Special Rare Cards

[Captain Scibra]

We already have the 4 full sets of rare cards: Weapons, Shards, Nymphs, Mark Cards.  But what about elements without that special 5th rare?  Water, Time, and Light have Arctic Squid, Pharaoh, and Miracle respectively.


Important Questions to Consider:
Do the other 9 elements deserve a special rare card? Why or Why not?
If so, what kind of mechanic should it cover?
Are there ideas in the CI&A that could potentially be rares for their element?
Do some elements already have a card that could fit rare status?

My Answers:
To me, I think that each element deserves it's own rare card.  I think it creates a balance in the value of the element as a whole, and it also deters the feeling that some elements have more potential than the other.
The current special rares all have on thing in common:  They actually aren't really special, as they all include mechanics that are already in the game, only on a potentially larger scale.  This highly suggests that each rare be an augmentation of the elements better purpose.
The CI&A is a vast sea of ideas.  I have no doubt there are ideas out there that could fit rare status if implemented to the game.  The question is if they belong to the game in the first place.
Absolutely.  There are cards that feel rare when I use them.  Phoenix would be a prime example.  It is unique, sure, but it augments Fire's best 'weapon':  Immolation/Cremation.  Fractal feels rare, but that is debatable.

What are your answers?

[EmeraldTiger]

i think the rarity in game is reflective of their price.
30 and under. 31 - 65 66-120 then it jumps 150 and higher
I may be wrong on values.

[xyan]

The 3 out-of-place rares seem to bring some kind of niche to their element that could make the element lack in strength without (water gets more cc, time gets more creatures and cc with  , light gets more healing power).

Do the other elements need something like this? What about rares for the other elements that fill a missing niche?
Cons: Most other elements seem strong enough to build monos with just rare weapons and have some variety to their deck, without the thought of missing some area of their strength.
Ideas: Fire getting a defensive creature? Death getting a vampire-ability creature? Air getting some sort of healing spell/permanent?

[Jyiber]

The 3 out-of-place rares seem to bring some kind of niche to their element that could make the element lack in strength without (water gets more cc, time gets more creatures and cc with  , light gets more healing power).

Do the other elements need something like this? What about rares for the other elements that fill a missing niche?
Cons: Most other elements seem strong enough to build monos with just rare weapons and have some variety to their deck, without the thought of missing some area of their strength.
Ideas: Fire getting a defensive creature? Death getting a vampire-ability creature? Air getting some sort of healing spell/permanent?

Vaguely the same opinion as I have. On that train of logic, you know who needs a rare most? Life 

@Captain Scibra I think every element should have the 5th rare. It would quell the incompleteness feeling my OCD hammers me with every time I think about this subject.

[dragonsdemesne]

I'd love to see more rares in the game for the other 9 elements, assuming that they could be balanced correctly.  If zanzarino ever sees this, I'd hope that he looks at life and gravity first, since I think they're two of the weakest elements, and could use a decent rare card to help them out.

I also wouldn't mind seeing other 'rare' series, like a set of shields or creatures, or even some other new rarity level set.  For example, a set of 12 cards that would be buyable in the bazaar, but were much more expensive (a few thousand electrum, maybe), or perhaps another type that could be earned only by defeating X false gods in a row, or that sort of thing.  It would be similar in difficulty to arena spins, but give more variety and new things to work towards ingame.

[Captain Scibra]

Probably the more important question to be addressed, now that the feedback relatively confirms that it would be better if all elements had a 5th rare, is what cards in game have the rare feel?

To name one, Phoenix.  Good attack/cost, and resilience unmatched (Specifically requires two hard CC cards to kill).  Practically Fire's best weapon when it comes to the speed of the element, primarily involving Immolation.  Upgraded, this synergy is majorly enhanced.  Definitely feels rare.

[nireus]

I'd love to see more rares in the game for the other 9 elements, assuming that they could be balanced correctly.  If zanzarino ever sees this, I'd hope that he looks at life and gravity first, since I think they're two of the weakest elements, and could use a decent rare card to help them out.

I also wouldn't mind seeing other 'rare' series, like a set of shields or creatures, or even some other new rarity level set.  For example, a set of 12 cards that would be buyable in the bazaar, but were much more expensive (a few thousand electrum, maybe), or perhaps another type that could be earned only by defeating X false gods in a row, or that sort of thing.  It would be similar in difficulty to arena spins, but give more variety and new things to work towards ingame.

I definitely agree that the 9 remaining elements with no extra rare card need one, but I also feel that this card should be a new one, at least for the elements which count a total of 17-18 cards (without Marks included). Looks like  definitely needs an extra rare card as it is already quite weak compared to other elements. Besides the fact that it would be great to see new cards in the game, it's also a matter of balance I think. As for  the addition of a new rare card would be very nice as Foil Chimera doesn't count as a new one towards the total number since its rarity consists on the special artwork. That said, I'd love to see new Foil cards added to the other elements as well  .

[Keolino]

I also wouldn't mind seeing other 'rare' series, like a set of shields or creatures, or even some other new rarity level set.  For example, a set of 12 cards that would be buyable in the bazaar, but were much more expensive (a few thousand electrum, maybe), or perhaps another type that could be earned only by defeating X false gods in a row, or that sort of thing.  It would be similar in difficulty to arena spins, but give more variety and new things to work towards ingame.

There are already 4 rare-series, so I don't think that there should be more. If there would come another one, that would be fine too.

But I agree with most of you, a new rare card for and probably one or would be really nice. But if there would come new "special" rare cards which can only be obtained in a special way, you have to consider, that till now, every rare card is obtainable by newer players. (Probably aside from marks, which aren't powerful enough for newbies to miss them.) As soon as a player can beat bronze and pvp not a single rare is out of reach. (And even if the luck you need to get a nymph by oracle sometimes feels stupid, you can still get them, or you can play them with nymph tears.)

But if one says now "x false gods in a row" you would only be able to get there with either oracle false god counters, or a special false god farmer. These would be the first cards which can't be obtained while staying with your own creative decks. (Since you need much more than the normal newbie-deckbuilder-skill to reach your own creative false god farmer.)

[OdinVanguard]

I remember seeing several discussions on rare cards.

A couple points I saw come up, that I thought would be relevant here:
1) Rare cards need to be balanced. This is actually MORE important for rares than non-rares.
---There are several reasons for this but the main one is that it will be very frustrating for beginners if rare cards are too powerful.
---This is particularly true now that arena is effectively the main place to gain rares. If rares are too powerful, then only players that have rares to begin with will be able to grind arena decks successfully in order to get more rares... So basically anyone just starting out gets #insert 4 letter word here#ed over.
2) Rare cards should be useful even with just a single copy in a deck.
---Again, needing to have 4 or 5 copies of a card that is hard to get just a single copy of is quite frustating for new players... think of how long it took you to grind for all those shards... now imagine how a beginner is going to feel if they realize that the rare they just grind for several days to get is useless without 3 to 5 more copies.

That said, I think seeing more rares in the game to balance out each of the nine other elements is a great idea.

Going forward with that, however, I think these rares should be obtainable from the level 3 AI's and up... Pharaoh is currently, arctic squid used to be and I think really should be again, as should miracle.

What I would suggest is:
1) Get a vote going to pick candidates for rares to fill out the other 9 elements.
2) Once the rares candidates are selected, have an event / competition /etc. to encourage players to come up with new level3 AI's that include the new rares. (we had a tournament like that in the past... I'll have to dig up the link)

There are already 4 rare-series, so I don't think that there should be more. If there would come another one, that would be fine too.

I agree here, although I think its really more like 4 complete series' (nymph mark weapon shard) and one incomplete 5th series... I think the best option is to flesh out the 5th 'series' (pharaoh, squid, miracle) to include 1 rare for each other element.

Also of note... of the 3 rares in the 5th series, none of them are permanents.

[Jyiber]

If done correctly, however, additional rares would actually be fun for beginners. Making them attainable but not impossible to collect is a healthy goal for players to work for. Card collecting is the best part of these kinds of games. I think this game doesn't have enough rares right now...

[dragonsdemesne]

I think you guys are misunderstanding.  Changing existing nonrares into rares is detrimental; it disadvantages those who didn't start when they were easy to get.  We aren't trying to make phoenix or dimensional shield into rares, we're discussing NEW rares.

[Keolino]

I think you guys are misunderstanding.  Changing existing nonrares into rares is detrimental; it disadvantages those who didn't start when they were easy to get.  We aren't trying to make phoenix or dimensional shield into rares, we're discussing NEW rares.

Nothing wrong with discussing all possibilities witch we can think of. How else would we be able to find out about the disadvantages of our ideas if we wouldn't be allowed to shout them out.


-->That aside, I can't even find where somebody would have suggested the change of nonrares into rares... (If there was one, I have to agree that I don't like the idea.)