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Offline drollyTopic starter

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Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481822#msg481822
« on: April 16, 2012, 12:32:57 am »
As Purify has become a targetable spell with 1.30, one won't be surprised to see it interact with Emerald, Jade, Reflecting and Mirror Shield. I had this situation already twice but the results were incompatible.

  • Scenario 1:
    I have a Reflective Shield on my side and decide to use Purify on myself. After targeting my own HP bar, I see my shield sparkle as if it reflected a spell. However, I'm happy that Purify got indeed cast as intended and wasn't redirected to my opponent. Sorry, I forgot to take a screenshot of this but I clearly remember the +2 counter on my side.
  • Scenario 2:
    The AI has an Emerald Shield up and uses Purify on itself. The shield sparkles and the spell gets redirected to me, the respective counter appears next to my HP bar (thanks AI). Moreover, the AI does that multiple times (it was a Purify Arena deck), such that I have a nice +10 counter when winning the game.
    Spoiler for screenshot after second Purify:

    Sorry, I've been too slow to take a shot showing the shield in effect. On all the five occasions.
Tl;dr: Purify cast against player doesn't get reflected, Purify cast against opponent gets reflected. (See post below.)

I don't know how it's intended to work but I suspect that this inconsistency could cause severe desynchs in PvP. I expect Purify to work similar to Holy Light when it comes to these shields as it's a healing spell. If I remember correctly, Holy Light doesn't get reflected because only damage-dealing effects do.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2012, 01:03:36 am by drolly »
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Offline furballdn

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481825#msg481825
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2012, 12:34:50 am »
You listed two scenarios, you using on self with shield, and opponent using on itself with shield. What happens when you use purify on opponent with shield or arena uses purify on you with shield?

Offline drollyTopic starter

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481839#msg481839
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2012, 12:53:35 am »
I've just played around with it in the trainer and tried to produce all four possible scenarios. Decks contained Reflectives, Purifies, Puffer Fish and Water Pillars.

  • Me on myself.
    Shield animation, Purify doesn't get reflected and heals myself. Note that the opponent's poison counter doesn't get removed.
    Spoiler for screenshot:
  • Me on opponent.
    Shield animation, Purify doesn't get reflected and heals opponent. Note the sparkling counter.
    Spoiler for screenshot:
  • Opponent on itself.
    Shield animation, Purify gets reflected and hits me instead.
    Spoiler for screenshot:
  • Opponent on me.
    Despite handing Puffers to the AI, receiving much damage and finally teasing with SoSac, bringing myself to 3 HP (while 2 Puffers are out, Purifying me would mean instant death for me), AI doesn't dare to use Purify on me just like Octane doesn't ignite his Unstable Gasses while Reflective Shield is up.
    Derp, did not take a screenshot as no Purify effect was on-screen obviously.

So, the tl;dr version has to be changed: Me using Purify doesn't get reflected, opponent using Purify does.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2012, 01:03:01 am by drolly »
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Offline furballdn

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481848#msg481848
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2012, 01:10:36 am »
If AI doesn't use purify on you, perhaps this can lead to more SoSac in farming decks as long as they pack a mirror shield?

Offline drollyTopic starter

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481852#msg481852
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2012, 01:18:14 am »
If AI doesn't use purify on you, perhaps this can lead to more SoSac in farming decks as long as they pack a mirror shield?
Depends on which behaviour is intended and which one is buggy. At least the player should not have an advantage by being able to purify themselves while AI can't purify the player or fails constantly while trying to purify itself. And it would be interesting to see what happens in PvP. I fear the worst ...
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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481896#msg481896
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2012, 02:35:25 am »
If AI doesn't use purify on you, perhaps this can lead to more SoSac in farming decks as long as they pack a mirror shield?
Depends on which behaviour is intended and which one is buggy. At least the player should not have an advantage by being able to purify themselves while AI can't purify the player or fails constantly while trying to purify itself. And it would be interesting to see what happens in PvP. I fear the worst ...
Desync?
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Offline furballdn

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg481902#msg481902
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2012, 02:39:34 am »
If AI doesn't use purify on you, perhaps this can lead to more SoSac in farming decks as long as they pack a mirror shield?
Depends on which behaviour is intended and which one is buggy. At least the player should not have an advantage by being able to purify themselves while AI can't purify the player or fails constantly while trying to purify itself. And it would be interesting to see what happens in PvP. I fear the worst ...
Desync?
Both players would see themselves get the purify when one person casts purify against a reflective shield. This'll lead to desynch.

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg482010#msg482010
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2012, 07:56:06 am »
AI would Purify me while I had a reflective shield, maybe it just didn't like Purifying the poison it caused to you.
AI used Purify, gets reflected (visual) but still removes Shard of Sacrifice and gives me a Purify counter:
Spoiler for screenshot:

Offline Zicandar

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg521694#msg521694
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2012, 11:34:49 pm »
As Purify has become a targetable spell with 1.30, one won't be surprised to see it interact with Emerald, Jade, Reflecting and Mirror Shield. I had this situation already twice but the results were incompatible.

  • Scenario 1:
    I have a Reflective Shield on my side and decide to use Purify on myself. After targeting my own HP bar, I see my shield sparkle as if it reflected a spell. However, I'm happy that Purify got indeed cast as intended and wasn't redirected to my opponent. Sorry, I forgot to take a screenshot of this but I clearly remember the +2 counter on my side.
  • Scenario 2:
    The AI has an Emerald Shield up and uses Purify on itself. The shield sparkles and the spell gets redirected to me, the respective counter appears next to my HP bar (thanks AI). Moreover, the AI does that multiple times (it was a Purify Arena deck), such that I have a nice +10 counter when winning the game.
    Spoiler for screenshot after second Purify:

    Sorry, I've been too slow to take a shot showing the shield in effect. On all the five occasions.
Tl;dr: Purify cast against player doesn't get reflected, Purify cast against opponent gets reflected. (See post below.)

I don't know how it's intended to work but I suspect that this inconsistency could cause severe desynchs in PvP. I expect Purify to work similar to Holy Light when it comes to these shields as it's a healing spell. If I remember correctly, Holy Light doesn't get reflected because only damage-dealing effects do.

Well, your first 2 scenarios are completly correct ACCORDING TO CARD DESCRIPTION!
However when AI uses purify with reflective shield it will be reflected, aka bugged? It does seem reasonable that it should be reflected with emerald shield however?

p.s. AI gave me a purify just today also, reflective shield in this case...

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg521712#msg521712
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2012, 12:51:09 am »
The reflecting ability from both shields is the same. The increase in cost of the Emerald Shield is due to the indestructible damage reduction.
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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg1023747#msg1023747
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2012, 01:38:17 am »
fixed in 1.32

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Re: Inconsistencies with Purify and spell-reflecting shields https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=38730.msg1023749#msg1023749
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2012, 01:47:26 am »
By "fixed", do you mean completely reflected (preferrable) or completely pass through?
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