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War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1151697#msg1151697
« on: August 17, 2014, 08:41:11 PM »

1 BUILDING AN ARMY
1.1 GENERALS
War will have 12 Generals, one for each element. Masters are the Generals of their element by default. If a Master is unable to join War, he or she will appoint a replacement General (Sr. Member or above). If a Master does not appoint a General, one will be picked by the Council.
 
Generals are given 450 blank cards. These cards will be used as currency when drafting players during the next phase. Later they will be used to build the starting Vault for the team.

1.2 PLAYER DRAFT
Players wanting to join War must start their own War application topic in the War Auction board where they should include relevant information. Players may ban up to 3 elements from bidding on them. However, each ban increases the minimum bid for that player by 5 cards. Players must include their in game name. All war matches must be played by them through that same in game name.

Players may also select any number of favorite elements. Favorite elements will be used as a tie-breaker during the draft. Not listing all non-banned elements may subject the player to a cointoss in case of a tie.

Both banned and favorite elements cannot change once bidding starts.

nb There are no guarantees you will be drafted by who you want. Drafted players who refuse to participate will be removed from the event & banned from next War.

The draft will occur over the course of 5 rounds. If there is an insufficient number of applications, the number of draft rounds will be reduced (thus reducing team size).

In each round, generals have 24 hours in which they must submit both a single bid and a rank list of 12 players via private message to the WMs. The minimum bid for each round is 1 card. Draft order for a round is determined by bid size. Proceeding in decreasing order of bids, each general gets the highest ranked individual on their list who is still available. The team with the highest bid gets their top choice. The team with the 2nd highest bid gets the next pick (one of their top 2 choices). This continues until the team with the lowest bid gets their highest ranked player that is still available (not necessarily their 12th choice). Each round is repeated as such until teams are filled.

A general cannot rank list players who:
  • Were drafted in a previous round already;
  • Banned the general's element

The maximum bid is as follows for each round:
Round 1 - 40 cards
Round 2 - 35 cards
Round 3 - 30 cards
Round 4 - 25 cards
Round 5 - 20 cards


Keep in mind that if a bid is submitted that is lower than the minimum cost of a player in the rank list, that player cannot be drafted and the next legally listed player will be drafted.

Spoiler for Example:
General A bids 1 card for Round 1
Rank list:
1. Player A - banned aether (minimum bid is 6)
2. Player B - no bans (minimum bid is 1)
3. Player C - no bans
etc.

Assuming both Player B and C are still available, Player B will be drafted to General A's team

If a tie occurs where 2 or more generals bid the same amount and have the same highest remaining ranked player, the tie is broken based on the players favorite elements. If a player does not have enough favorite elements listed to determine team placement, then the player will be randomized to a team by WMs.

If a team fails to draft a player for whatever reason, then they will be charged the maximum bid for the round and select one of the remaining players prior to the start of the next round. (To prevent this, Generals are encouraged to make sure they submit a full list of 12 players and make sure their bid is high enough for each player)

2 PREPARATION
2.1 SECRET FORUM SECTION
Each team has a hidden subboard visible only to its members, Warmasters and non-participating Administrators. All discussions held here MUST be kept secret. A player caught telling team secrets to anyone outside their own team will face consequences decided on a case-by-case basis, possibly including being permanently banned from all Elements community PvP Events. Basically, don't publicly talk about anything that goes on here.
 
2.2 MEMBER ROLES
1. General: Responsible for coordinating the team. If a member is unable to duel the General should coordinate a substitute.
2. Lieutenant: Second in command. They should be the first to fill in for Generals when necessary.
3. Soldiers: The rest of your team

2.3 THE VAULT
The Vault is your heart in War. Not only does it supply cards for deckbuilding, but acts as "hit points" for the team. If a team falls below 75 cards, they will be eliminated.

Cards that were not used during the player draft will form the team starting Vault. Up to this point, cards have just been a number, now it is time to fill the Vault with specific cards.
 
Vault building rules:
- At least 50% of cards must be in your element.
- maximum of 24 per card from your element (restriction doesn't apply to Pillars or Pendulums)
- maximum of 9 per card from other elements
- You may not have Shards or Relics in your vault.
 
Cards in the Vault are always unupgraded. During deckbuilding, unupgraded cards may be taken from the Vault and transformed into upgraded cards for that deck, up to the limits mentioned below. If you move an upgraded card back to the Vault, it becomes unupgraded.

"Mark of ..." cards are considered in the element they feature. Unlike in Tournaments, Marks are not considered equivalent to Pillars or Pendulums.

Important! Vaults are virtual. Players are not given cards taken from the Vault, nor are any cards removed from their account if they lose. Players must own the cards on their Elements game account in order to use them. If a player doesn't have a specific card in their account, they cannot use it even if that card is listed in the Vault. So try to pick cards that your members are able to access


3. STARTING A ROUND
War consists of multiple rounds. Each round lasts 1 week and will consist of 2 phases: Deckbuilding (4 days) and Duels (3 days)

3.1 DETERMINING OPPONENTS
Amount of cards in the Vault determine how many players from each team participates on a round:

0-74 cards=team is eliminated
75-109 cards=2 players fight
110-144 cards=3 players fight
145-179 cards=4 players fight
180-214 cards=5 players fight
215+ cards=6 players fight

Opponents will be determined randomly by Warmasters, with the constraint that no team will play another team more than once within a given round if possible. If there are an uneven number of players fighting during a round, the team which has to field the most number of players will have a bye, meaning one player in that team will skip the round. If there is more than one team which must field that number of players, then the bye will go to the team which has had the fewest byes so far out of those teams. If there is a tie for the team which has had the fewest number of byes, it will go to the team with the most cards out of those teams.

Duel pairings will be made public by Warmasters. Included should be Event Cards designed by Warmasters. Event Cards have a global effect upon all teams during that round.

In Rounds 2 & 4, teams are intentionally seeded against teams they did not play in the previous round.

3.2 DECKBUILDING
Teams must build a deck for each player fighting during the round.
 
Deckbuilding rules:
- Combining all decks must not use more than the vault carries. Upgraded cards in decks are counted as unupgraded cards in the vault.
- At least 50% of the cards must be in your element.
- Generals, Lieutenants, and Soldiers may use up to 12, 9, and 6 upgraded cards respectively.
- Teams may spend a relic to grant 1 extra upgrade to a deck. There is no limit to how many relics may be spent per round. However, event cards may change the ability of relics each round, so pay close attention

Conversion: Teams have the option to convert some of their cards. This means that they can replace any card in their Vault with a Pillar or a Pendulum of their element. Converting helps teams to avoid a situation where they would be otherwise forced to build "suicide" decks. Teams have unlimited conversions each round, including before round 1.

Explicitly Illegal Decks: Teams may title their illegal decks "Suicide". If so they will not be penalized beyond a 0-3 result.

You must not edit your decks, salvage, discard, etc. after the deckbuilding period ends. Doing so will result in a penalty, regardless of what the change was.

3.3 DUELS
Players will contact their opponent to try find a time that suits both. If the fight does not happen both players lose by default unless one player is clearly more active in trying to find a suitable time. Warmasters will determine who the most active player is.

Matches are best-of-five, which means that each battle's winner is the first player to win 3 duels. Remember, you must play all duels with the same deck and mark.

3.4 INACTIVE PLAYERS
If it looks like a member won't be able to fight during a round, the team has various options:

1. Temporarily replace a member with any other member. Temporary replacements use the same exact deck, number of upgrades, and mark as recorded for that player. The first substitution each round is free. After that the opposing team chooses how much salvage you receive (up to 6) if you win the match.
2. Permanently replace a member with a player who submitted an application but didn't end up on a team (costs 6 cards).
3. To permanently replace a General (as leader of the team), every other member must agree that the General needs replacing and a consensus must be reached on who the new General will be. Warmasters will remove the General from the team at no cost. If a new player needs to be added, see above.

Note that a substitute may not use ANY cards the player they are replacing does not have.

3.5 DISCONNECTS & DESYNCS
A player who is disconnected during a duel, for any reason except for disconnect bug (link), will receive a loss for that individual duel. Both players must provide screenshots of the disconnect. The disconnected player must get a screenshot of the disconnect countdown and the "You Lost" screen (example). The non-disconnected player may continue to play AI and must take SS of win screen if they wish to try to claim victory for the match. It is preferable that the players come to a consensus on whether a player won the disconnected match or if it should be a replay. If an agreement cannot be reached, a player who wishes to appeal the match for a win must inform their opponent. The remainder of the match can be played out, not counting the appealed game. WMs will make a ruling after the match is completed, if needed. There must be indisputable evidence that one player would have clearly won for a result to be overturned.

Desyncs will result in both players playing against the AI unless both agree to restart the duel. Screenshots of the "player not responding" countdown and the winning turn vs AI must be provided in order to claim a win or replay. Screenshots of the "Game Won" screen are insufficient. If both players beat the AI, and one player takes a screenshot while the other does not, then the player with the screenshot wins. In the event both players win or lose, and both present screenshots, a reduel will be ordered. The exception to this rule is if both players agree that one player would have won/lost if it were not for AI misplays. All games can be appealed to WMs, but there must be indisputable evidence provided that one player would have clearly won. Whether one player would have clearly won is decided strictly, and providing more information makes it more likely that an accurate ruling will occur.

If the desync causes strange things (impossible changes in game state, not including insta-win/lose) to happen, take a screenshot and the duel will be replayed.

4 POSTBATTLE
4.1 WINNING A BATTLE
The Winner of the duel starts a new topic in the "Battle Results" section, indicating the teams, the member roles, & the score. Member roles are abbreviated (Gen, Lt, Sld). For example if "KingKiller" from :air fights "LordOwner" from :water & wins 3-1, he will start a topic that could be titled in one of the following ways:
(Air Gen) KingKiller 3 - 1 (Water Lt) LordOwner
(Air Gen) KingKiller 3 - 1 LordOwner (Water Lt)
(Air Gen) KingKiller 3 - (Water Lt) LordOwner 1
(Air Sld) KingKiller 3 - 1 (Water Gen) LordOwner
(Air Lt) KingKiller 3 - (Water Sld) (Sub) LordOwner 1
(use SUB to indicate that someone else played instead of LordOwner)

 
In that topic KingKiller will post his deck, and should summarize the match. LordOwner will then reply to that same topic with his deck. He may also talk about the battle if he so chooses. Everyone may post in the topics after LordOwner replies.
If the player who played the match is not available to post their deck immediately afterwards, one of their teammates must do it. If this happens, the player should post in the same topic as soon as they are available.
 
The winning team salvages cards from the opponent's deck. The winning team MUST pick 6 cards to copy from the deck of the losing player into their vault unupgraded. These cards become part of the Vault

When salvaging cards into your Vault, you may choose to transmute them into cards of your own element instead. Salvaged cards may be transmuted at a two to one (2:1) ratio into any in-element card which you do not already have 12 copies of in your Vault, except for Shards.

Spoiler for Example:
Aether salvages 6 novas. They have 9 mindgates in their vault, so they decide to transmute all 6 novas into 3 mindgates


4.2 LOSING A BATTLE
When a team loses a battle they have to discard cards from the deck used. Cards that are left in the deck after discarding are returned back to Vault.

Loss inDiscard
Round #19 cards
Round #215 cards
Round #320 cards
Round #4+24 cards

4.3 WINNING WAR
If you're the only team left, or nobody is left and you have the largest vault out of anyone who participated in the last round, you've won. The winning team of War earns:
- Cool forum award icons.
- The forum "Reigned by" image will be changed to show which element won.
- And a Mark/Nymph reward code for each worthy member (as decided by an admin)

Otherwise a new round begins.

5 PENALTIES
Penalties are issued when a team somehow breaks the rules or disrupts War. A penalized team must discard from their Vault at the round's end. The following are guidelines, and Warmasters will determine penalties on a case-by-case basis.

Minor penalty: 3 cards. Small & harmless things like posting an illegal deck by mistake.
Medium penalty: 6 cards. For bigger infractions like not doing what they are supposed to do because of inactivity.
Major penalty: 12 cards. For major infractions like seriously disrupting the whole event.

BACKROOM DEALS
Conspiring with other teams is forbidden. Even discussing already public information ruins the spirit of the event, making it less fun for everybody.


To see how War is in reality, visit the War Archive subboard. Some things were done differently during previous Wars but the principles remain.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2014, 02:54:53 PM by CuCN »

Offline CuCN

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1152016#msg1152016
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2014, 04:15:35 AM »
Quote
Are the vault restrictions like 50+% in-element, 24 per card (in element), 9 per card (out element) applied only when building the vault or does it have to adhere to them at all times?

Only building vault

Quote
Are member roles permanent, or can we change them round to round?

General is permanent. Lt can be changed.

Quote
I have a question about relics and event cards.

"Vault building rules:
...
You may not have Shards or Relics in your vault."

and then:

"Deck building rules:
...
Teams may spend a relic to grant 1 extra upgrade to a deck. There is no limit to how many relics may be spent per round. However, event cards may change the ability of relics each round, so pay close attention"

The first rule would seem to prevent teams from getting relics, but the second shows how important they are to get. I know that in previous Wars, teams got relics from event cards. Is that going to be the same this War as well? Are there going to be other ways of getting relics (e.g. there was a suggestion that winning at least one battle per round would grant a relic to each team)?
Some event cards will grant relics. Relics are not part of the vault.

Quote
Does that mean that Relics have to be used in the round where they are given (by an event card) or can they be carried over to subsequent rounds?

Relics do not have to be used in the round they are earned, and they will carry over to the next round if not used.

Quote
All the bids are "blind" this war?

Bids will only be revealed after each draft round is over.

Quote
3.4 INACTIVE PLAYERS
Note that a substitute may not use ANY cards the player they are replacing does not have.
I noticed that this was changed from the War #7 rules to account for all cards as opposed to just Marks and Nymphs. How exactly is this going to be enforced? Or will we be going off of an honor system here unless given justifiable reason otherwise?
Just a little rewording, but this rule in general is tough to enforce. It is there more for marks and nymphs (player A has no marks is subbed by player B who has 6 marks). All other cards can be grinded, so these won't really be strictly enforced.
Quote
"When salvaging cards into your Vault, you may choose to transmute them into cards of your own element instead. Salvaged cards may be transmuted at a two to one (2:1) ratio into any in-element card which you do not already have 12 copies of in your Vault."

I'm thinking that you all want this to mean that you can transmute cards to have up to 12 copies of any card; is that correct?  e.g. Earth has 11 copies of antlion in their vault, they win a match; can they transmute this into 3 more antlions (=14 total), or rather only 1 more to equal 12 (and then have 4 other salvage to transmute or take)?
The latter. The weird case is if your opponent's deck had 4 antlions, you have 11 antlions in vault, & you want to transmute to 12 before salvaging the 4 antlions. Transmutation in this weird case shouldn't be allowed (unless you don't salvage any antlions)

In order to further clarify, the order in which everything takes place is as follows:

1. Salvage and discard (essentially simultaneous)
2. Transmutation
3. Conversion

So, if you salvaged antlions and have 12 or more after salvage, then none can be transmuted.

Quote
Hmmmmm, so a team may begin the War with up to 24 count of in-element cards but after War starts up-to-24 is the limit during salvage/discard but up-to-12 is the limit for transmutation (with Conversion being unlimited from any-card-to-a-pillar/pendulum)?
No. 24 is the limit for vault building. There is no limit on salvaging. You could salvage 6 antlions every round and finish war with almost 100 antlions.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2014, 02:15:00 PM by CuCN »

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155853#msg1155853
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2014, 03:07:13 AM »
1.2
- "All war matchs" --> "All war matches"
- Does the note bene mean that drafted players that do not participate are banned from next War?  That seems the most likely meaning but there is some ambiguity present.

:o :o  I think I like the 24 card vault limit for in-element cards!
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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155854#msg1155854
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2014, 03:20:38 AM »
The 74-card cutoff is still ridiculous, but...other than that, great work.
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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155855#msg1155855
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2014, 03:23:19 AM »
Just a precision I'd like to see on the rules... give a code of mark/nymph is really cool for the winners team... but it should say somehow that it is given if you didn't drop out cause it happens.
I don't like the idea that the general can't save the team as it is 2 players at least or you're out, and playing with ridiculusly tight vault can be fun ... other then that, looks like a fun war is on the way!!

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155857#msg1155857
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2014, 03:38:26 AM »
The 74-card cutoff is still ridiculous, but...other than that, great work.

Just curious, do you think it is too high or too low?  It seems in the right neighbourhood to me.

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155858#msg1155858
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2014, 03:39:18 AM »
Far too high...a team that can field 2 decks should not be eliminated.
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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155859#msg1155859
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2014, 03:41:44 AM »
Just a precision I'd like to see on the rules... give a code of mark/nymph is really cool for the winners team... but it should say somehow that it is given if you didn't drop out cause it happens.
I don't like the idea that the general can't save the team as it is 2 players at least or you're out, and playing with ridiculusly tight vault can be fun ... other then that, looks like a fun war is on the way!!

This has already been discussed with the admins, and we may make a modification to the rule before the start of war.

The 74-card cutoff is still ridiculous, but...other than that, great work.

Making this change allows us to address a lot of the suggestions and feedback from previous wars. Namely vault size, length of war, "sweet spot" issues, "easy wins" for top teams, and other issues. Thematically, it works because if a General has no soldiers, how can he fight a war without an army?

Far too high...a team that can field 2 decks should not be eliminated.

75 was chosen so that if a team needed 2 wins to stay alive, they would have a reasonable vault to make 2 decent decks.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2014, 03:43:22 AM by deuce22 »

Offline ddevans96

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155868#msg1155868
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2014, 04:12:36 AM »
Alright, going to counter those one point at a time.

Records last war, when a team has two matches or less:
Aether: 2-2
Air: 2-2
Time: 0-2
Gravity: 0-2
Earth, Death, Entropy: 0-0
Darkness: 1-1
Fire: 0-1
Life: 2-1
Water: 3-3 - round 8 forfeit, so 3-2 in matches actually played
Light: 0-1

Overall: 10-15 - if you exclude the post-spoils teams, which is where this war's rules are relevant, 6-7, potentially 7-6 if I didn't screw up.

How are these wins free?
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Offline rob77dp

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155869#msg1155869
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2014, 04:19:41 AM »
Alright, going to counter those one point at a time.

Records last war, when a team has two matches or less:
Aether: 2-2
Air: 2-2
Time: 0-2
Gravity: 0-2
Earth, Death, Entropy: 0-0
Darkness: 1-1
Fire: 0-1
Life: 2-1
Water: 3-3 - round 8 forfeit, so 3-2 in matches actually played
Light: 0-1

Overall: 10-15 - if you exclude the post-spoils teams, which is where this war's rules are relevant, 6-7, potentially 7-6 if I didn't screw up.

How are these wins free?

Did you account for the FOUR-HUNDRED FIFTY starting blank cards for each General?  (I'm not sure if that is different from previous Wars now that I type it up...)  Also, team sizes are smaller so fewer required bids.  Basically, I'm curious if your estimates accounted for what should be higher starting vault counts this War from last...
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Offline ddevans96

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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155870#msg1155870
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2014, 04:22:46 AM »
I'm using raw data right now, I'm not 'accounting' for anything. Either way, starting vaults are not relevant to that particular point.
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Re: War #8 - Rules http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=55465.msg1155871#msg1155871
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2014, 04:27:44 AM »
@dd, give me the record of teams from the last 3 or 4 wars that had 40-cards or less in their vault. I think you will find that these are the "free wins" I referred to in my previous post.

There is probably a better than 50% win rate for teams that had vault sizes between 55-65 with only the General fielding a deck. They then play 2 matches next round, and lose 1 of them. Following round, opponent knows your vault, and it is virtually a guaranteed loss. Eliminating teams when they get down to 1 deck would not have changed the outcome for those teams, and it would have shortened war by at least a few rounds.

 

anything
blarg: