Summoning Circle | Summoning Circle

[Pineapple]

Personally, I think it's UP with 1|2 dragons, even without the HP cost.

30 damage turn 2 at no quanta cost is UP now?
20 if you want to play it safe with immaterial creatures.

But take note that in order to summon 2/3 dragons in one turn, you have to have saved each one after drawing them for that one use of "summoning circle"...

[dracomageat]

Ok then, lets say I run a 30 card deck with 6 of this, 6 Unstoppable and nothing else but dragons ( mark). Is that not guaranteed to do massive damage from the second turn onwards?

[Pineapple]

Ok then, lets say I run a 30 card deck with 6 of this, 6 Unstoppable and nothing else but dragons ( mark). Is that not guaranteed to do massive damage from the second turn onwards?

From the second turn onwards, it can only do 26 (unstoppable crimsons) damage each turn, which is a 5 turn win. The deck is just as--if not more--susceptible to CC and more susceptible to PC as any other rush.

[OldTrees]

Personally, I think it's UP with 1|2 dragons, even without the HP cost.

Authors have tendencies to either overestimate or underestimate their cards. I tend to overestimate mine. You tend to underestimate yours.

[Pineapple]

Personally, I think it's UP with 1|2 dragons, even without the HP cost.

Authors have tendencies to either overestimate or underestimate their cards. I tend to overestimate mine. You tend to underestimate yours.

An unupgraded rush can throw out 25 damage per turn starting from turn one. A deck specialized for this card can at most deal 26 per turn and said deck can easily be countered by any form of CC that can do more than 2 damage, for destroying one of said deck's dragons sets the damage per turn to 13 for the remainder of the match.
But yeah, 1/2 it is.

[dracomageat]

From the second turn onwards, it can only do 26 (unstoppable crimsons) damage each turn, which is a 5 turn win. The deck is just as--if not more--susceptible to CC and more susceptible to PC as any other rush.

Ruby Dragons say 30 ( mark and Lightnings as a finisher maybe) and if you're worried about CC, Phasies say 20 for a 6 turn untargetable win.

I'm not saying this is broken but at 3 dragons (45 a turn with Rubies, 30 with Phasies) it most certainly would be.

[OldTrees]

Personally, I think it's UP with 1|2 dragons, even without the HP cost.

Authors have tendencies to either overestimate or underestimate their cards. I tend to overestimate mine. You tend to underestimate yours.

An unupgraded rush can throw out 25 damage per turn starting from turn one. A deck specialized for this card can at most deal 26 per turn and said deck can easily be countered by any form of CC that can do more than 2 damage, for destroying one of said deck's dragons sets the damage per turn to 13 for the remainder of the match.
But yeah, 1/2 it is.

25 damage per turn / 7 cards vs 26 damage / 3 cards? That is not an honest comparision.
25 damage per turn / 7 cards vs 25 (3/7) damage per turn + 26 damage per turn + 1 dead card / 7 cards
IE: 25 per turn vs 36 per turn.

[Pineapple]

Personally, I think it's UP with 1|2 dragons, even without the HP cost.

Authors have tendencies to either overestimate or underestimate their cards. I tend to overestimate mine. You tend to underestimate yours.

An unupgraded rush can throw out 25 damage per turn starting from turn one. A deck specialized for this card can at most deal 26 per turn and said deck can easily be countered by any form of CC that can do more than 2 damage, for destroying one of said deck's dragons sets the damage per turn to 13 for the remainder of the match.
But yeah, 1/2 it is.

25 damage per turn / 7 cards vs 26 damage / 3 cards? That is not an honest comparision.
25 damage per turn / 7 cards vs 25 (3/7) damage per turn + 26 damage per turn + 1 dead card / 7 cards
IE: 25 per turn vs 36 per turn.

I was doing 25 damage per turn / 30 cards vs 13 or 26 damage per turn / 30 cards

[zgatt]

Looked at another way, we are paying 10 HP, 0 quanta, and 3 cards to cause up to 30 hp worth of damage on turn 1 (and every turn thereafter). No other deck can do it so cheaply. Immo rushes are probably the fastest there are, and even they have to spend many more cards and/or have very specific first hands to match this damage output.

[ZephyrPhantom]

Looked at another way, we are paying 10 HP, 0 quanta, and 3 cards to cause up to 30 hp worth of damage on turn 1 (and every turn thereafter). No other deck can do it so cheaply. Immo rushes are probably the fastest there are, and even they have to spend many more cards and/or have very specific first hands.

Umm... 30 HP worth of damage every turn for 10 HP? If I understand the card correctly, it's 5 HP for 10 damage every turn and 20 HP (10 HP for 1 dragon) for 20 damage every turn. And then there are factors like shields, CC, etc...., just by itself.

From the general opinion on this thread it seems a bit overly strong, so I'd suggest making both versions cost 1 Dragon or you have the player take damage equal to the summoned dragon's attack.

[zgatt]

Looked at another way, we are paying 10 HP, 0 quanta, and 3 cards to cause up to 30 hp worth of damage on turn 1 (and every turn thereafter). No other deck can do it so cheaply. Immo rushes are probably the fastest there are, and even they have to spend many more cards and/or have very specific first hands.

Umm... 30 HP worth of damage every turn for 10 HP? If I understand the card correctly, it's 5 HP for 10 damage every turn and 20 HP (10 HP for 1 dragon) for 20 damage every turn. And then there are factors like shields, CC, etc....

Oh I'm sorry, that should've been 20HP on turn 1, yes. I was saying 30 damage with Ruby dragons in mind. Even then, 20 HP + 3 cards for 30 damage is still a great deal. Not to mention I could further use this in an Immo deck and end up with even more damage on turn 1.

I did not include CC or shields in the calculations because this rush is not any more or less susceptible to those than other rushes.

[Pineapple]

Looked at another way, we are paying 10 HP, 0 quanta, and 3 cards to cause up to 30 hp worth of damage on turn 1 (and every turn thereafter). No other deck can do it so cheaply. Immo rushes are probably the fastest there are, and even they have to spend many more cards and/or have very specific first hands.

Umm... 30 HP worth of damage every turn for 10 HP? If I understand the card correctly, it's 5 HP for 10 damage every turn and 20 HP (10 HP for 1 dragon) for 20 damage every turn. And then there are factors like shields, CC, etc....

Oh I'm sorry, that should've been 20HP on turn 1, yes. I was saying 30 damage with Ruby dragons in mind. Even then, 20 HP + 3 cards for 30 damage is still a great deal. Not to mention I could further use this in an Immo deck and end up with even more damage on turn 1.

I did not include CC or shields in the calculations because this rush is not any more or less susceptible to those than other rushes.

2/3 was a possibility never considered for Blood Ritual, but for the new card, which has a slightly different mechanic from Blood Ritual, so I assume you are talking about upped Blood Ritual?

Yes, it can do 30 damage in one turn, but it cannot increase that amount after the first turn without splashing incongruous deck-parts that hinder consistency.

Anyways, I understand that's OP, and have subsequently nerfed it à la the changes made to the mechanic for Summoning Circle.