[Official] Colossal Dragon | Massive Dragon

[rowcla]

I like the idea of a creature that you can reasonably use for defense in combination with Gravity Pull, but 30 HP just isn't enough. Give him 100, then we're talking. 

in other words your more or less giving anyone who uses gravity pull on it an extra 100 health

We already have Armagio. =P

armagio only has 25 hp not 100 like 10 men was suggesting

[ZephyrPhantom]

+70 HP is still a ridiculously large buff.  You might as well give it immaterial instead.  Also keep in mind that Dragons are meant to be beatsticks.

[Ekki]

I have looked over this card thousands of times, tested  it a little, obeserved it's use in other decks, and I have to agree, it is UP.

Why? Because whatever it can do gets outdone by other creatures.  Need a Gravity Pull decoy? Use  Armagio.  Need sheer power?  Well, ever other dragon has higher attack. What about catapult? Use Basilik Blood and Auburn Nymph if you're lucky enough.

I think the addition of momentum would greatly help this card.  It already has enough health, so buffing that is unesscessary.  What this needs is an ability, and I think momention fits its theme.  (I mean really, a giant dragon would easily smash a Permafrost Shield).

^This.

Personally, I don't think the card should be buffed by giving Momentum. All the dragons are meant to be vanilla creatures (as in creatures without abilities), and it should follow that rule.

Phase is immaterial, doesn't that count as an ability?

'nuff said.

I wish I could change my vote to "give it Momentum"...

[rowcla]

+70 HP is still a ridiculously large buff.  You might as well give it immaterial instead.  Also keep in mind that Dragons are meant to be beatsticks.

thats why i was against it in the first place.

immarterial wouldnt work because it would stop people from targeting it for other reasons like putting gravity pull on it to make a sub for armagio, also it doesnt fit as a theme.

momentum would be good though

[Dragoon1140]

Phase Dragon was an isolated exception to dragons having abilities; it was a nerf.  Before the immaterial, Phase Dragon + TU was too good in mono Aether, and was accordingly nerfed.  Colossal Dragon does not need a new ability, nor does it need any buff at the moment.  It's a fine dragon that is just slower than some of its counter parts.

You all know of our friend Steel Golem, correct?  Just because it is easily replaced by any other Earth creature does not mean it needs a buff, in ability or in cost.  It's just a vanilla creature that adds to the pool of total cards in Elements, very similar to the role Colossal Dragon plays.

[ZephyrPhantom]

Phase Dragon was an isolated exception to dragons having abilities; it was a nerf.  Before the immaterial, Phase Dragon + TU was too good in mono Aether, and was accordingly nerfed.  Colossal Dragon does not need a new ability, nor does it need any buff at the moment.  It's a fine dragon that is just slower than some of its counter parts.

You all know of our friend Steel Golem, correct?  Just because it is easily replaced by any other Earth creature does not mean it needs a buff, in ability or in cost.  It's just a vanilla creature that adds to the pool of total cards in Elements, very similar to the role Colossal Dragon plays.

You're missing the point.  Steel Golem makes good cannon fodder for a rush. What we are trying to do is give Colossal Dragon a purpose just like our Golem friend has a purpose.  I'm sure even the Steel Golem would agree with that.

[MXXE]

I'm just copying what I said long ago plus the answer. I just changed the dragons stats to be the "buffed" ones

If the a new card "Catapult" gets into the game it should maybe deal damage equal HP/2 (just what has been suggested)
... but NOT the "current HP", the "full HP"
... and because we do not want it to be too strong with gravity pull + catapulting it at low (e.g 5) current HP:


"Colossal Dragon, 10

7|35
When this creature enters play, 20 damage is dealt to it:
"

"Massive Dragon, 11

8|60
When this creature enters play, 30 (maybe even 40!) damage is dealt to it.

This+Catapult would make it useful...

This would cause it to NOT be second choice, when comparing to armagios.

If the a new card "Catapult" gets into the game it should maybe deal damage equal HP/2 (just what has been suggested)

Catapult, as far as we know, has been scratched.  It was unoriginal anyway, and wouldn't be all that useful the way Zanz wanted to implement it.

seems I was right 

Since the two most voted options are "momentum" and "New card to give usefulness to high-hp creatures", I think some good "new card"-stuff should be considered.

[ArtCrusade]

Possible solution:

Ability: Give Birth: Massive Dragon gives birth to 3 baby dragons. Delays for 9 turns.
I mean, this dragon is MASSIVE. Just from looking at it you have to assume it's pregnant. But I'd be fine with Momentum as well. What could possibly stop such a strong and big dragon like the Massive Dragon? Or make it have the ability Massive Size. Damageprevention is halved rounded up, and so are effects like Fog Shield or Spine Carapace. Fire Buckler would still deal damage. What I am thinking about is whether Hope should prevent any damage from Massive Dragon. All hope is crushed when a 80 tons dragon advances towards your health.

[Daytripper]

I think the people here obviously do not appreciate this dragon has 30 HP. You can't honestly say 30 HP for a few  more is expensive. It isn't. You can see it if you were to add a few attack. It just becomes a regular dragon but WITH 30 HP. You can say there is no use for the 30 HP, but obviously there is. It is not situational either. This dragon can stay on the field, do some damage, and it can be catapulted/Chimera'd/momentumed in the endgame. That is not situational. That is main line. It is situational if the opponent can play in such a way that you can't use the dragon. For example, take maxwell's. Situational, because the opponent might play low attack creatures. So it is not bad to have 1 or 2 dragons in your deck. Sure, you can say other creatures are better. Likewise, I can say, YES, but basalt dragons are also too expensive. I always use golems and graboids. Basalt dragons need a buff! Then someone can retort: Yes, but the basalt dragon is the ONLY creature that is airborne. Hmm. The MASSIVE dragon is the only gravity creature that is airborne, hence it has value. You have no defence here.   

Solution is simple: Add attack/give momentum maybe? (But why, what of the sapphire charger?) Then, cut the HP way down. Another ability is fine. But it can't really have ability and that much HP. It's OP.

I do like the last reply. The dragon looks incredibly fat indeed. It could lay a fate egg, then it could open in a few turns for sure. I can see the humour in that. I'm not going along with the 80 tonnes dragon. That is more than a whale, even almost double of a Dinosaur. Hence, it cannot be airborne anymore if it weighs 80 tonnes.

 

[TheonlyrealBeef]

Likewise, I can say, YES, but basalt dragons are also too expensive. I always use golems and graboids. Basalt dragons need a buff! Then someone can retort: Yes, but the basalt dragon is the ONLY creature that is airborne. Hmm. The MASSIVE dragon is the only gravity creature that is airborne, hence it has value. You have no defence here.

Ah but you see, Chargers ignore Wings as well as airborne creatures would, so there's my defence. Creatures don't need to be airborne to ignore Wings, Momentum works just as well. Earth has no Momentum-inherent creatures, or even spells that can cause it, Gravity has both.

[ArtCrusade]

There are a lot of iron dragons out there who disagree with your last statement! We don't know how high the weight of the dragon is, and we will never know, because we don't wanna be rude. You just don't ask women for their weight. Her weight is probably much lower

[ZephyrPhantom]

wCan't you just give it momentum?  It's even winning in the polls...  T_T

I think the people here obviously do not appreciate this dragon has 30 HP. You can't honestly say 30 HP for a few  more is expensive. It isn't. You can see it if you were to add a few attack. It just becomes a regular dragon but WITH 30 HP. You can say there is no use for the 30 HP, but obviously there is. It is not situational either. This dragon can stay on the field, do some damage, and it can be catapulted/Chimera'd/momentumed in the endgame. That is not situational. That is main line. It is situational if the opponent can play in such a way that you can't use the dragon. For example, take maxwell's. Situational, because the opponent might play low attack creatures. So it is not bad to have 1 or 2 dragons in your deck. Sure, you can say other creatures are better. Likewise, I can say, YES, but basalt dragons are also too expensive. I always use golems and graboids. Basalt dragons need a buff! Then someone can retort: Yes, but the basalt dragon is the ONLY creature that is airborne. Hmm. The MASSIVE dragon is the only gravity creature that is airborne, hence it has value. You have no defence here.   

Solution is simple: Add attack/give momentum maybe? (But why, what of the sapphire charger?) Then, cut the HP way down. Another ability is fine. But it can't really have ability and that much HP. It's OP.

I do like the last reply. The dragon looks incredibly fat indeed. It could lay a fate egg, then it could open in a few turns for sure. I can see the humour in that. I'm not going along with the 80 tonnes dragon. That is more than a whale, even almost double of a Dinosaur. Hence, it cannot be airborne anymore if it weighs 80 tonnes.

 

Your argument is invalid.
1) All the things that Massive can do get outdone by every other dragon and many other creatures/spells.
2)Dragons are meant to be beatsticks, not creatures spawners.  Besides, girlsgeneration already has an idea for that in the card ideas section. Check more throughly please.
3) As a beatstick, it is probably the least prefered dragon over any other dragon due to the fact it has lower attack yet same quanta cost.
4) Unupped is in an even worse state than the upped.