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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74048#msg74048
« Reply #36 on: May 24, 2010, 07:03:42 pm »
I still say that a shard as a creature is way too farfetched. Sure, there are spell and permanent shards, but those make sense. I don't understand how a piece of raw elemental ore representing a virtue can grow legs and hit someone.
well Ash piles can hit people with good damge (rage potion it) so a shard doing only 2 is more believeable as it is magical afterall (can i use magical in elements ^^ :L :S)

Offline Kuroaitou

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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74059#msg74059
« Reply #37 on: May 24, 2010, 07:27:33 pm »
I still say that a shard as a creature is way too farfetched. Sure, there are spell and permanent shards, but those make sense. I don't understand how a piece of raw elemental ore representing a virtue can grow legs and hit someone.
Since when did shards have to grow limbs to actually inflict damage?

I thought of this shard as sort of a 'restless soul' being trapped within the confines of a crystal, and occasionally (after it's played), it emits an aura of pain and "restraint" against a perceived enemy, thus reducing their health in the process from the crystallized soul energies.

If this was a permanent like Shard of Gratitude (dealing damage equivalent to a dirk, except it's not in the weapon slot), would it be potentially better? It'd make it more consistent alongside the other shards, but I suppose that's up to Bloodshadow.

Offline BloodshadowTopic starter

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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74129#msg74129
« Reply #38 on: May 24, 2010, 09:26:27 pm »
I still say that a shard as a creature is way too farfetched. Sure, there are spell and permanent shards, but those make sense. I don't understand how a piece of raw elemental ore representing a virtue can grow legs and hit someone.
It's a crystal shard floating in midair with a will of its own. It shoots beams of energy to attack its enemies. Does that make sense?

Fractal + this... Hmm, haven't thought of this combo... Maybe somehow make it so that you cannot target it, but your opponent can? Or make this expensive so that it's not suitable for Fractal?
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74144#msg74144
« Reply #39 on: May 24, 2010, 09:48:37 pm »
Or make it lose 1 hp for every one you control.

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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74160#msg74160
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2010, 10:12:55 pm »
Or make it damage all your creatures for 1 the moment you play it...

Now, that 'disadvantage' would make it almost useless in combination with fractal, but would give funny results if used in :death decks.
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74320#msg74320
« Reply #41 on: May 25, 2010, 01:52:14 am »
I still say that a shard as a creature is way too farfetched. Sure, there are spell and permanent shards, but those make sense. I don't understand how a piece of raw elemental ore representing a virtue can grow legs and hit someone.
There are several places in Elder Scrolls 4 Oblivion, where you are attacked by floating shards. Its annoying. and I consider this game to be much LESS realistic than oblivion. BTW BS, I like the idea a lot. Im still worried about adrenaline (would it have the same effect on the shard as it would on a poison creature? )
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Offline BloodshadowTopic starter

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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74325#msg74325
« Reply #42 on: May 25, 2010, 02:01:00 am »
This effect activates every other turn, just like Devourer and Venom. I thought I put it in the notes.

Maybe I should make the cost like 8 random or something? Then it cannot be Fractal'd. I'm reluctant on making this card "mathy" by making its stats change when there are more Shards on the field.
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74509#msg74509
« Reply #43 on: May 25, 2010, 12:55:46 pm »
Increasing the cost should help make it more balanced. Any card that reduces max HP is extremly powerful so you need to weaken it in some way.
Is there a way to make it untargetable by you but not your opponent? That would balance the card fairly well.

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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg74535#msg74535
« Reply #44 on: May 25, 2010, 02:08:55 pm »
This effect activates every other turn, just like Devourer and Venom. I thought I put it in the notes.

Maybe I should make the cost like 8 random or something? Then it cannot be Fractal'd. I'm reluctant on making this card "mathy" by making its stats change when there are more Shards on the field.
Oops, I missed that, sorry. And yeah, it does seem like it would need a big boost to how much it costs, 4 would be too little if it required 4 of a single quanta, but since you could easily, with the right hand, play 3 of these the first turn, I think its a little too OP with fractal.

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As awesome as fractal is, and how much I like the concept of it, it makes developing cards a pain!
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg77526#msg77526
« Reply #45 on: May 29, 2010, 08:18:35 pm »
As we all know, Zanz has implemented a yellow spell shard called Shard of Readiness, which had completely broken the creature-permanent-spell trinity and red-green-blue trinity that I had in mind. However, I have already thought of a solution for this:

There can be six shards, represented by the primary and secondary colors of light. There are two creature shards, two permanent shards, and two spell shards.

Creature: red, cyan
Permanent: green, magenta
Spell: blue, yellow

We already have the green, blue and yellow shards, and they follow the above pattern perfectly.

Also, I said that Shards have abilities that affect HP. However, SoR affects creatures. But the pattern can still be salvaged: The primary colored shards will affect HP, while the secondary colored shards will affect other cards. Since the yellow spell shard affects creatures, the cyan creature shard could affect permanents, and the magenta permanent shard could affect spells.
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg77549#msg77549
« Reply #46 on: May 29, 2010, 08:37:48 pm »
So, a few quick ideas:

cyan shard:
cyan seems a defensive color (reminds me of phase shield) so if it has to affect permanents I'd say make it some kind of a permanent-protecting-creature. Eg. it could have an ability "Whenever opponent tries to destroy/steal one of your permanents, his attempt fails and this shard loses 5 hp"
This way it would work as a single-use protection for all your permanents, unless you use basilisk blood or something similar.
Possible to remove it with creature control, so that it's less OP.

magenta shard:
permanent affecting spells? First thought - some kind of damage amplifier for Fire Bolts, Ice Bolts and Drain Lifes... but shards should be useful for all elements... and in this case there are very few common things between spells, so the only ideas I have:
- reduce spell cost by 1
- whenever you play a spell, 50% chance to draw a card
something along these lines
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Re: Shard | Shard of Vengeance https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=5667.msg77567#msg77567
« Reply #47 on: May 29, 2010, 08:49:40 pm »
The magenta shard could be called Shard of Acumen. It could give you +1 quantum of the spell's element after you cast the spell; this effect will stack. Is this too weak?

The cyan shard could be called Shard of Protection, and as you suggested it could use its HP to protect permanents. Maybe it's a 0/6 creature that uses 3 HP to protect one permanent?

Oh, and this card should be renamed Shard of Vengeance so that its abbreviation would not conflict with SoR. Zanz personally approved this name in chat the last time I saw him.
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