Post by: Leodip on January 26, 2014, 09:08:43 am
Winning Streak which only needs two wins;
Cost 20 Electrums to be played, win about 200 when you win, repaying 10 lost games (and is about 480 when you win with an EM);
Skips won't make you lose time, and playing only against decks you have a pretty good chance to win against should let you get a Special Spin which values, money-wise, around 1300 Electrums.
Gathering Deck's Needs:
[It mustn't have upgraded cards (I'm still deciding on rares, probably not shards);]
Has to have at least an 80% Win Rate against the deck(s) it wins against;
The deck(s) it wins against must be some of the usually posted in Platinum;
Preferably, has to EM;
Prefarbly, a 500 HP deck;
Doesn't need to be a fast deck, it can even win via deckout;
Preferably, has to be small in order to draw into key cards faster (if it is a stall, it still is preferred a 30-cards deck but with Eternities to loop a creature);
The more the deck it counters, the better.
Gathering Decks usually posted in Arena (not caring about metagames):
Pestal;
Poison Rush;
SoSacPoison;
SoFree-MonoAir;
Swallow;
Dischole;
Ghostmare;
Earthquake Denial;
MonoAether (with and without SoW);
SN-based Decks;
? (pretty sure I forgot some important ones).
Gathering Counter Cards to said Decks (respectively):
Rainbow Decks;
Purifies;
Purifies;
Denial for quanta and destroying SoFrees (SoSac with shards);
Return Times and Eternity;
Sanctuary (maybe with Enchant Artifact);
Time Deck (in order to summon the Ghosts of the Past nightmare'd);
Enchant Artifact;
Steals for Dim Shields or Momentum Rush or Poison Rush for SoW-less MonoAether, Reflective Shield or Emerald Shield (the latter may be played with a lot of Heal so that it can survive to creatures who didn't get SoW) for SoWMonoAether;
Black Hole;
?.
Deck Ideas:
Enchanted Dissipation Shield: with Enchant Artifact we defend ourselves from Earthquakes and SoFo's destruction. A lot of Amethyst pillars should be able to give enough fuel to Dissipation Shields. May splash in 3 Time Pillars, 2 Eternities and 1 Gnome Rider to get a smaller deck in order to draw more consistently Dissipation Shields and Enchant Artifacts.
Another build may be with Time and Amethyst pillars, some draw cards from Time Quanta and Enchant Artifacts splashed from the mark.
Pros: if it gets going, almost nothing can stop you. It being a Duo with a lot of quanta generation means it doesn't fear Black Holes, and if we get a Dissipation Shield to work, it protects us from Discord's Scramble.
Cons: (don't know whether the AI knows that keeping SoP a little more may kill my Dissipation Shield in a blow without me having the time to regenerate the quanta needed for them). Needs a lot of Amethyst pillars, but not too many in order to not increase the deck size by too much. Dissipation Shields can be killed in a blow. Fears Momentum. Poison gets through. Spell Damage gets through. Something else I may have forgotten.
Decks to be played against: Dischole, Earthquake Denial, Pestal (not sure, but most likely won't have enough damage to kill the shield if it can drain a lt of quanta and viceversa).
Decks to Skip: Poison Decks, decks with an high damage factor (which should, I think, easily surpass 70 damage per turn).
Decks to Try: Aether, unless you play against them you won't know if it is a SoW-less MonoAether. If it doesn't have neither Psions nor SoW, it will be a win.
I'm pretty sure I forgot a couple of points in the deck needs and a lot of decks in the most common decks of the Arena. May have fogotten a couple of nice counters, too. In deckk Ideas I only wrote the first deck that jumped to my mind, haven't worked on that, yet.
Post by: Gandora on January 26, 2014, 05:32:44 pm
Another advantage if Diss shield needing lots of quanta is that you can increase protection with Antimatter and prevent Momentim, sow, a bit sofr and poison if played along with creatures.
Post by: Leodip on January 26, 2014, 08:09:26 pm
Post by: serprex on January 26, 2014, 08:17:04 pm
Post by: Leodip on January 26, 2014, 08:37:19 pm
Dissipation won't work vs Dischole's that pack chargers. Mono Dark will SoV/Drain Life you. Pestal isn't too popular in Plat since mono dark plays pests so fast with double draw already1.Didn't think about chargers, I rarely even meet Dischole in Plat (added because I kept reading people met lots of Dischole recently in Plat) and that once I did recently I was with swallow and completely locked it down (you get what you deserve), didn't manage to see Charger;
2.Didn't list Monodark, should do so, I completely forgot it;
3.I got tons of Pestal in today's games in Platinum, but I see your point, thanks.
I wanted to say that the deck was just a thing I wrote on the spur of the moment, so it shouldn't be accurated. If someone likes the project and wants to partecipate with ideas in this, I'd be more than happy to modify or even remove it, if necessary. As of now it mostly is a placeholder.
Post by: serprex on January 26, 2014, 09:23:20 pm
To note: I feel that 30 cards isn't ideal if you're packing an Eternity stall payload. You want to minimize the impact of the payload
Post by: Leodip on January 26, 2014, 09:49:14 pm
If, for example, we were to include a MomentumedDuneScorpion deck in the list (which most likely won't make it because of dexterity and too many HPs), Eternity would fit well already, so we should aim to consistence, when possible.
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 26, 2014, 10:16:09 pm
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 26, 2014, 10:23:31 pm
I added in nightmare to eliminate double draw, I think its a pretty good counter to swallow, mono air, mono darkness, ghostmare (maybe), mono aether, earthquake denial (maybe), discohole. I also added in sofo (for shards) and BE because of the PC idea. Immo/qp/nova was because of "rainbow decks". Also decks that have every quantum (but dont use 5 elements quantum) could still be counters.
Post by: Leodip on January 26, 2014, 10:46:27 pm
Well, that list is pretty generic. I still prefer listing them with names and who they should counter, but thanks for the effort.You could add this to your OP, if so I will just delete this post.
I added in nightmare to eliminate double draw, I think its a pretty good counter to swallow, mono air, mono darkness, ghostmare (maybe), mono aether, earthquake denial (maybe), discohole. I also added in sofo (for shards) and BE because of the PC idea. Immo/qp/nova was because of "rainbow decks". Also decks that have every quantum (but dont use 5 elements quantum) could still be counters.
Post by: dawn to dusk on January 26, 2014, 10:59:55 pm
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 27, 2014, 04:47:50 am
I'll make a couple tests using my deck that got to rank 1 in silver. If that doesn't work, I'll try a dunebow with sancs and purifiescould a dunebow based around 3 sow 2 reflect shields work?
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 27, 2014, 04:49:20 am
No problem, but I meant have in there after the list, that way people can just copy paste the deck image code and then put more/less of them and quanta production and damage production, which would probably be lava golem+quint.Well, that list is pretty generic. I still prefer listing them with names and who they should counter, but thanks for the effort.You could add this to your OP, if so I will just delete this post.
I added in nightmare to eliminate double draw, I think its a pretty good counter to swallow, mono air, mono darkness, ghostmare (maybe), mono aether, earthquake denial (maybe), discohole. I also added in sofo (for shards) and BE because of the PC idea. Immo/qp/nova was because of "rainbow decks". Also decks that have every quantum (but dont use 5 elements quantum) could still be counters.
Post by: Dm on January 27, 2014, 08:24:48 am
I'll make a couple tests using my deck that got to rank 1 in silver. If that doesn't work, I'll try a dunebow with sancs and purifiescould a dunebow based around 3 sow 2 reflect shields work?
Original post already said "probably no shards".
Following.
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 27, 2014, 11:49:05 am
I'll make a couple tests using my deck that got to rank 1 in silver. If that doesn't work, I'll try a dunebow with sancs and purifiescould a dunebow based around 3 sow 2 reflect shields work?
Original post already said "probably no shards".
Following.
"Probably"
Post by: Leodip on January 27, 2014, 01:28:09 pm
Assuming you're talking about countering SoWAether:I'll make a couple tests using my deck that got to rank 1 in silver. If that doesn't work, I'll try a dunebow with sancs and purifiescould a dunebow based around 3 sow 2 reflect shields work?
1.Shards are generally avoided;
2.At least the last three SoWAether I played against won in 5 turns. 2 Reflect Shields wouldn't be enough, probably;
3.I see no reason for a Dunebow with Reflect shields. As I said, Aether with SoW is pretty damn fast, meaning you won't even get enough time to win out of Dune's Poison and you'll just win, if you do, with Reflect Shields.
EDIT: oh, totally haven't seen page two.
Yeah, I said probably no shards, but that's because these decks are mainly for beginners who COULD have other rares (or farm for them, eventually) and shards are out of their league.
Post by: Dm on January 27, 2014, 03:47:06 pm
I'll make a couple tests using my deck that got to rank 1 in silver. If that doesn't work, I'll try a dunebow with sancs and purifiescould a dunebow based around 3 sow 2 reflect shields work?
Original post already said "probably no shards".
Following.
"Probably"
In case you don't comprehend, that's usually meant to "if we cannot come to a good deck that can do this rareless and shardless then only then do we tackle shards as a form to viably farm Platinum since the goal is to give the un-upped people a means of farming and thus they probably don't have many shards or rares to begin with."
Post by: Leodip on January 27, 2014, 04:18:07 pm
Dim Shields vs. Rushes, Psions Vs. Shields, Fractal Vs. Healing-stall.
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 27, 2014, 09:32:55 pm
Post by: Keeps on January 28, 2014, 06:29:31 pm
My comments at the time were:
So I keep seeing requests for unupped FG decks.
This one has only the two SoPa's for required rares, there are two weapons here too, but they can be switched out. So with but a bit of PVP or bronze farming it won't take long for a player to FG farm with this deck.
It works well on any FG without PC control. It also provides a few options to counter momentum, poison, decay, etc.. so this deck works better than the Malignant Balls that Could for some FGs but not for others on that front. Still it seems to have a very high win rate for an unnupped deck. It might be useful for the newer player who isn't ready to for gold farming, but has picked up some rares from bronze.
The only feedback I had was:
The only thing I don't like about this is the 2 different weapons but I know that both are useful so I'm ok with it. Nice job, as usual.
If anyone wants to actually test it out for deeper stats, that'll be cool
Post by: Leodip on January 28, 2014, 06:56:13 pm
So you know, I posted this deck a long time ago, based on the BmBalls idea as an unupped FG farmer that had only 4 rares.An unupped FG Farmer exists, already, and it has well extablished its name. It's the Firecell OTK by Chapuz, and it is even rareless. What we're trying to do here, though, is attempting a Platinum farmer based on skipping in order to try a winning streak.
My comments at the time were:
So I keep seeing requests for unupped FG decks.
This one has only the two SoPa's for required rares, there are two weapons here too, but they can be switched out. So with but a bit of PVP or bronze farming it won't take long for a player to FG farm with this deck.
It works well on any FG without PC control. It also provides a few options to counter momentum, poison, decay, etc.. so this deck works better than the Malignant Balls that Could for some FGs but not for others on that front. Still it seems to have a very high win rate for an unnupped deck. It might be useful for the newer player who isn't ready to for gold farming, but has picked up some rares from bronze.
The only feedback I had was:
The only thing I don't like about this is the 2 different weapons but I know that both are useful so I'm ok with it. Nice job, as usual.
If anyone wants to actually test it out for deeper stats, that'll be cool
Post by: CrockettRocket on January 28, 2014, 10:02:41 pm
Post by: Keeps on January 29, 2014, 03:25:36 am
Yes the weapons can be changed out.
Yes we have firecell, however this has a higher winrate against FGs then firecell.
Finally, the trick with Plat is a deck that works well against a certain percentage of the types of decks you play against in Platinum, because of the how the balance between certain elements lines up, your goal is to match up against certain elements or to take advantage of something the AI does really dumb. This is one of those decks that takes advantage of both. Someone might want to give it an honest try in plat is all I'm saying.
The big hurt in plat is often anti-perm and anti-creature, and pestals, so an unupped pdials is another strong possibility or a light-air or mono-light simply to try to fight off pestal.
Post by: Leodip on January 30, 2014, 02:02:32 pm
Post by: Leodip on February 02, 2014, 08:33:25 am
If a deck can afford a 500 HP EM, that's what it should aim for.
Post by: TribalTrouble on February 02, 2014, 05:21:34 pm
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/the-hpkiller-arena-deck(plat-farmer)/
Honestly, it is trollish, but it does work and fits your requirements, if not your preferences.
Post by: Leodip on February 02, 2014, 05:49:34 pm
I've had one out for a while. It's based on the idea of farming extremely fast for extremely low HP decks to get a high return. Sometimes you can get 2 in a row, and we know what that means!That's awesome and, TBH, one of the reasons I wanted AMMP to record low HP decks
http://elementscommunity.org/forum/rainbow-decks/the-hpkiller-arena-deck(plat-farmer)/
Honestly, it is trollish, but it does work and fits your requirements, if not your preferences.
Post by: zephyl on November 20, 2014, 02:03:03 am
I just tested that deck out and fought the rank 2 person in platinum (12hp) And got elemental Master!
I gained about 4k electrum.
Counting the total amount i gained/loss:
Spent: 820 (estimated after the payback of 5 electrum).
Gained: 6,415
Total: 5,605