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Offline OldTreesTopic starter

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg517236#msg517236
« Reply #648 on: July 02, 2012, 07:08:53 am »
I forgot. What's the theoretical fastest way to deal 100 damage assuming you have complete control of the RNG and your opponent does nothing?
IIRC
Quantum Towers providing 3 quanta of your choice each.
Pandemonium providing Mass Parallel Universe.

So perhaps it was
1) Photon
2) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
3) 3 :entropy -> Improved Mutation (Photon -> 19|6 Ruby Dragon with  :fire:Dive)
4) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
5) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 19|6 and 23|10 Ruby Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
6) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
7) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 19|6, 23|10, 23|10 and 27|14,  Ruby Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
Total: 92 damage turn 1 going first with 384 damage next turn.
If going second, a Ball Lightning can be inserted at step 3.5 for 4 Ball Lightnings, dealing an additional 20 damage.
Total: 112 damage turn 1 going second with 384 damage next turn.

Just want to point out that this scenario is impossible, due to the fact you cannot get ruby dragons from mutants.
Errata: I forgot Improved Mutation only created unupped creatures.

1) Photon
2) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
3) 3 :entropy -> Improved Mutation (Photon -> 16|7 Crimson Dragon with  :fire:Dive)
4) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
5) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7 and 20|11 Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
6) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
7) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7, 20|11, 20|11 and 24|15,  Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
Total: 80 damage turn 1 going first with 336 damage next turn.
If going second, a Ball Lightning can be inserted at step 3.5 for 4 Ball Lightnings, dealing an additional 20 damage.
Total: 100 damage turn 1 going second with 336 damage next turn.

Anyways, OT, I haven't been paying much attention to war. For round 11, if we assume everyone has a 50% chance of winning, what are the percent chances that :time will win war? :fire? :aether?
I have not been paying any attention to the current war and do not have the vault management knowledge to make an accurate estimate of their current positions.
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Offline Xenocidius

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518049#msg518049
« Reply #649 on: July 05, 2012, 10:42:58 am »
OldTrees has asked me to announce that he is experiencing connectivity issues and may not have forum access for a while. That said, keep the questions coming.
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Offline OldTreesTopic starter

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518135#msg518135
« Reply #650 on: July 05, 2012, 03:54:35 pm »
Thanks Xenocidius. The connectivity problems appear to be over now.
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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518397#msg518397
« Reply #651 on: July 06, 2012, 10:34:56 am »
1) Photon
2) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
3) 3 :entropy -> Improved Mutation (Photon -> 16|7 Crimson Dragon with  :fire:Dive)
4) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
5) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7 and 20|11 Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
6) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
7) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7, 20|11, 20|11 and 24|15,  Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
Total: 80 damage turn 1 going first with 336 damage next turn.
If going second, a Ball Lightning can be inserted at step 3.5 for 4 Ball Lightnings, dealing an additional 20 damage.
Total: 100 damage turn 1 going second with 336 damage next turn.

Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed.

Photon+Mutation => 17 Crimson Dragon.
22 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
27 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
32 Crimson Dragon from Seed.

Or Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Seed, SoR, something

Photon+Mutation => 15 Devonian Dragon with Dive.
Sor => 60 attack Devonian Dragon.
Chaos Seed, party. 65 attack Devonian Dragon.


If going second, there is the chance to change that something with 1 more SoR and 1 more QT. Just to make things insane.
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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518494#msg518494
« Reply #652 on: July 06, 2012, 05:16:11 pm »
1) Photon
2) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
3) 3 :entropy -> Improved Mutation (Photon -> 16|7 Crimson Dragon with  :fire:Dive)
4) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
5) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7 and 20|11 Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
6) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
7) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7, 20|11, 20|11 and 24|15,  Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
Total: 80 damage turn 1 going first with 336 damage next turn.
If going second, a Ball Lightning can be inserted at step 3.5 for 4 Ball Lightnings, dealing an additional 20 damage.
Total: 100 damage turn 1 going second with 336 damage next turn.

Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed.

Photon+Mutation => 17 Crimson Dragon.
22 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
27 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
32 Crimson Dragon from Seed.

Or Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Seed, SoR, something

Photon+Mutation => 15 Devonian Dragon with Dive.
Sor => 60 attack Devonian Dragon.
Chaos Seed, party. 65 attack Devonian Dragon.


If going second, there is the chance to change that something with 1 more SoR and 1 more QT. Just to make things insane.
Good point about SoR (to use the mutant's ability) and Chaos Seed(cheaper pandamonium if only 1 target, though 2 QT + 2 Pandamonium = 1 QT + 3 Seeds)

Improved mutation is +0-4|+0-4 A 16|7 (12|3 +4|+4)Crimson Dragon is the best stats mutation can initially obtain.

Devonian Dragon is not able to be obtained by mutation.

I need to check if multiple dives in the same turn stack. (Otherwise Mitosis might be better)
« Last Edit: July 06, 2012, 05:24:01 pm by OldTrees »
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Offline Jyiber

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518554#msg518554
« Reply #653 on: July 06, 2012, 10:19:50 pm »
Two questions for the same card idea.

Thoughts on reusing a name that's been used multiple times, in this case Locust.

Thoughts on this card idea:
Locust  1|1 creature
-  Cost Undecided (what do you think would be balanced for life cost theory?)
-  Enters game burrowed. Skill: (Sacrifice card) create 3 Locust Eggs.

Locust Egg
-  0|1 creature
-  Skill: Hatch into Locust.

Wondering what costs should be applied to the skills. I'm thinking 1  :life :earth or :time
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Offline OldTreesTopic starter

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg518752#msg518752
« Reply #654 on: July 07, 2012, 08:01:52 am »
Two questions for the same card idea.

Thoughts on reusing a name that's been used multiple times, in this case Locust.

Thoughts on this card idea:
Locust  1|1 creature
-  Cost Undecided (what do you think would be balanced for life cost theory?)
-  Enters game burrowed. Skill: (Sacrifice card) create 3 Locust Eggs.

Locust Egg
-  0|1 creature
-  Skill: Hatch into Locust.

Wondering what costs should be applied to the skills. I'm thinking 1  :life :earth or :time
1|1 immaterial creature that can triple its attack every other turn at the cost of not attacking for a turn and temporary partial vulnerability to CC.

I would reccomend:
The initial skill be :life: (Sacrifice card) create 3 Locust Eggs. [Tie a exponential cost to the exponential benefit]
The second skill be  0: Hatch into Locust. [Have the cost be paid before the vulnerability to increase the significance of the vulnerability]
The 1|1 burrowed body with that pair of abilities is probably worth 3 :life + 1 card.


1) Photon
2) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
3) 3 :entropy -> Improved Mutation (Photon -> 16|7 Crimson Dragon with  :fire:Dive)
4) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
5) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7 and 20|11 Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
6) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
7) 3 :entropy -> Pandemonium (Parallel Universe -> 16|7, 20|11, 20|11 and 24|15,  Crimson Dragons with  :fire:Dive)
Total: 80 damage turn 1 going first with 336 damage next turn.
If going second, a Ball Lightning can be inserted at step 3.5 for 4 Ball Lightnings, dealing an additional 20 damage.
Total: 100 damage turn 1 going second with 336 damage next turn.

Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed, Chaos Seed.

Photon+Mutation => 17 Crimson Dragon.
22 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
27 Crimson Dragon from Seed.
32 Crimson Dragon from Seed.

Or Hand: Photon, Mutation, QT, QT, Seed, SoR, something

Photon+Mutation => 15 Devonian Dragon with Dive.
Sor => 60 attack Devonian Dragon.
Chaos Seed, party. 65 attack Devonian Dragon.


If going second, there is the chance to change that something with 1 more SoR and 1 more QT. Just to make things insane.
Good point about SoR (to use the mutant's ability) and Chaos Seed(cheaper pandamonium if only 1 target, though 2 QT + 2 Pandamonium = 1 QT + 3 Seeds)

Improved mutation is +0-4|+0-4 A 16|7 (12|3 +4|+4)Crimson Dragon is the best stats mutation can initially obtain.

Devonian Dragon is not able to be obtained by mutation.

I need to check if multiple dives in the same turn stack. (Otherwise Mitosis might be better)

Ghost of the Past (unupped) is the highest attack Time creature a mutant can be.
An improved mutant can get up to +4|+4

1) Quantum Tower -> 3 :entropy
2) Supernova -> 22 :rainbow
3) Photon
4) 3 :entropy -> Mutation(Photon) -> 11|8  :time:Dive Ghost of the past
5-7) 9 :rainbow -> SoR(Ghost) x3 -> x2^(2x3)=x64 attack = 704|8 Ghost of the past turn 1 going first.
Hand Summary: Quantum Tower, Supernova, Photon, Mutation, Shard of Readiness x3
Quanta remaining: 13 non :entropy
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Offline furballdn

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg519019#msg519019
« Reply #655 on: July 08, 2012, 02:47:08 am »
Hello again OldTrees! If I were to make a card that allowed protection of your permanents based on the number of airborne creatures you have (like one airborne creature=one permanent protected), where would weapon/shield fall in the queue? Before pillars/others? After? In between? If such a card exists, would it be bad if the upped form of it used other quanta?

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg519026#msg519026
« Reply #656 on: July 08, 2012, 03:32:44 am »
Hello again OldTrees! If I were to make a card that allowed protection of your permanents based on the number of airborne creatures you have (like one airborne creature=one permanent protected), where would weapon/shield fall in the queue? Before pillars/others? After? In between? If such a card exists, would it be bad if the upped form of it used other quanta?
For simplicity I would suggest permanents be selected in numerical order (1-3, S, 6-9, W, 11+). Skip the mark [5] of course. Usually this means it will be Pillars, Misc, Shield then Weapon.
I would recommend the card be airborne so it can be self sufficient. (and not protect itself)
I would recommend the upped still cost :air but I see good reasons for it costing  :rainbow too. It has a strong thematic connection to Air but has sufficient support outside of Air that it could work mechanically as an other card. I think theme wins in this case but the opposition is not certain.
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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg519029#msg519029
« Reply #657 on: July 08, 2012, 03:37:27 am »
Hello again OldTrees! If I were to make a card that allowed protection of your permanents based on the number of airborne creatures you have (like one airborne creature=one permanent protected), where would weapon/shield fall in the queue? Before pillars/others? After? In between? If such a card exists, would it be bad if the upped form of it used other quanta?
For simplicity I would suggest permanents be selected in numerical order (1-3, S, 6-9, W, 11+). Skip the mark [5] of course. Usually this means it will be Pillars, Misc, Shield then Weapon.
I would recommend the card be airborne so it can be self sufficient. (and not protect itself)
I would recommend the upped still cost :air but I see good reasons for it costing  :rainbow too. It has a strong thematic connection to Air but has sufficient support outside of Air that it could work mechanically as an other card. I think theme wins in this case but the opposition is not certain.
Well that could work. Putting all the permanents in a queue (pillars and misc first based on order of play, then shield then weapon). One airborne creature protects one each. I was actually thinking this card be a permanent, so it could synergize very well with mono air and SoFre. I thought of a 3|2 :air cost at first, but now I'm considering 3 :air unupped and 3 :rainbow upped. It'd make it more flexible while not being overly splashable.

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg519066#msg519066
« Reply #658 on: July 08, 2012, 06:28:54 am »
Hello again OldTrees! If I were to make a card that allowed protection of your permanents based on the number of airborne creatures you have (like one airborne creature=one permanent protected), where would weapon/shield fall in the queue? Before pillars/others? After? In between? If such a card exists, would it be bad if the upped form of it used other quanta?
For simplicity I would suggest permanents be selected in numerical order (1-3, S, 6-9, W, 11+). Skip the mark [5] of course. Usually this means it will be Pillars, Misc, Shield then Weapon.
I would recommend the card be airborne so it can be self sufficient. (and not protect itself)
I would recommend the upped still cost :air but I see good reasons for it costing  :rainbow too. It has a strong thematic connection to Air but has sufficient support outside of Air that it could work mechanically as an other card. I think theme wins in this case but the opposition is not certain.
Well that could work. Putting all the permanents in a queue (pillars and misc first based on order of play, then shield then weapon). One airborne creature protects one each. I was actually thinking this card be a permanent, so it could synergize very well with mono air and SoFre. I thought of a 3|2 :air cost at first, but now I'm considering 3 :air unupped and 3 :rainbow upped. It'd make it more flexible while not being overly splashable.
Clarification: I did not say "Putting all the permanents in a queue (pillars and misc first based on order of play, then shield then weapon)". The shield is the 4th permanent slot. The weapon is the 10th permanent slot. I suggested having it protect the permanents from lowest to highest slot.

One question you should consider when designing effects: "How do I want this effect to be able to be removed?"
If it were a cheap permanent then it would be removed by killing all but 1-2 airborne creatures and then using 1 PC.
If it were a resilient creature then it would be either using multiple CC on it or using CC on a few airborne creatures.

Provided it is balanced at 3 :air, 3 :air|3 :rainbow would be a fair upgrade. I think it is probably balanced around that cost depending on the final difficulty of removing it.
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Ask the Idea Guru: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32272.0.htm

Offline furballdn

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Re: Ask the Idea Guru https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=32272.msg519345#msg519345
« Reply #659 on: July 08, 2012, 11:21:56 pm »
Ah. shield was 4 and weapon is 10. That makes things a lot easier, since I thought shield and weapon were 22 and 23. Then yes, permanents are protected from lowest to highest.

How can this be removed? If it's a permanent, it'd be often played second or third in a mono air deck I imagine, so it'd require some light CC (or AoE CC) and a deflag/steal.

I priced it at 3 :air, since I tried to balance it to cloak. It requires creatures to be useful, so I made it slightly cheaper than unupped cloak. Is the requirement for its removal too much though for its price?

 

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