Elements the Game Forum - Free Online Fantasy Card Game
Other Topics => Forum Archive => Topic started by: TheoCT on June 03, 2010, 10:49:46 am
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As many of you know I'm against making farms to just GIVE cards away and a free 50 points. I farm t50 myself and I wish there weren't any freebies around. If you will be making a farm make it BITING. We shouldn't be giving away the rares and score but we should give them a better shot at winning the cards. Pretty much everybody just assumes we will give them farms but they all need to realize it's not a right but a privilege that some of the people in the t50 make farms to help other players. For example, pervepic's pharaoh/SoR deck is perfect, it's a difficult deck to play but if you win you have a high chance of winning an eternity/pharaoh/or SoR.
-TheoCT
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I am not in the top 50 however I agree with this. biting farms are more fun to play and you people in the top 50 don't HAVE to make us farms at all.
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not in the t50 but i agree=)
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While I am not in the t50, I would like to put in my support for this. It is more fun actually playing against a deck than just mindlessly click, click, clicking until I can collect a card and some score. Makes getting that rare, more ... rare, and something to work towards.
Corrum
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Not that im a t50. person, but Its a good idea, took me 2weeks to get 6x every wep. :D more biters please! =)
When I become a t50 player Ill make them bite with extra rabies!
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I feel sorry for people that were not around when gods were the best farms.
I completely disagree with this, and if I ever get myself to grind enough to reach T50, I will constantly make farms. Farms that are farms, not decks with couple of expensive cards in it.
On the side note, I hope Zanzarino implements decaying system for score.
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I feel sorry for people that were not around when gods were the best farms.
I completely disagree with this, and if I ever get myself to grind enough to reach T50, I will constantly make farms. Farms that are farms, not decks with couple of expensive cards in it.
On the side note, I hope Zanzarino implements decaying system for score.
So you support a system where a player can mindlessly click with their starter deck and get tons of electrum/score and all the rares they could ever want? Because that's what current farms allow.
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I feel sorry for people that were not around when gods were the best farms.
I completely disagree with this, and if I ever get myself to grind enough to reach T50, I will constantly make farms. Farms that are farms, not decks with couple of expensive cards in it.
On the side note, I hope Zanzarino implements decaying system for score.
So you support a system where a player can mindlessly click with their starter deck and get tons of electrum/score and all the rares they could ever want? Because that's what current farms allow.
I admit that I dont do T50 much myself usually, but for the last few days I've been farming it for SoRs. I have no idea where are those TONS of electrum/score as there really arent so many farms out there. What you're saying would be true if all T50 decks were non fighting farms. But they arent. They are in huge minority. Today and yesterday night, I found zero non fighting farms.
Farm decks are live ever since I started playing, which was long time ago. ALL current T50 players benefited from the system. Did it do anything bad for the game except provide more competition? Or did tournaments started to get tougher, so its right time to cut down the influx of new players with decent decks?
My point is, farms are harmless. They dont have big negative impact on the game. I'd also argue that they have positive impact on the game provided how much grinding it takes for a new player to get a decent deck.
I understand that T50 players want to "close down the pipe" to make it harder for others to get on their level, I just dont agree that its good for the game.
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I understand that T50 players want to "close down the pipe" to make it harder for others to get on their level, I just dont agree that its good for the game.
Well not all T50 players. There are quite a few of us who put up non-fighting farms the majority of the time. I currently have a fighting farm right now ONLY because of so many requests for SoR's. I would feel a bit uneasy making a non-fighting SoR farm at this time mainly because they are so rare and were only given to those who donated.
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In no way is this supposed to 'stop players getting on our level'. I started when the game started, if I remember correctly there weren't farms at the beginning. Yes, fg's were easier, there was less stuff, but because we started playing earlier and had it a bit easier in the beginning shouldn't mean we have to use the advantage we got for playing as long as we have to make it even easier for those who started later. It's not like we had it all that much easier in the beginning, we've just been playing longer. Yes, I've benefited from the farms as I can't avoid them (I'm not going to vs a farm and get a loss just because I don't like farms). The way the game was designed was meant for the RARES to be....well...RARE. Some players would get the cards from the AI, use them in decks, and others will beat them and win them occasionally, not what it's like now. Now the rares are easy as pie to get, any newbie can farm t50 from day 1 and get RARES. We had to work for them.
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I have an intermediate solution: all farms should be bite farms except those providing noobs with the essential pulvy, eternity and green shards, which anybody who has farmed a decent length of time should have an excess of. How's that? Then again, what's so bad about giving them a free 60 points and electrum when some of us would actually donate a lot more of our own electrum to help them if there were a means of transferring stuff?
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Yes Jmizzle thanks for those Nymph Tears X.X :P
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Trying to smuggle in my suggestion as far as removing farms and including weekly quests:
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,7061.0.html
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Theo could you tell me waht that charger deck is it looked interesting and jmizzle's deck.
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Theo could you tell me waht that charger deck is it looked interesting and jmizzle's deck.
Mono-grav black hole deck :)
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Im usually at top 50 just on Sundays for now. And I strongly disagree. I hate biting farms, and I will keep my farms non-biting.
1st of all, why would someone play T50? Its worse than lv3 to get money, even with a fully upgraded deck. In fact, if your deck is not an upgraded / powerfull one you will stand no chance against rush decks of life, fire, poison, or lava destroyer. Just a few can beat the most gay strategy ever, Fractal + RoL + Hope. And most times its that boring and defensive rainbow deck, a very slow and boring game even if you use the same type of deck. The single thing that make interest of anyone in T50 is farming rares because considering money / score, lv 3 is better.
Make people understand that having farms is a privilege? Whats the problem about what people think? And how making a difficult farm will teach someone that they should thank the T50 people for giving them a such "privilege"? Most time people will curse you instead by making them playing for like 5-7 minutes, and still losing / didnt get any card.
If a player has rare cards, hes not strong because of this. He will be strong if he has a good deck and knowledge about how to use it properly. I think that people should be able to have 6 of each rare card, no problem about that. If we consider the same point, them letting people use your deck is a privilege, and so you shouldnt post your deck, unless you post it edited in a weaker form.
If you think that biting farms are more fun, or you think that people should "learn" that having farms is a privilege, then I will say that having already 35-40 non farm decks is enough to you have fun / people learning.
NO BITING FARMS TO ME.
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Actually biting farms are more fun in my opinion especially the one theo had up 2 wins 2 losses vs that. It makes you all tense as to whether you'll win or not and makes you actually feel like you deserved it after.
Vs Theo's deck it was a case of who could rush the fastest and to my surprise that was extremely fun to play against, Jmizzle's deck on the other hand needed a while to get started and was easily defeated by the rush deck I was using.
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Marvaddin, I don't post all of my decks because, in my opinion, it is a privilege that I am willing to share decks I make to help other players out. Look at jmizzle, he doesn't post his decks anymore, but then again if you look at PuppyChow he posts pretty much all(if not all) his decks. What is the point of making rare cards rare if everybody will have 6 of them??? It makes no sense..... Me putting up a biting farm is not so people learn to understand that farms are a privilege and not a right but for them to EARN the cards they win. Even the cards in the bazaar aren't free like the rares in farms are, and those are RARES!!!!!
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Really, I dont think the rare status is necessary, even more given how easy is to get them, and how important they can be to some decks.
That said, even cards won from non bitting farms are not free. There are just a few farms, like 12 in 50 and just a few are non biting ones. Noobs that just started can surely defeat the non biting farms, but at what cost? Facing the strongest decks +70% of times, maybe more? Even skipping the non farms fights, its a 15 coins fee per fight, so I can surely say they arent free.
Same idea: lets suppose I have a deck with a 0% chance of defeating against a FG, hmmmm, I have a deck with a good amount of Jade Shields, that will make me win 100% of my games against Decay. Are the cards I win against that FG free? If you think so, feel free to get some free cards, but I disagree :D
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1st of all, why would someone play T50? Its worse than lv3 to get money, even with a fully upgraded deck. In fact, if your deck is not an upgraded / powerfull one you will stand no chance against rush decks of life, fire, poison, or lava destroyer. Just a few can beat the most gay strategy ever, Fractal + RoL + Hope. And most times its that boring and defensive rainbow deck, a very slow and boring game even if you use the same type of deck. The single thing that make interest of anyone in T50 is farming rares because considering money / score, lv 3 is better.
Well, t50 is SUPPOSED to be hard, its the TOP50!
When I see #Jmizzle7, im supposed to tremble, not think oyay, free rares! So if anything, biting farms are fine! I like chaoz farms =) the pharaoh/eternity/sog was excellent! And u should build ur deck so it counters most decks. If rol/hope is common, carry some mass CC, like fireshield.
Really, I dont think the rare status is necessary, even more given how easy is to get them.
Wich im positively sure its what Theo wants to get rid of, simply making it the way it was, and make the choice more important.
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Did chaoz finally get 6 pharaohs?
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Yea this "easy" score stuff needs to stop.
Thus, we also need Top50 players to cease playing rainbow decks. There are just too many people playing black hole decks with the goal of easy EMs vs all those bloated rainbow decks that Top50 players use.
Also, while we are at it, we need all the Top50 players to log on early Sunday morning and uploaded your deck. We can't let people farm Top50 on Sunday mornings in order to get easy score vs all those noob decks that get uploaded.
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Yea this "easy" score stuff needs to stop.
Thus, we also need Top50 players to cease playing rainbow decks. There are just too many people playing black hole decks with the goal of easy EMs vs all those bloated rainbow decks that Top50 players use.
Also, while we are at it, we need all the Top50 players to log on early Sunday morning and uploaded your deck. We can't let people farm Top50 on Sunday mornings in order to get easy score vs all those noob decks that get uploaded.
So you're trying to mock by doing suggestions that would make it even easier for everybody? You're not making any sense mate. I'm just saying that RARE cards should be RARE and the way that they're around this game everybody has a bunch of each and they're not rare.
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In no way is this supposed to 'stop players getting on our level'. I started when the game started, if I remember correctly there weren't farms at the beginning. Yes, fg's were easier, there was less stuff, but because we started playing earlier and had it a bit easier in the beginning shouldn't mean we have to use the advantage we got for playing as long as we have to make it even easier for those who started later. It's not like we had it all that much easier in the beginning, we've just been playing longer. Yes, I've benefited from the farms as I can't avoid them (I'm not going to vs a farm and get a loss just because I don't like farms). The way the game was designed was meant for the RARES to be....well...RARE. Some players would get the cards from the AI, use them in decks, and others will beat them and win them occasionally, not what it's like now. Now the rares are easy as pie to get, any newbie can farm t50 from day 1 and get RARES. We had to work for them.
While I think that rares should certainly be rarer than they are, I also think Theo is taking this way too far. When I read other's posts, I read well rounded (generally) arguments for and against biting farms. When I read Theo's posts, I see a noob hating rage filled player who thinks that nobody new deserves to play the game he's been playing for around half a year.
If you are as against farm decks as you make yourself seem, then you will quit farm decks as soon as you see them. That is what it means to stand up for what you believe. Standing up for your beliefs means sacrifice, not the hypocrisy you're preaching.
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Nymphs and marks are really the only 'rare' cards. The 'rare' cards that can be won in the slots are more like uncommon cards. Also, a biting rare farm is still a rare farm. Any decent rush deck will still beat a biting rare farm. And most everyone farming T50 uses a decent rush deck.
Bottom line is that farm decks exist and most all of us (if not all of us) have benefited from them. If you want to make a biting farm deck, then make a biting farm deck. If you want to make a free farm deck, then make a free farm deck. If you are in the top 50, you've earned the right to post whatever deck you have the cards to make...
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Yea this "easy" score stuff needs to stop.
Thus, we also need Top50 players to cease playing rainbow decks. There are just too many people playing black hole decks with the goal of easy EMs vs all those bloated rainbow decks that Top50 players use.
Also, while we are at it, we need all the Top50 players to log on early Sunday morning and uploaded your deck. We can't let people farm Top50 on Sunday mornings in order to get easy score vs all those noob decks that get uploaded.
So you're trying to mock by doing suggestions that would make it even easier for everybody? You're not making any sense mate. I'm just saying that RARE cards should be RARE and the way that they're around this game everybody has a bunch of each and they're not rare.
Its alil bit to late for that Teo.. they should have thought of that before Shards became a priority in about 80% of all the T50 deck wich were from the start only attainable from donating cash to Elements.. and yes RARES should be rares wich they arent anymore..
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I have an intermediate solution: all farms should be bite farms except those providing noobs with the essential pulvy, eternity and green shards, which anybody who has farmed a decent length of time should have an excess of. How's that? Then again, what's so bad about giving them a free 60 points and electrum when some of us would actually donate a lot more of our own electrum to help them if there were a means of transferring stuff?
who decides which rares to give away? as a newer player when i didnt have a lot of rares i would've much rather received a vamp stiletto, 2 arsenics, 2 titans, and then 3 lobos...(in that order)...(btw i've never made a FG rainbow as i went the RoL/Hope route)
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Personally I rather the non biting farms and here is why:
- it is only after i built a pretty good semi upgraded, well rounded deck that I started doing the T50 so in that sense it forced me to be a better player. And I was rewarded for this by encountering the occasional farm.
- it's not like EVERYONE uses the T50, I know a few people that specifically grind FG's for their main source of income. That is fine for them but what if I don't have the resources to build that FG deck I have been thinking of? Hello T50 farms!
- if you are going to argue that there should be no easy button you missed that train way back when SG and puppy posted those FG decks that everyone uses. I myself have never used those decks but everyone who has is pretty much swimming in electrum.
But in the end it's up to you guys. Do you reward people like me for making neat decks that can counter most of what the T50 has to offer by providing the occasional oasis? Or do you try to push the idea that are FG's the best way to make money and foster even more SG/Puppychow sheep? :P
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Yay, I've won 8 flying weapons from these "farms" instead of actual rares. Not to mention how much less score and electrum I got because of not getting masterity.
Biting farms are stupid. Beginners might play top 50 for the rares, but after some time they'll have tons of them.
The real purpose of farms is an acceptable way of electrum (and to a lesser extent score) farming, other than the false gods.
Biting farms are unfit for that, while also reducing the chance of winning a rare a lot...
Besides, to farm to 50 you need a very strong deck, so it's not like you get the rares for free. You'd still need to be able to have a decent win rate against the remaining top 50 decks, if you don't want to lose lots of electrum and score.
I'll never, ever make a biting farm...if I want to give people a challenge, I'll load my strongest pvp deck, and if I want a farm I'll make one optimized for farming, and having only the cards least commonly seen in farms or having the highest electrum value. These biting ones are useless for both purposes, they don't provide a real challenge (except for a very few, they at annoying at most), but they are considerable worse for farming as well.
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Seravy you explained your point very well,
and your point is the reason why my farm doesn't "bite" and has 6+6 rares and the others are pillars.
i know that trowing in 6 animate weapon can make the deck "slightly" more challenging, but basically i am wasting my opponent's time because i am not offering an interesting game, nor the good chance of getting a rare!!!
so, +1 karma for you :)
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I have always liked biting farms more, and the main reason for that is I like to play. Even if my opponent is not the the strongest one (like biting farm or something) I still prefer that he does at least something. Maybe it is just me but I never needed any weapon, rare or score so strongly that I got pissed because of winning only Animate Weapon. That's a good thing of course that there is a big disagreement here; so there will never be very similar decks in top 50.
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My position:
If one wants to give (read: allow people to get easily) rare cards then one should make it as easy as possible.
If one doesn't want people to get rare cards, or think they should stay 'rare' (whatever that means considering they aren't even rare), then one should just not make a farm.
I don't get this in between business of making biting farms.
Ultimately, people in Top 50 should have whatever decks they want and nobody should suggest otherwise.
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Giving people rares is just stupid really. I don't mind helping people out by giving them a better chance at getting a rare and if they beat me then they deserve to get what they win, otherwise it's just giving them away, ya know?
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so you're basically against "farms", I don't feel that way, but I understand your point! :)
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Personally I think
1. The game is much more fun if you have rare cards as they not only are powerful, but lots of them are also mechanically very interesting. Especially Shard of Gratitude just completely opens up the possibility to play a wide range of more defensive decks.
2. Winning 60 coins is awesome.
Therefore, and because I'm sort of a philanthropist, I try to post no-bite rare farms as often as possible.
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I would understand theoCT's point if the cards were actually rare.. but they're not.
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I think biting farms are most important for SoR which are quite rare and don't think you should be able to easily get them and considering they're an extra source of income for zanz.
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This is the result of too many biting farms :
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,8187.0.html (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,8187.0.html)
Yes...poor players are starting to believe Flying Weapon is a rare, because they see it in farms all the time.
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I think that the Flying Weapon part is just an irony. Looks like hes being sarcastic about these guys that dislike non-biting farms, and really requesting Lobotomizer.
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I think that farms are ok to a point. Like getting a few rares here and there is fine, but I have five shards of readiness already that are all from farms. I don't think that you should be able to get so many of these shards so early after they came out from farms. So these are cards gotten from donating money, but i have enough shards to equal $30 from T50.
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[sigh]
So, you're going to donate $30, right? Don't forget the shards of gratitude. They were the original donation cards. If the farms are only OK to a point, you should probably sell most of your rares... to a point, wherever that line is...
[/sigh]
Zanz has said time and time again that this is a free game, and that donators wouldn't have access to cards that everybody didn't also have access to (obviously by way of PvP and T50 spins). Sure, if you donate, you'll get a code for a shard. But you shouldn't get upset when T50 is full of them and everybody has them, because donation-only-cards was never Zanz's plan for the game (so far as I know).
Fortunately the Elements community as a whole understands that this free game isn't really free and costs Zanz time and money to keep it running. And a lot of people donate for that reason alone... some people even donate regularly...
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I think it's a difficult situation. It's true, playing against a farm deck isn't fun, but is it fun against the AI when it's a biting deck? I don't think it is very much. To the contrary, I'm more annoyed when I play t50 and it's not a farm deck, since I play t50 for farming purposes solely. If I want to have fun, I'd rather play the people in t50, not an AI that poorly plays their decks.
Without farm decks, it might take ages to win specific rare cards needed for, say, an fg farming deck. Maybe it should take ages to acquire these rare cards, but they are essential for a lot of effective decks. Farming just isn't that fun in general, but it would be miserably slower if t50 didn't have farm decks. I talked to a player the other day who was depressed because it took him so long farming level 3 and pvp just to upgrade one card. I suggested he try farming FGs, but he lacked the eternity for ScaredGirl's, the electrocutors for rol/hope, the pulvs for the no CC deck, etc. I told him not to worry about it because of the farm decks on T50.
It might mitigate the situation if rares could be purchased for, say, 20,000 electrum. Then at least players won't have to feel hopelessly relying on luck to win the eternity needed, for, say, ScaredGirl's fg farming deck. Hopefully they'll win the specific rare sooner than that, but if they can't, at least there's a backup to which they can steadily progress. It'll be an expensive goal, but at least it won't seem hopeless.
The AI in general isn't very fun IMO. There are so many ways to exploit it, and FG killing decks are generally designed to do just that for many of their strategies. Did the AI play a pulverizer a turn before you could? No problem, play an hourglass and a pulverizer and he'll pulverize the hourglass and you can destroy his pulv. Have an FFQ against AI with creature control but no quintessence handy? No problem, just use antimatter on it. The AI has gotten a lot smarter since the game was introduced but it's still pretty dumb: mutating one of your creatures that aren't a major threat when you are rainbow into something much better, etc.
The real fun is in playing real people. I think everything else is just a grind, and it's already quite slow as it is. I'm quite thankful for the farm decks and think it speeds up the boredom that is already involved playing t50 decks against the AI. T50 decks also are especially prone to be poorly played by the AI. For instance, amassing fire quantums before using fire lance just doesn't register with the AI. A lot of these decks require specific strategies and sometimes heavy brainpower, and the computer just doesn't do very interesting things with those decks. Even the decks not made for farming at all can be ridiculously easy to beat and boring just because the computer doesn't know what to do with it: generally the more sophisticated the deck, the worse the AI does with it.
If we really want to make it challenging to win rares and based more on perseverance and skill than luck, perhaps rares should only be obtainable through pvp and false gods who at least have the extra hp, 3x mark, and extra draw to make up for their poor AI. For a truly elitist game we could have a system where a pvp win grants the winner the loser's card and the loser loses the card from his deck. Then it would really be the top players that have the rare cards only as bad players would not be able to win them and, even if they could, they wouldn't be able to hold onto them for long. That would also make the rares truly hard to get and keep, so people wouldn't design so many decks around rare cards.
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You can win rares in PvP, ai3/5, and FG's. And the game is meant to be a long term game, thats the point, it took me quite a while to get my first rare(other than the one I got from the quest) and to fill out what I have today. No reason we should be giving you the same thing we worked for on a silver plater.
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I still think theres no point in making rares harder to get. Noob people need them, and I think we shouldnt make them live with the disadvantage of not having rares.
In fact, some biting farms make me much more enraged than normal non farm decks. However, thats just me.
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I think one problem with the game is almost the exponential difference in the rate at which you can win upgraded cards and electrum between beginners and more experienced players. There was a time about a year ago when I started where it took me a couple of days just to earn enough to upgrade one card. I was so excited. However, after getting frustrating pvp matches against players with fully upped decks that were quite similar to mine (and frankly, I thought mine was a better designed smaller deck), I began to get more and more frustrated by how long it was taking me to upgrade cards. At the rate I was going, I'd have to play every day for a month or two just to get one upgraded deck.
That was until I discovered how to successfully farm FGs. After that, I was upgrading multiple cards every hour (this was before sundial nerf when fgs were so much easier and we could easily get something ridiculous like a 75% win rate even with a deck that wasn't upgraded). I feel sorry for those stuck in the same shoes as I was before. It took me a long time to realize how to farm FGs and the only reason I could start reasonably quickly (within a day or so) after starting was due to the kind people who had non-biting farms to give me the rares that these decks absolutely needed (the rares weren't a nice little option which rares probably should be). Biting farms might have been okay but then it might have taken me much longer to win eternity. On the other hand, elders didn't seem to award rares quite as often as they do now. Rares really are becoming less rare all the time, and I can understand the concern there.
I think one problem is the matching system in pvp 2. I have around 50k score right now and I get matched up with people with something like 1000 score with one upgraded card in their deck. It seems awfully unfair against my fully upped deck, but why wouldn't the novice, with his first upgrade card, not get excited and want to try it out in a pvp2 match when he invested all that time in upgrading it? It's not fun for either of us. I don't like beating down opponents with almost no chance of winning against me, and it's probably even worse for the opponent. Pvp 1 almost seems more appealing to experienced players than new ones to try non-upgraded deck ideas. Perhaps if the game matched more appropriately by similar scores or allowed players to refuse matches without hindering their score, maybe it would mitigate this problem somewhat and the fact that rares truly become rare would be more acceptable without discouraging new people to the game.
Perhaps another problem is with the slots. The random nature of them makes it difficult to win rares at any kind of consistent rate except from farm decks. It might take a few matches or it might take hundreds to win a rare from a regular deck not full of rares. Maybe if the algorithm as improved to, say, omit towers, the spin/win rate might be better. I still like the idea of selling rares at the bazaar for, say, 20,000 electrum (maybe 100k for a nymph). That's a hefty cost but we could make them truly rare but something one can win eventually without gambling with every victory.
Take nymphs, for example. I haven't won one. I've been playing regularly for at least a year now (maybe over), though oracle didn't exist until long after I started. I have friends who have won 6 nymphs from oracle in spite of playing a shorter time. I visit the oracle daily and have only won non-rare cards. It kind of sucks that I, in spite of putting a lot more time and effort into the game, can not win any nymphs but my friends who just casually play and farm level 2 can win multiple. That doesn't seem fair at all, so perhaps if this luck element was reduced a bit, it would be better. For instance, perhaps one can get a rare for every 1000 victories. That would still take ages regardless of whether you're farming elders, fgs, t50, or doing pvp matches (especially this), but it would reduce the luck factor (some could get lucky and win much sooner, but at least those who are unlucky could eventually win a needed card for their deck).
So if the general idea is that people should have to really put in some elbow grease to win rares, I'd agree if we make this consistent: reduce or take out the luck factor of slots and oracle and provide alternative ways to win a rare (it could require a ton of work but guarantee a rare to be won). Either this or implement a trading system so that when we win rares we don't need, we can trade them for something else we do need. That would make this like Diablo 2 where unique items that are very hard to come by (might play for months but never win one for someone looking to find that item specifically) yet unneeded for a character build can be exchanged for one that is needed. If either of these things could happen, I think rares could truly become rare: maybe we don't even need to win them from regular games, or at a much lower rate to make them super rare, but this way people are bound to win some rare which they can trade or win a rare of their choice after, say, 1000 victories which takes ages.
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Peaceful farms should be alowed. Having to try beat the decks of people with all the cards inorder to get the cards you need to stand a chance is frustrating. I avoided the top 50 for a long time beacasue of this. You can lose a ton of electum trying to find farms if you are not prepared and there are so few unupgraded strategies available. You need shards for many strategies so I had to play T50 to get them because ROL Hope needs them. Also 1500 per pupgrade is ridiculously harsh. 150 seems more apprpriate.
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Peaceful farms should be alowed. Having to try beat the decks of people with all the cards inorder to get the cards you need to stand a chance is frustrating. I avoided the top 50 for a long time beacasue of this. You can lose a ton of electum trying to find farms if you are not prepared and there are so few unupgraded strategies available. You need shards for many strategies so I had to play T50 to get them because ROL Hope needs them. Also 1500 per pupgrade is ridiculously harsh. 150 seems more apprpriate.
1500 for an upgrade is fine. The decks in the top 50 are actually easy to beat with a good enough deck, since a lot of them are usually the big time rainbows built for FGs. The Top 50 category was made for you to fight decks in the Top 50, not for you to scan through to try to get lucky with a farm.
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I was saying you have to actually fight your way thorough the top 50 to find so peaceful famrs are not a problem. How is 1500/upgrade fun? How is grinding suppsoed to be fun? Also what is they besides lava golems, shriekers, poison or fire decks for unuped?
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Peaceful farms should be alowed. Having to try beat the decks of people with all the cards inorder to get the cards you need to stand a chance is frustrating. I avoided the top 50 for a long time beacasue of this. You can lose a ton of electum trying to find farms if you are not prepared and there are so few unupgraded strategies available. You need shards for many strategies so I had to play T50 to get them because ROL Hope needs them. Also 1500 per pupgrade is ridiculously harsh. 150 seems more apprpriate.
150? thats a bit extreme. that would cost barely more than a dragon, fallen elf, etc. Maybe 750 - 1000 would be more appropriate?
I think 1500 is perfectly fine. I got my whole RoL/Hope deck upgraded in maybe a day.
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only necessary upgrade for RoL/Hope is the RoLs themselves
SoGs arent needed at all in its purest form
@stinky: not to rub it in your face (maybe i just did) but i thought going for nearly 2 months without getting a nymph is bad (just got my first nymph yesterday - entropy, just what i've always wanted). little did i know theres someone who hasnt got a nymph ever since the oracle exist. all the best to you man. hopefully you got whatever nymph you desired on your next spin
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The way I think about it is that you need to find a good dek and be good with it. Dont count on farms for all your cards. You should be happy that they are there anyway. On average, there are about 10-15 Farms up. (though ive only been playing a week or two) That means, if you go by statistics, if you beat 5 t50s, you will face a farm. So the farm is your reward for being able to beat the non farms. No need to get greedy when you are already getting help from people that dont have to put up farms. :)
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im not a t50 but yes i agree biting farms are way funner than the boring just clicking stuff
blarg: