Post by: n00b on September 03, 2012, 04:07:05 am
(http://elementscommunity.org/images/Cards/Upgrade.png)
Well, after a very large discussion in chat, I decided that our talkingsingness should be posted here. Basically, Forest Scorpion, primarily the unupgraded version, is too weak to be able to do much if any damage before shields are able to block the damage required for poison to be dealt. I don't have much else to say besides that, except for a proposed buff:
Make Forest Scorpion 2|2 for 3 :life and, when upgraded, make Scorpion 2|2 for 2 :life. This in turn makes Forest Scorpion worth using and makes Scorpion more able to be implemented into decks that rely on quick damage, such as rushes. I don't have much else to say, except for the magic word:
Discuss.
Post by: Calindu on September 03, 2012, 07:00:06 am
My idea is:
:life: Inflict 2 damage per turn to a target creature, delay itself.
Post by: Ilias22 on September 03, 2012, 07:12:00 am
Post by: Poker Alho on September 03, 2012, 11:36:25 am
Post by: Vangelios on September 03, 2012, 01:15:00 pm
Post by: willng3 on September 03, 2012, 02:37:16 pm
he is very good, no need to buff the damage of poison is more powerful because it remains even with the dead creature, with this buff you'd be making same effect of the flying arsenic.This creature is completely walled by nearly every shield in the game when its purpose should be to help give Life a way around these shields. Even in a Life-based PvP setting I seldom if ever find myself using this card because it's either destroyed too easily or has its effect negated too easily by my opponent. As it stands you're lucky to get off even 3 poison counters before the creature is killed or walled for the rest of the game; it is in fact not very good but near useless in its current condition.
I also don't understand your stance on making it the "same effect of the flying arsenic". Buffing Forest Scorpion would still make it both a) more expensive and b) easier to kill than Arsenic in addition to the fact that they both have the same effect already. Upgraded it would still deal 2 less damage. It really wouldn't overshadow Arsenic in the slightest.
Life needs more CC, so why not giving Scorpion to poison the target creature?Because Life needs to bypass shields more than it needs new forms of CC. And then considering that Life also has a huge problem with keeping its creatures on the field, I don't foresee this proposed change getting used often, if at all.
My idea is:
:life: Inflict 2 damage per turn to a target creature, delay itself.
I fully support the changes proposed by the OP.
Post by: nensuru on September 03, 2012, 04:08:59 pm
Unnuped scorp vs Unnuped cockatrice
| Turn | Total damage Unnuped scorp | X | Unnuped Cockatrice Total damage |
| 1 | 1(1) | 4 | |
| 2 | 3(2) | 8 | |
| 3 | 6(3) | 12 | |
| 4 | 10(4) | 16 | |
| 5 | 15(5) | 20 | |
| 6 | 21(6) | 24 | |
| 7 | 28(7) | 28 | |
| 8 | 36(8 ) | 32 | |
| 9 | 45(9) | 36 |
Unnuped Noob's scrop vs Unnuped Cockatrice
| Turns | U.N.S.T.D. | X | U.C.T.D |
| 1 | 2(1) | 4 | |
| 2 | 5(2) | 8 | |
| 3 | 9(3) | 12 | |
| 4 | 14(4) | 16 | |
| 5 | 20(5) | 20 | |
| 6 | 27(6) | 24 | |
| 7 | 35(7) | 28 | |
| 8 | 44(8 ) | 32 | |
| 9 | 54(9) | 34 |
Imo the unnuped seems good, since you can stop a scorp more easly then a cockatrice
The upped seens op to me. From all the scorps the green is the only with a in element buff (adrenaline).
The upgraded Noob's scorp would make adrena + scorp a 5 :life for 8 physical damage and 2 poison damage per turn with is much better ihmo them deathstalker, who needs a duo to work.
I would suggest a +1/2 defense on the upped and stay with 3 :life
Post by: nensuru on September 03, 2012, 04:09:35 pm
Post by: Vangelios on September 03, 2012, 10:01:05 pm
Post by: omegareaper7 on September 03, 2012, 10:08:32 pm
It wants to increase the damage, use blessing, to create a deck of life and poison, very useful.So for it to be useful, it needs to have another card to buff it? Sorry, but this isn't death stalker or dune scorpion, this card needs to be buffed itself. Decreasing cost would help, but like has been pointed out, the upped might benefit more then it should from it.
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on September 03, 2012, 10:14:54 pm
Let us discuss a few things; Forest Scorpion is the only scorpion able to deal damage as it is, without any buffs. Because of this, it can strike extremely fast if you have one on your starting hand and it is very good if Adrenalined|Epinerphined. Furthermore, this card can be a menace against mono :aether or mono :air if played early enough, before a Dim Shield chain or Wings chain occurs. I have defeated countless mono-aether decks this way. As for DR shields, there are Blessings ( :light is extremely easy to be combined with :life) and there are Frogs/Cockatrices (no one says to fill your deck only with Forest Scorpions). Against AI, this card is even better, since it doesn't only acts as a soft PC against a few types of shields, but it also acts as CC bait (Otyughs eats them instead of Frogs/Cockatrices and they become poisoned, Wardens block them even with a Titanium Shield on your opponen'ts shield slot etc.), making it a reliable card versus AI3 or Bronze League. Seriously, no buff needed, this card rocks! :P
Post by: Cheesy111 on September 03, 2012, 10:20:57 pm
Seriously, do you think Forest Scorpion | Scorpion needs buff? As a fanatic :life player, I seriously find tis card a little overpowered in comparison with any other scorpion! No buff needed.
Let us discuss a few things; Forest Scorpion is the only scorpion able to deal damage as it is, without any buffs. Because of this, it can strike extremely fast if you have one on your starting hand and it is very good if Adrenalined|Epinerphined. Furthermore, this card can be a menace against mono :aether or mono :air if played early enough, before a Dim Shield chain or Wings chain occurs. I have defeated countless mono-aether decks this way. As for DR shields, there are Blessings ( :light is extremely easy to be combined with :life) and there are Frogs/Cockatrices (no one says to fill your deck only with Forest Scorpions). Against AI, this card is even better, since it doesn't only acts as a soft PC against a few types of shields, but it also acts as CC bait (Otyughs eats them instead of Frogs/Cockatrices and they become poisoned, Wardens block them even with a Titanium Shield on your opponen'ts shield slot etc.), making it a reliable card versus AI3 or Bronze League. Seriously, no buff needed, this card rocks! :P
Anything about any card against AI is irrelevant regarding balance.
Post by: Vangelios on September 03, 2012, 10:21:55 pm
It wants to increase the damage, use blessing, to create a deck of life and poison, very useful.So for it to be useful, it needs to have another card to buff it? Sorry, but this isn't death stalker or dune scorpion, this card needs to be buffed itself. Decreasing cost would help, but like has been pointed out, the upped might benefit more then it should from it.
Turns out he is not good with blessing, it is fantastic!. and yes, many cards in this game are better with another.
Post by: furballdn on September 03, 2012, 10:36:38 pm
Upped scorp is balanced.
Unupped could use some some minor buff.
@nensuru thanks for the comparison. Do you mind making one factoring in (unupped)frog+adren vs scorp+adren?
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on September 03, 2012, 10:37:04 pm
Anything about any card against AI is irrelevant regarding balance.
Ok, I accept that anything about any card against AI is irrelevant regarding balance. Let's talk about RNG and the fact in order to use any other scorpion you have to prepare a combo with a card of an element other than the scorpion's element (Momentum, Blessing, Nightfall etc.) and that scorpion is almost completely useless otherwise, making its function too RNG-based and requires the whole deck to be built around that combo. Forest Scorpion | Scorpion doesn't need 2 cards of different element to function, it actually doesn't even need 2 cards of the same element, it can function just by itself, it doesn't require a whole deck to be built around it and it can easily fit into any :life deck! Furthermore, :life has Adrenaline as an excellent buff (as I have already mentioned), Mitosis can produce more of them and it can be also combined well with non :life buffs (Blessing etc.). Also, as I pronounced in my previous post, Forest Scorpion is usually life's only way to counter Dims & Wings by poisoning the opponent as long as the shield slot is empty. I have not defeated just AI with :life scorpions, I have rulled countless times in PvP too, even against experienced players.
I have spent infinite hours playing mono :life decks and seriously dudes, it am quite dissapointed you view Forest Scorpion as an underpowered card. Such an underestimated gem... :(
Post by: OldTrees on September 04, 2012, 01:11:29 am
The solution is not a buff but rather to increase both cost and attack. Be warned, Pufferfish is 3|5 venom and is not used often.
2|2 Venom for 4 unupped is reasonable.
Post by: nensuru on September 04, 2012, 05:42:31 am
His scorpion version (4 :life 2/2) would be good to counter 1dr shields, but it would not be so effective against full blocking shields, where the rush, as ARTH mentioned, is most valuable
Since 1dr shields have 1-2 copies on most decks, and fulldr shields are more likely to come im 5-6 i would opt for rushing the poison counters then trying to bypass the 1dr shields
Adrena scorp vs Adrena horned frog
| Turns | Adrena scorp(un) | X | Adrena frog | X | Adrena scorp(up) |
| 1 | 4(2) | 12 | 8(2) | ||
| 2 | 10(4) | 24 | 18(4) | ||
| 3 | 18(6) | 36 | 30(6) | ||
| 4 | 28(8 ) | 48 | 44(8 ) | ||
| 5 | 40(10) | 62 | 60(10) | ||
| 6 | 54(12) | 74 | 78(12) | ||
| 7 | 70(14) | 86 | 98(14) | ||
| 8 | 88(16) | 98 | 120(16) | ||
| 9 | 108(18) | 110 | 144(18) |
Post by: willng3 on September 04, 2012, 03:15:51 pm
Honestly I have not seen any evidence that the Effect < Cost. What I have seen is evidence that the purpose (shield bypass) and the Attack are not in agreement.Part of my issue here is that I personally disagree with how much value is currently put on Venom as a contributor to card cost for creatures. Assuming I'm understanding this correctly, the current cost calculation for Forest Scorpion is 1 attack (1 cost) - 1 (Life's element modifier bonus) + 0 (HP modifier) = 0. Because Forest Scorpion is placed at 3 :life, this would seem to indicate that Venom is worth 3 :life. However, Venom is listed as being worth 2 additional cost according to your own Card Design guide (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,16655.msg213155.html#msg213155) assuming that it has no mono buffs (in which case I assume that this includes Adrenaline). This then causes an issue with how Pufferfish is balanced because 3 attack (3 cost) + 0 cost (HP modifier) + 2 cost (Venom, no mono buffs) = 5 but because Pufferfish is also an upgraded card this means that there should be at least 1 additional modifier factored in somewhere whether it be +1 attack, -1 cost, etc. Does this mean that Venom is placed at an ability value of 3 regardless of an element's access to in-element buffs? After reconsidering nensuru's comparison of Horned Frog to a 2 attack Scorpion I'm finding it harder to agree with the in-element buff clause applying to 1 attack creatures as well (in Adrenaline's case at least).
I would normally refrain from comparing creature cost calculation and weapon cost calculation since it seems that weapons are balanced on a completely different scale than creatures, but if we were to make Arsenic fit a similar role as Forest Scorpion then I would be interested in seeing how the community would react to reducing unupped Arsenic to both 1 cost and 1 attack and seeing the reaction. I'm fairly certain it would be considerably negative. While I have some reservations when it comes to giving both +1 cost and +1 attack to Forest Scorpion, I would favor it more than its current state at the moment.
His scorpion version (4 :life 2/2) would be good to counter 1dr shields, but it would not be so effective against full blocking shields, where the rush, as ARTH mentioned, is most valuableI'm not sure what kind of magical deck he's using to where he's able to defeat Mono :aether and Mono :air by getting a great amount of Poison on the opponent before they're able to block off the Scorpions (or even if his opponent at the time was smart enough to consider this) consistently, but as someone who I should hope has had at the very least an equal amount of experience with these types of match-ups, my experience tells me that unless you have copious amounts of luck in your favor or your opponent hasn't even bothered putting more than 3 copies of Dims/Wings in their deck, your chances of being able to connect enough hits to where Poison ultimately finishes them off before they can hit you harder or destroy everything that you own is not likely at all. I mean just use common sense here: Unless the opponent's deck has a QI of 15, how likely do you think it is that they won't be able to start a Shield chain by turn...3?
Quote
Since 1dr shields have 1-2 copies on most decks, and fulldr shields are more likely to come im 5-6 i would opt for rushing the poison counters then trying to bypass the 1dr shieldsI suppose this would be true in more randomized PvP, but there are plenty of cases in restrictive PvP (i.e you know your opponent is going to use mainly Life cards) where adding additional copies of a 1DR shield would be extremely useful just because it cuts down on Adrenaline's damage output considerably (not to mention Skull Shield and Ice Shield do even more damage to that card). You may also want to consider that smarter opponents won't start a chain of Wings/Dims until you've started to inflict damage on them (or if it's late into the game already), in which case a +1 cost/attack bonus will a) not interfere with your ability to play a Scorpion + Adrenaline combo much more than its current state and b) grant you an additional damage head start to deal to the opponent before they decide to start chaining shields. In fact, the threat of a creature dealing 8 damage + 2 Poison damage each turn may very well prompt the opponent to play Dim Shields earlier than they normally would, increasing the odds of a Dim Shield chain breaking earlier.
Quote
Adrena scorp vs Adrena horned frogSo this indicates that AdrenaScorps unupped should surpass a single Frog's damage output by turn 6 with the proposed changes. What this doesn't factor in, however, is the fact that the Scorp's extra cost will make less Scorpions playable per Frog each turn. I can't do much more than speculate how that affect the difference in speed though, and I recognize that this change may actually make 3 cost, 2 attack unupped too fast. If that's the case then 2 attack for 4 cost would be more appropriate.
Turns X Adrena frog X Adrena scorp(up) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
Post by: OldTrees on September 04, 2012, 04:15:23 pm
The card cost thread is outdated. The elemental bonuses (like the Life bonus) were replaced with using Photon as the base creature. This resulted in increasing the estimated value of most skills by 1.Honestly I have not seen any evidence that the Effect < Cost. What I have seen is evidence that the purpose (shield bypass) and the Attack are not in agreement.Part of my issue here is that I personally disagree with how much value is currently put on Venom as a contributor to card cost for creatures. Assuming I'm understanding this correctly, the current cost calculation for Forest Scorpion is 1 attack (1 cost) - 1 (Life's element modifier bonus) + 0 (HP modifier) = 0. Because Forest Scorpion is placed at 3 :life, this would seem to indicate that Venom is worth 3 :life. However, Venom is listed as being worth 2 additional cost according to your own Card Design guide (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,16655.msg213155.html#msg213155) assuming that it has no mono buffs (in which case I assume that this includes Adrenaline). This then causes an issue with how Pufferfish is balanced because 3 attack (3 cost) + 0 cost (HP modifier) + 2 cost (Venom, no mono buffs) = 5 but because Pufferfish is also an upgraded card this means that there should be at least 1 additional modifier factored in somewhere whether it be +1 attack, -1 cost, etc. Does this mean that Venom is placed at an ability value of 3 regardless of an element's access to in-element buffs? After reconsidering nensuru's comparison of Horned Frog to a 2 attack Scorpion I'm finding it harder to agree with the in-element buff clause applying to 1 attack creatures as well (in Adrenaline's case at least).
I would normally refrain from comparing creature cost calculation and weapon cost calculation since it seems that weapons are balanced on a completely different scale than creatures, but if we were to make Arsenic fit a similar role as Forest Scorpion then I would be interested in seeing how the community would react to reducing unupped Arsenic to both 1 cost and 1 attack and seeing the reaction. I'm fairly certain it would be considerably negative. While I have some reservations when it comes to giving both +1 cost and +1 attack to Forest Scorpion, I would favor it more than its current state at the moment.
Pufferfish is considered UP. It costs 5 :water + 1 card > Photon + 2 attack + 1->5hp + Venom (atk>0) + upgrade
5 :water > 2 attack + 1->5hp + Venom (atk>0) + upgrade
3 :water > 1->5hp + Venom (atk>0) + upgrade
4 :water > 1->5hp(rounds to +0) + Venom (atk>0)
4 :water > Venom (atk>0)
Since Pufferfish is considered UP but is not a common buff thread, the magnitude of the imbalance is probably 1 quanta
3 :water =?= Venom (atk>0)
However it is possible that the community is merely unaware of how overpriced Pufferfish is. In that case Venom (atk>0) might be worth only 2 :life.
Arsenic costs the weapon slot. This is currently estimated to be worth 3 :underworld. This estimate is also possibly wrong.
Conclusion:
Forest Scorpion should at least be adjusted with +1 atk +1 cost in order to better preform its purpose at the same balance level. However it is possible that venom is overpriced and Forest Scorpion should receive +1 atk without +1 cost. I have not seen evidence of this in this thread yet.
Post by: omegareaper7 on September 04, 2012, 04:27:17 pm
Better, yes. But a card like scorpion should not require an off element to be any good. You might as well just use adrenafrogs if your going to use life, or rustler with light pillars or something of the like if your going to splash light in. Do you see what these two deck types might have in common? A lack of use for scorpions.It wants to increase the damage, use blessing, to create a deck of life and poison, very useful.So for it to be useful, it needs to have another card to buff it? Sorry, but this isn't death stalker or dune scorpion, this card needs to be buffed itself. Decreasing cost would help, but like has been pointed out, the upped might benefit more then it should from it.
Turns out he is not good with blessing, it is fantastic!. and yes, many cards in this game are better with another.
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on September 04, 2012, 06:08:16 pm
About beating :aether , it is nothing magical with it. Dimensional Shields are expensive and RNG is usually mean, which makes :aether players unable to always start a shield chain early and to keep it until the very end. On the other hand, mono :aether has no healing at all, making 1 poison counter to always deal 1 damage, 5 poison counters to always deal 5 damage etc. This can kill :aether slowly but steadily, while :life has tons of healing to keep it alive, let alone :aether has no PC, so Thorns are deadly to Immortals, Phase Dragons and Recluses, while Emerald are extremely nasty against Psions and SoW in general. Seriously, when I firstly played ETG with my mono :life one of my greatest nemesis was mono :aether, but not anymore. Now, I know how to use :life cards in order to strike :aether hard and Forest Scorpion is a must-have of these strategies.
If you guys want to buff Forest Scorpion, please do it! I would love to have one of my favourite :life cards becoming overpowered, or slighly better at least! So, please buff it, I'm sorry disagreeing with you, yes FS needs a serious buff, maybe giving it +2 atk & -2 cost or something? Trololololol.... :P :P :P :P :P
Post by: Laxadarap on September 04, 2012, 07:17:49 pm
Anything about any card against AI is irrelevant regarding balance.
Ok, I accept that anything about any card against AI is irrelevant regarding balance. Let's talk about RNG and the fact in order to use any other scorpion you have to prepare a combo with a card of an element other than the scorpion's element (Momentum, Blessing, Nightfall etc.) and that scorpion is almost completely useless otherwise, making its function too RNG-based and requires the whole deck to be built around that combo. Forest Scorpion | Scorpion doesn't need 2 cards of different element to function, it actually doesn't even need 2 cards of the same element, it can function just by itself, it doesn't require a whole deck to be built around it and it can easily fit into any :life deck! Furthermore, :life has Adrenaline as an excellent buff (as I have already mentioned), Mitosis can produce more of them and it can be also combined well with non :life buffs (Blessing etc.). Also, as I pronounced in my previous post, Forest Scorpion is usually life's only way to counter Dims & Wings by poisoning the opponent as long as the shield slot is empty. I have not defeated just AI with :life scorpions, I have rulled countless times in PvP too, even against experienced players.
I have spent infinite hours playing mono :life decks and seriously dudes, it am quite dissapointed you view Forest Scorpion as an underpowered card. Such an underestimated gem... :(
Yet, those other 2 scorpions have a much greater ability than a forest scorpion. Plus, because it requires a duo, you are more prepared for a shield (excluding nightfall).
| Turn | Forest Scorpion | Death Scorpion |
| 1 | 1 | 0 |
| 2 | 3 | 0 |
| 3 | 6 | 3 |
| 4 | 10 | 8 |
| 5 | 15 | 15 |
Granted, that is a blessed dune scorpion, but I gave an extra 2 turns to draw the card combo and gather quanta. A 3th turn deathstalker or whatever they're called is really not hard to get, same with a 1st turn scorpion.
EDIT: Also, poison is very good in stalls, death can stall extremely well due to bonerwalls, and time has RT, procrastination, and sundials. Life needs something to keep up with these other elements.
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on September 04, 2012, 07:26:24 pm
Post by: Laxadarap on September 04, 2012, 07:30:42 pm
^Still, you have to build your deck around it. Furthermore, a CC on a Deathstalker or a Dune Scorpion hurts much more than a CC on a Forest one. FS's poison has less power than the other two scorpions but it is a much more versatile card. About poisoning being very good in stalls, what makes you think :life can't have decent stalling decks? ;)
That actually kind of helps my argument, you can make very good decks based around those cards, you can't make a very good deck based around forest scorpion. It is more of a supplementary card. CC on a death and a dune does hurt, but it will have gotten more poison damage in most cases. For example, a dune scorpion only needs 1 hit. The point of scorpions is that they continue to damage if they die/if they are shielded. Also, 4 hp is slightly sturdier than 2. Finally, :life can stall, it just takes longer to set up, death decks can stop a rush for a couple turns, simply by dropping a bonewall. Life can't do that. Time, can stop a rush in its tracks, and not even lose any card advantage while doing it.
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on September 04, 2012, 07:52:48 pm
That actually kind of helps my argument, you can make very good decks based around those cards, you can't make a very good deck based around forest scorpion. It is more of a supplementary card. CC on a death and a dune does hurt, but it will have gotten more poison damage in most cases. For example, a dune scorpion only needs 1 hit. The point of scorpions is that they continue to damage if they die/if they are shielded. Also, 4 hp is slightly sturdier than 2. Finally, :life can stall, it just takes longer to set up, death decks can stop a rush for a couple turns, simply by dropping a bonewall. Life can't do that. Time, can stop a rush in its tracks, and not even lose any card advantage while doing it.
IMHO, 1-card-1-element-versatile-scorpion > 2-cards-2-elements-certain-deck-based-scorpion. By the way, a Bonewall-based :death deck can't block a well-prepared :life rush, since Adrenafrogs/Adrenascorpions will deplete Bonewalls very fast. :time can RT Forest Scorpions or Turtle Shield them, but still their venom will pass to the opponent. Furthermore, a RT Forest Scorpion can be played again without any extra cost, while a Momentumed Dune one or Deathstalker need to be buffed by Momentum again in order to function. Conclusion: Forest Scorpion vs :time > Dune Scorpion/Deathstalker vs :time.
Post by: nensuru on September 04, 2012, 08:08:51 pm
Quote from: OldTrees
Forest Scorpion should at least be adjusted with +1 atk +1 cost in order to better preform its purpose at the same balance level. However it is possible that venom is overpriced and Forest Scorpion should receive +1 atk without +1 cost. I have not seen evidence of this in this thread yet.
Quote from: Laxadarap
Finally, :life can stall, it just takes longer to set up, death decks can stop a rush for a couple turns, simply by dropping a bonewall. Life can't do that. Time, can stop a rush in its tracks, and not even lose any card advantage while doing it.
Water and Death are better at make the game going longer, and so the venom ability should cost more on these elements then in :life
This card, imo, is more anti-cc oriented then anti-shield. Raising its cost would make
Post by: OldTrees on September 04, 2012, 09:22:19 pm
Anti-cc and anti-shield barely conflict. I see no reason Scorpion would not fit as a hybrid card alongside 2 more specialized cards.Quote from: OldTreesForest Scorpion should at least be adjusted with +1 atk +1 cost in order to better preform its purpose at the same balance level. However it is possible that venom is overpriced and Forest Scorpion should receive +1 atk without +1 cost. I have not seen evidence of this in this thread yet.
This card, imo, is more anti-cc oriented then anti-shield. Raising its cost would makesingle targetcc worth even more against life. I would opt for adding another card focused on beating shields. (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,26661.0.html)
Post by: aristalis on August 03, 2013, 11:45:35 am
Life needs more CC, so why not giving Scorpion to poison the target creature?this would be effective enough that the cost could be raised by 1 when it's upped.
My idea is:
:life: Inflict 2 damage per turn to a target creature, delay itself.
Post by: kisking11 on August 15, 2013, 06:08:56 pm
And a suggestion: I don't know it's a bug or not, but when adrenaline is on it hits 4 times, but adds only 2 poison counters. Is it a bug, or this was made because it would be too OP if it would do 4 poison?
Post by: seulintse on October 29, 2014, 12:11:58 am
Post by: Espithel on October 29, 2014, 12:15:14 am
Heal is one of them. So is forest spirit. Forest scorpion is also said support card.
Building a deck based around 6 forest scorpions is kinda like building a deck based around 6 purifies.
As a support card, it does its job just fine, really.
It really does help if you're expecting heavy shield play.
Post by: eljoemo on October 29, 2014, 12:27:02 am
Forest scorpions benefit is also in it's mono synergy, with adrenaline and mitosis. Adrenascorps may not be the best in the world but it works better than dunes and deathstalkers. And mitoscorps is a mono compared to the trio necessary to combine it with deathstalkers or dunes.
But personally, I think all the scorpions are a bit bad... but that's just me
Post by: Tiko on October 29, 2014, 12:58:52 am
It is a well balanced creature, and has its place. Both a cost decrease or an attack buff would make it way too dangerous, I believe.
Post by: Chapuz on October 29, 2014, 01:18:13 am
Post by: serprex on October 29, 2014, 01:20:00 am
Post by: Cheesy111 on October 29, 2014, 01:21:58 am
Post by: Espithel on October 29, 2014, 01:31:19 am
(This is fun.)
Post by: seulintse on October 29, 2014, 03:10:06 am
make a simple deck involving 6 shriekers, 6 stone dragons, 6 hematite golems, and 12 stone pillars. you will see the power of shriekers in PvP1
Post by: Espithel on October 29, 2014, 03:22:25 am
(Make a deck consisting of 6 chaos seeds, 6 antimatters, 6 purple dragons and 12 pillars. You will see the power of chaos seed in PvP1)
Post by: Dm on October 29, 2014, 08:40:07 am
Make a simple deck featuring 6 pheonixes, 6 fire bolts, 6 rage potions, 12 pillars. You will see the power of pheonix in PvP1
Take a simple read through your post. You will see the power of grammar in forums.
It's phOEnix.
Post by: omegareaper7 on October 29, 2014, 02:41:27 pm
As for buffing the card, I agree. I don't think decreasing its cost to 2 would make it much better overall. Same price as frog, less damage, less durability, still worse adrenaline fodder, but it would be a start.
Post by: ARTHANASIOS on October 29, 2014, 04:48:01 pm
Let alone using Forest Scorpion as a hard-counter, especially against teams with strong defence, like Team :aether and Team :light! :-\
(the examples used above are completely co-incidental and have absolutely no relation to real-life events) :P
Post by: iDaire on October 29, 2014, 08:55:35 pm
Forest Scorpion is basically a creature that was made with the intention of poisoning on each attack. Seeing as it has done this well, it doesn't need a buff.
Having one attack on a poisonous creature is enough. Which basically means instant poison whenever you summon it.
If I had to buff anything, I would buff the HP. It's kinda weak.
Post by: omegareaper7 on October 30, 2014, 12:30:02 am
Forest Scorpion doesn't need a buff IMO.The problem with that is that they are blocked by just about every common shield. Which renders them useless outside of being buffed. They aren't really good enough to warrant only 1 attack and be 3 cost.
Forest Scorpion is basically a creature that was made with the intention of poisoning on each attack. Seeing as it has done this well, it doesn't need a buff.
Having one attack on a poisonous creature is enough. Which basically means instant poison whenever you summon it.
If I had to buff anything, I would buff the HP. It's kinda weak.
Post by: seulintse on October 30, 2014, 03:14:35 am
Forest Scorpion doesn't need a buff IMO.The problem with that is that they are blocked by just about every common shield. Which renders them useless outside of being buffed. They aren't really good enough to warrant only 1 attack and be 3 cost.
Forest Scorpion is basically a creature that was made with the intention of poisoning on each attack. Seeing as it has done this well, it doesn't need a buff.
Having one attack on a poisonous creature is enough. Which basically means instant poison whenever you summon it.
If I had to buff anything, I would buff the HP. It's kinda weak.
oh, right...
make a deck of 6 steals, 6 devourers, and 6 black dragons. you will see the powers of devourers in pvp1
Well, what would you suggest as a buff?
(Make a deck consisting of 6 chaos seeds, 6 antimatters, 6 purple dragons and 12 pillars. You will see the power of chaos seed in PvP1)
Post by: bossitron on October 30, 2014, 07:01:22 am