing are removed. For example artwork. If artwork is awesome, sure it can deserve a karma point. Does it really deserve 20 though? No matter how epic it is?
      b)Helpfulness. Karma should only be given out for helpful things. Sure the post was funny. Does that mean it is karma worthy though?
      c)Relation to the game. You may have the most thought provoking political point. You could find the best website in the world. Does this mean that you should get karma though? It really has nothing to do with the game.

2)Have different "types" of karma. this could work in a couple different ways.
      a)Game Karma/Off Topic/Humor Karma. Game karma would be things that relate to the game. That could be game suggestions, to war, to helping newbies. Off topic would fall into any of the other parts of the forum. Web, politics, religion ect. Humor-if the post is genuinely funny.
      b)Just add Benevolence along with karma. Karma would fall into general things. Benevolence would be the truely helpful posts.

3)Ignore it. This I honestly dont agree with. Even if the vets know that it really means nothing, a newb wouldnt. When I was a newb, I trusted the people who had a lot of karma more than the people who had none.

4)Only allow karma to be given in chat related to the game. Off Topic forum would be karmaless. The problem with this is that people will still say random funny things in general discussion, or any other part and will skew it still.


I say something related to suggestion 2 is best. Would require no additional modding, and the least amount of work.

Now give me karma for my epic post!
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Offline Camoninja

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293710#msg293710
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2011, 03:20:28 am »
Does that little number make anyone jealous? Us newbies and Jr. members do not care about karma because it is unlikely that we will get karma, being new. Bringing back the minus (I did not know about it) would discourage me from posting though, and that would contradict parts of the forum, like the deck help and newbie area.

When you think about it, is it more valuable to have a good laugh, or to worry about being famous in a game? To me, the people with more posts are more helpful and dedicated anyway, karma or not. People here are usually nice in my experience.

If we needed a better incentive to be helpful or have karma be more important, it should probably be more visible, and easier to give karma, similar to the Quick Reply, maybe in bold next to the signature. A lot of time I come across good advice and rush to try it, and forget about karma because it is so small and out of the way. In Poisonking's case I laughed and didn't feel the need to leave the page so I remembered about the karma.

Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293712#msg293712
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2011, 03:23:11 am »
2)Have different "types" of karma. this could work in a couple different ways.
      a)Game Karma/Off Topic/Humor Karma. Game karma would be things that relate to the game. That could be game suggestions, to war, to helping newbies. Off topic would fall into any of the other parts of the forum. Web, politics, religion ect. Humor-if the post is genuinely funny.
      b)Just add Benevolence along with karma. Karma would fall into general things. Benevolence would be the truely helpful posts.

Was just about to suggest #2 as well, +Ka... jk ;D
In addition to #2, why not have the Kama # on their profile page? That split second change can be just enough of a hassle the giver to think about it again? It'd also wouldn't be as much of a clutter to have:
Funny: +2
Smart: +3
Cute: +1
Dumb: +45

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Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293717#msg293717
« Reply #22 on: March 19, 2011, 03:32:47 am »
If you can find me a forum where Karma/Reputation/etc is given primarily to those that contribute rather than those who are kindasortafunny ... ... ...I'll +karma you. Sure, that was a bit of a twisted joke, but in all honesty, I think you will be quite hard pressed to do so. You may have noticed already but the [ + ] button alone is not the best way to reward someone for something they have done. The "Reply" button is, or at the very least you will need to use the two in conjunction. I'm certain you can already see why, and if you can't, you likely belong in the category of people that is being discussed in this thread. Run!

Certainly, there are those who deserve forum-wide recognition for things the have done - things that have been of great benefit to the community, things that often go above and beyond what is asked of anybody. If you feel that Karma is far too cheap a reward, don't fret; there's something called Cookies of Awesomeness (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,7123.0.html) for that. What gives it the value that it has? The fact that it's so rare? The fact that SG is the one pinning the button to your uniform? The fact that it's not just some depressingly plain number like "1337", but a cookie? Who knows? The fact remains that it does what you ask of Karma to do right now, and it works. The current system should stay as it is.

Also, consider this: a change in the system that creates room for exploitation is a change that should not be made. Even if Karma's value has slipped a few feet down the drain, that may not be such a bad thing. Give it more value, more of a "purpose" if you will, make it a valuable collector's item, elevate it to Cookie status, then you will find people engaging in questionable and shady dealings. Because it's something that almost anyone can give, and something that almost anybody can receive, you will need to greatly reduce the number of users that can give it in order to fix the exploitation problem (which you will be worried about only because it has value...!) and that's quite unfair. I am not saying that everybody's Karma will start shooting through the roof the moment this change is made since I know that this community is better than that, but the same could not be said of a less ethical userbase. But as long as there is room for exploitation, someone will eventually come along and take a few liberties with the system.

Karma is like a party favor right now - no, better yet, a shiny rock. Everybody loves shiny rocks. You love them. I love them. You and I might get a little jealous if you see someone walk by with a pile of shiny rocks that is bigger than ours combined. You and I may become a little disappointed when everyone is giving shiny rocks to a specific user while the shiny-rock-piles of the Global Moderators remain unchanged day after day despite all the work they do behind the scenes [/suckup]. But you would be royally ticked off if those piles of shiny rocks were Diamonds. The difference between shiny rocks that bear little value yet are coveted so, and Diamonds that are rare overpriced symbols of the elite, is just that big. So it is better for Karma to keep its role of the shiny rock. Do not make them Diamonds. It's not worth it.

Ninja'd by plastique, who clearly knows how things should be.

Re: Karma https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23123.msg293737#msg293737
« Reply #23 on: March 19, 2011, 04:30:03 am »
I don't even know how to check the one-liners about why I received my karma.  Apart from curiosity, though, I don't really care.

I've never really paid much attention to Karma, since anyone can give it for any reason.

 

blarg: