Holy Blacksmith | Steel Enchanter

[Midnar]

NAME: Holy Blacksmith ELEMENT: Light COST: 8 TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 6|6 TEXT: : Enchant Artifact Target permanent can not be the target of any skill.	NAME: Steel Enchanter ELEMENT: Light COST: 1 TYPE: Creature ATK|HP: 0|4 TEXT: : Enchant Artifact Target permanent can not be the target of any skill.

ART: None. IDEA: Midnar NOTES: SERIES: N/A

Well, I noticed that there's 2 quint-on-a-stick (anubis and aether nymph), but no permanent counterpart. So I decided to create this Enchant Artifact on a stick.

Flavor and elements choice:
Holy Blacksmith is part of the great army of Light, along with the Crusader. His ancestral forgery techniques allow him to reinforce various objets to a nearly indestructible state. No magic in there, that's definitely an earthy skill. He is also incredibly strong in close-combat, fighting with a sword he forged himself.
Steel Enchanter masters the protective aspect of psychokinesis. This could sound aetherish, but the fact that it is purely protective oriented my choice toward light. Like most magus, he is also very weak in melee.

Balance:
Holy Blacksmith: 6 (attack) +1 (hp) +2 (skill) -1 (duo) = 8
Steel Enchanter: 0 (attack) + 0 (hp) + 2 (skill) -1 (upgrade) = 1
There's no unupgraded Light creatures whose cost is between 5 (Crusader) and 12 (Light Dragon). Holy Blacksmith fills this gap. Steel Enchanter does not, because it would be competiting with Archangel.
Holy Blacksmith is credible as a middle-range fighter, but his skill is hard to use: the skill is duo, an 8-quanta cost is a bit too much to be viable in a rainbow, and the Light weapon is already protected.
On the other hand, Steel Enchanter has no offensive capability, but is a good alternative to PA in permanent-heavy decks, either rainbow or mono-light (6 protected SoG + 6 protected Sanctuaries, anyone? )

Any feedback or art suggestion would be highly appreciated !

[Vara]

The gap between upgraded an unupgraded is way too big.

Unupgraded costs you an expensive 8 quanta, while upgraded is practically free 1 quantum.
Unupgraded is duo with an element that diesn't mix at all, upgraded it mono.
We don't care about those six attack points (which you use to justify the differences); if we use that card, whe want to protect our pernaments, not to benefit from it's horrible cost/damage ratio.

In short:
+ Unupgraded is useless;
+ Upgraded is epic;

Remove the attack from the unupgraded version and reduce it's cost.

[Rutarete]

I'm not sure i like just Enchant artifact on a stick. Try adding your own twist to it.

[Midnar]

The gap between upgraded an unupgraded is way too big.

Unupgraded costs you an expensive 8 quanta, while upgraded is practically free 1 quantum.
Unupgraded is duo with an element that diesn't mix at all, upgraded it mono.
We don't care about those six attack points (which you use to justify the differences); if we use that card, whe want to protect our pernaments, not to benefit from it's horrible cost/damage ratio.

In short:
+ Unupgraded is useless;
+ Upgraded is epic;

Remove the attack from the unupgraded version and reduce it's cost.

Have you read my first post? The huge difference between unupped and upped is intented. Of course, it makes the upgraded better, but that's what the upgrades are for.
Horrible cost/damage ratio? Well, the cost/damage ratio of this card is nearly equal to the one of the light dragon : .75 for this card, .83 for the light dragon. And the powerful ability of Holy Blacksmith largely accounts for this small difference.
Unupgraded is useless? No, definitely no. Compare it to Anubis: this is slightly better, imo.
Upgraded is epic? Well, I guess you're right. I'll decrease it's hp from 4 to 2. Less epic now?

[OldTrees]

Please reset the upgraded hp at 4. The gap between unupped and upgraded was perfect.
Activation Costs of 2-3 have a -1 cost reduction hence you meant
"+3 (skill) -1 (expensive)"

[manaboy100]

For me, the name is reversed

Pretty nice, but why  and  ? They're the same to me :/ Maybe lessen the activation cost by 1 for the upped?

[Vara]

For me, the name is reversed

Pretty nice, but why  and  ? They're the same to me :/ Maybe lessen the activation cost by 1 for the upped?

Paying or makes an HUGE difference (which in one of the reasons why it's so incredibly imbalanced). Earth and light are two elements which don't mix. To be able to use Holy Blacksmith's ability, you need eiter an duo or a rainbow. Steel Enchanter on the other hand is completely capable of doing this mono (or duo with an non-earth element).

Example: would you rather have the Graboid's evolve ability cost or ? The fact it costs it one of the few things that balances it.

[Midnar]

Paying or makes an HUGE difference (which in one of the reasons why it's so incredibly imbalanced). Earth and light are two elements which don't mix. To be able to use Holy Blacksmith's ability, you need eiter an duo or a rainbow. Steel Enchanter on the other hand is completely capable of doing this mono (or duo with an non-earth element).

Example: would you rather have the Graboid's evolve ability cost or ? The fact it costs it one of the few things that balances it.

Do you really think I didn't know that a same-element ability is more useful than a cross-element ability? That's precisely what makes the upgrade worth it. If the Steel Enchanter's ability cost was , it would be hardly as good as the Holy Blacksmith. These 6 attack point and these 2 hp DO make a difference.
And your argumentation makes absolutely no sense. It's like saying that Maxwell's Demon is OP just because it's ability is mono-element. Other factors have to be taken into account. Once you have 1 (or maybe 2) Steel Enchanters out, any new one is a dead card: there isn't enough permanents to protect, and the 0 attack won't help you much. Running 6 of these, you would end up with dead cards more often than not, and running fewer than 6 you may not get it early enough to protect your vital permanents. And unless you quint it, it may be killed, leaving your permanents vulnerable. As an example, 6 Phase Shields + 6 EA sounds much better to me than either 6 PS + 6 SE or 6 PS + 3 SE + 3 Quint.

[Boingo]

Throw in a couple of miracles, stone skins, diamond shield, sanctuaries and Morning Glory and you have your ultimate deckout with punch (especially a 6|6 creature with a skill to protect said permanents...)  You'd probably win before decking the other guy out.

[Raptor6789]

sort of an off-topic question but...
i see that your card has no art for it. is this allowed in the card ideas section? do our card ideas have to have art?

but other than that... i think the cost of the upgraded creature should be 2-4.
as for the unupgraded, the light-earth thing needed seems just too bulky and unfit, and it is too different from the upgraded. might as well be a different card.

[ZephyrPhantom]

sort of an off-topic question but...
i see that your card has no art for it. is this allowed in the card ideas section? do our card ideas have to have art? No, card ideas do not need images at all. If we required all card ideas to have an image from the get go the influx of card ideas would be much slower.

but other than that... i think the cost of the upgraded creature should be 2-4.
as for the unupgraded, the light-earth thing needed seems just too bulky and unfit, and it is too different from the upgraded. might as well be a different card.

The unupped seems fine to me. It's a decent midhitter similar to GotP. I also like the concept of this being in reverse to Guardian Angel and Archangel.

The upped is definitley strong. It can potentially render PC useless, especially if quinted (with 0 attack, it's not even triggering an unupped Thorn Caparace). However it's balanced as shown by what oldtrees and the calculation provided by midnar.  Also keep in mind the upped has no offensive potential - if there are no permanents to enchant then the card is useless.