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Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg109912#msg109912
« on: July 07, 2010, 07:26:14 pm »
General:
Victory conditions

After some time, this even has to end so that we can restart it, keeping things fresh. I was thinking we should have different paths to victory. Here are some ideas.

One element is the winner of WoE.
One player from that element is the Champion of WoE.


Quest Victory
Winning element: Champion's element.
Champion: Player who becomes a God by finishing the storyline quests and winning the final battle.


Conquest Victory
Winning element: Element that controls 120+ hexagons
Champion: Player from that element who has the most duel wins.


Cultural Victory
Winning element: Element that controls all 12 Wonders.
Champion: ??



Yeah.. I need some more ideas.

Offline ddevans96

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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg109935#msg109935
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2010, 07:47:02 pm »
One should be being the last element remaining, if this one will have players being defeated and stuff like that.
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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg109944#msg109944
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2010, 07:55:49 pm »
I'd say for the Cultural Victory you should have the King as champ, as he most likely organized the attacks and stuff. Also, diplomatic victory is not so cool. You do have diplomacy to help in the fights, but after all you DO need a big bad army to win it all.
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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg109950#msg109950
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2010, 08:01:09 pm »
I agree with Xdude about the Diplomacy part, since you can only have a maximum of three Elements in an alliance anyway.  Why not make the third condition beating the False-False-God?  Seems simple enough to implement and easy to crown a champ.

A little off-topic, but will this champ receive any in or out of game prizes?
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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg109954#msg109954
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2010, 08:10:17 pm »
One should be being the last element remaining, if this one will have players being defeated and stuff like that.
Well, the Conquest Victory kind of does that already. "Last element standing" system would make the last few weeks of WoE extremely boring as we would have one giant elements slowly beating down one smaller element.


I'd say for the Cultural Victory you should have the King as champ, as he most likely organized the attacks and stuff. Also, diplomatic victory is not so cool. You do have diplomacy to help in the fights, but after all you DO need a big bad army to win it all.
Yeah, I guess King could work. Or maybe the player with the most wealth (cash, castles, etc.).

I agree that some kind of Diplomatic Victory would be pretty lame, but I also would like to offer multiple different paths to victory. Not everything has to be about killing your enemy. Then again, if we take away the duels, it's not about Elements anymore, lol. :)


Why not make the third condition beating the False-False-God?  Seems simple enough to implement and easy to crown a champ.
Yes, that is definitely one of the conditions. It's actually the most important one, I just forgot to add it.

A little off-topic, but will this champ receive any in or out of game prizes?
Yes.

Offline Kuroaitou

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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110079#msg110079
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2010, 12:41:05 am »
I'd say for the Cultural Victory you should have the King as champ, as he most likely organized the attacks and stuff. Also, diplomatic victory is not so cool. You do have diplomacy to help in the fights, but after all you DO need a big bad army to win it all.
Yeah, I guess King could work. Or maybe the player with the most wealth (cash, castles, etc.).

I agree that some kind of Diplomatic Victory would be pretty lame, but I also would like to offer multiple different paths to victory. Not everything has to be about killing your enemy. Then again, if we take away the duels, it's not about Elements anymore, lol. :)
It's interesting about the concept of a 'Diplomatic' Victory.

When I saw that, I thought that it means that you (as an element) can be capable of doing something beyond killing, controlling wonders, and manipulating the terrain. What if there was some sort of prize for being the most 'helpful' element (not just to the other elemental allies/alliances), but also in terms of quest lines?

Perhaps there should be a minor (but MUCH longer) story quest line where you have to do all these quests to help the NPCs rebuild their land and protect them. Perhaps the final goal should be finding a way where you somehow manage to get all of the elements to ally together/stop 'fighting' and bring peace to the non-fighting elements in Outlaw City/other areas, which summons the 'REAL' god (Zanz? :P) who congratulates the element and player for bringing unity to the WoE, and all that stuff.

...of course, I don't see all the elements trying to become pals due to current mechanics. XD


As for Cultural Victory, it should be the player who actually visited the most wonders - and if there is more than 1 that visited a whole bunch of them, then you'd separate it by those who actually fought for those wonders or defended them from opposing elements, as well as those who used them the most to gain resources/advantages.

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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110144#msg110144
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2010, 02:38:23 am »
I love the Civilization ideas for victory.  You could make beating the False God the Transcendent Victory because that seems to be what the champion is doing, transcending this mortal world into the world of the gods.

Yeah, I agree that Conquest should be percentage based otherwise it'd just be kinda tedious to get that last little bit.  Something like 67% or 80%.


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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110174#msg110174
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2010, 03:30:59 am »
Diplomatic victory: All 11 elements are in your debt.
Champion: Player who elements are most indebted to.

You may become in debt by:
  • Requiring an opposing element to defend your homeland
  • Owing an opposing element resources you cannot supply
So there are several ways to win diplomatically.  One method would be to become "anti-winner".  By picking the winning element, and going out of harms way to stop all advances of that element.  In this way, you would defend 10 elements, and they would be "in your debt".  Approximately 30 cards worth of resources in debt.  Or, from a more resource standpoint, just have a trade agreement, and then attack your allies source of resources so they cannot pay you, making them indebted to you.  A combination of these would be the best method.  With a coordinated strike, a team of six players can make six teams lose their resources and become in debt.  So if you have 8 elements you rescued, and you destroy three element's source of metal in a coordinated strike, suddenly all 11 elements owe you.  And, you can kindly wave their debts if they accept you as their superior and leader.

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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110196#msg110196
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2010, 04:44:22 am »
Diplomatic victory: All 11 elements are in your debt.
Champion: Player who elements are most indebted to.

You may become in debt by:
  • Requiring an opposing element to defend your homeland
  • Owing an opposing element resources you cannot supply
So there are several ways to win diplomatically.  One method would be to become "anti-winner".  By picking the winning element, and going out of harms way to stop all advances of that element.  In this way, you would defend 10 elements, and they would be "in your debt".  Approximately 30 cards worth of resources in debt.  Or, from a more resource standpoint, just have a trade agreement, and then attack your allies source of resources so they cannot pay you, making them indebted to you.  A combination of these would be the best method.  With a coordinated strike, a team of six players can make six teams lose their resources and become in debt.  So if you have 8 elements you rescued, and you destroy three element's source of metal in a coordinated strike, suddenly all 11 elements owe you.  And, you can kindly wave their debts if they accept you as their superior and leader.
Isn't that a little too complicated?  I understand wanted to add depth to this MMO, but we need to make it understandable as to how to win the game.   ;)
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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110200#msg110200
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2010, 05:02:42 am »
I have yet to see simple diplomacy.

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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110226#msg110226
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2010, 06:00:08 am »
I have yet to see simple diplomacy.
Well there is no need for a Diplomacy win condition, in my opinion.  Three is pushing the line as is between simple and complicated.
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Re: General: Victory conditions https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=9324.msg110236#msg110236
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2010, 06:21:20 am »
Maybe we can implement a form of elemental government, in which people elect whos in power for a certain number of turns. Then, the diplomacy champions could be the element who had the same leader for the longest amount of time without him being overthrown. As for the all 12 wonders, it could go to the element that has fought in all 12 capital cities :)

 

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