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Offline mesaprotector

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg485203#msg485203
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2012, 12:42:44 am »
Posting a bunch of ideas, hopefully one or two might be worthwhile.

Hide from the Storm
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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 590 590 590 590 590 590 779 779 8pm


AI3 Testing: 5-0, got through a couple of really bad draws. Main weaknesses are lots of early CC and, of course, any opposing deck that doesn't use targetable creatures.

Early Chaos
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vf 50u 50u 50u 5rk 5rk 5rk 5rk 5rk 5rk 8ps


AI3 Testing: 4-1, only loss was to the rainbow AI when it played Discord and BH on the same turn.

Second Law of Thermodynamics
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AI3 Testing: 5-0, but most of the wins were by rush. I only even drew Hope in two of the games, and only played it in one (the last one). Might not work so well against faster rushes.

Coalescence
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4vl 4vl 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5f0 5f0 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f4 5fb 5fb 5gi 5gi 8po


AI3 Testing: 3-2, but kinda unfair to the deck; one loss was the Life/Entropy AI playing Emerald Shield, the other was being 2 HP short of OTK and then being Silenced the next turn.

Sudden Nightfall (I know it's not 50% :entropy , this isn't final)
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vh 5um 5um 5um 5um 5um 5um 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 61o 622 622 622 622 622 622 8pt


AI3 Testing: Not gonna bother, I know it sucks.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2012, 03:57:59 pm by mesaprotector »
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Offline Jaymanfu

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg485345#msg485345
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2012, 11:16:57 am »
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 590 590 5if 5og 5v1 5v1 61q 713 74f 77g 77g 77j 77j 7ae 7ds 8pm


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 55v 55v 55v 55v 55v 745 745 8pl


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4vd 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5f6 5f6 5fc 5fc 5fc 7ds 7ds 7ds 8po


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vn 4vn 4vn 50u 50u 50u 50u 5lm 5lm 5lm 5lm 5lm 5lm 8pq


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 61t 61t 61t 61t 61t 61t 8pu


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5lj 5lj 5lj 5lk 5lk 5lk 7jp 7jp 7jp 7jp 7jp 7jp 8pj


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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vn 4vn 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5og 5ru 5ru 5ru 5ru 5ru 5ru 5v1 5v1 7th 7th 8ps


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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vn 4vn 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 593 593 593 593 593 77a 77a 8pm


Overall I think we should use:
8 decks + extras or 9 decks (couple extras)
1. A good poison deck if its pandybone or pandysundial either works really
2. Grabow
3. Rainbow
4. lycan/steal
5. pheonix/deflag
6. fractal or dim shield
7. EQ deck
8. Mono
9. ???

Offline mesaprotector

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg485408#msg485408
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2012, 03:59:07 pm »
Tested the decks I posted just a little (results are in that post), I can test more later today.
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Offline Jaymanfu

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg485510#msg485510
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2012, 07:27:28 pm »
Id like to see some tests of our decks that can beat, the time gotp deck... and some of the other hard decks that we know we will see

Offline majofaTopic starter

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg485519#msg485519
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2012, 07:46:22 pm »
Spoiler for Totals so far:
TOTAL: 226 cards
43x Amethyst Pillar
5x Maxwell's Demon
7x Abomination
8x Purple Dragon
6x Lycanthrope
1x Dissipation Shield
12x Nova
11x Discord
6x Chaos Seed
7x Antimatter
8x Pandemonium
1x Purple Nymph
42x Entropy Pendulum

6x Dimensional Shield
2x Fractal
1x Lightning

1x Fog Shield

3x Steal
2x Liquid Shadow

5x Bone Wall
2x Arsenic
2x Death Pendulum

4x Graboid

5x Deflagration
1x Rage Potion

6x Black Hole

1x Forest Spirit

2x Reverse Time
3x Eternity
6x Sundial
6x Dune Scorpion
4x Time Pendulum

Poison Decks (43 cards)
6x Nova
6x Pandemonium
10x Entropy Pendulum
6x Poison
5x Bone Wall
2x Arsenic
2x Death Pendulum
6x Sundial
Spoiler for Poison Decks:
Pandebonium:
6x Pandemonium
10x Entropy Pendulum
6x Poison
5x Bone Wall
2x Arsenic
2x Death Pendulum
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4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 52o 52o 52o 52o 52o 52o 52r 52r 52r 52r 52r 542 542 71a 71a 8pk


Poison Dials
6x Nova
4x Pandemonium
5x Entropy Pendulum
6x Poison
1x Bone Wall
6x Sundial
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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vp 4vp 4vp 4vp 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 52o 52o 52o 52o 52o 52o 52r 5rp 5rp 5rp 5rp 5rp 5rp 71a 71a 8pk




Dune Scorpion (31 cards)
2x Pandemonium
8x Entropy Pendulum
2x Reverse Time
3x Eternity
6x Dune Scorpion
4x Time Pendulum
5x Chaos Seed (+1 more for the General)
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4vp 4vp 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5rk 5rk 5ro 5ro 5ro 5rt 5rt 5rt 5rt 5rt 5rt 5t2 5t2 5t2 5t2 6u2 6u2 6u2 6u2 6u2 8ps




Darkness Duo (31 cards)
8x Amethyst Pillar
2x Maxwell's Demon
1x Purple Dragon
5x Lycanthrope
2x Discord
2x Antimatter
6x Entropy Pendulum
3x Steal
2x Liquid Shadow
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4vd 4vf 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 5up 5up 5up 5uu 5uu 6u7 6u7 8pt




Grabbow Decks (43 cards)
7x Amethyst Pillar
1x Maxwell's Demon
3x Abomination
1x Lycanthrope
6x Nova
4x Discord
5x Entropy Pendulum
6x Graboid
4x Earthquake
1x Forest Spirit
1x Fog Shield
1x Nghtmare
1x Lightning
1x Black Hole
1x Deflagration
Spoiler for Grabbow Decks:
Grabbow (30 cards)
7x Amethyst Pillar
1x Maxwell's Demon
3x Abomination
1x Lycanthrope
6x Nova
2x Discord
4x Graboid
1x Forest Spirit
1x Fog Shield
1x Lightning
1x Black Hole
1x Deflagration
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vh 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vl 4vl 590 590 590 590 5c1 5og 61q 74f 7dm 8pm


Grabbow Denial (30 cards)
6x Nova
4x Discord
5x Entropy Pendulum
6x Graboid
4x Earthquake
1x Fog Shield
1x Nightmare
1x Lightning
1x Black Hole
1x Deflagration
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4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 590 590 590 590 590 590 593 593 593 593 5og 5v1 61q 74f 7dm 8pm




Fire Duo (31 cards)
10x Amethyst Pillar
1x Maxwell's Demon
2x Abomination
2x Purple Dragon
1x Dissipation Shield
3x Discord
2x Antimatter
1x Purple Nymph
4x Entropy Pendulum
4x Deflagration
1x Rage Potion
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4ve 4ve 4vg 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vn 4vn 500 50u 50u 50u 50u 5f6 5f6 5f6 5f6 5fb 6tv 6tv 8po




Dim Shield - Fractal (31 cards)
8x Amethyst Pillar
2x Purple Dragon
3x Antimatter
10x Entropy Pendulum
6x Dimensional Shield
2x Fractal
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vf 4vf 4vn 4vn 4vn 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 61t 61t 61t 61t 61t 61t 622 622 6ve 6ve 8pu




Discord/BH (29 cards) <--- To make this 6, we'd have to pull the Black Hole from the Grabbow deck
10x Amethyst Pillar
1x Maxwell's Demon
2x Abomination
3x Purple Dragon
4x Discord
4x Entropy Pendulum
5x Black Hole
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 55v 55v 55v 55v 55v 55v 6ve 6ve 8pl
« Last Edit: April 23, 2012, 07:55:53 pm by majofa »

Offline Jaymanfu

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg486058#msg486058
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2012, 07:25:29 pm »
A control bow, could - some CC and add a few more creatures if u need.
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TOTAL: 274 cards
36x Amethyst Pillar
4x Maxwell's Demon
13x Abomination
13x Purple Dragon
9x Lycanthrope
1x Dissipation Shield
18x Nova
13x Discord
8x Chaos Seed
7x Antimatter
8x Pandemonium
1x Purple Nymph
45x Entropy Pendulum

6x Dimensional Shield
2x Fractal
3x Lightning

2x Fog Shield
5x Wings
3x Owls Eye

3x Steal
2x Liquid Shadow
1x Nightmare

1x Mummy
5x Bone Wall
2x Arsenic
6x Poison
2x Death Pendulum

6x Graboid
2x Pulverizer
5x Earthquake

6x Deflagration
1x Rage Potion

6x Black Hole

3x Forest Spirit

2x Reverse Time
3x Eternity
6x Sundial
6x Dune Scorpion
4x Time Pendulum

1x Purify

4x Quantum Pillars

= 274
« Last Edit: April 24, 2012, 10:17:40 pm by Jaymanfu »

Offline majofaTopic starter

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg486062#msg486062
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2012, 07:43:07 pm »
This is a very good counter to the Time/Aether duo.
It was used against Death last War in round 1.
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« Last Edit: April 23, 2012, 07:45:49 pm by majofa »

Offline dragonsdemesne

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg486116#msg486116
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2012, 09:37:45 pm »
I think either of those novabows would do well against the time/aether duo.  In majofa's, I'm a bit worried that there's too much strain on earth quanta, though, and eternity would be killer on graboids, either forcing them to burrow or bouncing 8 :earth creatures in a deck that is already going to be strained on earth quanta.  Between those two lists I'd be more comfortable using jaymanfu's build against ghostal.

Also, nightmare is an excellent counter to fractal, because it fills the enemy hand with unplayable creatures, which in turn makes the fractal unable to give a hand full of useful things.  If we knew we were up against ghostal, I think I'd take jaymanfu's deck and do something like -2 chaos seed -1 lycanthrope and +1 nightmare +1 graboid +1 earthquake, or maybe even +2 earthquake.  Even a single earthquake would either catch them unawares with all of their pillars committed, or force them to hold a few back, and ghostal really needs a -ton- of quanta to work right; on team time we'd run it with at least 50% pillars/pends.

I'll be home from work in under 2 hours; I'll see who's in team chat then to discuss things.  I was going to sneak on earlier today but things got fairly busy; last war I usually checked in at work during breaks once or twice a day in chat, so I'll be around.

In regards to jaymanfu's suggestions for the vault, I'd prefer the wings/owl's eye (I already made my case for that deck) and the purify and earthquake.  After that, maybe one dusk mantle and some sanc/miracle, or more discords, or some phase dragons for majofa's idea using them.

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg486239#msg486239
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2012, 12:39:30 am »
Tested time ghostal here:
Spoiler for Hidden:
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5rg 5rg 5rg 5rg 5rg 5rg 5rg 5rm 5ro 5ro 5ru 5t2 5t2 5t2 5t2 5t2 5t2 5t2 61t 61t 61t 61t 622 622 7q0 7q5 7q5 7q5 7ri 7ri 8pu

versus this slightly modded version of jaymanfu's novabow control:
Spoiler for Hidden:
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4sa 4sa 4sa 4sa 4vh 4vh 4vh 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 4vj 50u 50u 50u 50u 52t 590 590 590 593 5c1 5c1 5f6 5og 61q 61q 77f 77f 8pm

Time won 4 games, Entropy won 3, though entropy could have definitely won at least 1 more had a human played it.  The last game I tested where entropy won, it played an early earthquake and that devastated the ghostal; it needs pillars real bad.  I'm going to design a new deck that uses that idea.

edit: Tested the same time ghostal against this entropy earth duo:
Spoiler for Hidden:
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 50u 593 593 593 593 593 77a 77a 8pm
and the duo won 4-1.  2 of the wins the duo got an EM by denying basically everything; I'd play like an hourglass and never get the quanta to do anything else.  The other two wins I'd get the dimshield chain going but not have enough quanta to fractal.  The one loss came because I got both the ghostal creatures early and played them because there was no creature control. (it didn't draw the demon)  I'm going to tweak it a bit more and I think we have a ghostal counter ready.

edit: Tried this entropy earth duo and it didn't do quite as well (3-5)
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4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vc 4vd 4vd 4ve 4ve 4ve 4ve 4vf 4vf 4vl 4vl 4vl 4vl 50u 50u 50u 593 593 593 593 7n2 8pm
  The idea was that the antimatters were weak vs eternity, since you can just bounce the creature to get rid of it, and that adding a demon and discord (and animate weapon since 4 discords is a lot) were better than having the golems, which aren't much better than abominations here.  If the duo gets an early discord or earthquake, it gains enough time to set up that it's usually fine.  The AI was also dumb because a human would be targeting the pendulums more to deny aether quanta, but the AI would sometimes pick the pillar stack just because it was bigger, and so the dimshield chain could be maintained if one was played, but if EQs were targeting pends, then the dimshield chain can break.

I think the deck should even play a 3rd demon instead of an abomination or the flying weapon, because if the dimshield chain starts, the ghostal can still win if it just plays both its creatures and eternity.  Even without fractal, it will win this way if there is no demon to kill them.

Basically, you win in this matchup if you get discord and EQ fast, and demon soon after, and you lose if you don't.

(also, jaymanfu pointed out in chat that the pulvy novabow is illegal; when testing I did realize that and I actually tested with -2 qp +2 pend but I forgot to modify this post)

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg486789#msg486789
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2012, 11:08:41 pm »
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TOTAL: 274 cards
36x Amethyst Pillar
4x Maxwell's Demon
13x Abomination
13x Purple Dragon
9x Lycanthrope
1x Dissipation Shield
18x Nova
13x Discord
8x Chaos Seed
7x Antimatter
8x Pandemonium
1x Purple Nymph
45x Entropy Pendulum

6x Dimensional Shield
2x Fractal
3x Lightning

2x Fog Shield
5x Wings
3x Owls Eye

3x Steal
2x Liquid Shadow
1x Nightmare

1x Mummy
5x Bone Wall
2x Arsenic
6x Poison
2x Death Pendulum

6x Graboid
2x Pulverizer
5x Earthquake

6x Deflagration
1x Rage Potion

6x Black Hole

3x Forest Spirit

2x Reverse Time
3x Eternity
6x Sundial
6x Dune Scorpion
4x Time Pendulum

1x Purify

4x Quantum Pillars

= 274
Looks good Jay... I'll take a closer look at it when I get home from work.

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg487288#msg487288
« Reply #22 on: April 25, 2012, 05:25:12 pm »
Cards have been added to the Vault. If it needs a change at all, now is the time to say something.

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Re: Vault Building https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38946.msg487321#msg487321
« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2012, 06:06:14 pm »
The vault looks fairly good in general to me.  I hate how small it is compared to war 4, but at least that's universal across the board :)  I'd have liked to see a holy flash or two for death/darkness, and maybe more maxwell's, to make sure we don't run out, but overall I'm fairly happy with it.  The time pends also seem a bit weird to me (the death ones make more sense for pandebonium) but would dune scorps really need those pends?  It's not a huge deal either way to me, though.

 

anything
blarg: mesaprotector,Jaymanfu,majofa,dragonsdemesne