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Elements the Game => Level 1 - Crucible => Card Ideas and Art => Crucible Archive => Topic started by: ZephyrPhantom on March 20, 2011, 09:31:27 pm

Title: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: ZephyrPhantom on March 20, 2011, 09:31:27 pm

(http://imageplay.net/img/m7Gbd161417/elements_EA.png)	(http://imageplay.net/img/m7Gbd161416/elements_ES.png)
NAME: Entropy Adept ELEMENT: Entropy COST: 3  :entropy TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 1 | 4 TEXT:   :entropy :entropy : Chaoscast - Add a random Entropy spell to your hand.	NAME: Entropy Sage ELEMENT: Entropy COST: 3  :entropy TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 1 | 5 TEXT: :entropy :entropy : Chaoshex - Add a random Entropy spell to your hand.

ART: Zblader IDEA: Zblader NOTES: A card that can spawn spells in your hand (without relying on the opponent's field), which is something I think may be an interesting effect ingame. Also gentlemen (and ladies), he's not upside-down, you're just sitting upside-down.  ;) :entropy Entropony Entropy, chaos. Luck, weighted dice, and gambles. Look, a pink pony. SERIES: Sage Series (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,22551.0.html)

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: Jocko on March 20, 2011, 10:00:34 pm

Quote from: Zblader on March 20, 2011, 09:31:27 pm

Also gentlemen (and ladies), he's not upside-down, you're just sitting upside-down.  ;)

How did you know? O_O
Interesting idea. You would cast the skill and a nova/mutation/chaos power/pandemonium/antimatter would pop into your hand? Or it would be drawn from the deck instead?

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: Wonder on March 20, 2011, 10:01:34 pm

Antimatter would get so annoying with this card...

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: ZephyrPhantom on March 20, 2011, 10:03:27 pm

Quote from: Jocko on March 20, 2011, 10:00:34 pm

Quote from: Zblader on March 20, 2011, 09:31:27 pm

Also gentlemen (and ladies), he's not upside-down, you're just sitting upside-down.  ;)

How did you know? O_O
A little birdy told me.  :P
Interesting idea. You would cast the skill and a nova/mutation/chaos power/pandemonium/antimatter would pop into your hand? Or it would be drawn from the deck instead?

It would appear in your hand. You don't draw it from the deck.

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: ZephyrPhantom on March 23, 2011, 11:26:46 pm

Bump for additional feedback before I submit to Crucible.

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: TuckingFypo on March 24, 2011, 12:18:12 am

I don't like this card.  I know it's a bad reason, but it's because of a gut feeling.  It just feels like having, in a sense unlimited Pandemonium's/AM's/Mutations, would be OP.  I don't have mathematical proof or a well though-out argument to back this up, so please prove me wrong. xD

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: ZephyrPhantom on March 24, 2011, 01:02:41 am

Well, consider that Mindgate can copy various cards from the opponent's deck and you can use them against the opponent provided you have the right quanta.

From Entropy Adept you can get :
Note that I add the ability cost from Entropy Adept into the final cost for the card played.

Chaos Seed - Decent CC that may do about 2-3 damage. 3  :entropy spent.
Nova - 1 quantum for each element, possible rainbow. 2 :entropy spent (Almost like a half-Supernova)
Mutation - 50% Abomination , 40% Mutant, 10% dead creature. 4 :entropy spent.
Antimatter - Invert attack. 10 :entropy spent.
Butterfly Effect - Target a < 3 attack creature and give it  :entropy :entropy :entropy Destroy. 7 :entropy spent.
Pandemonium - Random effects to all creatures.
Fire bolt, Ice bolt, Freeze, Gravity Pull, Shockwave, Sniper, Reverse Time, Drain Life, Infection, Lobotomize, Lightning, Parallel UniverseMost likely damage occurs. 5 :entropy spent.
In general you'll probably get a CC spell (Chaos Seed, Mutation, Pandemonium, Antimatter) or a buff card (BE,Mutation).
Technically it's CC on a stick similar to Arctic Squid and Vanadium Warden but it costs the same/more and is unreliable since you may have too much quantum or get the wrong card.
From Entropy Sage you can get :
Note that I add the ability cost from Entropy Sage into the final cost for the card played.

Chaos Seed - Buff of  +1-5 | +1-5 . 3  :entropy spent.
Supernova - 2 quantum for each element, possible rainbow use. 4 :entropy spent
Mutation - Random Mutant. 5 :entropy spent.
Antimatter - Invert attack. 8 :entropy spent.
Butterfly Effect - Target a < 3 attack creature and give it  :entropy :entropy :entropy Destroy. 6 :entropy spent.
Pandemonium - Random effects to all enemy creatures (See unupped list for possible effects). Most likely damage occurs. 7 :entropy spent.
Overall most cards end up being more expensive w/better effect or slightly less expensive. It's slightly more buff-focused since CC is now limited to Panda and AM which is 7 or 8 quanta total.
Although the spells are technically "unlimited", they are also unpredictable - similar to Mindgate, you may not get the card you're expecting or that you need. It's also more unreliable than Mindgate because at least with Mindgate you can obtain select cards like Towers and Creatures multiple times but this will give you a different spell with multiple uses, and they may not be the one you want.  This card is also vulnerable to CC, so it seems balanced to me.

I would like Oldtrees's opinion on this.

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: OldTrees on March 24, 2011, 02:41:29 am

Opinions about this cards balance rely too much on gut.

This card seems ready for a playtesting stage such as cards only receive In Development.

I expect that after a month of playtesting this card would be shown to be barely above par. Perhaps by .5-2 :entropy.

I will tell you this: Entropy Adept would alter the metagame in a significant manner somewhere in between Voodoo Doll and Crusader.

This is not the best vehicle for the rider effect but it is a good enough to warrant a passing grade on that issue.

Title: Re: Entropy Adept | Entropy Sage
Post by: ZephyrPhantom on March 25, 2011, 02:30:17 am

Quote from: OldTrees on March 24, 2011, 02:41:29 am

Opinions about this cards balance rely too much on gut.

This card seems ready for a playtesting stage such as cards only receive In Development.

I expect that after a month of playtesting this card would be shown to be barely above par. Perhaps by .5-2 :entropy.

I will tell you this: Entropy Adept would alter the metagame in a significant manner somewhere in between Voodoo Doll and Crusader.

This is not the best vehicle for the rider effect but it is a good enough to warrant a passing grade on that issue.

Thank you for your advice. From what I can tell of the series in general, the Sages are able to make their own impacts as if they were cards of their own, which is definitley good.  Entropy Sage may seem a little odd but I think his ability really does make him an interesting card.

Submitted to the Crucible.