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Offline Submachine

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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1122683#msg1122683
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2014, 11:55:27 am »
Spoiler for Notes:
Quote
The purpose of this card is to protect your creature for 3 turns. Namely it creates illusions of the target creature which fill the entire field. The creature itself is randomly moved to an other place on the field so that the opponent does not know which creature is the real one.

Of course illusions are just... illusions, so they cannot attack nor use their skill. You can target them and waste your card as it would result in no effect.

The caster sees illusions as blurred copies of the target creature, opponent sees then as normal creatures.

Of course the oppoent can still target your real creature, but if it is filled with illusions, there is a little chance to succeed. Thus, the fewer creatures you have on the field, the better.

If a target creature is altered in any way, all illusions are altered as well accordingly.

If you play a creature while having your field filled with illusions, it just occupies the regular place and one illusion is removed.

Another Illusion on another creature removes previous illusions and are replaced by new ones.

So basically I just fill my field with illusions and the real creature is transported into one of those. Is it possible that the creature stays in its original spot or is it always transfered away?
And if it transfers away from spot n to spot n+1 (where a newly summoned creature would go) and I summon a new creature, does it get played on the illusion's spot and makes the illusion transfer away again, or does the new creature get summoned on spot n+2 (if unoccupied)?
If the original creature uses an ability that has a unique animation (e.g: golden nymph, pegasus, etc.), does the opponent see the animation only on the original creature or the illusions too?
And if the opponent cast a spell on an illusion, for example casts lightning on an illusionist squid, nothing happens, right? So it doesn't disappear on touch, or anything? Because I would like to see a way to slowly get rid of the illusions, even if one-by-one. ^^

That's all for now. :) Maybe more will come later.
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Offline dragtom

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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1122684#msg1122684
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2014, 12:25:22 pm »
I've discussed most of these questions with krzy yesterday.

A creature can only replace an illusion; it skips the 'real' creature, giving away it's position.
If the original creature uses an ability, all illusions get the same particle effect.
nothing happens indeed when targeted; but because of that it is shown that the target is an illusion. (or, if something does happen, it is the original).
be quick- time is quanta.

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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1122747#msg1122747
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2014, 09:42:37 pm »
Spoiler for quote of Submachine's reply:
Spoiler for Notes:
Quote
The purpose of this card is to protect your creature for 3 turns. Namely it creates illusions of the target creature which fill the entire field. The creature itself is randomly moved to an other place on the field so that the opponent does not know which creature is the real one.

Of course illusions are just... illusions, so they cannot attack nor use their skill. You can target them and waste your card as it would result in no effect.

The caster sees illusions as blurred copies of the target creature, opponent sees then as normal creatures.

Of course the oppoent can still target your real creature, but if it is filled with illusions, there is a little chance to succeed. Thus, the fewer creatures you have on the field, the better.

If a target creature is altered in any way, all illusions are altered as well accordingly.

If you play a creature while having your field filled with illusions, it just occupies the regular place and one illusion is removed.

Another Illusion on another creature removes previous illusions and are replaced by new ones.

So basically I just fill my field with illusions and the real creature is transported into one of those. Is it possible that the creature stays in its original spot or is it always transfered away?
And if it transfers away from spot n to spot n+1 (where a newly summoned creature would go) and I summon a new creature, does it get played on the illusion's spot and makes the illusion transfer away again, or does the new creature get summoned on spot n+2 (if unoccupied)?
If the original creature uses an ability that has a unique animation (e.g: golden nymph, pegasus, etc.), does the opponent see the animation only on the original creature or the illusions too?
And if the opponent cast a spell on an illusion, for example casts lightning on an illusionist squid, nothing happens, right? So it doesn't disappear on touch, or anything? Because I would like to see a way to slowly get rid of the illusions, even if one-by-one. ^^

That's all for now. :) Maybe more will come later.

Thank you dear Submachine for editing my notes :) I approved it and replaced suggested corrections. Also added EDIT.

I've discussed most of these questions with krzy yesterday.

A creature can only replace an illusion; it skips the 'real' creature, giving away it's position.
If the original creature uses an ability, all illusions get the same particle effect.
nothing happens indeed when targeted; but because of that it is shown that the target is an illusion. (or, if something does happen, it is the original).

Everything is correct. Actually I did not think much about the fact that the new creature may reveal the position of randomly moved creature, especially if you play more than one new creatures. Anyway, let's consider it as a drawback if this card which costs only 1 :aether in its upgraded form anyway. Though imagine protecting your powerful chimera with it for example from RT or freeze. Wouldn't it be useful then? :)
« Last Edit: January 23, 2014, 09:44:11 pm by Krzysiekxd »
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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1122749#msg1122749
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2014, 10:06:34 pm »
The one thing that will give away the real creatures position is attacking.
Since the illusions don't attack, the enemy could simply watch carefully to see what creatures actually do attack.

This is easy since the number will appear above the attacker.

Now, you could have them "show" an attack but not actually deal damage... again, careful watching will get around that by correlating when the damage actually gets done.

Alternately, you could have them all show an attack when any one of them would normally be attacking... This will work, but only if there are no other creatures to give away the true timing.

The last option I can think of is to move the real creature around every turn... of course, this could cause problems with flooding.

At any rate, this particular point is often the stumbling block for illusion and creature concealing effects. If you can figure out how to deal with it effectively, then this could be an awesome card.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2014, 10:09:05 pm by OdinVanguard »
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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1122751#msg1122751
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2014, 10:11:35 pm »
The one thing that will give away the real creatures position is attacking.
Since the illusions don't attack, the enemy could simply watch carefully to see what creatures actually do attack.

This is easy since the number will appear above the attacker.

Now, you could have them "show" an attack but not actually deal damage... again, careful watching will get around that by correlating when the damage actually gets done.

Alternately, you could have them all show an attack when any one of them would normally be attacking... This will work, but only if there are no other creatures to give away the true timing.

The last option I can think of is to move the real creature around every turn... of course, this could cause problems with flooding.

At any rate, this particular point is often the stumbling block for illusion and creature concealing effects. If you can figure out how to deal with it effectively, then this could be an awesome card.

Well, animation of dealt damage could be hidden or actually showed by illusions as well (confusing opponent even more), I don't really know how to solve this problem. Any suggestions?
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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1127634#msg1127634
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2014, 07:21:28 am »
Bumping it and asking if it is ready and worthy enough for Crucible?
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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1127833#msg1127833
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2014, 02:29:12 am »
Semi-counter for this card: Flooding/Inundation. As it moves to a random place, it can get to the flooded zone and die unless it's a malignant cell or a water creature.
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Re: Illusion | Improved illusion https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=53459.msg1127846#msg1127846
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2014, 03:39:54 am »
I must have missed this when you first posted it, but its a really great and original idea. A lot of my questions have been answered already. As for your attacking problem (and the same for quanta producing creatures), if it's possible to code, I would make it say that's its doing damage (or generating quanta) but only the 1 creature actually does the damage. Like say you have one RoL, and you use this, all the copies make a -1 happen to your opponent's health and have the white side bar things, but only 1 actually generates quanta and does the damage.

Crazy idea, why not have the real creature move places after attacking?

I like the touch with targeting your opponent's field. Reminds me of a card I made (Shameless self-promotion) except yours is in a viable card as well :D
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