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Offline UTAlan

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326549#msg326549
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2011, 05:51:26 am »
I love this system. Great work coming up with all the details of this SG (& council?).

Offline TStarTopic starter

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326558#msg326558
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2011, 06:12:08 am »
I love this system. Great work coming up with all the details of this SG (& council?).
This was created by a coordinated effort between the League, Tournament, and Event Organizers with input from SG.  While some members of the Council were involved in this through their staff positions, the PvP Parasite Warning System is not a project of the current or previous Council.
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Scaredgirl

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326563#msg326563
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2011, 06:36:48 am »
I think the 1 strike and you're out of this system is a bit much. I think a good way to introduce leeway for people with good reasons while discouraging people from just quitting would be to give someone one freebie every length of time, say 3 months. That way people who genuinely have to withdraw for good reasons can do so, but people who quit every event as soon as it becomes boring will still be stopped.
I don't see how this system could be described as "you're out". Not being able to join any PvP events for 4-8 weeks, is not the end of the world. And no "innocent" person will ever get that 12 week PvP ban.

Like I've said before, it's all about time management. Most PvP events we organize are not something you need to quit your day job over. Usually when people quit because they "don't have time", it's not that they suddenly became the busiest person in the world, it's just that they chose to spend that time doing something else. If we gave 1 million dollar cash prizes to winners, I can guarantee that nobody would ever quit.

Sure sometimes the reason for quitting can be a legitimate one, like getting hit by a bus. That is however extremely rare. Most reasons for quitting are things that the person in question did, or should have, expected to happen. When we didn't have a warning system, people joined just in case they somehow managed to find the time to participate, then quit after after they didn't. With Parasites, players will think twice before joining an event. This will naturally mean slightly less participants, but it will also mean much less quitters.

The way I see it, when players sign up to these events, they make a commitment to finish the event. If they choose not to finish the event, and do something else instead, they will have to pay the price for it. It's taking responsibility for their actions.

Offline Tiko

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326580#msg326580
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2011, 07:59:17 am »
I think we had a need since long for something like this (just from my personal experience with War, the Draft, etc).

Oh and in case it wasn't mentioned earlier.. this new rule won't affect any PvP events that have already started, it only affects PvP events that start from this day forward.
Not even War?
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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326582#msg326582
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2011, 08:07:51 am »
Oh and in case it wasn't mentioned earlier.. this new rule won't affect any PvP events that have already started, it only affects PvP events that start from this day forward.
Not even War?
Person who quits War, cannot join the next one.

Offline DesertKnight

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Section One - Recovery 0AIDE7 https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326585#msg326585
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2011, 08:12:18 am »
Section One - Recovery 0AIDE7

QuantumT

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326751#msg326751
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2011, 03:57:06 pm »
I think the 1 strike and you're out of this system is a bit much. I think a good way to introduce leeway for people with good reasons while discouraging people from just quitting would be to give someone one freebie every length of time, say 3 months. That way people who genuinely have to withdraw for good reasons can do so, but people who quit every event as soon as it becomes boring will still be stopped.
I don't see how this system could be described as "you're out". Not being able to join any PvP events for 4-8 weeks, is not the end of the world. And no "innocent" person will ever get that 12 week PvP ban.

Like I've said before, it's all about time management. Most PvP events we organize are not something you need to quit your day job over. Usually when people quit because they "don't have time", it's not that they suddenly became the busiest person in the world, it's just that they chose to spend that time doing something else. If we gave 1 million dollar cash prizes to winners, I can guarantee that nobody would ever quit.

Sure sometimes the reason for quitting can be a legitimate one, like getting hit by a bus. That is however extremely rare. Most reasons for quitting are things that the person in question did, or should have, expected to happen. When we didn't have a warning system, people joined just in case they somehow managed to find the time to participate, then quit after after they didn't. With Parasites, players will think twice before joining an event. This will naturally mean slightly less participants, but it will also mean much less quitters.

The way I see it, when players sign up to these events, they make a commitment to finish the event. If they choose not to finish the event, and do something else instead, they will have to pay the price for it. It's taking responsibility for their actions.
I say 'one strike and you're out' because one thing happens and you're immediately punished, regardless of circumstances. That's why I proposed everybody gets something like 1 penalty free drop per 6 month period. This will give people with legitimate reasons (death in the family, lost job, hit by bus, etc.) a chance to withdraw while still punishing the undesired behavior (people who just join all kinds of events then quit).

Offline TStarTopic starter

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326754#msg326754
« Reply #31 on: May 04, 2011, 04:01:08 pm »
I say 'one strike and you're out' because one thing happens and you're immediately punished, regardless of circumstances. That's why I proposed everybody gets something like 1 penalty free drop per 6 month period. This will give people with legitimate reasons (death in the family, lost job, hit by bus, etc.) a chance to withdraw while still punishing the undesired behavior (people who just join all kinds of events then quit).
Doesn't really matter why you quit, it's the same amount of work and disruption.  Line up a replacement and inform the organizer you must leave and I'm 99% sure you won't need to worry about a Parasite.  Vanish and try asking for clemency after the fact (no matter what reason you give) and your pleas will likely fall on deaf ears.
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QuantumT

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326760#msg326760
« Reply #32 on: May 04, 2011, 04:05:09 pm »
I say 'one strike and you're out' because one thing happens and you're immediately punished, regardless of circumstances. That's why I proposed everybody gets something like 1 penalty free drop per 6 month period. This will give people with legitimate reasons (death in the family, lost job, hit by bus, etc.) a chance to withdraw while still punishing the undesired behavior (people who just join all kinds of events then quit).
Doesn't really matter why you quit, it's the same amount of work and disruption.  Line up a replacement and inform the organizer you must leave and I'm 99% sure you won't need to worry about a Parasite.  Vanish and try asking for clemency after the fact (no matter what reason you give) and your pleas will likely fall on deaf ears.
The reason I don't like this system at all is that it catches innocent people in the attempt to punish the guilty parties. Did you give any consideration to my suggestion?

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326767#msg326767
« Reply #33 on: May 04, 2011, 04:16:28 pm »
QT has a good point. The strike system could be more harsh than this system, and wouldnt effect those people who rarely ever quit. It still doesnt allow excuses to get you out of it, however, if a person genuinly did havve a good excuse, theres a good chance they wont be quitting again mid event any time soon.

to further expand on it...
2 strike system-You receive a strike. That strike stays with you for 3 months. if you quit again, you are banned from tournaments for 1 month. When you return from that tournament, you still have a strike against you for 3 months.

3 strike system-You receive a strike. That strike stays with you for 3 months. if you quit again, you receive another strike. 3 months will remove 1, waiting 3 more months will remove the first one. If you quit again you are banned from tournaments for 6 month. When you return from that tournament, you still have a strike against you for 3 months.

Either of these would allow strict penalties for repeat offenders, while offering people that have good excuses some leway.

On a different note, I feel certain events, such as trials should have more strict penalties for quitting in the middle of them.
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Offline TStarTopic starter

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326845#msg326845
« Reply #34 on: May 04, 2011, 06:02:24 pm »
We did consider your suggestion QT.  This is something we've been discussing and working on for a long time and your points were raised and talked about.  Ultimately it was decided to go with the system we are using because 1) it is impossible to verify whether a person is being honest, and 2) ultimately the decision to hand out Parasites rests with the organizers so there is plenty of leeway involved to avoid a Parasite if you keep an open line of communication and help facilitate a transition.  There are ways to peacefully leave a function without accruing Parasites, but since every PvP function is different it would be impossible to create an overall list of them.  This is just in place to discourage players from quitting events on a whim out of boredom, not to make it impossible for a player to leave an event without punishment is something arises.

Just give the system a chance and see how it runs.  For all we know your concerns may not even be an issue, and if they are I can assure you that a solution will be quickly developed and implemented to address it.
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Offline Avenger

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Re: PvP Parasite Warning System https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=25593.msg326910#msg326910
« Reply #35 on: May 04, 2011, 07:25:36 pm »
Well, this is exactly what i suggested to treat war quitters. Except maybe the flame war part.
It must be really heavy flaming that can disrupt an event and result a penalty.

 

blarg: