Detrimental Permanents

[ManOfManySpoons]

Alright, so I was reading the topic idea for Dark Gift/Grim Charity (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,4954.0.html), and thought it might be really interesting to have a card like this if there were permanents that existed that you may or may not want to have, but your opponent would almost definitely not want on their side of the field.  I don't know what they should cost, but I would love to hear some input.

I realize that I do not have costs for these.  I would more like to see what people think of the ideas before figuring out how expensive they would need to be in order to be fair but playable.  Drawing up some ideas on the fly, this is what I've got:
  Tortoise: You only draw a card every other turn(or two out of every three turns- could be good to avoid deckouts, but mostly just slows everything)
Upped could become Hare: Your opponent draws two cards every turn (maybe every other turn is more fair, I don’t know).  This would be great for passing  over to speed up your deck. 

  Mudslide: All of your creatures become burrowed.  Pay 1 to unburrow. 
----->I'm not sure it's possible to do this, as unburrowing is free as it stands now, but it could protect your creatures or halve your opponents attack force permanently if they have no earth quanta

  Fighting Spirit: All creatures on your side of the field gain +1/-1 at the end of your turn. 
------>The fiery spirits within your creatures make them fight harder, but exhaustion takes its toll.  Use it to buff your own creatures, then pass it off before they die. 

  Inside Man: The top card of your deck is always turned face up.
------>This idea seems kind of weak to me, but it could give you some insight as to what's coming next and it is always useful to get a clue what the opponent is doing.  I don't think the darkness one in this series should be very good if this Dark Gift idea would be darkness.

  Open Air: The slots your creatures take up are redistributed randomly at the end of each turn. 
------>Appealing to the description of air: "...take advantage of their freedom of movement....", could work well with Flooding (although that is three elements with Water/Air/Darkness. 

  Heavy Atmosphere: All of your creatures gain +0/+5, but are rendered unable to attack every third turn. 
------->Would work as a time bubble effect for 1 turn after 2 consecutive turns of attacking.  Not sure how this would work with something like Sundial, which prevents attacking for a turn. 

  Green Thumb: 1/4 of all quantum of your mark that you own at the end of your turn are converted to life quantum. 
------->There are situations where this could be good, it would allow you to splash life without taking a life mark so it might be OP.  I'm not sure how to balance it.  The idea is to  sabotage your opponent by giving them useless quanta though. 

  Ghost Catcher: A counter is added to this card for each creature that dies.  Skeletons gain +1/+0 for every 8 counters.  When the counter reaches 21, deal 10 damage to owner and Ghost Catcher is destroyed. 
------->I don't know about this one.... I was trying to work out a sort of time bomb idea that wasn't just a straight up "Deal 15 damage to owner 5 turns after placement", because that's lame.  Something like this could be a lot of fun though.

  Divine Intervention: 10% chance that your creatures with skills will have their skill replaced with bioluminescence. 
-------->Because bioluminescence has become too useful with the introduction of Hope, this works as an off-chance lobotomizer that makes creatures light-emitting.  Enjoy your light quantums, non-hope decks!

  Stasis: Your field is locked for three turns(or every third turn, for long-term effect).  All of your creatures become immaterial, but no creatures may be added to the field during this time period.

  Transfiguration: Redistribute the Att/HP of your creatures each turn.  There can be no change greater than +/-5. 
-------->Kind of lame, but I'm having a hard time thinking of one for entropy to be honest. 

  Panacea: Add 1 poison counter to 1 of your creatures per turn.  You are immune to poison. 
-------->Toss it in a deck with no poison.... just gives your opponent a poison counter on one of their creatures each turn.  This seems OP, but I'm at the end and am too lazy to come up with something better for water.

Other; Corrupted shard: Deal 3 damage to the owner each turn. 
-------->5 seems a bit much, but it could be made into a reverse SoG if it was seen fit. 

Congrats if you actually made it through that wall of text.  I hope this strikes a chord with someone, I think it could be an interesting idea.... although they would all rely on the spell that passes permanents so that's a bit shaky.  I just thought this was a fun idea and I actually managed to come up with an idea for each element (although some are shakier than others)

I like the idea of making the opponent choose between blowing up your hourglass or some other such useful permanent or saving themselves the hassle of having one that just messes with their entire plan. 

[pepokish]

I kind of like Fighting spirit.  Especially the reasoning behind it.  I like when cards make sense from more than a game-play point of view. 

I don't know about having it deal +1/-1 every single turn, however.  But I guess in a deck supporting fire, you would be able to throw some deflags in to use on yourself -- and in a rainbow, you could use a pulvy.  Still, that seems a bit cumbersome...  It might work better as a spell, like a mass mini rage potion.

[miniwally]

When I began reading it I was like oh great this is going to be just full of cards that will be worthless but actually after reading it these are some pretty good ideas as they're all helpful but can be a hindrance if given to an enemy I think the death and darkness ones need some work though.

[coinich]

When combined with Dark Gift or even Steal, some of these become somewhat interesting...

I like the ideas.

[Hyroen]

Interesting, I especially enjoyed Mudslide. Halving enemy damage, Dusk Mantle, that is some serious defense. And in an Darkness-Earth Denial Deck.  I've actually suggested some negative permanent as well, Prize \ Gift. The mechanics behind it I think will make for an interesting match. It may actually be OP.. hm...

[oorenotsoo]

These are really cool ideas. I like stasis cuz i love immaterial creatures. I also like mudslide for the same "ahh they're safe now" idea; i know it doesnt matter against fire shield and the new life shield though. Anyway, I would enjoy having more permanents.

[ManOfManySpoons]

Alright, I've finally got some free time so I decided to come back and try to hash out at least a rough estimate for costs.  I know there are people who know this game better than myself, so input about when I'm wrong/my suggestion would make it too costly or too cheap are definitely welcome.  I am also basing these on the idea that some kind of card that would allow you to pass your permanents to the other player would be implemented as a darkness card. 

Tortoise(assuming it reads "Draw two out of every three turns/Don't draw every third turn): 4
Not too high cost, as it is a pretty bad card to have on your side of the field unless you get a great opening hand and have a deck that tends to deck out, but it is a pretty heavy hindrance to the opponent if you manage to pass it over. 

Hare(Opponent draws 2 cards every other turn; draws 1 card on the other turns): 7
This would be ridiculous in a rush deck, but it would require you to use Time/Darkness along with whatever your rush is.  I'm not sure if time or darkness rush on their own are too potent that it should have a higher cost. 

Mudslide: 4 /3
It protects all of your creatures, but also halves your attack power.  Unless you've got dragons out or the opponent isn't running a shield (heavy creature control with no shield? this card is useless if they don't have creature control), then it's not really a game-breaker. 
**It also just occurred to me that creatures might have to lose their abilities in order to be burrowed... would it be possible to have something like a Squid burrowed and use its ability again upon unburrowing?  More thinking about this one is leading to potential problems here, oh well.

Fighting Spirit: 8 /6
This one is just plain good, even if you can't pass it over.  You could still deflag it yourself in a mono fire once your creatures get buffed enough, and come to think of it playing this with golems/heavy armor/rage potion+earth mark might be too good.....  Then your golems are gaining +3/+1 each turn, with armor and potions to give them +6/+0 on top of that if you draw right.  Scary.

Inside Man: 3 /2
It's not good (usually) to have on your field, and it isn't a game-breaker to have it on their side. 

Open Air 4 /3
I could even see making this one 3 unupped and 2 upped.  It would have to be played with darkness to pass it over and water to take advantage of flooding or even entropy to make antimattered creatures have a chance to go sooner

Heavy Atmosphere 5 /4
Just slows down rush decks, anything relying on control and abilities would still persist.  If it was designed to put creatures in a time bubble every third turn, maybe more expensive because that would also prevent abilities from being used. 

Green Thumb 7 /6
If you're going to try to use this to splash life with nothing but a mark and this generating quantum, it shouldn't be able to be played too early.  Passing it over is a major hassle, especially if people are splashing their mark as their only source of non-pillar quantum

Ghost Catcher 3 /2
It takes a while to get it going, plenty of time for it to be destroyed, and at most your skeletons gain +2/+0, which is not overwhelming considering it goes away as soon as it hits 20 (21 was a typo).  This one is too complicated.  I like the ideas, but maybe it's too many ideas in one.  I'll revisit it at a later date. 

Divine Intervention 4 /4
Same cost, up the chance to 15% for the upped version. 

Stasis (assuming locked for three turns, but creatures are immortal) 11 /9
This seems like it would have the most utility lategame for leaving on your own side of the field, which is why I made it cost a lot.  It would make it difficult to halt your opponent's building if they have a speed deck, but enemies that need time to set up would suffer if you got this to their side of the field.  It also would halt boneyards from generating skellies for a few turns, which is an interesting effect. 

Transfiguration 4 /3
This could be a boost in attack or basically a complete neutering of your creatures.  I have no idea what is a fair cost.  I picked something that I felt to be middle of the line for a permanent with such long term implications.

Panacea 7 /6
Re-reading this, the card seems really stupid.  I apologize.  I'll try to think of something better. 

Corrupted Shard (assuming it deals 3 damage to owner) 2 random
It's like the anti-SoG, but 5 damage seems too much, so I made it 3 and maintained the cost.

Hope this sparks some more conversation or interest!  I'll see if I can come up with something better for water or death, but right now I've got to run.

[icybraker]

Finally! A reason to Deflagrate your own permanents! I always thought targeting your own permanents were silly with Deflag. This is a good reason for this.

Stealing your own permanent is even funner. Try it!