Round 1 Strategy

[majofa]

Post all your strategies here.

Napalm Grenade vs Boingo

Code: [Select]

majofa vs xn0ize

Code: [Select]

lava golem vs willng3

Code: [Select]

Svennigan vs Terroking

Code: [Select]

catalyzeme vs Noobiecakes

Code: [Select]

gavsword vs DSSCRA

Code: [Select]

Legit vs Jen-i

Code: [Select]

Dogg vs girlsgeneration

Code: [Select]

[majofa]

As far as the event card goes... we'll have to take it on a deck-by-deck basis....

It being the first round.. dropping cards to possibly win cards, may not be our best strategy.. what are your thoughts?

[catalyzeme]

Every extra game we win in the first round is a 12 card swing. For 13 cards, we could have every player play like a general. I think we should seriously consider sacrificing 9+ cards to try and steal a game. Obviously all the decks don't lend themselves to it (like Immophoenix), but we could also come up with new ideas that do. Lava Golem decks, Graboid decks, Twin Universe decks, would all benefit from upgrades. Stalls could potentially establish a lockdown quicker. Fire Bolts save you 2 quanta upgraded, for example. Miracle loses 3 cost.

If we sacrifice 12 cards (hopefully pillars and pends we don't need and will reconvert after the round), and we win 2 extra matches, we come out on top. Any deck we send in without upgrades has a pretty big chance of facing them, too. We should probably keep it situational, but I wouldn't mind some decks seeing 9-12 upgraded cards if that would make them more opportunistic.

As far as predicting decks goes, it's my opinion that it's impossible. Obviously we should still try to get into good match-ups, but I noticed last war that playing on an element's weaknesses backfires a lot. Maybe most of the time, in the first round. Every team is thinking "well everyone knows we have ______, so maybe we should play something surprising the first round."

I think we should spend more time figuring out what decks to play (as opposed to specifically against who), and how we can take advantage of the Event Card in a more significant way than just upgrading a few random cards that will help trivially. Decks that really thrive off a few upgraded cards would be good.


majofa  xn0ize
And I know I *just* said we shouldn't worry too much about the other elements' strengths and weaknesses in round 1, but death is going to be packing Soul Catchers, Skull Shields, or Bone Walls. I don't think there's anyway we see a deck without any of them (maybe two of them). An upgraded Steam Machine deck might be good here. Especially since it could pack Purifies. We might not know what they will play, but an upgraded Steam Machine deck with Purifies counters a lot of tactics.

catalyzeme Noobiecakes
Against , I'd like to see something with Dragons, possibly a Silence deck. I don't like playing them much 'cause they feel risky, even when they work perfectly, but they pass Wings and a well-placed Silence could neutralize a lot of their CC threats.

Svennigan Terroking
Against , who knows. They probably suspect several teams are packing Wings but don't know who yet. I vote we throw those at them somehow. Either Wings Phoenix or a deck Similar to the one posted. Plus, since Wings can be played off the mark, it offers the deck-out possibility if they bring EQs but only land creatures.

lava golem willng3
Aether is very hard to predict. Honestly, Fractix with Deflags instead of Phase Shields could work here. Other fast decks would too, but Fractix might have a better shot at fitting enough Deflags to take care of Phase Shields. If they don't have Phase Shields, they might be pretty easy to just rush. So I think maybe Fractix here.

gavsword DSSCRA
Everyone knows we have at least one Sanct stall so we might as well not hide it. We should play it somewhere. Perhaps against , in case they just decide to go Pandebonium right off the bad. Really though, it counters a lot of what they have. Losing to them with it would be bad, although giving anyone Sanctuaries is bad. We still need to play them. I think it's a good match-up, and DSSCRA likely won't be bringing upgraded cards. He certainly can afford it, since his unupped and rare collections are fairly complete, but Zeru might not make him. Zeru's team is stacked with players that can use upgrades without it being a huge cost. Plus, we want more cards. This is an important match-up all throughout the war.

Legit Jen-i
Who knows what they have, at this point. Reverse Time susceptible decks might be a bad call here, since we are widely known for quanta delicate rainbows as well as expensive creatures, but it might be worth it to throw something like Poisonbolt at them. Dune Scorps generally die from one RoF or Fire Bolt. Against a Dune Scorp deck, it may or may not out-poison. Keep in mind Bolts can do some damage pretty quickly though. I wouldn't be surprised to see something like a Chaos Power Dune Scorpion deck. Maybe an EQ based deck, too. Vreelys has the quanta to absorb a Reverse Time or two, and it has a very good chance of beating virtually any deck just with its speed. I think I might prefer that idea to Poisonbolt.

Napalm Boingo
This is tough. Light is a tough match-up and we don't even know what they are bringing. Honestly, I think anything non-rush here, just because I think risking the rainbow cards as opposed to Pends is a bad move here. Maybe the Bone Wall Poison deck? Upgrade 3 Bone Walls and 3 RoFs? Both of those are good upgrades, as they each save 2 quanta.

Dogg girlsgeneration
I feel similar to this one as to light. I am 100% jmdt (helped) put together a ridiculous vault for gravity. They are going to be much more formidable than their cardset would otherwise lead you to believe. Maybe something as simple as a straight up Fire deck with Reverse Times splashed in. Test the waters, give it a good chance to win (that would take out a buffed creature deck). jmdt loves Catapult, so Flying Titans are a possibility. Deflags will be essential here. At the same time, Reverse Time counters Overdrive.


These are completely preliminary, but those are my thoughts so far. I'll have more to contribute tomorrow, I'm sure.

[Legit]

I don't think we should use the event card at all. It's the first round and we have no idea what to expect. Losing only means discarding 6 cards, so winning is not crucial.

majofa  xn0ize
I think we should use the Poison bolt deck. It could potentially outrace a poison deck, and it has no creatures so any method of CC will be useless, which I expect Death to bring. Round 1 in War #2, Earth outsmarted Death using a Poison deck, so I think it's a potential idea.

catalyzeme Noobiecakes
Air has a lot of great CC cards against Fire, and I think we could use a Firestall here. Cat's idea of a Dragon deck with silence works as well, although cards like Owl's Eye and Fog Shield are a problem.

Svenningen Terroking
I think they'll use a Graboid rush with either Earthquakes or Reverse Time. EQ counters Firestall, and RT counters Immo. I'm pretty sure they will use one of those two, depending on what they think we will bring.

lava golem willng3
Aether is very hard to predict. <--- I agree. Higurashi as the master makes it even worse. A rush/immo deck or Fractix as cat suggested (Even though I'm against using the event card) would work, adding in deflags would be a good idea.

gavsword DSSCRA
Well, Poison bolt would work well here as well. We only have one, so I'd say use it against Death or Entropy. I don't think we should take something like a rush deck though, Entropy can counter those pretty well.

Legit Jen-i
They will probably bring Reverse Time, a Dune scorp deck is a possibility. A rush deck or an Earth duo with EQ might work.

Napalm Boingo
Discord + Chaos Power + Fire rush duo?

Dogg girlsgeneration
Taking RT against Gravity is a great idea, just throw some in a rush. Gravity can't stall well and RT counters most of their decks that they would use against us. (Catapult, flying titan, etc) Cat nailed this one.

[gavsword]

majofa  xn0ize
Bonewall Burn? It's hard to want to play a creature based deck with all the hate they have. Also a chance to use steam machines.

catalyzeme Noobiecakes
Dragonpowa or candlelight?

Svenningen Terroking
Wings stall, but aiming for deckout instead of win by bolt? My vote is maybe the last wings stall deck.

lava golem willng3
Candlelight is very effective. A RoF Sanct deck beats most of their options IMO.

gavsword DSSCRA
Sanct is big game here, but also any thoughts on an immo rusher? I'd rather use the candlelight decks for tougher matchups. My guess is they will expect us to use sanct here. Discord EQ grabbys for them.

Legit Jen-i
My money is on some sort of timebow with dune scorps, momentum and reflective shields. Quinted dragons?

Napalm Boingo
Excepting them to try stall, either dragonpowa with silences or candlelight.

Dogg girlsgeneration
I feel like the EQ Grabby decks would be quite effective, especially with such high priced gravity cards.

[catalyzeme]

Suggestions so far:
majofa  zn0ize
catalyzeme: Steam Machine deck, with Purifies, possibly upgraded
Legit: Poisonbolt
gavsword: Bone Wall deck or Steam Machine deck

Anyone who wants to try to put together a steam machine deck is obviously welcome. I might try to do one tonight. What fire bits it can take might depend on what other cards we use, but it should have some flexibility in what kind of CC/extra creatures it takes. I disagree with using a deck against them, as our decks use their most flexible cards. Possibly giving them an extra set would probably mean one extra round later down the line they can produce a solid deck using their best cards. Plus, in regards to Poisonbolt, I don't think we can outpoison them, as we wouldn't be blocking their Arsenic unless we brought Bone Walls too. Still, I think that's too risky a choice. I could live with it though. We definitely want to avoid Immolation decks here, due to Soul Catchers, and I don't think any of the Dragon decks has a chance because of Bone Walls. I think Steam Machine and a Poison deck are our two best options. Steam Machines for the strength, Poison for the surprise. I still vote Steam Machines though.

catalyzme noobiecakes
catalyzeme: Dragon deck with Silence
Legit: Firestall, maybe Dragon deck
gavsword: Dragonpowa or Candlelight

RE: Legit's comment, "cards like Owl's Eye and Fog Shield are a problem."That style of deck shocked me with how well it performs, and it's exactly because I would have thought the same thing. The only shield is really has trouble with is a PA'd shield or Bone Wall, because otherwise you just need to reserve a Deflag to play the same time you drop Dragons. Most decks can apply CC gradually really well throughout a match, so dropping Dragons one at a time they can kill em all off in one turn. If you can play 5 all at once, then a Blessed Otyugh can only take out 1, an Eagle's Eye can only take out 1, etc. If you can silence that same turn, you eliminate card based CC as well. And since you have a lot of both Dragons and PUs, its much easier to accumulate 5 or 6 in your hand. It's basically a quanta race, like in a Fire Stall. In a Fire Stall, you have to accumulate way more quanta, but you also have more defense in the form of CC. For the Dragon Deck, you are basically betting that you can accumulate around 50+ quanta before your opponent can kill you. Against a surprising number of War decks, this is the case. Most war decks are not built to work as a race against the clock. Obviously it fails against EQs and Discords, but CC is surprisingly not a big problem, if played correctly. I am going to test against some typical strong Air decks and see what I can do with a Dragon Powa variant.

Svennigan Terroking
catalyzeme: Wings based deck
Legit: they will bring Graboids or EQ
gavsword: Wings stall

I am making this assumption for Legit since he didn't specifically say, but I think we are somewhat in agreement so far that Wings is the way to go. They might have their clunky Basalt Dragons, since they *know* they are susceptible to Wings, but otherwise Wings is a great bet. It's EQ proof and stops Graboids and Steel Golems (two great upgrades, so good chance they play lots of them).

lava golem willng3
catalyzeme: Fractix
Legit: Immo rush or Fractix
gavsword: Candlelight

gavsword is right that Candlelight could be a good match-up here. Immortals would be a problem, but I don't think an Immortal rush makes sense against Fire. It beats very few of our decks. Fahrenheit + Bolts would probably be enough, combined with the healing, even if that was what we'd see. I think Fractix would work too, but I think I might be leaning toward gavsword's idea, so we don't give them more cards. Phase Shields and Fractals... I doubt they need too many more of those, but then again, Aether is a very restricted card pool.

gavsword DSSCRA
catalyzeme: Sanct stall
Legit: Maybe Poison. Not a rush.
gavsword: Immo rush

Immo rush is not the worst idea. Frankly, until we know their decks, I'm personally gonna feel like every deck is a bad idea. They beat us down hard at the end of last war, they certainly know how to beat us. We're shooting in the dark with whether they bring a counter similar to War 2 or a new deck. I am worried we might see Pandebonium though, right off the bat.

Legit Jen-i
catalyzeme: Vreely's or EQ based deck
Legit:  Rush deck or earth duo with EQ
gavsword: Quinted Dragons

I don't think I have anything more to say for time... yet.

Napalm Boingo
catalyzeme: Bone Wall/Poison
Legit: Discord + Chaos Power duo
gavsword: Dragon Powa or Candlelight

I think Candlelight is a bad idea here. We don't want to give them more Sancts. I don't expect them to try to stall, either, because I think they will feel the same way about us. Everyone already has realized how powerful Sanct stalls are with fire. I don't think they will want to risk giving us more. If they do bring Sancts, Bone Wall/Poison is a terrible idea, so maybe we should account for that in case I am wrong. Legit's idea of a an Entropy duo could be good. Discord won't scramble early, although it might be able to Deflag a Sanctuary or two early and do a bit of scrambling. Might be worth a shot. Quanta balance should heavily favor fire if it's just bringing Chaos Power and Discords. Chaos Powers can be run off mark. You basically just need Pends to play Discord. In fact, I might even prefer a straight up deck with Chaos Powers played off mark. I don't know. Maybe this is all off. I need to think about it more.

Might be better to just try to rush them, with deflags in case they play sancts. EQ/grabbies here maybe. Would slow their stalls enough to take them out.

Dogg girlsgeneration
catalyzeme: Reverse Time splashed fire deck
Legit: RT deck
gavsword: EQ/Grabby

I still think RT is a great call. EQ/grabby isn't bad either, but there might be somewhere else we'd rather play it. Like against Light. It would work, too, though!


Also, just in general, I'm still in favor of liberally taking advantage of the event card. Yeah, if we are gonna go 7-1, it would be silly. But without using it, I feel like we will be in a disadvantage in a lot of match-ups. I would expect something like 2-6 to 4-4 if we don't take it, just because it's a total crapshoot anyway, and we might end up playing the equivalent to 5-8 generals. Turning one loss into a victory saves 12 cards. If it costs us 10 cards to full upgrade that deck to win, that's better than losing with no upgrades (-4 vs. -6). Obviously we don't wanna upgrade everything, and we don't want to make it so we lose cards even if we win (like in that example), but sacrificing 2-4 cards in appropriate decks could help us steal a win or two. If we get 2 extra victories, it was brilliant strategy. We come out huge on top. If we get 1 extra victory, we probably still come out ahead (plus we inflict 6 more cards of losses to other teams). I think it would be foolish to not upgrade where we can. Even upgrading Pillars in some of these decks would give them a big advantage. I really, really support using this Event Card to the fullest extent.

[gavsword]

Also note the steam machine is weak against bonewall, which it's very likely they will play against us. If any candlelight deck is left open I will happily use it. For  specifically a feel like we could build a denial bow to use our main strategies in EQ and RT by modding some of the immo phoenixes.

[catalyzeme]

RE: the event card

If we go 4-4 with *no* upgrades, we get +0 (no change to vault total)
If we go 5-3 with 30 upgrades, we get +2 to the vault.

Upgrading is very low risk at this point, where people have cards they think they can live without anyway. I expect lots of teams to bring upgrades against us, so I think the different might be more realistically something like this:

We go 2-6 with no upgrades, we get -24 to the vault.
We go 4-4 with 30 upgrades, we get -10 to the vault.

30 is a lot of upgrades. That could easily net us 1-2 extra victories. I don't think Immophoenix needs them, but every other deck improves drastically with upgrades. Shriekers, Golems, Fire Bolt... we have lots of good cards to upgrade, either for damage or quanta savings. Even pillars could speed up our decks. I think it would be a huge mistake to let this Event Card pass us by.

[~Napalm]

I'm not going to get into an element by element breakdown just yet. And most of what I'd suggest has been suggested already.

I will say this though, It's very easy to convert Pillars and Pends this time around. Discarding a few and then turning some of our salvages back into them doesn't seem very problematic if you ask me.

[majofa]

...would have owned the deck

by majofa

Hover over cards for details, click for permalink

Deck import code : [Select]

593 593 593 5f6 5f6 5f6 5f9 5f9 5f9 5f9 5f9 5f9 5fa 5fa 5fa 5fa 5fa 5fa 5gi 5gi 5gi 5l9 5l9 5l9 5l9 5l9 5l9 6rl 71a 7do 8pm