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Offline EssenceTopic starter

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Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf [Legacy - Armory] https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41288#msg41288
« on: March 20, 2010, 12:58:32 am »
CURATOR COMMENT:

Due to the original image's host being taken down I've replaced the art field with artless copies. May replace with arted copies later.



Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf
NAME: Alpha Wolf
ELEMENT: Life
COST: 5 :life
TYPE: Creature
ATK|HP: 2|2
ABILITY: When Alpha Wolf enters play,
summon 2 Pack Wolves.
NAME: Elite Alpha Wolf
ELEMENT: Life
COST: 5 :life
TYPE: Creature
ATK|HP: 3|2
ABILITY: When Alpha Wolf enters
play, summon 2 Pack
Wolves.
ART: Essence, modified from flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dalliedee/2993568176/sizes/l/in/photostream/) (rights to modify explicitly given.)
IDEA: Essence
NOTES: - Pack Wolves Noted Below
NAME: Pack Wolf
ELEMENT: Life
COST: 1 :life
TYPE: Creature
ATK|HP: 2|1
ABILITY:
NAME: Pack Wolf
ELEMENT: Life
COST: 0
TYPE: Creature
ATK|HP: 2|1
ABILITY:
ART: Modified from Wikimedia Commons
IDEA: Essence
NOTES: - Created by Alpha Wolf | Alpha Wolf and available standalone as well.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2015, 12:24:10 am by AD TienzuStorm »
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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41290#msg41290
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2010, 01:05:24 am »
Great cards. Like you said, It'll be great for a Mono-Life deck with 2 or 3 Feral Bonds.

Oh, and congratulations on learning how to use Pixlr.

Wisemage

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41316#msg41316
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2010, 02:04:40 am »
idk, 4 life quanta for 7 damage, thats a bit much dont you think, although that frog is 2 for 5 right?

Scaredgirl

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41342#msg41342
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2010, 03:00:22 am »
I like the card. Simple, yet offers many deckbuilding options, and on top of that the theme fits perfectly.

What I don't like is balance. This card id ridiculously overpowered. Like Wisemage already said, this card does 7 damage with only 4 quantum which itself is powerful. But the worst part is that one card instantly creates 3 creatures.

Think about it. With 6 of these cards in your deck, and only 24 quantum, you can create an army of 18 creatures that do 42 damage. Nothing in Elements comes even close to that. This card would instantly become the ultimate creature factory card with  :'(INSANE :'( synergy with cards like Feral Bond.

Needs a serious nerf.

P.s. the quantum icon in the top-right corner is on the wrong side of the number :)

Offline Bloodshadow

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41349#msg41349
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2010, 03:40:46 am »
How about nerfing it to something like this:

When Wolf comes into play, create another copy of Wolf.
To be or not to be, I can do both at once. Go learn quantum mechanics, n00b.

Offline Glitch

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41356#msg41356
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2010, 03:58:43 am »
Naw, just up the cost of Alpha wolf.... a lot.

Maybe make alpha a 2|1, and pack wolves 1|1?

Just out of curiosity, why is this card weaker than a frog?

Offline EssenceTopic starter

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41718#msg41718
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2010, 11:19:11 pm »
What I don't like is balance. This card id ridiculously overpowered. Like Wisemage already said, this card does 7 damage with only 4 quantum which itself is powerful. But the worst part is that one card instantly creates 3 creatures.

Think about it. With 6 of these cards in your deck, and only 24 quantum, you can create an army of 18 creatures that do 42 damage. Nothing in Elements comes even close to that. This card would instantly become the ultimate creature factory card with  :'(INSANE :'( synergy with cards like Feral Bond.

Needs a serious nerf.

OK, I don't get it.  2 :life for 5/3  -- which is 30 damage for 12 quanta -- is totally cool, but 42 damage for 24 quanta (a much worse ratio) is imbalanced?

42 damage for 24 quantum is easy-peasy -- 6x Phase Recluse.  7x6=42 damage, 4x6=24 quanta.  And 18 creatures for 24 quantum isn't really too big a deal either when you consider that 6x Elite Deja Vu gives you 12 creatures (and 24 damage) for 12 quanta.   So the numbers don't back you up.


The synergy is the only thing that could be overpowered about it, and seriously, you'd have to actually draw through your deck in order to see the full power of it -- how often does that happen in mono-Life? -- or build a deck specifically around this one card and it's synergies, which would in the end be no stronger than any other similar deck because it would have so many vulnerabilities: (Thunderstorm/Plague/RoF), any repeatable creature control (Oty/EE/Maxwell's), permanent control (Pulvy/Butterly/Steal/Deflag on the Bonds), any 2-damage shield...there's just too many counters to get your panties in a twist about it.  Heck, without even trying, I just rattled off counters from :entropy :air :death :fire :gravity and :darkness.  I'm sure there's more if someone actually wants to THINK about it.

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Scaredgirl

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41935#msg41935
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2010, 01:10:14 pm »
What I don't like is balance. This card id ridiculously overpowered. Like Wisemage already said, this card does 7 damage with only 4 quantum which itself is powerful. But the worst part is that one card instantly creates 3 creatures.

Think about it. With 6 of these cards in your deck, and only 24 quantum, you can create an army of 18 creatures that do 42 damage. Nothing in Elements comes even close to that. This card would instantly become the ultimate creature factory card with  :'(INSANE :'( synergy with cards like Feral Bond.

Needs a serious nerf.

OK, I don't get it.  2 :life for 5/3  -- which is 30 damage for 12 quanta -- is totally cool, but 42 damage for 24 quanta (a much worse ratio) is imbalanced?

42 damage for 24 quantum is easy-peasy -- 6x Phase Recluse.  7x6=42 damage, 4x6=24 quanta.  And 18 creatures for 24 quantum isn't really too big a deal either when you consider that 6x Elite Deja Vu gives you 12 creatures (and 24 damage) for 12 quanta.   So the numbers don't back you up.


The synergy is the only thing that could be overpowered about it, and seriously, you'd have to actually draw through your deck in order to see the full power of it -- how often does that happen in mono-Life? -- or build a deck specifically around this one card and it's synergies, which would in the end be no stronger than any other similar deck because it would have so many vulnerabilities: (Thunderstorm/Plague/RoF), any repeatable creature control (Oty/EE/Maxwell's), permanent control (Pulvy/Butterly/Steal/Deflag on the Bonds), any 2-damage shield...there's just too many counters to get your panties in a twist about it.  Heck, without even trying, I just rattled off counters from :entropy :air :death :fire :gravity and :darkness.  I'm sure there's more if someone actually wants to THINK about it.
Instantly creating 18 creatures with only 6 cards and 24 quantum is the worst part. Them doing 42 damage is just added bonus which makes things ever worse.

Too bad we don't have this is trainer or something. Otherwise I could show you what I mean.

omerbey

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg41937#msg41937
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2010, 01:16:40 pm »
having multiple "alpha" wolves sounds weird.

I think it should simply be: wolf
if there are no other wolves in play, it becomes alpha wolf.

alpha wolf has the ability  :life :life generate wolf
and stat 5|2

when alpha wolf is killed, another wolf becomes the alpha wolf.


Offline EssenceTopic starter

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg42066#msg42066
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2010, 08:15:34 pm »
The whole scenario I was trying to avoid was to have another creature that played the role of FFQ or Pharaoh, omerbey.  I believe Life really needs a multiple-creatures-in-one-card card.

And SG, I'd love to have it out with you in the Trainer.  I really think you're seriously overestimating the value of a bunch of 2/2 skill-less creatures AND overestimating the time it takes to get 6 of a card into your hand and then into play.  Hell, Ambominations would be overpowered if you could instantly get 6 of them into play with 6 cards.  Fortunately, that's not how the game works.

You might, if you're lucky, get 2 Alpha Wolves in the first few turns, and get a Feral Bond to go with them.  14 damage and 6 points of healing.  Meanwhile, for the same cost in time and cards and less quanta, a typical :earth rush deck could have out 2 Shriekers and a Shard of Gratitude -- 20 damage and 5 points of healing.  The Shriekers are harder to kill, penetrate shields better, and can be Burrowed.  The Wolves are cute, but they're not overpowering a damn thing.
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omerbey

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg42198#msg42198
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2010, 01:44:24 am »
The thing is, if you had three of these in your hand, you could drop all three easily, and get 9 creatures on the field. As opposed to FQ needing much more quanta and turns to do the same, and in splash. Useful for bioluminescence and bonds mostly.

I'm not necessarily saying it's overpowered, I'm just saying the total attack power is not the main power of the card.

also, fractal  ;D

Offline EssenceTopic starter

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Re: Alpha Wolf | Elite Alpha Wolf https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=4195.msg42209#msg42209
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2010, 02:05:28 am »
Tiny modification: Elite Pack Wolves now retain a 1 toughness, but also have a 0 casting cost, making Rewind less of a threat but Thunderstorm/Unstable Gas more of one.
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