Dark Adept | Dark Sage

[Flayne]

I don't like the ability at all. It creates a pretty big discrepancy between all the dragons.
with this, mono just simply becomes OP.

is there a limit or is it spammable?
this plus normal dragon cards equals huge damage.

how is this beneficial for the game? I don't understand the approach of this idea.

[ZephyrPhantom]

There is a limit - your own hand size. Also, if you get hit with Nightmare while adding Dragons to your own hand you might mess yourself up since you now have a hand filled with unplayable cards and some dragons that you may not be able to get out until late game.

It's beneficial for the game as being a new method of card generation as well as providing unusual synergy with Nightmare.

[Flayne]

There is a limit - your own hand size. Also, if you get hit with Nightmare while adding Dragons to your own hand you might mess yourself up since you now have a hand filled with unplayable cards and some dragons that you may not be able to get out until late game.

It's beneficial for the game as being a new method of card generation as well as providing unusual synergy with Nightmare.

Thats not necesarily much of a downfall when considering fractal pest.

[ZephyrPhantom]

There is a limit - your own hand size. Also, if you get hit with Nightmare while adding Dragons to your own hand you might mess yourself up since you now have a hand filled with unplayable cards and some dragons that you may not be able to get out until late game.

It's beneficial for the game as being a new method of card generation as well as providing unusual synergy with Nightmare.

Thats not necesarily much of a downfall when considering fractal pest.

with this, mono just simply becomes OP.

That requires a duo, not a mono as you stated above. Also, Fractal's expensive, and Pestals are counterable. Sanctuary as usual is the biggest counter here - Dark Sage can't even add cards into the enemy hand if they have Sanctuary up.

[Flayne]

There is a limit - your own hand size. Also, if you get hit with Nightmare while adding Dragons to your own hand you might mess yourself up since you now have a hand filled with unplayable cards and some dragons that you may not be able to get out until late game.

It's beneficial for the game as being a new method of card generation as well as providing unusual synergy with Nightmare.

Thats not necesarily much of a downfall when considering fractal pest.

with this, mono just simply becomes OP.

That requires a duo, not a mono as you stated above. Also, Fractal's expensive, and Pestals are counterable. Sanctuary as usual is the biggest counter here - Dark Sage can't even add cards into the enemy hand if they have Sanctuary up.

yeah but im just trying to stress the fact that its too easy with black dragon.
why couldnt it be for example another creature like vampire or something, that would make a lot more sense imo.
but your choice. i just find that instant adding dragons to your hand are a way too easy way to deal high damage very quickly.

[OldTrees]

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

[ZephyrPhantom]

There is a limit - your own hand size. Also, if you get hit with Nightmare while adding Dragons to your own hand you might mess yourself up since you now have a hand filled with unplayable cards and some dragons that you may not be able to get out until late game.

It's beneficial for the game as being a new method of card generation as well as providing unusual synergy with Nightmare.

Thats not necesarily much of a downfall when considering fractal pest.

with this, mono just simply becomes OP.

That requires a duo, not a mono as you stated above. Also, Fractal's expensive, and Pestals are counterable. Sanctuary as usual is the biggest counter here - Dark Sage can't even add cards into the enemy hand if they have Sanctuary up.

yeah but im just trying to stress the fact that its too easy with black dragon.
why couldnt it be for example another creature like vampire or something, that would make a lot more sense imo.
but your choice. i just find that instant adding dragons to your hand are a way too easy way to deal high damage very quickly.

1) Vampires are cheaper and more rushable than dragons, not to mention they also have the added benefit of draining health.
2) I don't want the spawned card to be easily played from the enemy hand in order to maintain synergy with Nightmare.
3) What else could he be possibly be summoning in the picture? That's definitley not a gargoyle. ^^;

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

Mitosis: Does not clog up your hand with effect, but does require a creature to be on the field. Has no 1 turn delay if used on a creature that has not activated it's ability. Much more rushable and flexible since you get to pick the creature. SoR gives you free creatures.

Dark Sage: Clogs up your hand with effect, although as a creature can be played by itself. Starts with summoning sickness. Starts with a designated hard-hitter, but is expensive. SoR lowers the cost to play the dragon slightly... and that's it. Can target either player's hand.

I think Mitosis would be the faster card in terms of dealing damage, but Dark Sage can build up damage better in the long term, as well as have a different field of use.

[OldTrees]

@ZBlader
Look at the costs. Is the difference reasonable?
Check the costs for 5 dragons. (on the field)

[Flayne]

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

4  + 3 skill = 7 in beginning to summon Obsidian dragon which is 12  . difference is 5  on creature summoning + casting cost initially.

Use this skill 6 times = 6 Ob. dragons, original total value of dragons = 72

1st dragon = creature summoning + casting cost initially = 7 
+ skill cost and onwards with same creature,
2nd dragon = 10
+ 3rd Dragon = 13
+ 4th Dragon = 16 
+ 5th Dragon = 19 
+ 6th Dragon = 21 

72 original total cost - 21 new total cost = 51  saved

6x12=72 damage for 21 quanta

thats a lot  quanta saved if you ask me, 21  quanta isn't exactly hard to get, especially considering devourer.

[OldTrees]

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

4  + 3 skill = 7 in beginning to summon Obsidian dragon which is 12  . difference is 5  on creature summoning + casting cost initially.

Use this skill 6 times = 6 Ob. dragons, original total value of dragons = 72

1st dragon = creature summoning + casting cost initially = 7 
+ skill cost and onwards with same creature,
2nd dragon = 10
+ 3rd Dragon = 13
+ 4th Dragon = 16 
+ 5th Dragon = 19 
+ 6th Dragon = 21 

72 original total cost - 21 new total cost = 51  saved

thats a lot  quanta saved if you ask me, 21  quanta isn't exactly hard to get, especially considering devourer.

The sage adds the Dragons to the hand not the field.

[ZephyrPhantom]

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

4  + 3 skill = 7 in beginning to summon Obsidian dragon which is 12  . difference is 5  on creature summoning + casting cost initially.

Use this skill 6 times = 6 Ob. dragons, original total value of dragons = 72

1st dragon = creature summoning + casting cost initially = 7 
+ skill cost and onwards with same creature,
2nd dragon = 10
+ 3rd Dragon = 13
+ 4th Dragon = 16 
+ 5th Dragon = 19 
+ 6th Dragon = 21 

72 original total cost - 21 new total cost = 51  saved

6x12=72 damage for 21 quanta

thats a lot  quanta saved if you ask me, 21  quanta isn't exactly hard to get, especially considering devourer.

Incorrect. Flayne, you made the exact same mistake Wonder did -  the dragons do not get played. They are added to your hand. I am now going to add this to the notes - it seems too many people misunderstand this.
Obsidian Dragons cost 12 . With the add to hand cost, this makes each Dragon cost 15 .
6 Dragons therefore cost 97 total - that's 25 quantum more than just playing 6 dragons.

Mitosis costs 4 . Jade Dragon costs 12 .
Using Mitosis to generate 6 Jade Dragons results with a net cost of 76 - 21 quantum less than Dark Sage.

EDIT : Oldtrees is an awesome ninja.

[Flayne]

@Flayne
Take a step back, do the math and then make a decision about this card.

@ZBlader
Sorry about missing the connection for so long but please compare this to Mitosis.

4  + 3 skill = 7 in beginning to summon Obsidian dragon which is 12  . difference is 5  on creature summoning + casting cost initially.

Use this skill 6 times = 6 Ob. dragons, original total value of dragons = 72

1st dragon = creature summoning + casting cost initially = 7 
+ skill cost and onwards with same creature,
2nd dragon = 10
+ 3rd Dragon = 13
+ 4th Dragon = 16 
+ 5th Dragon = 19 
+ 6th Dragon = 21 

72 original total cost - 21 new total cost = 51  saved

6x12=72 damage for 21 quanta

thats a lot  quanta saved if you ask me, 21  quanta isn't exactly hard to get, especially considering devourer.

Incorrect. Flayne, you made the exact same mistake Wonder did -  the dragons do not get played. They are added to your hand. I am now going to add this to the notes - it seems too many misunderstand this.
Obsidian Dragons cost 12 . With the add to hand cost, this makes each Dragon cost 15 .
6 Dragons therefore cost 90 total - that's 18 quantum wasted.

Mitosis costs 4 . Jade Dragon costs 12 .
Using Mitosis to generate 6 Jade Dragons results with a net cost of 76 - 14 quantum less than Dark Sage.

 ok Z, they dont get played, but if you had enough darkness quanta (pest), all you need to do is play one dragon each turn or 2 turns. Thats still pretty easy imo.
in 6-10 turns, you've stacked 72 damage.
in those 6 turns, you've done 72 damage already with the first dragon. still pretty strong imo.