Question... Illusions? Could deception be a useful game mechanic?

[Jyiber]

Very theoretical question for the community. I don't even have any specific cards in mind for these yet, but here it goes... Some ideas for cards along the lines of:

-enemy sees false quanta gain information.
-enemy sees false number of cards in hand.
-enemy sees false health information (for either player).
-stealth creatures and/or permanents that can't be seen except for when ______ happens.
-trap creatures and/or permanents that can't be seen and trigger effects when opponent plays ______.
-other deceptive ideas that I haven't shown here.

Thoughts about this subject. I have a feeling it might get negative feedback....

[storyteller]

sounds awesome, go for it

[furballdn]

No. These would be useless in PvE and useless in PvP as well since anyone observant would be able to tell, and the AI can't be fooled unless it's deliberately programmed to. It's the same reason why very few people use cloak to hide stuff, as opposed to using as anti PC and anti CC.

[Naesala]

No. These would be useless in PvE and useless in PvP

I agree, it just wouldn't work.

[tyranim]

like i said in a similar thread: i love the idea of illusions.
its just so juicy

[dragonsdemesne]

It would be really cool, but how would you tell the difference between, say, a stealth otyugh eating your stuff, or a desync?

[Jyiber]

No. These would be useless in PvE and useless in PvP as well since anyone observant would be able to tell, and the AI can't be fooled unless it's deliberately programmed to. It's the same reason why very few people use cloak to hide stuff, as opposed to using as anti PC and anti CC.

There is a question as to how the AI will handle and use them, but in PvP is where this idea shines.
In my opinion Cloak is not really a way to hide things. It's more like an extra layer of protection from PC and CC, and there's several ways to counter it.
These operate off the idea that your opponent will be unable to know what your doing. Things like a card that's invisible, doesn't leave a visible quanta usage, doesn't show it being played and leaves a empty placeholder card in your hand to fool them.

It would be really cool, but how would you tell the difference between, say, a stealth otyugh eating your stuff, or a desync?

Good question. I'm thinking a stealth creature would become visible when it uses any skills it has. Also, any damage a stealth creature is doing will be hidden until it's "stealth" is revealed. Probably some hard to miss animation showing the stealth creature and everything it did while invisible. There is a question as to how long it should last though, I'm thinking 2-3 turns...

[Shantu]

Illusions are great, and some of them can be made to work against the AI.

For example, an idea I've been having for a while but been restraining myself from spamming it:
Mirror Image
Create two illusionary copies of target creature and randomize their places.

Effectively you have one third chance of finding the real one with any CC. Copies would do no damage of course.

[furballdn]

People would notice when their hp actually fell if there were illusionary creatures.

[storyteller]

-stealth creatures and/or permanents that can't be seen except for when ______ happens.
-trap creatures and/or permanents that can't be seen and trigger effects when opponent plays ______.

these are actually the best ideas really. with multiple effects and a simple faxce down place holder, it is hard to know what is played until it acts

ambush party, creature that kills next creature played then leaves
sabotage, permanent that desrtoys next perm played
replica, permanent that copies next permanent played
stalker, creature that deals 1 damage to a creature when it attacks, etc

3-4 more and they will be usable easily, with the AI either ignoring or being very cautious when any are in play

[Shantu]

People would notice when their hp actually fell if there were illusionary creatures.

Quite easy to avoid, like it's always the first one shown to be doing the damage, no matter whether it's real or not.

[OdinVanguard]

I'll back it. I've been trying to think of how to make a card that would do something similar for a while.
(another idea for deception is "turn / play face down" mechanics).
I also proposed trap cards a while back in the design theory section...
At any rate if you can make some cool cards to show off the ideas you suggested it would really cool.

People would notice when their hp actually fell if there were illusionary creatures.

This is actually tougher to keep track of than you might think. Especially when there are a lot of creatures... and if the number still showed up even though the health value didn't change, I think it would be subtle enough to make finding the illusions difficult. So even if a very attentive player can see through, this would still promote skill and careful attention.
One possible solution though: have the illusions be linked to the creature they were spawned from and randomly shuffle their position each turn (like the ball under the cup trick).