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Offline SnoWebTopic starter

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Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297279#msg297279
« on: March 24, 2011, 03:52:54 pm »

NAME:
Black Grasshopper
ELEMENT:
Darkness
COST:
2 :darkness
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
2|1
TEXT:
Destructive: When discarded,
the whole hand is discarded.
:life :life : Swarm - Generates
a new Grasshopper.
NAME:
Black Grasshopper
ELEMENT:
Darkness
COST:
2 :darkness
TYPE:
Creature
ATK|HP:
2|1
TEXT:
Destructive: When discarded,
the whole hand is discarded.
:life : Swarm - Generates a
new Grasshopper.
ART:
http://www.sxc.hu/photo/1175610
IDEA:
SnoWeb
NOTES:
"Destructive" is a passive ability and cannot be lobotomised.
SERIES:
Invasive creature series (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,23363.0.html)

Wonder

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297731#msg297731
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2011, 01:43:34 am »
I don't really get the point of the "Destructive" ability...

Offline icecoldbro

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297734#msg297734
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2011, 01:45:50 am »
I don't really get the point of the "Destructive" ability...
This plus Nightmare makes your opponent discard his combo cards, 6 nightmare and this is pretty annoying.

Offline TuckingFypo

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297737#msg297737
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2011, 01:49:00 am »
I think it's a bit overpowered.  Not everyone plays using Darkness, Rainbows, or Duo's right?

Offline SnoWebTopic starter

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297837#msg297837
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2011, 08:02:35 am »
I don't really get the point of the "Destructive" ability...
If you discard this card, the rest of you hand is also discarded. Obviously you will not discard it if you have important cards that you want to keep in your hand. Otherwise, if your hand is full you might discard it. You are then left with 0 cards. That's exactly what a nightmare player will want: an empty hand is where nightmare is the most efficient. I hope I answered your question.

Grasshopper - Nice. Balanced cost effect and makes nightmare mono playable.
Thanks Kael. That was the whole purpose. That is the main reason why the proliferative part of this card is not passively triggered like Flame (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,23276.0.html) or Ivy (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,23314.0.html) but actively triggered using :life . You can use it in mono darkness but you loose part of it's strength. If you use it in duo :darkness / :life , you gain the ability to swarm but you then have then less space to use synergistic darkness cards (like eclipse, nightmare and steal).

Standalone useage: Significantly underpar.
Clog Hand use: Never discarded.
Clog Field use: Will not clog the field
I don't understand why you think it will never be discarded. If you succeed in clogging your opponent hand, he will have to discard it and then you can feast (see above). Obviously you need to successfully clog his hand which is not always easy.
The card will also not clog you opponents field as aflatoxin might do (if it's what you want to say). However, it can rapidly fill yours. If you activate the ability of each grasshopper every turn, it is just slightly slower than a malignant cell (due to summoning sickness). True, it costs you a lot more quanta but you can control it which clearly worth the quanta spent IMO.

Overall Mechanically:
Please forget this card.
Other critiques:
The name/element do not seem to fit the mechanic thematically.
A series is more credible if it does not try to force the idea into every element.
Obviously you dislike this idea. Concerning the theme, please note that the trivial name of the grasshopper on the picture is "Devil's Horse". It didn't call it this way because I wanted to avoid the darkness/evil association. This little bug is the worse nightmare of the farmers in the area where it lives. Darkness already has two other bugs (parasite and devourer). The proliferative effect is typically a life thing so paying :life for it made sense to me. As there was still no creature in game which was a :life / :darkness I thought I might give it a try.

I think it's a bit overpowered.  Not everyone plays using Darkness, Rainbows, or Duo's right?
Remember, the card by itself doesn't produce the effect. You have first to use nightmare on it and then your opponent can choose if or when he discards it. The only moment he cannot choose between this card and another to discard is when his hand is full of these and in this case it doesn't really matters.

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297842#msg297842
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2011, 08:39:18 am »
Standalone useage (aka clog your field): Significantly underpar.
Clog Hand use: Never discarded.
Clog their Field use: Will not clog the field
I don't understand why you think it will never be discarded. If you succeed in clogging your opponent hand, he will have to discard it and then you can feast (see above). Obviously you need to successfully clog his hand which is not always easy.
The card will also not clog you opponents field as aflatoxin might do (if it's what you want to say). However, it can rapidly fill yours. If you can the ability of each grasshopper every turn it is just slightly slower than a malignant cell (due to summoning sickness). True, it costs you a lot more quanta but you can control it which clearly worth the quanta spent IMO.
By never discarded I meant that with the exception of decks with draw engines or fractal, it will never be discarded and take desirable cards with it. Hence its effect will never be triggered when it means anything. However in my haste I overlooked the side effect of it never being discarded. That side effect being that each nightmare cast on a Black Grasshopper is a "discard 0-2 cards" effect. (adding devourer would cause more cards discarded but that is the discard effect of devourer not of nightmare'd black grasshopper)

The standalone  :darkness :life usage of the dark grasshopper seems slightly underpar. This is a minor detail at most in this case. +1 attack at the most I would think.

Overall Mechanically:
Please forget this card.
Other critiques:
The name/element do not seem to fit the mechanic thematically.
A series is more credible if it does not try to force the idea into every element.
Obviously you dislike this idea. Concerning the theme, please note that the trivial name of the grasshopper on the picture is "Devil's Horse". It didn't call it this way because I wanted to avoid the darkness/evil association. This little bug is the worse nightmare of the farmers in the area where it lives. Darkness already has two other bugs (parasite and devourer). The proliferative effect is typically a life thing so paying :life for it made sense to me. As there was still no creature in game which was a :life / :darkness I thought I might give it a try.
I judged this card too fast earlier.
Mechanically (once the standalone usage is slightly buffed) it will match Ivy and maybe Flame in quality. I must remember it as an example card for a card creation guide later. It's primary effect is a perfect example of the power of a threat an the importance of measuring the cost of the avoidance of the threat rather than measuring the cost of the effect.
Thematically the context of the particular grasshopper explains the element choice very well. I still see no reason thematically that discarding the grasshopper would discard the hand. However the actual effect of the discard effect is that the opponent discards 0-2 cards or so. That is easily explainable as crop devastation.

Thank you for not dropping this great card.
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Offline SnoWebTopic starter

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297845#msg297845
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2011, 08:58:26 am »
The standalone  :darkness :life usage of the dark grasshopper seems slightly underpar. This is a minor detail at most in this case. +1 attack at the most I would think.
I didn't want to make it too strong at first because of three other already existing cards: Empathic Bond|Feral Bond Nightfall|Eclipse and adrenaline|Ephedrine. As being a duo :darkness / :life , the grasshopper can be easily combined with these three cards.
An attack of 3 would make it very powerful with adrenaline. At least now it requires eclipse to perform the damage. In the same way, combined with empathic bond it already gives a nice stall possibility. However, a superior HP would make more difficult to destroy and then maybe too powerfull. At least now it requires eclipse to be more resistant.

Overall Mechanically:
Thank you for not dropping this great card.
Thanks to you too for spending the time.

Offline Bieber4Ever98

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297856#msg297856
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2011, 09:24:23 am »
Destructive is very versatile. It can be used with Nightmare which is a deadly combo. If opponent tries to discard any Grasshopper in hand it will make him lose his whole cards and makes him vulnerable to another Nightmare (for a whooping 16 life drain). On the other this can be used by a player to clear his hand for a Fractal in an intended deck.

With the Destructive passive alone this is a strong and useful card. With the second skill Swarm it creates many strong synergies with Life element. Being a darkness creature with Swarm, it gets benefits from both Nightfall and Feral Bonds.

Overall it is a cool cheap darkness creature which can form plenty of comboes with many cards. Will be a useful card in many decks. On top of that the art is also very good. Would be a fun card to play.

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burne

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg297864#msg297864
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2011, 10:16:07 am »
I love it.

we definitely need more cards that create synergy between elements.

Powerfull ability but well balanced by the weakness of the creature. Maybe even 1/1 stats should be enough with the use of Eclipse.

And trying to improve the use of Nightmare is also a great idea.


ShiningSword

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg298244#msg298244
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2011, 12:09:41 am »
what would happen if the opponent discarded this while having GotP in his hand?(as it makes them discard the whole hand, would ghost's ability trigger)

Offline DSSCRA

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg298340#msg298340
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2011, 06:11:39 am »
minor note but swarm is the ability name for scarabs n hp you should probably change the ability name to mitosis because they are the same thing. The main reason for not having a different word for different abilities is mostly to streamline game play and make the board state easier to comprehend other than that great card.
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Offline Bieber4Ever98

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Re: Black Grasshopper | Dark Grasshopper https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=23365.msg298463#msg298463
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2011, 10:32:02 am »
what would happen if the opponent discarded this while having GotP in his hand?(as it makes them discard the whole hand, would ghost's ability trigger)
Yes, according to the text descriptions it should. Now that's a killer combo is'nt it ?


minor note but swarm is the ability name for scarabs n hp you should probably change the ability name to mitosis because they are the same thing. The main reason for not having a different word for different abilities is mostly to streamline game play and make the board state easier to comprehend other than that great card.
Mitosis should have same quanta cost as the element type of the card. This is a darkness creature that uses life quanta to produce same creature. The game should recognize this as a different ability from mitosis. You can't call this ability same as Mitosis. Literally, you broke your own rule yourself by giving a different ability with an existing same name mitosis.

The ability name Swarm should be changed. Possible suggestions for a new ability name : Breed, Mass, Myriad.
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