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Offline Shantu

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg336286#msg336286
« Reply #24 on: May 18, 2011, 06:15:22 PM »
I have an idea for training. Since it doesn't make much sense that you can learn any skill in any town, I guess it will most likely be changed. However, if it is changed to something like you can learn skills only in the respective element's town/city, you won't be able to learn the skills of those that you are at war with. So, to prevent this, I had 2 ideas:
- Each city/town will be able to train you in their element, as well as 1-2 others (either chosen by the organizers or randomized).
- There could be wandering elemental NPCs that - for a fee - would agree to train you in the use of a skill, even if you are at war with that element. Something like a renegade trainer. They could also be killed, just like any players, though they would have powerful decks with perhaps more upped cards than normal players.

Offline Wizardcat

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg336306#msg336306
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2011, 06:51:01 PM »
Darkness also has the Disguise skill for getting into the cities of enemy factions. It's a Tier 1 Skill, so it's not very hard to acquire.
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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg336971#msg336971
« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2011, 05:28:53 PM »
I have an idea for training. Since it doesn't make much sense that you can learn any skill in any town, I guess it will most likely be changed. However, if it is changed to something like you can learn skills only in the respective element's town/city, you won't be able to learn the skills of those that you are at war with. So, to prevent this, I had 2 ideas:
- Each city/town will be able to train you in their element, as well as 1-2 others (either chosen by the organizers or randomized).
- There could be wandering elemental NPCs that - for a fee - would agree to train you in the use of a skill, even if you are at war with that element. Something like a renegade trainer. They could also be killed, just like any players, though they would have powerful decks with perhaps more upped cards than normal players.
This is very close to like I envisioned it, but instead of Diplomatic Relations, I was going to go with geographic location. Idea was that when you are in, lets say :darkness City, you can train skills from that element, and both of the neighboring elements. Like this:

:darkness (all skills)
:death (Tiers 0-2)
:earth (Tiers 0-2)

In other words, the further you are from the Capital City of a specific element, the more difficult it is to train their skills.

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337146#msg337146
« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2011, 11:05:09 PM »
That's work, since then you can learn skills (0-2) from an element you're at WAR with, right?

But you couldn't any tier 3 skills.

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337217#msg337217
« Reply #28 on: May 20, 2011, 01:40:15 AM »
I think players shouldn't be allowed to buy skills or cards from elements they are warring with.  This would promote players having to work together and buy/sell or trade cards with each other to get cards too instead of just doing everything at the merchant.
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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337222#msg337222
« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2011, 01:46:40 AM »
I think players shouldn't be allowed to buy skills or cards from elements they are warring with.  This would promote players having to work together and buy/sell or trade cards with each other to get cards too instead of just doing everything at the merchant.
What about Underworld? I don't see a place for it on the diplomatic relations chart, so how would we determine who is at "War" with them?

Offline TStar

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337268#msg337268
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2011, 03:04:02 AM »
I think players shouldn't be allowed to buy skills or cards from elements they are warring with.  This would promote players having to work together and buy/sell or trade cards with each other to get cards too instead of just doing everything at the merchant.
What about Underworld? I don't see a place for it on the diplomatic relations chart, so how would we determine who is at "War" with them?
Since UW isn't an organized faction, but rather a bunch of lawless players with no ties, nobody can really be at war with them.  You could do the following:
*  Since UW is like the "Black Market" all non-rare cards can be bought in Outlaw City (or whatever the UW city is) by UW players at normal price and by non-UW players are double price.  This reflects the premium a non-UW player would have to pay to obtain cards they can't get from Merchants due to War, etc.
*  Rare cards can only be purchased from Merchants in the cities or towns of the element they are in.  This means a UW player with a negative reputation with an element would not be allowed to buy rare cards of that element since they cannot enter the city/town.
*  Non-rare cards of an element can be purchased from cities or towns of that element or their allies.  This means players at War with an element can still obtain cards of that element without using UW if they are not at War with the allies.

This would discourage UW players from simply attacking everything in sight since they will be be barred from obtaining Rare cards from the elements of players they kill unless they do quests to "redeem" themselves to that element.  This type of check-and-balance system forces UW players to get involved with other elements in non-violent ways if they don't want their decks seriously restricted by a lack of rare cards.
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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337283#msg337283
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2011, 04:13:36 AM »
I think players shouldn't be allowed to buy skills or cards from elements they are warring with.
Now that movement will probably be faster, I changed my earlier example to this:

 :darkness (all skills)
 :death (Tiers 1 only)
 :earth (Tiers 1 only)

So if you want to learn a skill, you need to travel to a City/Town of that Element, unless you want a lower Tier skill which can be taught in neighboring Cities/Towns as well.

I don't think we can do buying/selling based on current Diplomatic Relations will work because it would be insane amount of work to change everything every time Diplomatic Relations change. And if we make it so that players themselves decide, that will just lead to tons of user errors.

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337286#msg337286
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2011, 04:27:28 AM »
So is this a Beta thing, or currently in effect?

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg337964#msg337964
« Reply #33 on: May 21, 2011, 01:10:52 PM »
I decided to compare the fast travel options of the different elements (work in progress):

ElementHexes/turnAP/activationOther costsLimitationsComment
:aether32-no anglesvery powerfull, but tier 2 skill
:air41-needs at least one other playerHas potential, needs some co÷rdination, depends on number of players
:darkness1-1611 relictarget = other player with same skillCould be powerfull, depending on the number of players, especially because you have even one action point left
:death32Next turn no moving-Weak, 3 hexes in two turns is even less than normal movement.
:earth41-Between tunnelsUsefull to travel around you territory, useless when you are traveling around the map
:entropy1-1621 relicTarget hex is randomNeeds testing to show it's usefull/uselessness.
:fire621 creature cardBetween Volcano'sVery fast, but limited. The 1 creature card won't matter much, you can salvage them after beating an element with not much usefull cards.
:gravity421 extra roundOnly from rocket to rocketFast but very limited. Usefull to join the action or retreat, not to speed around
:life41-Forest hexes onlyGood skill, though likely limited to the outer parts of the map
:light81-Stallion routeFastest of all, but just like gravity, only good to get out of the corner
:time41-Camel routeLike earth: Usefull to travel around you territory, useless when you are traveling around the map
:water32-Water hexesUsefull to travel around, but not much faster than normal movement.
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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg338100#msg338100
« Reply #34 on: May 21, 2011, 05:59:23 PM »
After thinking about the skills some more, I think that we totally need to ditch the 'Improvement' skills, or the: "Build a _______ " ones. Considering the complexity of the event (and the difficulty in 'adding' more icons to the map), the idea of having these custom-made icons for these four elements (adding improvements wherever they can) just seems more tedious and annoying, and doesn't really contribute anything to the game. It's nice for experience gains, but then again, 'spamming' these skills seems a somewhat boring way to level up.



We could address what 'improvements' are, but I'll just add my other skill ideas to the respective topics instead. ^^;

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Re: WoE Alpha - General Feedback http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25138.msg338131#msg338131
« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2011, 07:17:22 PM »
After thinking about the skills some more, I think that we totally need to ditch the 'Improvement' skills, or the: "Build a _______ " ones. Considering the complexity of the event (and the difficulty in 'adding' more icons to the map), the idea of having these custom-made icons for these four elements (adding improvements wherever they can) just seems more tedious and annoying, and doesn't really contribute anything to the game. It's nice for experience gains, but then again, 'spamming' these skills seems a somewhat boring way to level up.



We could address what 'improvements' are, but I'll just add my other skill ideas to the respective topics instead. ^^;
Very much agreed. It'd also be visually disadvantageous, because having a map spammed with, say, windmills is not exactly easy to look at.
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