Starlit Sky | Celestial Sky

[Purity_Riot]

I meant the somewhat random choice of elements. Some are left out all together. There doesn't seem to be a point to a card that favours a random handful or elements, forsakes another equal handful, and ignores the rest. Quantum production should be balanced, otherwise it's going to effect the core of the game. Without more cards in the series, this one card is unbalanced, and thus breaks the rules about individual cards in a series being able to be implemented on their own. Without other cards giving the same favour to another random handful, until you have a bunch that all equal out, this card is at it's base, unbalanced and pointless in the current game.

[Avenger]

This card will seriously suck against discord

[Kael Hate]

I meant the somewhat random choice of elements. Some are left out all together. There doesn't seem to be a point to a card that favours a random handful or elements, forsakes another equal handful, and ignores the rest. Quantum production should be balanced, otherwise it's going to effect the core of the game. Without more cards in the series, this one card is unbalanced, and thus breaks the rules about individual cards in a series being able to be implemented on their own. Without other cards giving the same favour to another random handful, until you have a bunch that all equal out, this card is at it's base, unbalanced and pointless in the current game.

Why does Quantum production affect the balance of the game any more than any new card affects the balance of the game, if that card on its own does not break an environmental curve?

If said card can only exist in the presence of another card(s) that offset any gain that the card gives how can said card ever be individually evaluated to make it through the levels of card design?

That also being said if a card like Fractal offsets the card advantage to Aether over any other element is it not also causing an inbalance and should it not have ever been designed without a counterbalance put in place?

May I ask what other Card Games you have played so I may find a design reference I can relate with?

[Purity_Riot]

MtG, Pokemon trading card game back in the day, Yu-Gi-Oh, also back in the day.

It offsets the balance because Quanta Production is a core mechanic in the game. This card incorporates so many of the elements without incorporating all of them, so the others are left out in the dust with no rhyme or reason.

It's not that each card needs to be offset, but what you've essentially done is taken the colour wheel,

 


and said....

 

I like these colours, that's all that's going to be in my world. Forget the others, they do not need to be included.

[Kael Hate]

MtG, Pokemon trading card game back in the day, Yu-Gi-Oh, also back in the day.

It offsets the balance because Quanta Production is a core mechanic in the game. This card incorporates so many of the elements without incorporating all of them, so the others are left out in the dust with no rhyme or reason.

It's not that each card needs to be offset, but what you've essentially done is taken the colour wheel,

 


and said....

 

I like these colours, that's all that's going to be in my world. Forget the others, they do not need to be included.

Magic is the only one of those that has a costing resource control. Do you still play?

In the Standard environment there are lots of examples, but lets use "Keeper of Progenitus" and "Druid of the Anima", both of these cards are not considered top tier in any fashion but they only offer Mana of Red, White and Green. They have not unbalanced the game in any way but offer no bonus for Blue or black and there is no counter balancing variant that gives Blue or Black a mana producer. In a game that is the top of the genre for may years if they can create cards without spectral balance why can't they exist here?
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=175033
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=174903

As to limiting what the card gives you, it is to deliberately reduce the combinations it can be coupled with. It is very unlikely to stop any particular deck creation but gives you a technical limitation preventing you from taking the best of all worlds and putting it in one deck. If you want the better production that this card gives, you'll have to give up the Mutation part of your rainbow deck. Its just a quirk of the card, just like Immortals get the Immunity from your opponents targeting but sadly you can't pump them up with blessing.

As for the "I like these colours, that's all that's going to be in my world. Forget the others, they do not need to be included." thats only on this card. Just as Anubis has no care for Life decks and neither does this. There are other cards that can be made, In fact I have a set of 12 that work mechanically in this price range with different mechanics. All of them can work independantly and open up Duo Trio And more element combinations.

If this is still not enough for you then I ask you. What would your version of an Aether card that produced quanta to allow it to synergise with some other elements do?

[dekskose]

i think its good think of it play mark aether and you have no problem for trio decks with this card maybe liquid shadow +monoaether(dim shields)with devourers and anubis or something

[Purity_Riot]

My only problem with the reference is that there's an odd number of colours in MtG, where as we have an even number, and even then this number provides mana for sixty percent of the colours.
Your card provides mana for 33 percent of the elements, while denying another 33 percent of them, and ignoring the last bit.

Also, there is an entire story and in depth history behind MtG, but that's not the case with elements. The flavour of their cards gives explanation behind cards like this that appear to favour one group of elements over another.

Unless the other cards are implemented, that still leaves this one to be fairly out of place.

Also, if I created an aether card that provided quanta, it would either provide quanta for one other element, or some other number that can be multiplied into twelve. 2 3 4 6. Eight just seems random and out of place.

[dekskose]

absoulutly not random elements,,,

Nice idea for the quantum mechanics but shouldn't Entropy be celestial too? I would put "gains  and consumes  " It would make sense more.

Look up at the sky at night, it is a collection of celestial bodies stuck in an enternal aether showing the same trail from the dawn of time until its end. THis is the reason for choosing and . The things that the sky ignores are menial things like life and death, they matter not to the heavens. The small forms of mass and chaos cannot change the heavens and there is no understanding of them through coteplation of the sky.

Another way to look at it is that the heavens are and acknowledgement of the Logical Energies - Time (defined), Light (positive), Aether (infinite), Darkness (negative) and that contemplating the Logical energies mean you lose access to the Transversal Enegies - Life (Coherent Energy), Gravity (Internal Energy), Death (Incoherent Energy), Entropy (External Energy)

I don't understand your view, can you explain it to me?

[Purity_Riot]

Yes, but there's no way of knowing this based solely of the card and other present lore. You'd have to hunt down the forums.

and, be that as it may, i'd have to say that it's not a very accurate description of the sky. Looking up at the night sky, you'll see  doing it's job all over the place. You can't look up without seeing  . The stars themselves are light and heat energy. So  and  .

Say a comet is flying by?  in the form of ice.

[dekskose]

im sure you cant see the atmoshphere so gravity and im not sure how good you can see the air with your eyes and if you see the stars you see just some light wich is only light and fire on stars you see also 100%ly not
same water...

[Scaredgirl]

I think copying MtG would be the worst possible path for Elements, which is why I don't care at all how things are done in MtG. Elements differs from traditional CCG's because it's not designed to get people to buy new cards every couple of months.

Do we really want this:

"You cannot do this because it's done differently in MtG!"
"You have to do it like this because this is how it's done in MtG!"

[Kael Hate]

I think copying MtG would be the worst possible path for Elements, which is why I don't care at all how things are done in MtG. Elements differs from traditional CCG's because it's not designed to get people to buy new cards every couple of months.

Do we really want this:

"You cannot do this because it's done differently in MtG!"
"You have to do it like this because this is how it's done in MtG!"

I used magic because they have a tried and true example of professional design, and he was aware of the Game. I don't believe we should copy MtG but I'm sure we can apply the practices and experience that the game has shown to elements.