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Offline serprex

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092959#msg1092959
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2013, 07:47:03 pm »
It seems a good QC for death. I feel it can cost less, comparing to Silence, EQ. Remember that Blackhole heals the caster

Offline skyironsword

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092965#msg1092965
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2013, 08:30:09 pm »
Actually, the unupped is already borderline OP in my opinion. Making it last more than one turn is plain crazy.

Compare to Silence.

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092972#msg1092972
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2013, 08:44:09 pm »
Do you really think that the cards are still too expensive?

You're not only "halting" your opponent for one turn but actually slowing him for the rest of the game.

I think this is much worse than silence.

Offline serprex

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092974#msg1092974
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2013, 08:57:18 pm »
Honestly, Silence is likely a bit overpriced. Consider Reverse Time costing 1 less while slowing down one's draw and removing a creature from the field. Silence's strength is breaking a chain or blocking things like Miracle, something this doesn't stop directly

Offline Zergva

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092975#msg1092975
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2013, 08:58:45 pm »
Do you really think that the cards are still too expensive?

You're not only "halting" your opponent for one turn but actually slowing him for the rest of the game.

I think this is much worse than silence.

Actually, I compared it to Silence: The opponent DOES have quanta at the next turn, just not getting more at the End Phase. So, with a good portioning, the opponent have freedom from a limited cost. Silence can do such situations as Miracling at the next turn, force discard. You have the quanta benefit forever, but only if that was beneficial. Pdial use maximal 2 pillars (it plays with more, but it's only needs 2-3 quanta/turn) so denying for 4 is rarely good. Silence stops free cards from play, so can force you to discard. And you are only comparing when opponent DOES NOT have enough quanta to play any card from it's hands. But a good  :life  :death  :air rush sitting on 20-30 quanta at the midgame. Silence can slow it in this phase too, but Flatline not. Btw I said it's better than Silence so it's deserves the 4|3. I'll say again: It's drains 1-10 quanta, and quanta deny is really cheap (under 0.5-0.33  :rainbow ) so the cost is right. Spamming 2-3 of this can be cruel, but the cost changing does not really helps on this situation.

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092976#msg1092976
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2013, 09:01:01 pm »
What would be your suggestion for the cost, serprex? And skyironsword?

Zergva, I also think 4/3 is best! But, as I said, I'm not actually skilled...^^

Offline serprex

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092977#msg1092977
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2013, 09:05:16 pm »
4/3 is fine, but I lean towards 3/2. It's a matter of whether you want to round up or down
You're trading a card advantage for a quanta advantage. You lose that quanta advantage if this costs too much, and this becomes a waste of a card. 4 :death means that this doesn't break even until the opponent has 4 pillars out (not 3, since you need to take into account the 1 :underworld card cost)
« Last Edit: August 16, 2013, 09:09:09 pm by serprex »

Offline Chapuz

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1092986#msg1092986
« Reply #19 on: August 16, 2013, 10:16:19 pm »
You could just say the effect is for your opponent, as it's a 'bad' effect. You would never use it in yourself
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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1093061#msg1093061
« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2013, 06:58:02 am »
Updated with new pic, text and 4/3.

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1093087#msg1093087
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2013, 09:43:06 am »
Actually, the unupped is already borderline OP in my opinion. Making it last more than one turn is plain crazy.

Compare to Silence.

The problem is that this bypasses Sanctuary, you are not changing the quanta pool or messing with the hand, but preventing the pillars/pends/mark to work. If we change Sanctuary then it becomes a lot like Silence (a bit weaker, unless combo'd with other types of QC). But let's not forget that Silence is pretty disruptive too.

Also, Silence let's you build your quanta to help recovering after the effect is gone.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2013, 10:01:04 am by andretimpa »
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Offline Chapuz

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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1093104#msg1093104
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2013, 02:34:55 pm »
This card is suposed to be blocked by sanct, imo.
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Re: Flatline | Flatline https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=50800.msg1093115#msg1093115
« Reply #23 on: August 17, 2013, 04:51:06 pm »
This card is suposed to be blocked by sanct, imo.

No it isn't. At least not from what I had in mind. Because it does not "alter" the quanta pool (actually it does the opposite^^).

 

blarg: