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Offline Drake_XIV

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg495820#msg495820
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2012, 11:02:42 pm »
I think if your hand is full they should be lost, or just go straight to your deck.

example- the opponent uses EQ on your stack of towers, your 2 towers are put back into your hand, the third is overfill and goes to the top of your deck.

Offline storyteller

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg495953#msg495953
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2012, 03:07:28 am »
no I mean if your hand is full, you should lose those cards OR instead of going to your hand at all, they should go to your deck. I do not think you should have an all powerful permanent saver that sends them to your hand and then your deck if it is full. One or the other, not both.

Offline Drake_XIV

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg495970#msg495970
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2012, 03:19:53 am »
It's not all-powerful.  You still have to pay to replay them.  Also consider that it is somewhat detrimental as it clogs up your hand and eventually your deck, so you might not be able to draw anything useful for a long time.

Offline storyteller

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496020#msg496020
« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2012, 04:10:44 am »
its pretty powerful, and how does it work as an active ability? do you target permanents to protect it damaged?

Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496413#msg496413
« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2012, 09:26:53 pm »
Oh gods no! I just thought of the potential for some serious abuses...

This + pulvy + Dim shield... or a butterfly effect equivalent
Or perhaps worse... sundial!

As if dim shield spam wasn't annoying enough already, now it won't even be limited to 18 turns. Sundial stall will become viable too and will be even more tedious. At least with dim shield you can use momentum (or now SoW and SoF) to get around it. Put them both together and you're in for a long tedious game. In short, infinite stall decks become viable.

I still think its a cool card concept, but 30+ round games would get old very fast.
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Offline neuroleptics

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496414#msg496414
« Reply #29 on: May 10, 2012, 09:29:40 pm »
Haha...this sound fun...counter SoFocus?? But i think the quanta cost should be raised :)
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Offline Pineapple

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496423#msg496423
« Reply #30 on: May 10, 2012, 09:40:15 pm »
I also think it's a bit too powerful because there is no counter (except denial) for a deck based on abusing PC, not even PC (the irony).
Usually, I would advise to drop the cost and nerf the ability, but the cost already seems pretty lenient as is. Maybe increase HP instead dropping the cost?
Anyways, my suggested nerf would be to either limit the ability to once/twice per game, once per turn, or only during the opponent's turn. You could also weaken the ability by reducing the %chance of salvaging from the current 100%, but RNG sucks.

Thoughts?

Offline Poker Alho

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496430#msg496430
« Reply #31 on: May 10, 2012, 09:50:03 pm »
I also think it's a bit too powerful because there is no counter (except denial) for a deck based on abusing PC, not even PC (the irony).
Usually, I would advise to drop the cost and nerf the ability, but the cost already seems pretty lenient as is. Maybe increase HP instead dropping the cost?
Anyways, my suggested nerf would be to either limit the ability to once/twice per game, once per turn, or only during the opponent's turn. You could also weaken the ability by reducing the %chance of salvaging from the current 100%, but RNG sucks.

Thoughts?

you completely forgot to mention that CC was a counter to that PC abuse, if it were thru this card, wich makes it less overpowered than you would think. Still, the skill should be limited to the opponent's turn to avoid that kind of exploit like you said

Offline neuroleptics

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496431#msg496431
« Reply #32 on: May 10, 2012, 09:51:17 pm »
I also think it's a bit too powerful because there is no counter (except denial) for a deck based on abusing PC, not even PC (the irony).
Usually, I would advise to drop the cost and nerf the ability, but the cost already seems pretty lenient as is. Maybe increase HP instead dropping the cost?
Anyways, my suggested nerf would be to either limit the ability to once/twice per game, once per turn, or only during the opponent's turn. You could also weaken the ability by reducing the %chance of salvaging from the current 100%, but RNG sucks.

Thoughts?

agreed, and the card should immediately be discarded after the destroyed permanent return to hand. (meaning that the creature sacrifice itself to gain the permanent back)
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Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496449#msg496449
« Reply #33 on: May 10, 2012, 10:22:05 pm »
I also think it's a bit too powerful because there is no counter (except denial) for a deck based on abusing PC, not even PC (the irony).
Usually, I would advise to drop the cost and nerf the ability, but the cost already seems pretty lenient as is. Maybe increase HP instead dropping the cost?
Anyways, my suggested nerf would be to either limit the ability to once/twice per game, once per turn, or only during the opponent's turn. You could also weaken the ability by reducing the %chance of salvaging from the current 100%, but RNG sucks.

Thoughts?

you completely forgot to mention that CC was a counter to that PC abuse, if it were thru this card, wich makes it less overpowered than you would think. Still, the skill should be limited to the opponent's turn to avoid that kind of exploit like you said
I agree, limiting to opponents turn would probably do the trick.
Limiting to once a turn may work ok too ... abuse would still be possible, but at least would be easier to counter.
As long as people can't spam sundials and dim. shields indefinitely it should be just fine. Eighteen rounds of dim shield is annoying enough already... lol
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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496482#msg496482
« Reply #34 on: May 10, 2012, 11:58:50 pm »
OK that is a good point about destroying your own permanents, the two solutions i would be willing to consider would be only being triggered on your opponents turn, or simply have it not apply to permanents that have durations.
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Offline OdinVanguard

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Re: Graviton Salvager | Graviton Salvager http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=39851.msg496860#msg496860
« Reply #35 on: May 11, 2012, 04:13:22 pm »
Either one works for me. Other than that one issue though, it looks like a cool card. I look forward to seeing it in crucible.
Whether the glass is half full or half empty is a moot point. It is always filled to the brim. It is only a matter of by what. The real question is: What fills you?
If your zombie plan is
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You might be a unix junky

 

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