[Official] Chrysaora | Physalia

[Gufo90]

The question is simple: why one person should spend 1500 electrum to upgrade chysaora?

Physalia has not advantages but the atk power; but we have to consider that for the card we are examining have an atk power is, most of the times, a misadvantage: she will take damage and die with  shield, she can't use her power when stunned by procastination or freezed by  shield and will die with every istant card that kills also chysaora (drain life. fire bolt, shockwave etc...)...

In my opinion the upgrading could improve other things: become a 0|4, become free to use or  other ones...

What do you think?

[Shantu]

That 2 attack triples the Physalia's damage output. Check out the speed of unupgraded speed poison and compare it to the upgraded version's. You will see that the so-called disadvantage allows you to win 1-2 turns earlier, which is a great improvement.

I never understood those who said not to upgrade them - there are a few shields that can screw you over, of course, but I find the tripled damage a worthwhile sacrifice and it's not like every person are using those shields. Also note that you can play them a lot faster than your opponent can play his shield. You shouldn't rely on Physalias as your main source of damage, anyway.

[Gufo90]

That 2 attack triples the Physalia's damage output. Check out the speed of unupgraded speed poison and compare it to the upgraded version's. You will see that the so-called disadvantage allows you to win 1-2 turns earlier, which is a great improvement.

if your opponent has no shield...

i know that atk power could be useful in some situatio but for a card that was made to stay on the field puttting poison damage every turn paying some quanta have an atk power is not a great thing in my opinion... but it's obviosly opinable 

[ddevans96]

In a deck with these and the Poisons spell as basically your entire offense, the unupped version is definitely better against shields, but not as great everywhere else. However, in a deck (such as my somewhat-popular FR) where there are several other sources of damage, the upped is by far preferable for that bonus damage, even against shields.

[Jappert]

2 damage for 1 quanta and it has a skill that poisons also!

I don't see how this card needs a buff, great card as it is, very strong. The unupped card having an advantage is only good so that using that one instead of upped allows for tactical choices.

[Atico]

Upped card should be always better than unupped. Here we can see that upped card has got more problems with shields than unupped version and it is mistake. Making Phylasia 0/6 solve this problem.

[adrix89]

Since it is an active ability instead of on successful attack doesn't it bypass most shields already?
Also the  shield will kill any creature eventually which is annoying when your main attack force dies.
Just be grateful that you add some poison counter before they die.

[Jappert]

Upped card should be always better than unupped. Here we can see that upped card has got more problems with shields than unupped version and it is mistake. Making Phylasia 0/6 solve this problem.

Pufferfish isn't always beter then Toadfish.
Ruby Dragon isn't always beter then Crimson Dragon.
Upped Spine Carapace isn't always beter then unupped Spine Carapace.

The list is long, my point is:

an upgraded card isn't ALWAYS better then an unupped card.

[Gufo90]

Since it is an active ability instead of on successful attack doesn't it bypass most shields already?
Also the  shield will kill any creature eventually which is annoying when your main attack force dies.
Just be grateful that you add some poison counter before they die.

only 1 XD...

[Atico]

an upgraded card isn't ALWAYS better then an unupped card.

I didn't write that they always ARE better I wrote that it SHOULD be better

[Tiko]

That 2 attack triples the Physalia's damage output. Check out the speed of unupgraded speed poison and compare it to the upgraded version's. You will see that the so-called disadvantage allows you to win 1-2 turns earlier, which is a great improvement.

I never understood those who said not to upgrade them - there are a few shields that can screw you over, of course, but I find the tripled damage a worthwhile sacrifice and it's not like every person are using those shields. Also note that you can play them a lot faster than your opponent can play his shield. You shouldn't rely on Physalias as your main source of damage, anyway.

Shantu and others before me already made a good reasoning why in fact Physalia is better than Chrysaora, just a little addition:

You may want to seperate upgraded and unupgraded settings, as most of the upgraded shields are completely blocking the damage Physalia provides, and still forces the opponent to use CC to get rid of these little critters. The shields that are meant to affect opposing creatures (Fire, Thorn, Turtle, Skull) are designed in a way to provide little to no protection, so they let the creatures through to trigger the desired effect. Still, 2x2 damage for a single cost with a possible additional poison counter (in case of a Fire Shield) makes Physalias one of the most cost efficient creatures Water can provide, especially if you have other hard hitters out like Crawlers and/or using Poison, as they add up to each other pretty quick. Also, you may want to consider using a few Bonewalls too in the classic Water/Death pairing, because every Physalia that dies on a shield like that (and every Immolation that is cast) gives you additional protection (and time for your poison), thus Bonewall is the shield that Fire has the hardest time to get around.

All in all, Physalia is an awesome creature as it is, and I see your main problem is mostly Fire (like for many of us..), not this creature's stats.

[Pineapple]

Okay, guys, let's do some math:

2 Skull Buckler: Assume it dies first turn.

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10	11
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

4 Turtle Shield

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	2	2	5	6	10	12	17	20	26	30
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

4 Fire Buckler: Dies in two turns.

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	2	5	6	7	8	9	10	11	12	13
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

6 Ice Shield: Assume it is frozen every time it attacks.

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	1	1	1	1	3	4	5	6	9	11
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

7 Thorn Carapace: Assume it is poisoned every time it attacks.

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	2	5	9	11	13	15	17	19	21	23
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

8 Spine Carapace: Assume it is poisoned every time it attacks.

Total Damage
Turn	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Physalia	1		3	6	8	10	12	14	16	18
Chrysaora	0	1	3	6	10	15	21	28	36	45

Note that these are worst-case scenarios. Also note that Physalias are always better in the beginning, and are only worse (in the long-run) for these shields.

As has been pointed out in previous discussions, we are discussing the place of Chrysaoras/Physalias when they can use their ability every turn, aka we are talking about their place in Speed Poison.
Fully upped (aside from the Physalias) Speed Poison can consistently win in under 10 turns, with the help of Deadly Poison and Arsenic. You have 6 chrys/phys in Speed Poison, and the opponent has at most 4 of the above shields and at least 30 cards in their deck. You start with 7 cards in your hand, and draw 9 more cards, so that's a total of 15 cards out of 30 for you and 16 out of 30 for your opponent. That means you draw 50% of your deck, or 3 chrys/phys, during the match, sometimes with two in the starting hand. It also means the opponent draws 50% of his/her deck, or 2 shields, getting the first in his starting draw but usually without the quanta to play it.

Therefore, chrys/phys are sent out on average somewhere around 3-8 turns before the end of the game, and with most shields, even at worse-case scenario, and assuming the shield is up before you play the chrys/phys in question, Physalia is not that much worse than Chrysaora.

Personally, I think that it should get the same upped advantage as Fire Spirit => Fire Spectre: 0|2 => +1 cost 2|3, which is +1 cost +1 def different from Physalia's current stats. Of course, people attached to Speed Poison would rage more about how Physalia would become worse-suited than it is now, but meh.