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Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg498943#msg498943
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2012, 10:01:49 pm »
The only problem I see with it is that, unlike malignant cell, this is pretty much a hard lock on their permanent slots since there is basically no way to remove them. The clogging potential is thus much greater.
If it weren't for the figments being immaterial I'd say this is pretty well balanced as is... clogging the field with no chance of countering is a bit harsh though.
Other than that I think its a really cool idea... mono aether duels will get pretty vicious if it makes it in since players would be able to shatter each other's dimensional shields... could be fun :)
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Offline EvaRiaTopic starter

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg499000#msg499000
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2012, 12:11:39 am »
It makes thematic sense for me to have the things be immaterial - but not necessary.

If it's necessary for balance then I can remove that.

Offline Annele

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg499211#msg499211
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2012, 07:37:33 am »
It makes thematic sense for me to have the things be immaterial - but not necessary.

If it's necessary for balance then I can remove that.

I'd remove the immatarial. I don't see how, say a Burning Tower, could shatter into Immatarial fragments. But this idea is epic. It's probably the best suggestion for clogging the opponent's permanent space yet.
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Offline Pineapple

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg499271#msg499271
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2012, 12:13:54 pm »
No nerf needed, especially not immaterial removal
There are only few "common" permanents in the game...

Support:
Pillars - stacks, figments count as substitution
Soul Catcher - figments count as substitution
Mindgate
Hourglass
Cloak
Shards - can stack

Survival:
Empathic Bond, Sanctuary
Shards - can stack
Flooding

Damage:
Unstable Gas - UG decks usually have a secondary form of assault
Shards - can stack
Sundial
Catapult

Note 1: After the "common permanent" area is filled, Shatter only becomes as powerful as a second Deflagration.

Conclusion: Not only is the range of the swarming small, but also the extremely slow permanent swarming is negligent compared to the basic PC ability. Therefore, I do not believe that the swarming effect is enough to warrant a nerf.

Note 2: If it's really that bad, you can do something like "For 8 turns, generate 1 random quanta. Immaterial." Giving the opponent an option to waste PC on figments won't nerf it that badly.



Btw, since I hate hard PC, I'd rather have this "delay" (make unusable) the target for a few turns.

Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg499369#msg499369
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2012, 04:52:49 pm »

Note 2: If it's really that bad, you can do something like "For 8 turns, generate 1 random quanta. Immaterial." Giving the opponent an option to waste PC on figments won't nerf it that badly.



Btw, since I hate hard PC, I'd rather have this "delay" (make unusable) the target for a few turns.

Making both the delay and  figments last a set number of turns (maybe 4 to 8 ) would actually work pretty well I think. In that case leaving the figments immaterial probably won't be too bad since they player will eventually get their field back, albeit, after a long wait.
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
You might be a unix junky

Offline dracomageat

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg499451#msg499451
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2012, 07:02:33 pm »
In that case I'd suggest a cost drop.

Offline EvaRiaTopic starter

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg501605#msg501605
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2012, 12:48:43 am »
I like the idea for setting a counter on this.

3/3 cost, 6 turns/8 turns, 5 Figments seem about right?

Offline Pineapple

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg501786#msg501786
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2012, 11:00:55 am »
I like the idea for setting a counter on this.

3/3 cost, 6 turns/8 turns, 5 Figments seem about right?

Sounds good to me.

Offline NonexistentFlower

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg501852#msg501852
« Reply #20 on: May 21, 2012, 02:43:36 pm »
How 'bout making them stack, but only to two?
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Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Dream Shatter | Dream Shatter https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=34904.msg501971#msg501971
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2012, 08:08:42 pm »
I like the idea for setting a counter on this.

3/3 cost, 6 turns/8 turns, 5 Figments seem about right?
Sounds good to me. Let the permanent slot domination begin... lol
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
kill -9 `ps l | awk '{print $2" "$3" "$9}' | grep "Z" | awk '{printf("%s ",$2)}'`
You might be a unix junky

 

anything
blarg: