Eternal Spells

[OldTrees]

Have you ever tested Relic in a match? Relic is a spell that remains in the hand when cast and can only leave the hand by being discarded. This unique mechanic could be used in card design to create interesting eternal spells. As always, implementation mechanics result in restrictions on what rider mechanics would be appropriate. Eternal spells are repeatable like activated abilities but as fast as spells. There should be a downside comparable to these advantages. Some downsides I have considered are Discard effects, Higher costs, Slower effects and/or constructive Effects. Negative discard effects would punish having more eternal spells. Higher costs would slow down the eternal spells. Slower effects would give the opponent time to respond to the effect. Destructive effects (Removal, Damage, ...) are much more effective when made eternal. Constructive effects (Buffs, Healing, ...) are also more effective but not ridiculously so.

So the idea is spells that remain in the hand when cast, have negative effects when discarded and have constructive rather than destructive effects.

Note on Eternal: Silence prevents casting eternal spells. (See Relic)

[Shantu]

Interesting idea, strangely enough I quite like it.

I could easily imagine making a spell out of it, that makes a spell eternal; much like the metamagic feats in D&D. However, it would have to increase the spell's casting cost to balance it, by 3 or 4, or even 5 I guess. So, for example, you could make lightning eternal but each instance would cost 6 quanta, which is very expensive.

I don't think making a series out of this is a very good idea.

[ZephyrPhantom]

Repeatable - when played, another copy is spawned in your hand.
Good idea. How do the following sound?

Vengeance
3 
Discard a card. Target creature takes 3 damage. Repeatable.

Basically an attempt at 'damage-on-a-stick' that could be comparable to OE (though OE does not risk losing the 1-for-1 card advantage and deals reduced damage).

Piety
3
Gain . If possible, target creature loses all of it's status effects. Repeatable.


Expands upon Light's 'conversion' abilities while giving them another cure card that could neutralize statuses such as Poison or Momentum.

Gene Splicer
3
1 | 1
- Target card in your hand gains Repeatable and +2 cost.

Gets around the potential spell-on-a-stick issue by making it an expensive duo/trio.

Rampant Cells
5
3 | 3
Repeatable. (When played another copy is spawned in your hand.)

Locust
2
1 | X
Swarm. Repeatable.
2 possible creature examples, 1 vanilla, 1 with Swarm as an experiment (effective against damage shields, perfect mutant/sacrifice fodder, etc...). Life seems the best candidate for this given it's swarm nature.
I will likely be developing Piety and Locust. Thanks for inspiring me.

[The_Mormegil]

  : Temporal Stasis
High cost (12 | 10 ), opponent cannot draw cards. Effect is cancelled when you draw a card. Eternal (goes back to hand after being played).

  : Awaken the Forest
High cost (10 | 9 ), create a Treefolk. Eternal (goes back to hand after being played).
Treefolk has random stats between 6 and 9, and a random ability from a list.

Stuff like this could be interesting.

[freemod1espilon]

What if an eternal spell had a large positive effect but it came with a negative effect that stacked each time it was used? Like adding 1 poison per use.

[OldTrees]

@Shantu
Metamagic is a very valuable idea, unfortunately an Eternal Silence would be more problematic for the metagame than Fire Stall was. Other implementations of metamagic would not have this problem.

I agree that 6 eternal spells would be too much. However I think that 2-3 specific eternal spells would be useful.



@ZBlader
Repeatable is a variation. Eternal describes an existing mechanic of not leaving the hand rather than being replaced (See Relic).

Lethal CC on a stick without possibility of removal is problematic in one card.

Gene Splicer might make Eternal Silence a Trio but such lockdowns should be avoided.

Piety and a Creature summoned by an eternal spell are interesting



@The_Mormegil
Eternal describes an existing mechanic of not leaving the hand rather than being replaced (See Relic).

Draw Denial is probably too powerful for an Eternal spell

a Creature summoned by an eternal spell are interesting


@freemod1espilon
A per use negative effect would be another good balance tool. Poison being a good example.

[Rutarete]

Just thought of this:

You must have more than one copy of this in your hand to play it.  I haven't decided on the effect yet, but the idea is that it's eternal by working back-and-forth. Perhaps there could be a card with example name: Eternal Spell that has a time border, and another with the same name but a life border. Each would have the above clause, but a different effect. This is italicized to note that it could just be the name of the card, (as in the example) instead of just a single card with a single effect.

However, ^ is not enough to be 'eternal', so something along the lines of "Eternal Spell must be played every turn," which doesn't designate a specific version (the life bordered one or the time one)

Thoughts?

[OldTrees]

@Rutarete
Brainstorming is useful

Requiring multiples would encourage Eternal Spell only rainbow decks and discourage other usages.

Requiring it be used every turn would reduce the number of decisions the player can make and thus reduce the potential for tactics.

[Shantu]

@Shantu
Metamagic is a very valuable idea, unfortunately an Eternal Silence would be more problematic for the metagame than Fire Stall was. Other implementations of metamagic would not have this problem.

I agree that 6 eternal spells would be too much. However I think that 2-3 specific eternal spells would be useful.

Didn't think of that. Such a lockdown would be worth the 7-8 quanta cost a turn. Same with Nightmare.
If such a spell existed, a limitation would have to be added maybe, which allows casting it only on spells that cost more than 3. The problem is, most spells are cheap, so this would limit its usage way too much.
Adding a clause specifically excluding Silence and Nightmare is.. barbaric, for lack of a better word.

The only possible fix I see (while keeping the idea the same) is to ban all hand-altering cards to prevent complete draw/play denial and such. It is a fair solution, I think.

What if an eternal spell had a large positive effect but it came with a negative effect that stacked each time it was used? Like adding 1 poison per use.

That sounds just like Neurotoxin. Casting such an Eternal spell could infect you with neurotoxin. Of course, simple neurotoxin counters would be increased by playing other cards too, which is not a big deal if the spell is powerful enough.

[esran]

a card like "deal 3 damage to target creauture or player. increase this cards cost by 1" could be cool.

[eaglgenes101]

Mirror monster
5 . 3|4. Eternal.

[bobknows]

if we are going to make eternal spells such as this then we need to have ways to remove them.
one option that i have heard of is a creature that causes the opponent to discard one card upon attack. (maybe this was done before in dune scorp?)
also, having the ability to make anything eternal will be problematic, ex: infinite silence, infinite nightmare, infinite rewind, infinite sundials or sosac etc...