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Elements the Game => Level 3 - Armory => Card Ideas and Art => Anvil Archive => Topic started by: majofa on November 10, 2011, 01:25:58 am

Title: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on November 10, 2011, 01:25:58 am
With the success of Seiryuu (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,21677.0.html) and the popularity of Genbu (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,29433.0.html) and Suzaku (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30203.0.html) I figure I'd start work on the 4th card of the set.

So now I present... Byakko

(http://imageplay.net/img/m7Gbd236115/Byakko2.png)
(http://imageplay.net/img/m7Gbd236114/ByakkoU2.png)
NAME:
Byakko
ELEMENT:
Light
COST:
6 :light
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
7|2
TEXT:
When Byakko attacks, if any damage is blocked, increase your maximum HP by that amount.
NAME:
Byakko
ELEMENT:
Light
COST:
6 :light
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
9|2
TEXT:
When Byakko attacks, if any damage is blocked, increase your maximum HP by that amount.
ART:
Art by Vyrilien (http://browse.deviantart.com/?q=gallery%3Avyrilien%2F8839811#/d17pj2m)
IDEA:
majofa
NOTES:
The effect works the same as using Shard of Divinity... increasing your HP and maximum HP.

This effect works whenever damage is prevented. For damage reduction shields, the damage prevented adds to your maximum HP. In the case of 'stop all' shields like Bone Wall and Dimensional Shield since all the damage is prevented, you would gain maximum HP equal to Byakko's attack. This is also the case for Fog Shield and Dusk Mantle, if Byakko 'misses' you gain maximum HP equal to Byakko's attack. This ability doesn't trigger with Sundial in play. For Gravity Pull, Byakko is still doing damage, so it doesn't work there either. If Byakko has a negative attack, the ability is negated.

The ability is an active ability (can be lobotomized) named: Virtue.

During the Han Dynasty, people believed the tiger to be the king of all beasts. Legend had it that when a tiger reached 500 years old, its tail would turn white. In this way, the white tiger became a mythological creature. It was said that the white tiger would only appear when the emperor ruled with absolute virtue, or if there was peace throughout the world. Because the color white of the Chinese five elements also represents the west, the white tiger thus became a mythological guardian of the west.

Props also to Jen-i and the Elements Chat for help with the cool ideas.
SERIES:
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: darkrobe on November 10, 2011, 04:08:12 am
tuned.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Pineapple on November 10, 2011, 02:31:22 pm
In case it matters, I place my vote for anything that includes a "metal" or "death" mechanic.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: rickerd on November 10, 2011, 02:53:30 pm
sounds cool what about the atk an hp?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on November 15, 2011, 06:35:20 am
Card posted.... thoughts?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: darkrobe on November 15, 2011, 06:43:28 am
thats an interesting mechanic. definitely fits with light i would think. my first impression is.... i think i like it. ill see tomorrow after i sleep if i still do. :)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Pineapple on November 15, 2011, 06:50:45 am
I like the original mechanic, but don't see how it fits Byakko.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on November 15, 2011, 07:00:31 am
I like the original mechanic, but don't see how it fits Byakko.
Longevity.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: oblivion1212 on November 15, 2011, 07:29:21 am
ooooohhhh... the master of :light is trying to beef up RoL + Hope 's already terrifying potential  :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))

nice idea, i love how its HP < 5, light needs moar glasscannons  8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: darkrobe on November 15, 2011, 02:11:07 pm
after sleep i think it is slightly too cheap. you may want to bumb the price up a tad. that skill is pretty good.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: The_Mormegil on November 15, 2011, 05:07:14 pm
Underpriced. Its low hp are not enough to justify a free skill plus a -1 cost reduction. I think a cost of 8 | 8 is more appropriate.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: rickerd on November 15, 2011, 05:32:24 pm
I like the picture very much
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: dracomageat on November 16, 2011, 10:38:23 pm
I like it. Elegantly symbolises both the long life and prosperity associated with the albino and the aggressive nature of the king of the forest.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: rowcla on November 30, 2011, 05:45:16 am
I approve, unupped light needs a strong attacker besides dragons, even if it is a bit vulnerable...
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 01, 2011, 02:38:50 am
Byakko is now in the Crucible (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,5522.0.html). Please Vote! :D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Jappert on December 01, 2011, 01:34:34 pm
The art and passive effect are absolutely awesome. You got my vote in the Crucible for sure!

I do feel the attack power of the upped version is a bit to high though. Even with just 2 HP it's very powerfull.
Might I suggest 8 attack, 3 HP for the upped version?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 01, 2011, 03:10:59 pm
The art and passive effect are absolutely awesome. You got my vote in the Crucible for sure!

I do feel the attack power of the upped version is a bit to high though. Even with just 2 HP it's very powerfull.
Might I suggest 8 attack, 3 HP for the upped version?
The card as it stands, only has 2 more attack than Archangel and 4 less HP. Plus, I wanted it to be a little to the powerful side to give :light that extra kick it needs. :)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 06, 2011, 11:12:46 pm
Alright, poll has been reset. Byakko will be in it for the whole time, so it'll have a better chance of making it through. Although it almost did the first time. Thanks for the continued support. :D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Jappert on December 06, 2011, 11:15:00 pm
Alright, poll has been reset. Byakko will be in it for the whole time, so it'll have a better chance of making it through. Although it almost did the first time. Thanks for the continued support. :D
No worries, I am pretty sure you're nominated!

The art aswell as the card is really nice.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 06, 2011, 11:28:57 pm
Oh, I was talking about Crucible lol... but that's cool if it's nominated for best card also. :D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: dracomageat on December 12, 2011, 03:57:58 pm
Sorry I forgot to vote the first time. Still, you have my support now.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Daguerreo on December 19, 2011, 05:24:17 pm
How this card work if is blocked from phase shield?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 19, 2011, 05:31:33 pm
From the notes:
Quote
In the case of 'stop all' shields like Bone Wall and Dimensional Shield since all the damage is prevented, you would gain maximum HP equal to Byakko's attack.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Sevs on December 19, 2011, 09:24:02 pm
I think it is a great effect but i dont think the attack should be that high. with those stats i would think this belongs in fire.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Daguerreo on December 19, 2011, 09:44:09 pm
From the notes:
Quote
In the case of 'stop all' shields like Bone Wall and Dimensional Shield since all the damage is prevented, you would gain maximum HP equal to Byakko's attack.
It isn't OP?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 19, 2011, 09:47:36 pm
It is powerful, but it's not OP. Wouldn't your opponent playing a card that stops all your damage be considered even more OP?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Daguerreo on December 19, 2011, 09:49:44 pm
It is powerful, but it's not OP. Wouldn't your opponent playing a card that stops all your damage be considered even more OP?
Ok but, with a phase shield, your creature increase its attack x3, so 21 and 27 atk seems few excessive.... and with bone wall, only creature... atk x7 O.O
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 19, 2011, 09:50:59 pm
Oh, I think you misread the ability. It doesn't increase Byakko's attack. Your max HP increases by the amount of Byakko's attack that is blocked.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Daguerreo on December 19, 2011, 09:55:47 pm
Oh, I think you misread the ability. It doesn't increase Byakko's attack. Your max HP increases by the amount of Byakko's attack that is blocked.
Wooops! My apologize :D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: ralouf on December 19, 2011, 10:06:39 pm
I like this weapon a lot, it also give a good ability for light when facing some boring shield, where they hadn't any solution before.

Also the name remind me the manga called 'bleach' nothing to see with this ?
(I guess it was the captain of the first division who was called byakko)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Anarook on December 20, 2011, 06:42:11 am
Not to bash, but am I the only one who doesn't fidn this card all that impressive?
I really can't explain it though. :-\
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 20, 2011, 07:02:47 am
Not to bash, but am I the only one who doesn't fidn this card all that impressive?
I really can't explain it though. :-\
lol so far, I guess 8)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Xenocidius on December 20, 2011, 07:09:46 am
I'm also surprised by the overwhelming support it seems to have in the Light Crucible poll. I personally like the card, but I don't think it's amazing. In fact, I'm almost suspicious that people are voting on it purely on the basis of the art quality and other three cards (a strictly forbidden practice, might I add). That said, I think it deserves a place in the Forge anyway.

The low HP doesn't really fit the Light theme though; maybe raise its HP to 9 (nine lives!) and possibly bump up the cost slightly?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 20, 2011, 02:26:46 pm
I'm also surprised by the overwhelming support it seems to have in the Light Crucible poll. I personally like the card, but I don't think it's amazing. In fact, I'm almost suspicious that people are voting on it purely on the basis of the art quality and other three cards (a strictly forbidden practice, might I add). That said, I think it deserves a place in the Forge anyway.

The low HP doesn't really fit the Light theme though; maybe raise its HP to 9 (nine lives!) and possibly bump up the cost slightly?
Sheesh Xeno... why so much hate?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Xenocidius on December 20, 2011, 02:32:57 pm
Hate? Far from it; I actually like the card.

I've addressed my concern for the low HP. Is there any thematic reason for it having low HP? If not, I believe it should be raised so as to fit better with the Light theme.

Also, is the ability active or passive?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on December 20, 2011, 02:49:52 pm
Oops, thought I had that in the notes. It's there now. Thanks :D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on January 09, 2012, 03:23:46 pm
Byakko is now in the Forge - Creatures (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,6846.0.html), thanks for your continued support.

(Also Suzaku (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30203.0.html) is there as well)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: dracomageat on January 17, 2012, 04:40:05 pm
Also the name remind me the manga called 'bleach' nothing to see with this ?
(I guess it was the captain of the first division who was called byakko)
Byakko is a white tiger of japanese myth (often known as the White Tiger) and king of the forest. As such, bleach probably used the name because he his known for his reckless ferocity (hence the high ATK in relation to cost and HP here) but, being an albino and in charge of the forest, Byakko is also strongly associated with the essence of life, hence the HP gain. The ability triggering off failed attacks neatly ties the two aspects together.

The only thing I'm not really sure on is why light but it does seem to work so...
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: headshrinker on March 02, 2012, 01:04:58 am
I love this card and it's art! :P Hope could see it in game soon~~~
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: XVoidWalkerX on April 26, 2012, 01:59:33 am
First thought...this card would eat up Mono-Aether :o
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: UndeadSpider1990 on May 17, 2012, 05:31:37 pm
I agree with (someone) seems a bit cheap. Also I'm not convinced it is good to say you still gain life if it 'misses' due to fog or dusk. Criticism being constructively intended of course, I like the idea very much :)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Chapuz on May 23, 2012, 01:47:15 am
I love it and I would really would like to see it in the game, but with lower stats!
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Cheesy111 on May 23, 2012, 01:56:49 am
I love it and I would really would like to see it in the game, but with lower stats!
Light is in need of an unupped midhitter.  Why would you want to lower its stats?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Chapuz on May 23, 2012, 04:08:49 pm
I love it and I would really would like to see it in the game, but with lower stats!
Light is in need of an unupped midhitter.  Why would you want to lower its stats?
Because against more than half of the shields it gains the same HP effect, but against dim, fog, duck and diss field you are geting a huge bonus.
Mid attacker can be 4-6 sttack or so. Upped,  :light has awsome archangels.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Aroodwen on June 23, 2012, 06:00:30 am
I like the potential of this card against dimension shields/bonewalls. Hope it gets passed. ;D
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: UnholyAir on April 03, 2013, 11:42:40 pm
I love the Idea of Byakko, the story and card art make it memorable.


I Hope this gets passed.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Vangelios on July 19, 2013, 05:32:25 am
 Really liked the card hability and art, but 7-2 and 9-2 are status OP for only 6 :light, I'm surprised to see a card with OP status here in Lv3.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Rutarete on July 19, 2013, 05:56:13 am
Really liked the card hability and art, but 7-2 and 9-2 are status OP for only 6 :light, I'm surprised to see a card with OP status here in Lv3.
It dies to nearly any CC. Also, consider archangel, which is 7/7 for 6 :light.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Vangelios on July 19, 2013, 06:42:21 am
Really liked the card hability and art, but 7-2 and 9-2 are status OP for only 6 :light, I'm surprised to see a card with OP status here in Lv3.
It dies to nearly any CC. Also, consider archangel, which is 7/7 for 6 :light.
If you compare with seraphim byakko is OP, also if compare with pegasus
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on July 19, 2013, 06:56:36 am
GotP has nearly identical stats for a nearly identical cost.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Rutarete on July 19, 2013, 07:18:15 am
Really liked the card hability and art, but 7-2 and 9-2 are status OP for only 6 :light, I'm surprised to see a card with OP status here in Lv3.
It dies to nearly any CC. Also, consider archangel, which is 7/7 for 6 :light.
If you compare with seraphim byakko is OP, also if compare with pegasus
Sure, same if you compare it to photon.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Vangelios on July 19, 2013, 07:26:01 am
ok then, but it is not characteristic of light creatures with high attack and low defense
and upgraded version should cost 7 :light (gotp up is 7 :time)
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Marsu on July 19, 2013, 11:08:10 am
I agree with Vangelios. This card is way too strong, and I'm surprised by people not seeing that.

I'd go as far as saying that 4/4 or 5/2 would be the correct stats for this card for this price. (Remember great synergies with buffs)

The idea is cool.
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Rutarete on July 19, 2013, 04:21:20 pm
I agree with Vangelios. This card is way too strong, and I'm surprised by people not seeing that.
It is indeed strong, but why do you think it's TOO strong, marsu?

ok then, but it is not characteristic of light creatures with high attack and low defense
and upgraded version should cost 7 :light (gotp up is 7 :time)
You people and your element-set characteristic predispositions... Opposed to even one card being different and trying to change it to conform :(
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Marsu on July 19, 2013, 05:03:21 pm
It is indeed strong, but why do you think it's TOO strong, marsu?

The stats are already very good. I would kill for a 7/2 vanilla for 6  :life - and Life already has a bonus for creatures, in contrast to Light.

The effect on the other hand is ridicoulusly strong. If you played a mono Light with 6 of these vs a standard mono Aether with 6 Dims, you'd heal yourself for almost as much as the opponent could damage you per turn, not to speak of the fact that it's max HP and thus has an insane synergy with the in-element Miracle. Oh, and speaking of synergy, also Blessing.
In short, the effect is way to good for a creature who would still be useful if it was vanilla to have.

Your other question probably deserves a thread of its own, but in short: Each element having weaknesses and strengths, a character, a feeling - that's not a small part of why this game is so great. Take it away, and the enjoyment of this game suffers. I also don't really see your problem to be honest, because you can still have innovative stuff (see this creature's ability) or even abilities that don't directly fit a certain element, but have a fitting drawback (See the great 'Grateful Oak' for example).
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on July 19, 2013, 05:32:45 pm
If you play against monoAether, what's to say it won't get Lightning Bolted or Lobo'd?
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Vangelios on July 19, 2013, 06:03:51 pm
following this reasoning a lot of cards are UP
for example Vampire would as status, 7-2? (If you play against mono aether)
how many combos you do with gotp? only one with nightmare
how many combos you can do with Byakko? a lot.

I really liked the card, but statuses is somewhat above, this only my suggestion of equilibrium
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: majofa on July 19, 2013, 06:29:38 pm
following this reasoning a lot of cards are UP
for example Vampire would as status, 7-2? (If you play against mono aether)
how many combos you do with gotp? only one with nightmare
how many combos you can do with Byakko? a lot.

I really liked the card, but statuses is somewhat above, this only my suggestion of equilibrium
Well, then you suggestion is noted and swiftly dismissed. There's already been much discussion about this. Necroposting to troll isn't a good idea anyways...
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Vangelios on July 19, 2013, 06:57:30 pm
Noted and swiftly dismissed ... oh well, if lv3 is example of balanced,
and a card with 6 :light upgraded with status is 9-2 is balanced (based gotp and mono aether), go ahead, we have a creature with greater attack with 6 :underworld
now will be a new reference
Title: Re: Byakko | Byakko
Post by: Rutarete on July 19, 2013, 11:39:19 pm
I also don't really see your problem to be honest
I've seen too much of it in my time here for my liking :(
blarg: