Forum Brawl #4 - Timed Face-Offs - Voting Phase

[Espithel]

Then we reach a paradox.
If tasks get progressively and progressively harder,
And the idea was there to be a single role have a TFO each round,

Then each TFO had had to get progressively and progressively harder. Meaning that each role being treated the same makes little sense - Because they weren't. Unless every task was designed to be hard, which, given my task, I can believe.

What I'll say is that whatever tasks were designed to be harder are worth more points. We're paying extra points because of the task's extra difficulty, not the role.

And if they weren't designed to be harder, they're worth the same.

[andretimpa]

Then we reach a paradox.
If tasks get progressively and progressively harder,
And the idea was there to be a single role have a TFO each round,

Then each TFO had had to get progressively and progressively harder. Meaning that each role being treated the same makes little sense - Because they weren't. Unless every task was designed to be hard, which, given my task, I can believe.

What I'll say is that whatever tasks were designed to be harder are worth more points. We're paying extra points because of the task's extra difficulty, not the role.

And if they weren't designed to be harder, they're worth the same.

OT is arguably one of the easiest ones and it is worthy the second highest amount of points. CD was a hard one. Second least amount of points

/logic

[ARTHANASIOS]

This ignores the fact that the earlier rounds are a piece of cake compared to the latter ones.

With the exception of Round 1 (easy round) and Round 6 (hard round), I find the rest rounds of every F.Brawl to be of average difficulty in general.

About TFOs, their difficulty is progressive imho:

Artist TFO (easy): Redesigning is easier than creating something from scratch and avatar size is 128x128 which is less demanding in detail in comparison with other Artist tasks (but nothing prevents you from drawing in big canvas and shrinking it later).
Deck Builder TFO (below average): Almost every fully upgraded deck can beat HBs and the Trainer can be used to test stuff very fast; so, only the thematic part was the challenging one.
Forum Expert TFO (average): Editing formatting code is easier than creating it from scratch.
Card Designer TFO (average): CI&A image creator tool makes it easy to create 2 card ideas in an hour, but basing them upon OldTrees and Drake adds an extra edge of difficulty.
Off-Topicker TFO (above average): Though it looks like an easy task, it requires a very good sense of humour, good taste and rich imagination.
Writer TFO (hard): Having to write lyrics for your Boss within 100 words (while Writers normally have no word limit) and trying to figure out the possible lyrics of the other Bosses in order to outwit them looks like a hard task to me.

[Espithel]

For reference, the CDTFO was the hardest task I have done this brawl. Including the ridiculously hard challenge I sent to frostbite.

[Naesala]

*Reigns everyone back*

There was miscommunication because this wasn't added to the rules or fully discussed, my apologies. Timed face-offs got screwed up because of real-life issues I had arise at the start of round 1 that are ongoing. That's why they didn't happen with the correlating rounds, and instead all at once.

However, they were not meant to be scored inequivalently. I am speaking with Arth about how they should be valued but all timed face offs will be awarded points the same way, regardless of role.

[ARTHANASIOS]

For reference, the CDTFO was the hardest task I have done this brawl. Including the ridiculously hard challenge I sent to frostbite.

That's because you had only 1 hour to do it, not because it was difficult as a theme for the Card Designer role (though I admit many new community members do not know a lot about Drake and many had no idea that Trees was an idea guru in the past).

[Espithel]

That's because you had only 1 hour to do it, not because it was difficult as a theme for the Card Designer role (though I admit many new community members do not know a lot about Drake and many had no idea that Trees was an idea guru in the past).

All a week's worth of time would've done is make me pick a better card that I already made in the first 20 minutes of the task.
I was struggling to come up with anything- took me 40 minutes to get the two cards down.

[OldTrees]

However, they were not meant to be scored inequivalently. I am speaking with Arth about how they should be valued but all timed face offs will be awarded points the same way, regardless of role.

Quite reasonable.

Since the TFOs affect each role equally and affect each team equally, then they act the same way as any round of Brawl.

Although, now that it has been brought up, I am curious about the design philosophy that has later rounds worth more points. (Ramping difficulty philosophy? Potential comeback philosophy? Other?) It is a design feature I have seen in several places but rarely discussed/examined. However this is just mild curiosity.

For reference, the CDTFO was the hardest task I have done this brawl. Including the ridiculously hard challenge I sent to frostbite.

Really? Round 6 seems harder to me and Round 4 might be the 2nd hardest Card Design task across all Brawls since they both are easy to do badly but hard to do well.

[Espithel]

If we go by how many cards I have in my dump for these rounds, then yes, they're a lot easier.
If I have many cards in my dump, then I have many different ways to solve a problem.

That TFO's submission were the only ideas I had.

(Then again, I'm known for being cray-cray, so <:/)

[Naesala]

The philosophy for awarding more points in later rounds is multifaceted

1) It keeps everyone involved in the event to the end, by allowing weaker teams to come back and not letting stronger teams rest on their laurels.
2) Later rounds are intended to be more difficult. However, it may be a bit difficult to gauge what is harder in some role aspects.
3) It makes later rounds "more exciting" as more is at risk, which is how an event should feel in my opinion.


Arth and I have decided to value the timed face offs equivalent to Round 6 due to the difficulty they have caused with scheduling, the short time to make the submission, and because it feels the most "right". We will evaluate this more for next brawl (or whether timed face offs were a good idea).

[JonathanCrazyJ]

on the subject of TFOs being a good idea:

HELL YES. Most fun and tensest I have been all brawl. Loved it

[Espithel]

on the subject of TFOs being a good idea:

HELL YES. Most fun and tensest I have been all brawl. Loved it

As much as I whine about them, it was the highlight.