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Offline The_Mormegil

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg222751#msg222751
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2010, 08:34:11 am »
@OldTrees: you should account for some things when you consider the slow start (which is the part I like the less of this card, since speed is power, and only versatility can match it).
1) This can be destroyed. AI can be programmed to have an increasing priority for this, so to steal it or explode it when it reaches good speed, hence wasting your quanta production in a terrible way. Pillars are "ready to go", and as such, destroying them is a pain but not as painful as a thing that you must tick up to efficiency before being useful.
2) This wastes a card slot. It is a quantum generator and as such, you would play it INSTEAD of Pillars, Pendulums or novas. Since this has a cost, you need pillars (or novas) to play this. With less of these cards in your deck, the probability to have a good hand are heavily reduced, and coupling the lack of normal pillars with the intrinsec slowliness of this card, you have a *very* slow deck.

Conclusion: as it is, this card may be balanced on paper, but will be rarely if ever used, since it is so slow that a non-rush deck would probably outrush you into oblivion.

Suggestion: add a minimum speed, and a cap speed. Possibly make it a standard speed, and if you want to keep the speed up ability, make it last a single turn and, say, double speed for that turn.
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Boret

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg223180#msg223180
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2010, 09:00:09 pm »
OldTrees: Ok, now I understand better your explanation, and I agree with you. Yet, it's quite a hard job to evaluate an average game unfolding (maybe because there is no average game unfolding, after all...) vs a single card. At this point, the only thing that'll tell us is experience, or statistics. If people like the concept, I can make a macro that could calculate average quanta production within a specified deck. Since it is automated, I could do something like ~500 simulations so we could get an overview of how it combines with other cards.

joebob777: thanks :) There is just this thing I don't understand, but you're welcome anyways :P
Quote
thanks for the earlier english boret
The Mormegil: I don't agree. Yes, this card is not fit for speed decks (at least I don't think so, we should see what would 2~3 of these cards do). You say speed is only matched by versatility. But tell me, what's more versatile that a card potentially providing you 1 of each quanta every other turn + a fair amount of quanta?

About point 1. I'd say that this is not the only card that takes time to set up that can be screwed by the opponent (any growth, ablaze creature for instance). It's just the game, and should you fear your EC may be destroyed, protect them, then.

Your point 2. makes sense. But once again, bad draws are part of the game, too. Even with a 30 cards deck, you can have bad draws. Hence, as I said earlier, only experience will tell us if you're right or not. As it is, I personally think that I would put 3 of them in a "standard" rainbow deck, for 3 :gravity is still affordable.

About the min/max speed, I'm not fond of the idea of having 10 lines of instruction on the card. It's true it is probably the best way to balance it, but the easier the card is, (though analytical details are a bit complicated), the better it'll be.

P.S.: I answered to your Temple Art request (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,17315.0.html)

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg223306#msg223306
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2010, 12:46:26 am »
joebob777: thanks :) There is just this thing I don't understand, but you're welcome anyways :P
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thanks for the earlier english boret
in my part of the world, when ever we need some help from some stuff we dont understand, we say "in english please" its what i was going for

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg223348#msg223348
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2010, 01:22:47 am »
suggested description
Cycle through 1 quanta each turn. after each pass, play one nova
 :time :time Speed Up: (cycles through one more quanta) max speed of 9
(optional)

Boret

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg223826#msg223826
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2010, 05:59:23 pm »
Ah ok, didn't know this expression.
I'll update description and art, but the cost is supposed to be  :time for both cards.

Anyway, with a max speed of 9, do you think it's ok for Crucible?

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg223988#msg223988
« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2010, 09:55:35 pm »
forgot it was 1 :time but yes, it is crucible ready

Boret

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg224904#msg224904
« Reply #30 on: December 15, 2010, 12:16:02 am »
Description & Art updated.

Thanks for your advices ;)

Offline AnonymousRevival

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg225808#msg225808
« Reply #31 on: December 16, 2010, 07:41:46 am »
Even if the card is :gravity, I see that the background is the Other element.
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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg226203#msg226203
« Reply #32 on: December 16, 2010, 11:42:00 pm »
Oops you're right, I updated the background. Thanks for notice :)

Offline EvaRia

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg226205#msg226205
« Reply #33 on: December 16, 2010, 11:46:09 pm »
You flipped the prices, it should be 4/3.

Offline ddevans96

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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg226206#msg226206
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2010, 11:50:19 pm »
The text on the card needs to match the text in the table :)

I like the card overall, though it might be too much quanta generation at the same time.

Also, there's an in game cycle used in the bazaar you might use, but the current cycle works too :)
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Re: Elemental Clockwork | Elemental Chronometer https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=17373.msg226478#msg226478
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2010, 10:34:15 am »
Ok, note for myself:
Edit cards only when own mind is clear :d

Anyway, thank you again for notice, card fixed.

ddevans96: Maybe, but I don't know. Only experience will tell, and I still have available adjustments so if it's OP we could still reduce max speed/raise the cost. About cycle in the bazaar, do you mean :entropy :death :gravity :earth :life :fire :water :light :air :time :darkness :aether (or is it wrong?). I wanted :time to be the 1st Quantum generated (so the 1st speed up could possibly be auto-fuelled), and also I wanted to have opposite elements at opposite directions.

On a sidenote, I made art for the Entangling Roots (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,15093.0.html), and I saw later that you were willing to do it too. Do you have any news from card author ?

 

blarg: