Round 9 - Main Topic

[willng3]

Erm.  That gives Eva 0% win chance against their Sanc Stall if they're dumb/smart enough to play it...but it's ultimately Eva's call I guess.

[EvaRia]

I'm... cautious about them bringing sanc stall again.

I'm pretty sure Zeru at least knows that we can crush their grabbows...

I originally had 2 arsenics just in case, and I don't really want to part with my other...

If it boosts your win rate a whole ton I'll let you have it but I prefer to keep it just in case.

Entropy's a slightly higher priority target too, so...

[deuce22]

Well, it definitely improves my chances. But I can make do without it if necessary.

Not sure if anyone has analyzed entropy's vault to see if their sanc stall is even feasible. They lost a lot of essential cards, and even if they do still have a semi-functioning one (likely without pandas much pandas or AMs), would they dare try a 3rd time?

Based on salvages and remaining decks, their 2 strongest decks are monoentropy and scrambled shriekers. Mono-entropy is probably going to fire because mono-entropy can't pass dim shields. They could have saved their sancs and miracles and maybe 2 pandas (or AMs?), which would mean it would be less of a stall and more of a duo. If this is the case, arse is still better than vamp dagger, but it becomes less crucial.

I totally agree that entropy is a higher priority, so if you guys feel the need for the arse is greater there, then i am cool with that.

Although, it would be interesting if they used their dissipation shields and saved pandas and AMs from the sanc stall and created a mono-entropy stall. That would kind of suck, but an early arse and mid-late dissipation shield is the only way to win. They definitely have 4 diss shields available to them (see round 7 winner below). Because we always use grabbow, they might try to specifically counter it...

by deuce22

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[willng3]

We'll never know, like always; there's enough arguments both against and supporting them using that deck against us again so discussing it would probably get us nowhere.  But nevertheless:

They've been able to salvage from about 40000000000000 Sanc Stalls over the past few rounds and we only know for certain what one of their decks is. 

Fire's FSS is a complete counter to that deck as well as a counter to the deck they won with last round.  It also counters anything Entropy may use with creature spam/Discords.  If this were the case then this puts Entropy in a difficult decision because they are now forced to send the deck with the lowest chance of losing against Fire.  And based on the damage output, their Mono Entropy/critter spam/Novagrabby deck is their best chance of winning even though that chance is almost nonexistent.

Now Entropy takes a look at our counter decks.  They'll assume we're going send at least 1 Bonebolt against Fire, possibly two to increase winning chance.  This leaves us with at least 1 more remaining with a number of opponents it would be effective against; one of them being Entropy if they used their winning deck from last round.  Their Sanc Stall would probably stall out Bonebolt and best of all, they just lost with it which makes it somewhat of a surprise tactic.  Lastly Sanc Stall has the greatest chance of defeating the same Grabbow we've used against them multiple times in the past regardless of it having been defeated by us twice so far.

However because my line of thinking and logic is not the same as everyone else's and that I do not know everything that they have in their vault, there is always the chance that I am completely wrong here.

[deuce22]

After discussing with will, zeru will most likely expect a bonebolt similar to what higs used because it beats everything they have. Which means he will either use scrambled shriekers (EQ + discord gives him a small chance) or sanc stall (which is pretty much demolished as is). In order for him to play monoentropy with diss shields, he would have to do pull an epic mindgate.

Either way, arse at least gives eva a chance against those decks, so I am cool with her keeping it. Sorry about my last second paranoia. You guys should be used to it by now

[EngPhys]

EDIT2: Not sure, but I think I found a decent strategy against firestall. So, the idea is to fractal a dragon halfway through the match and play only 2 or 3 dragons (probably can't play more than 4 anyway) This will draw out their bolts or rage pots, and keep playing a dragon every other turn or so. Again, this is a little more RNG dependent, but this will prevent them from OTK with 10 cards left and it will allow you to not spend as much quanta on bonewalls (yay for 1-2 more dragons!)

This works amazingly well. fractal dragons early, and generally never have more than 2 on the field at once because 2x RoF can really blow. Replacing plague with arse makes it much more consistent too.

Currently 5-1 against FSS

EDIT: 1 more thing. Once 3 Fire bolts have been used, might be a good idea to wait for OTK at that point, but depends on the situation and everything.

Pika and UT, you should read this and try it if you haven't done much testing against FSS. Bumping it since it may have been lost in the commotion.

[pikachufan2164]

Owowow, two losses against Death -_-"

I'll have to do more playtesting when I get home.

[Higurashi]

Mm.. the stall was outfitted with Bone Walls and Plagues, so I can understand that loss.
Losing against Reclusetal was pure RNG hate though. Again.

[EvaRia]

Although, it would be interesting if they used their dissipation shields and saved pandas and AMs from the sanc stall and created a mono-entropy stall. That would kind of suck, but an early arse and mid-late dissipation shield is the only way to win. They definitely have 4 diss shields available to them (see round 7 winner below). Because we always use grabbow, they might try to specifically counter it...

[UTAlan]

Nice mindgate deuce. Good thing Eva was able to pull out the victory.

[deuce22]

Nice mindgate deuce. Good thing Eva was able to pull out the victory.

grabbow was the right choice. Eva won because she played it like a pro. Quite possibly the best played match of war for our team.

Will, I'm sorry I "misunderstood" you. I'm going to keep my paranoias to myself from now on. I don't want to cause any hard feelings within the team.

[willng3]

The only part where I feel like you misunderstood me is when you stated that "I shot you down".  That wasn't my intention from the beginning.  Entropy could have had those Shields in their Vault or they could have converted them at any time.  There was no way for us to know this for certain.  Yes, it would have been awesome to take a direct counter to that deck, but that naturally means that we would have left ourselves open to something else that we may not have foreseen; I simply wanted to cover all of our bases.

Btw:  A little inside info on me as a person:
If I feel like my point is not getting across to the person I'm having a conversation with or they're still trying to convince me of a certain stance when I feel it puts me (or us in this case) in a difficult situation then I will immediately shut myself off from the conversation.  I absolutely despise arguing and I can't help but feel like I am arguing with a person when they continue to press their opinions on me, I explain my reasoning, and the conversation continues in circles.

However this is not to say that your reaction is unjustified.  I was probably more blunt than I should have been simply because my patience was being tried at that point in time in RL.  I'm sorry if I came across as completely objective, but I thought I expressed in our conversation that I couldn't state for sure whether or not they would use that deck because our knowledge of their vault was limited as well as incomplete.  That is why I felt that saying you were shot down was an uncalled for statement.

No hard feelings at all