Post by: DrunkDestroyer on September 09, 2011, 01:09:20 am
To make the game as fun and challenging as possible, please post any mistakes or bad decisions the AI makes against you - with screenshots and details if possible.
A list of these will slowly be compiled in attempt to store all information so that the game can continue to improve.
Thanks for your help!
Antimattering its own creatures when they reach >50 Attack.
Switching between Acceleration and Overdrive (when it has access to both)
Using the Freeze and Shockwave effect on a creature which would die to Shockwave (or other CC which the ai is about to use)
Stacking multiple buffs on one creature (when it would be better on others - eg Scorpions, Sparks)
Using buffs directly after the Deja Vu ability / Playing Parallel Universe
Not using nightmares on GoTP even when it has one in hand and playable that turn.
Using Deja Vu/Flying Weapon/Scarab/Firefly even when field is full.
Not accounting Ustable Gases when considering Miracle/Stone Skin/Heals
Being able to Paradox Poisoned creatures.
Use weapons abilities before flying them
Buffing/Fractalling Ash over Phoenixes
Does not empty hand before playing Fractal (misses out on potential extra creatures/damage)
Uses cards like Luciferen/Stone Skin/Shard of Patience even when absolutely nothing will happen
Replacing weapons and shields (whole priority system here, with Steal options as well)
Uses Shard of Serendipity when hand is near full.
Using Overdrive on opponents creatures, then Basilisk Blood.
Burrowing creatures with quintessence.
Using Antimatter before pandemonium.
Does not always take into account creature status/abilities when RT'ing. (eg, Skeleton with Mitosis vs regular, two opposing creatures, one with adrenaline)
Plays both Dissipation Shield as Sanctuary when it shouldn't.
Fractal priority targets need some work (fractals flying weapons over some creatures for example)
Doesn't use a free Time ability gained from SoR twice. (example: doesn't use the flying Eternity rewind twice after buffing it with SoR)
Doesn't unburrow creatures when it's in kill range.
Using Quintessence on unbuffed Dune Scorpions or Death Stalkers.
Suicides with SoSa + Vampires/Black Hole.
Uses reverse Time when opponent is about to deck out, preventing it's own win.
Uses PU on an unbuffed Dune Scorpion while it was able to PU a momentumed one.
Arena decks set to one Health should not play Miracle
This is just where there are a few which I think would be more fleshed out with more information. Keen to help out?
Diving/Playing a Spark when Phase Shield is Up. (Sundial? Cloak? Wings -and spiders?)
Priority Targeting of RoL, does this change when Hope is up? Do no creatures take priority? Etc)
The Playing of shields on top of each other. Which ones, when/how - and whether it is useless from every standpoint, or a situational one.
Using Immolation when Bone Wall is up (and ai has nothing useful, bar a deflag). - Does it occur with other death effects, and will it in a majority of cases actually help the ai more than it hurts?
Example of Situational standpoint - AI Nightmares GoTP when you have 30 Time quanta. Bad in that situation, usually good.
Example of when its bad in every standpoint - Have a Dusk. Play a Fog.
Post by: Rutarete on September 09, 2011, 01:25:19 am
Post by: DrunkDestroyer on September 09, 2011, 11:47:54 pm
Is this a continuation of the old thread? (similar to BP starting a new Ask BP! thread?)Yes and no.
It's the same thread, but newer, shinier and better. It just needs some of those eager and helpful forumers to start fillin' it up!
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 10, 2011, 12:00:09 am
AI really hates ROL, and will reverse time it over bigger theats (I had about 10 ROLs and a golden dragon, AI hit an ROL)
The frequently mentioned playing shields on top of each other
Using parallel universe or splitting a deja vu and then playing a buff on one of them afterwards.
Stacking multiple buffs on one scorpion when other 0 attack ones are on the field.
Playing a spark or diving when phase shield is up.
Played a nightmare on its (already out) devourer and then immediately played a GotP
Post by: EvaRia on September 10, 2011, 02:24:01 am
AI Antimattering it's own creatures when they hit 50+ attack. (Seriously, lolwut?)
AI switching between Accel and Overdrive when it has access to both.
Post by: BluePriest on September 10, 2011, 06:25:13 am
Post by: Jenkar on September 12, 2011, 10:36:30 am
Post by: rowcla on September 13, 2011, 08:17:33 am
Post by: Xenocidius on September 13, 2011, 08:21:25 am
Using Deja vu / flying weapons when field is full.Also, Scarab and Firefly.
Post by: Sevs on September 13, 2011, 09:17:50 am
- holding back adrenaline or only using green nymph on 1 creature
- fractal targeting could use an upgrade to upgrade higher cost cards with more quanta.
- liquid shadow usage (especially jezebel)
Post by: 10 men on September 13, 2011, 01:13:51 pm
Post by: ffun on September 13, 2011, 01:53:53 pm
And a couple of bugs with Phoenix:
- AI doesn't use Immolation on Phoenix.
- AI will place buffs on Ashes and turn them into Phoenix right after.
- AI will Fractal Ashes over Phoenix.
It's not necessarily a bug, but it would also be an improvement if the AI would consider using Chimera and Sky Blitz even if it won't kill the opponent in that same turn (to bypass shields - Chimera - or to be able to use multiple copies of the card - Sky Blitz). On the other hand, the AI shouldn't normally play those cards when there's a sundial in the field (it does it with Chimera, not sure about Sky Blitz, but I wouldn't be surprised if it did - it should be the same programing that makes it dive creatures that won't cause damage that turn).
Post by: The_Mormegil on September 13, 2011, 02:01:12 pm
Post by: DarknessDemon on September 19, 2011, 03:05:45 am
I also think that when it has a voodoo it should rage pot his voodoo rather then rage potting a lava golem...
Post by: furballdn on September 19, 2011, 03:54:34 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 28, 2011, 02:40:15 pm
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 03, 2011, 06:04:18 pm
Heres some i can think of off the top of my head:
Similar to switching shields.. like putting up ice shield then replacing with bonewall or vice a versa..The AI switches weapons like they are candy. If they are going to switch the weapon, some way of checking if its right? seen them switch out an eternity for something else when they had very few cards left in the deck and that was only way i was going to win was by their deck out. Also when switching them out at least have them use the ability? return my creature with eternity, use eagle eye, destroy with punisher, etc. Also noticed with Dirk the AI will play dirk on top of a dirk which is dumb. hold on to the weapon in case of PC.
fractal targets are just wonky. sometimes they will pick my 2/2 skeleton over the phoenix.. this happens a lot vs the false god.
use of black hole ability with nymph and the black hole.. if i have 0 quanta ive seen the AI use it anyway. idk if this is intended or not.
Targets of explosion have been strange..ive seen AI use explosion on a weapon over my sanctuary when the AI obviously needs to use nightmare on their GOTP. Also destroying weapons or hourglass over a shield that is killing their creatures.
Using nightmare when i have only 1 card slot and/or plenty of time quanta. i can understand using it when i have 1 slot left to jam my hand but not if i have quanta to play them.
using bolts/lances of any kind as CC instead of killing me.. sometimes leads me to win due to not dying.
*edit
Also the use of abilities is not done properly. The AI will not use quanta if it is say <5 of the element that the ability goes with. Instead of destroying my pillars/pend. or any other item i have out, they wait a turn or 2 to try and get more quanta before using abilities. waiting like that has led me to win/destroy w/e permanent or creature that could destroy my things before they acquire enough quanta to use abilities. If it is worth using the AI should just use it instead of waiting.
Post by: furballdn on October 04, 2011, 02:27:16 am
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 06, 2011, 07:19:46 pm
[img=http://imageplay.net/m7Gbd229627/Ai3fail_thumb.jpg][/img] (http://imageplay.net/view/m7Gbd229627/Ai3fail)
Post by: lynx655 on October 06, 2011, 10:39:57 pm
(http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/4531/reversed.png)
Well, thanks for the EM...
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 08, 2011, 08:17:22 pm
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 11, 2011, 11:15:45 pm
Post by: furballdn on October 12, 2011, 04:19:56 am
Post by: Jenkar on October 13, 2011, 10:16:19 pm
Post by: Elite arbiter on October 16, 2011, 05:48:25 am
(http://i.imgur.com/VVw5E.jpg) (http://imgur.com/VVw5E)[
Thank you, image that doesn't vanish until you hover over another card.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on October 16, 2011, 09:17:06 am
AI keeps rewinding my creatures even though I have 0 cards in my library. It should just let me die :p
Post by: Jenkar on October 18, 2011, 08:15:00 pm
SoX bug :
-Ai plays healing when it has SoX out.
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 18, 2011, 11:57:17 pm
Post by: ddevans96 on October 19, 2011, 12:51:07 am
playing against jumpingfishes deck in arena, it used miracle.. THEN played SOD.. it should ALWAYS play that the other way around to gain the max hp then heal to max-1 of the new max.. not heal to max-1 then improve max..In that instance both orders have the same effect.
Post by: furballdn on October 19, 2011, 01:00:54 am
Post by: ninetyfools on October 19, 2011, 01:23:10 am
AI uses antimatter twice on one of my creature
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 19, 2011, 02:55:39 am
no they dont? 100 hp.. use miracle u go to 99..play SOD go to 115/116playing against jumpingfishes deck in arena, it used miracle.. THEN played SOD.. it should ALWAYS play that the other way around to gain the max hp then heal to max-1 of the new max.. not heal to max-1 then improve max..In that instance both orders have the same effect.
play SOD first.. max hp = 116 .. play miracle hp = 115..
Post by: Elite arbiter on October 19, 2011, 10:34:04 am
Hp 1/100 + Miracle = Hp 99/100 + SoD = 123/124
Hp 1/100 + SoD = Hp 25/124 + Miracle = 123/124
Post by: Calindu on October 19, 2011, 12:46:10 pm
AI uses heal when it has full hpFalse, Ai doesn't do this.
AI uses antimatter twice on one of my creature
Post by: ninetyfools on October 19, 2011, 09:45:26 pm
Post by: ddevans96 on October 19, 2011, 10:33:06 pm
100 hp.. use miracle u go to 99..play SOD go to 115/116Miracle, then SoD. You have 115/116.
play SOD first.. max hp = 116 .. play miracle hp = 115..SoD, then Miracle. You have 115/116.
What am I missing here?
Post by: bored_ninja777 on October 20, 2011, 01:49:35 am
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on October 20, 2011, 03:09:11 am
Post by: DarknessDemon on October 20, 2011, 04:26:51 am
Post by: furballdn on October 21, 2011, 12:13:30 am
Post by: DarknessDemon on October 22, 2011, 04:22:34 pm
Post by: Evan20000 on October 22, 2011, 06:26:30 pm
Post by: Calindu on October 22, 2011, 06:34:04 pm
AI doesn't bother to kill antimattered creatures with useful abilities (FFQ, Dune Scorp, etc...). It is fairly good about lobotomizing them, if presented with the opportunity.Ai knows the anti-poison bug :))
Post by: Brontos on October 23, 2011, 04:04:15 am
I just saw it doing a first turn Quantum Tower + SoSe. Was great for me btw.
A second point, but it's more general and I'm not sure how to propose it, but the AI likes to feed player's Otyugh. Even if a big Bone Wall is on the field against him. It's my major Arena farming strat right now.
Post by: Elite arbiter on October 23, 2011, 09:56:20 am
Post by: Evan20000 on October 23, 2011, 03:07:52 pm
Post by: Elite arbiter on October 25, 2011, 05:00:52 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/s4EAa.png)
Post by: ninetyfools on October 25, 2011, 09:19:36 pm
Post by: furballdn on October 25, 2011, 09:46:06 pm
Using USEM (semi upped) AI3 steals my short sword while he has a Fahrenheit and I am serious.He could've done that to reduce the damage he'd take.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on October 28, 2011, 06:28:17 am
A couple turns later it played a second Unstable Gas, and still didn't use the first one. This surprised me, but I figured it would just use them both next turn to deliver the coup de grace.
The next turn, it had 2 fire quanta from the pillars, two Unstable Gases, and my hp was in the 20s somewhere, I think 22. It didn't use either gas, preferring to cast explosion on my weapon instead of killing me with the two gases.
The turn after that, it wastes the fire quanta on another explosion, casts Sky Blitz, which due to my Dusk shield, the dragonflies and flying eagle's eyes, doesn't kill me. (I can't fault it for sky blitzing there, but it should have just killed me with gases)
The turn after that, it doesn't even play any fire cards, it just ignores the gases despite having two unused fire quanta, attacks, and gets through my dusk shield, finally killing me.
I'm wondering if maybe some card I had in play made the AI erroneously think I could reflect its gases. Unfortunately, other than the improved dusk shield, I can't remember what permanents I had. I think I had a sanctuary and an hourglass and the shield left at the end, and some towers; everything else was blown up.
Short version: If the AI has enough unstable gases and enough fire quanta to kill the player, it should just do it! :p
Post by: furballdn on October 29, 2011, 12:53:42 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on October 29, 2011, 05:09:50 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on October 30, 2011, 07:22:17 am
It played overdrive on my lava destroyer, presumably to lobotomize it, which makes sense, given that it was a brand new 7/1 and the 2nd turn of the game. However, following that up with a Basilisk Blood on the same creature... not so smart.
It turns out I lost the game before it unfroze, but still... not very bright :p Only one or the other was needed for control, not both.
Post by: Brontos on November 01, 2011, 02:22:44 am
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 01, 2011, 03:13:01 am
Post by: Brontos on November 02, 2011, 03:45:37 am
Not sure it was a smart decision. :]
Post by: fbparis on November 02, 2011, 03:04:52 pm
Also AI always prefers steal/destroy Feral Bonds than Shield of Gratitude or Jade Staff, even when very few creatures on the board both sides. On this point, not sure if it's good or bad.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on November 03, 2011, 10:12:13 am
(http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/962/floodingu.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/13/floodingu.jpg/)
I know it drew an Inundation two turns ago, because the one in my hand is from Mindgate. My Micro Abomination is on the edge. It has plenty of quanta and hasn't done anything else in those two turns, other than maybe some towers.
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 03, 2011, 12:30:59 pm
Egregious example. A pharaoh who has had shard of readiness cast on it doesn't activate its ability twice per turn. Sometimes it doesn't use it's ability at all!It can only activate the ability twice on the turn it is used, after it is used. Acctually, it can be used once (for full cost) before SoR is used, THEN twice free AFTER SoR. However, every future turn is only once (albeit free). As the SoR's description says at the end " :time creatures can use their skill twice this turn". If they don't use the ability at all though, then yeah that's almost always dumb. Maybe they still think it costs quanta?
Others I have to add:
-The AI will sometimes use two weapons in the same turn. Can't see when this is ever a good idea.
-The AI will use Sundial while THEY have a Phase Shield up. Basically pointless.
-The AI seems to ignore the fact that a creature they can send out can be devoured. While I understand sometimes you still want it out to attack the player, occupy their devourerer's (for lack of a better word) turn, drain their :gravity -- whatever. But honestly, they shold pay much closer regard to devour if at all possible. Please note that they will send out creatures with 0 attack that have no use to be out for just 1 turn (such as Otyugh, ironically). I'm also to assume this is the same case for Paradox, although I don't use it myself so couldn't be certain.
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 03, 2011, 12:53:46 pm
Before that, it used a Dimensional Shield and then a Sundial. Same battle. I kid you not.
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 03, 2011, 12:55:33 pm
Post by: bored_ninja777 on November 03, 2011, 02:04:39 pm
Also, using blessing on the wrong creatures.. I was playing in Arena with someone using a photon and a bunch of lava golems. I antimattered 1 golem and it slowly became a -1/9 or something and the AI used blessing on a photon to make it a 4/4 instead of making the golem + attack. ive seen this with deja vus i antimatter and they put it on a different creature. i can understand that its because of a lower attack if done on the - attack creatures but a lot of the times the - creature is saving me... especially when they are multi attackers. 1 de ja vu = 8 damage.. 1 dragon = 10 .. almost cancels out. 1 blessing on the proper creature means im taking 4-5 damage instead of healing 8
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 03, 2011, 04:37:07 pm
-The AI will sometimes use two weapons in the same turn. Can't see when this is ever a good idea.
Freeing up hand space for double-draw. But this is usually a bad idea yes.
-The AI will use Sundial while THEY have a Phase Shield up. Basically pointless.
Agreeing in the case that I've seen this happen- but I'd like to add the qualifier for if this gets looked at to be fixed "And no momentum creatures are on the opponents field".
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 03, 2011, 10:41:13 pm
Yeah, they do this even when I have no creatures with Momentum. Of course, I could send one out but the likelyhood of that happening is pretty low...and if that happens, just use the Sundial afterwards.-The AI will sometimes use two weapons in the same turn. Can't see when this is ever a good idea.
Freeing up hand space for double-draw. But this is usually a bad idea yes.
-The AI will use Sundial while THEY have a Phase Shield up. Basically pointless.
Agreeing in the case that I've seen this happen- but I'd like to add the qualifier for if this gets looked at to be fixed "And no momentum creatures are on the opponents field".
Post by: Brontos on November 04, 2011, 02:30:23 am
I think I've seen this with SoR with different creatures, maybe the AI thinks it still has a cost.
Post by: FSK on November 04, 2011, 02:59:50 am
The AI used to unburrow creatures when near victory. It doesn't do that anymore.
The AI shouldn't always immediately play protect artifact. Save it for a good permanent.
Here's an amusing bug. The AI plays unstable gas. The AI uses protect artifact on the unstable gas. The AI explodes the unstable gas. The AI plays another permanent in the unstable gas slot. The new permanent already has protect artifact on it.
Post by: Calindu on November 04, 2011, 06:55:34 pm
The AI shouldn't play silence on turn #1 when it wins the coin toss and plays Aether towers.<----That's a great strategy actually.
The AI used to unburrow creatures when near victory. It doesn't do that anymore.<---It didn't.
The AI shouldn't always immediately play protect artifact. Save it for a good permanent.<---True.
Here's an amusing bug. The AI plays unstable gas. The AI uses protect artifact on the unstable gas. The AI explodes the unstable gas. The AI plays another permanent in the unstable gas slot. The new permanent already has protect artifact on it.<-----Never seen the bug, but yeah, it's stupid to PA then explode.
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 05, 2011, 04:03:00 am
Post by: Calindu on November 05, 2011, 08:54:40 am
The AI will kill creatures even when there's a better creature with the same HP on the field. Example -- killing a Mummy with 3 health when there's an Elite Mummy with 3 health.Both haves the same attack, only a cost issue.
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 05, 2011, 05:38:23 pm
Technically the Mummy will rewind into a Pharaoh while the Elite Mummy will rewind into an Elite Pharaoh, so 'technically' with this one there is a small issue still.The AI will kill creatures even when there's a better creature with the same HP on the field. Example -- killing a Mummy with 3 health when there's an Elite Mummy with 3 health.Both haves the same attack, only a cost issue.
Also, AI still evolves Grabiods and revives Phoenixes during SoSa, former is almost unquestionably bad, latter is only usually bad. And it also still uses TU.
Post by: furballdn on November 06, 2011, 03:06:23 am
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 06, 2011, 04:27:56 am
Also, AI burrows when it has invulnerability up.
(http://i.imgur.com/Q8NOZ.png)
Post by: russianspy1234 on November 07, 2011, 03:19:54 pm
ai in general makes poor use of gravity pull. rainbow will play gravity pull, then lightning or otherwise remove the creature. oblitirator(i think) will play it on my creatures but give all of his creatures momentum.
AI in silver arena played wings, then stole my wings which only had 1 turn left on them. i had an arsenic in play and AI had no weapon.
AI played shard of rediness on its otyugo and then didnt bother to eat my 1/1 specter or cat. later, played the shard on firefly queen and didnt bother to spawn.
played liquid shadow on its 0/6 graviton firemaster and then next turn on its light nymph
played momentum on his otyugos (making them 1|4) and then not eating my shriekers.
reversed timed my regular shrieker when i had an upped shrieker (and a 3/3 forest specter) on the field.
Post by: fbparis on November 09, 2011, 04:56:53 pm
Post by: mycale on November 10, 2011, 04:58:52 am
Post by: Captain Scibra on November 11, 2011, 01:24:59 am
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 11, 2011, 01:19:58 pm
Furthermore, they did NOT use it last turn, when the Armagio was sent out (and couldn't have used its ability itself). I'm pretty sure they had the card already, because they played a pillar this turn. (They seem to be good at playing pillars the turn they're drawn.)
EDIT: Remember when I said the AI seems to not fear being devoured? They've taken it to the next level. I had a Mummy, 5 Elite Scarabs with 5 HP, and an Elite Pharaoh. The Mummy and 3 Scarabs wear frozen/congealed. Their blessing'd Arctic Octopus has 5 HP. The AI congealed the 2 Scarabs (one with the Octopus' ability, the other with a spell card)...and not the Pharaoh -- permitting the Pharaoh to raise ALL six Scarabs' HP to 6 so whichever was free first could devour the Octopus -- rather than freeze the Pharaoh so my Scarabs wouldn't have 6 HP for a while. Furthermore, on the next turn (when my Pharaoh was the only non-congealed creature), the AI congealed the already-congealed Mummy...which happens to be the only currently-congealed/frozen creature which could NOT devour the Octopus. O.o I think if the AI feared Devour, somehow, a lot of problems I see would be fixed. lol
Post by: Elsy on November 11, 2011, 06:32:35 pm
Post by: Calindu on November 11, 2011, 07:32:49 pm
I just had a Platinum deck Shard of Sacrifice itself down to 20 health from full (3 SoS) when it had 6x Shard of Gratitude up, as well as a Sanctuary and two Feral Bonds (with 23 creatures on the board). Needless to say, it killed itself. I was running a Dune Scorpion deck against it and had, I think, 69 poison counters on the platinum deck, which it was still out healing every turn.Who the hell puts SoS with healing?
Post by: russianspy1234 on November 11, 2011, 07:46:14 pm
someone who expects the AI to not be stupid with it?I just had a Platinum deck Shard of Sacrifice itself down to 20 health from full (3 SoS) when it had 6x Shard of Gratitude up, as well as a Sanctuary and two Feral Bonds (with 23 creatures on the board). Needless to say, it killed itself. I was running a Dune Scorpion deck against it and had, I think, 69 poison counters on the platinum deck, which it was still out healing every turn.Who the hell puts SoS with healing?
Post by: Elsy on November 11, 2011, 08:03:54 pm
I forgot to note that it also had a number of Minor Vampires on the field (the AI fractal'd them). I'm not sure if there were enough to kill itself without the other healing.I just had a Platinum deck Shard of Sacrifice itself down to 20 health from full (3 SoS) when it had 6x Shard of Gratitude up, as well as a Sanctuary and two Feral Bonds (with 23 creatures on the board). Needless to say, it killed itself. I was running a Dune Scorpion deck against it and had, I think, 69 poison counters on the platinum deck, which it was still out healing every turn.Who the hell puts SoS with healing?
Anyway, I assume the deck maker was just thinking that SoS are good for stalling and didn't really think it through. You're right though that this probably isn't a huge problem since we won't see too many decks constructed that way.
Post by: ninetyfools on November 11, 2011, 08:30:27 pm
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 12, 2011, 10:27:39 am
Post by: ninetyfools on November 12, 2011, 10:12:52 pm
I deflagged it so im not complaining...
;)
Post by: FSK on November 15, 2011, 05:22:27 am
The AI should never play multiple weapons on the same turn. The AI should never play multiple shields on the same turn.
Post by: willng3 on November 16, 2011, 02:10:20 am
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 16, 2011, 09:00:31 am
Post by: I8SumOrangesNItWasK on November 16, 2011, 09:38:16 am
AI starts turn with no quanta to use an Hourglass (stolen). It steals a time tower from me but does not activate the Hourglass, although I'm not sure if this is because it didn't want to 'lose' the one quanta incase it had to play the non-existent time cards in its deck, or if the order just didn't check for time quanta again.I think it doesn't like to 'lose' the 1 quanta. I've seen times when it will refrain from using Lobotomize, Growth, etc. when it barely has the quanta to and it would be wise to do so, and I assume it's simply to "save" the quanta. However, it doesn't appear to know that it has nothing else to use that :time on in your case, which IS a problem.
Oh, and speaking of the AI using multiple shields at once. Today I experienced the AI had a Tower Shield up, which prevented me from killing it during my next turn. Despite that, the AI used a Fire Shield. This move allowed me to finish it off in my next turn. Guess it just gave up. :P
o.O The AI just used Acceleration on a creature of mine. The next turn, it used Overdrive and then Acceleration on the same creature. This doesn't really make any sense at all and is dumb on so many levels. My assumption is if it has enough quanta to use Acceleration/Overdrive, it will, and for some reason, my Mummy was more important than my Chrysora all 3 times. It probably either A) will always use it on Mummy or Chrysora, or B) will usually use it on Mummy over Chrysora. What it SHOULD do is take OTHER factors into consideration, such as if the Mummy already has Acceleration...
Post by: russianspy1234 on November 16, 2011, 08:49:40 pm
Post by: macgawel on November 19, 2011, 09:00:31 am
Since 1.292, AI don't play new creatures when you play SoSa. Good :)
But it uses abilities such as FQ, Pharao or Ablaze :P
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 19, 2011, 11:33:31 am
Post by: Brontos on November 19, 2011, 01:15:57 pm
It's quite frequent that the AI won't use a free ability twice.
Flying Eternity is the most obvious case. Even with two or more targets on the opposing side, only one will be reversed when it's just obvious to target 2 of them (no complicated scenario here).
I've seen Mitosis/SoR/Silurian Dragons having the same behaviour, and they don't need target to duplicate themselves twice on the turn SoR is played.
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 19, 2011, 02:17:04 pm
... what I want to know is why is Holy Flash in a Plat deck in the first place?
Also, AI uses the growth of the Forest Spectre while anti-mattered, and waits to anti-matter it back to normal until after its growth rather than before it.
Post by: ninetyfools on November 20, 2011, 01:29:52 am
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 20, 2011, 12:41:21 pm
Post by: Avenger on November 23, 2011, 08:45:25 pm
Post by: UserClone on November 24, 2011, 01:58:50 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on November 24, 2011, 03:53:37 pm
The AI is using the Adrenaline in my Arena deck on the Rustler (the quanta filter) instead of the Ray of Light (quanta producer). This is...problematic.AI seems to have a major crush on rustler. I've seen it use adrenaline on it instead of a frog or other better options.
Post by: Elite arbiter on November 26, 2011, 01:14:52 am
Post by: petersenk on November 27, 2011, 05:39:46 pm
And if possible, AI should only play dune scorpions or death stalkers, if it can buff them that very turn (or if the hand is full). That would be a simple, yet good rule too.
Post by: Dengeki on November 29, 2011, 04:28:02 am
Post by: TheForbiddenOracle on December 02, 2011, 09:53:24 pm
Post by: Taglio on December 06, 2011, 07:19:47 pm
I wanted to point out two things I think might result as improvements:
1) in Arena the AI doesn't register the card SANCTUM as a main target for permanent control EVEN WITH DEVOURER/SILENCE DECK. I think this card is a total trump against the strategy of these two cards. Could it be lifted in the priority list for permanent control?
maybe when the AI has played at least 2 devourers and/or has two silence in hand... Just my two cents
2) airborne titan (especially with acceleration) is invincible and very good for a False god approach.
but I am thinking of what could stop it apart from rewind and mutation cards.
death, fire, darkness, air, gravity: all these creature controls all fall before this mighty combo. Water can slow it, just like sundials.
Isn't the case of lowering its hit points?
I hope I posted in the right section.
thank you everybody for this great game!
Taglio
Post by: fbparis on December 12, 2011, 08:45:29 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on December 12, 2011, 03:08:09 pm
Post by: Avenger on December 12, 2011, 06:19:56 pm
2. AI uses parallel universe on unbuffed dune scorp vs. momentumed dune scorp
Post by: Jappert on December 13, 2011, 04:46:58 pm
I'll be changing the lay out of this topic soon to make it more accessible and readable.
Please keep posting your suggestions on how to improve this game's AI and continue pointing out mistakes it makes when playing decks. Please supply screenshots whenever possible aswell!
Thanks alot in advance + hugs.
Post by: fbparis on December 14, 2011, 02:00:50 pm
Regarding this thread, a dedicated board for AI bugs & improvement would be great, each bug a new topic for example.
Post by: Firenotes on December 22, 2011, 09:39:36 pm
PS: The AI dropping SoG first turn is awful as well. 90% of the time this is a very bad play.
Post by: Elite arbiter on December 22, 2011, 11:01:24 pm
Post by: Eleahen on December 26, 2011, 07:45:30 pm
Probably applies to all cases when 1hp creature is valued for it's ability than for it's attack or being Cremation fodder.
Post by: zzz124 on December 26, 2011, 08:44:03 pm
Post by: Elbirn on December 26, 2011, 09:49:46 pm
Post by: Elite arbiter on December 30, 2011, 08:55:59 am
Post by: Eleahen on January 10, 2012, 10:09:43 am
Example:
Raging flying Eagle Eyes deck.
Post by: Eleahen on January 10, 2012, 09:28:26 pm
It might be better if AI used Cremation only when it's needed or otherwise Cremation target would be lost.
Pros:
- more quanta from rols/gemfinders/etc. which would be better for Arena deck construction purposes
- some damage to opponent from Cremation fodder
- better defense against Discord/BH combo
- better defense against BH if deck relies on non-Fire quanta from Cremation
- better defense against Nightmare
Cons:
- Cremation fodder creatures would be more vulnerable to CC
edit:
rephrased
Post by: Sevs on January 11, 2012, 01:21:26 am
Post by: Shylderidh on January 20, 2012, 05:25:44 pm
Many examples :
- AI uses purify as soon the card is available, even if the opponent has poison creatures/weapon in play and the poison counter is low (a better script would be if opponent use poison, only use purify if poison counter is say > to 30% of remaining hp)
- AI immolate creatures even when it has no use for the produced quanta, losing the dammage they can make (even worse for immo arena decks AI instantly immolate low attack creatures having an usefull ability, ie chrysaora or vultures if photons aren't available)
- AI immolate/kill creatures in front of opponent's bone wall, when this bone wall can be destroyed by not killing anybody (a better script would be only feed opponent bone wall if you are near death and need to kill those creatures to survive)
- AI play creatures with low hp in front of fire walls/thorn carapace (here it may sometimes be usefull to finish an opponent, but the chances to do so should be reduced in early game)
- AI plays soul catcher or bone wall after killing/immolating creatures in the same turn when they could have been played before
- AI doesn't consider waiting to use shard of readiness, and will waste it on any creature having an ability, even if lots of the needed quanta is available
- AI doesn't consider waiting to use quintessence, and will waste it on any creature if nothing strong/having an usefull ability is on the field (including creatures like scorpions needing buff to do dammage)
- AI waste deflags on pilars when opponent already has lot of pilars and quantum, instead of waiting for a shield/strong permanent to remove (a better script would make the AI only use deflag on pilars if the opponent has less than 4 or 5 of this kind and low quantum)
- AI waste momentum on weak creatures, even just before playing a stronger one (ie cast momentum on a gnome gemfinder just before playing a shrieker)
Edit two more specific problems I just witnessed :
- shadow or death/light half blood kill their own creatures trying to heal them with holy light
- AI prefers to steal an hourglass over a permafrost shield, that despite all its creatures are blocked by the shield (seen trying a minor vampire + adrenaline arena deck) ; in general AI obsession for stealing hourglasses is a big AI weakness when the opponent can be killed in 1-3 turns by stealing its shield (especially when AI doesn't have the time quantum income to use those hourglasses)
Post by: Gandora on January 22, 2012, 03:04:14 pm
AI played a fractal Phase spider deck.
It killed one of my creatures with a lightning. I survived with 2 HP and won next turn.
If the AI had used it on me the dmg would have been enough to kill me.
Post by: Shylderidh on January 24, 2012, 11:30:09 am
AI waste acceleration on enemy fireflies when it can be cast on big hp creatures of its side.
AI casts both acceleration then living shadow on the same creature in the same turn.
AI casts living shadow on a 3/19 voodoo doll under overdrive effect, when a 8/16 collossal dragon under momentum effect is available (especially stupid as opponent was protected by a phase shield).
AI casts acceleration on a vampire collossal dragon when keeping its vampire skill is needed to survive this turn.
AI waste living shadow to kill fireflies, when it can be cast on opponent's firefly queen to suppress its skill.
Post by: Eleahen on January 27, 2012, 01:22:55 pm
- AI casts hp buff on Otyugh but doesn't use it's ability on new available targets on the same turn.
Post by: Eleahen on January 28, 2012, 08:39:22 pm
Post by: mesaprotector on January 28, 2012, 09:20:36 pm
Post by: Shylderidh on January 29, 2012, 01:15:42 pm
Seen with an arena deck : I'm under 20 hp. The AI has an unstable gas out and 1 fire quantum to kill me and will lose if I survive its turn. For an unknown reason the AI waited to use the gas and lost.
Post by: Daguerreo on January 29, 2012, 02:02:02 pm
Post by: black rat on February 18, 2012, 12:28:25 pm
he just keep the cards in reserve to kill my creatures, even if he could have killed me with my 3 antimattert dragons (and 30 hp) and his three liquid shadows in his hand...
Post by: axel1989 on February 20, 2012, 09:14:46 pm
I wish I helped
Post by: kimham8a on February 28, 2012, 02:34:42 am
Post by: Aves on February 28, 2012, 05:08:50 am
Post by: Eleahen on February 29, 2012, 10:49:28 pm
Post by: furballdn on March 01, 2012, 01:59:18 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on March 03, 2012, 08:07:40 pm
The AI cast Shard of Readiness on... are you ready for this? Ash. ASH. wtf?
Post by: dragonsdemesne on March 15, 2012, 01:11:45 am
Post by: mesaprotector on March 15, 2012, 05:08:49 am
Post by: kimham8a on March 16, 2012, 01:30:14 am
Post by: waterzx on March 20, 2012, 02:55:49 pm
Card order : photon --> immo --> fire spirit --> immo --> fire spirit --> immo --> golem --> empty hand
Finally, I had a nice game with nightmare chain + RT
When I see AI flaws, I don't normally bother posting them because they are so numerous, and I'd be making a dozen posts a day. However, this last one was so fail I have to post it.You have no idea how hard I laughed when I read this
The AI cast Shard of Readiness on... are you ready for this? Ash. ASH. wtf?
Post by: Wizy on March 22, 2012, 11:37:46 am
liquid shadows on its own zero attack pests <-srslywtf
Post by: furballdn on March 23, 2012, 04:46:23 am
Post by: kimham8a on March 24, 2012, 05:42:10 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on March 27, 2012, 10:00:22 pm
Post by: Aves on March 28, 2012, 02:08:01 am
The CPU had an Emerald Shield, and played 2 Heals on itself, therefore reflecting them at me. :DThat should definitely not be happening...
Post by: furballdn on March 28, 2012, 02:11:47 am
The CPU had an Emerald Shield, and played 2 Heals on itself, therefore reflecting them at me. :DThere is something wrong with that because heal does not target. Holy light targets, but heal does not.
Post by: pulli23 on March 29, 2012, 10:41:12 am
chimera -> overdrive -> chimera -> chimera -> chimera -> dragon
Waste of cards?
Post by: waterzx on March 29, 2012, 12:13:56 pm
Akebono just did this sequence (while I was low hp, but had sundial up):I saw this when farming a FG, not sure which one, but it really makes me laugh
chimera -> overdrive -> chimera -> chimera -> chimera -> dragon
Waste of cards?
Post by: Schlonz on March 31, 2012, 06:03:12 pm
Uses cards like Luciferen/Stone Skin/Shard of Patience even when absolutely nothing will happenEven worse:
AI plays SoP several times in a row in the same turn
only to play serveral water creatures in the same turn directly after the SoPs.
(happend repeated times when I played against my own arena deck)
Post by: mesaprotector on March 31, 2012, 06:58:12 pm
Same thing with Sky Blitz, AI3 played it with only 2 crusaders out on the field and me at low health.Uses cards like Luciferen/Stone Skin/Shard of Patience even when absolutely nothing will happenEven worse:
AI plays SoP several times in a row in the same turn
only to play serveral water creatures in the same turn directly after the SoPs.
(happend repeated times when I played against my own arena deck)
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 11, 2012, 11:30:50 pm
(http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3535/shieldfail.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/515/shieldfail.jpg/)
The AI couldn't win this game, as chaining phase shields wouldn't have helped vs pulvy, and neither would leaving hope out due to the steam machines, but that's still lot of fail in the pic :) Not even a miracle saved it in the end, as I killed him before he got quanta for the next one.
Post by: eaglgenes101 on April 12, 2012, 02:55:47 am
AI also can't use sparks well (fails to buff or immolate them).
Post by: qwas296 on April 14, 2012, 03:40:58 pm
I have no pic because it happened too fast ;P
Any confirmations?
Post by: Soulshader on April 14, 2012, 03:59:47 pm
Post by: Gandora on April 14, 2012, 04:54:47 pm
good to know. I might use this information for cc decoy ^^
Post by: Elite arbiter on April 14, 2012, 05:18:59 pm
(Just checked. 75 Water Quanta and sufficient water creatures and SoP on the field, no Flooding in a oracle card flooding deck.)
Post by: n00b on April 14, 2012, 05:21:58 pm
Post by: Wizy on April 15, 2012, 06:53:25 pm
My deck had one Purify, It did not have any SoSa or Mind Gate. I did not get any Purify from any SoSe.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/35alzsk.jpg)
Post by: bogtro on April 15, 2012, 08:40:04 pm
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on April 15, 2012, 08:43:05 pm
This is not a bug, simply stupid ai, ai improvements belong here: http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30783.0.html
locking topic.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 15, 2012, 08:59:34 pm
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on April 15, 2012, 10:12:21 pm
I had an antimattered purple nymph (to protect vs fire shield) and the AI cast purify on my nymph.
nice lol. next thing you know they will put purify on overdriven creatures that were antimattered.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 17, 2012, 04:14:28 pm
On the plus side, the AI will actually play shard of patience now; before, it never put it down unless it had something like 6-7+ creatures or you had sundial/sosa active. It also seems to be a little better at using abilities when it has quanta, rather than doing things like passing the turn when it has 2-3 gravity quanta and a pulverizer out, and you have a permanent it should be targeting. It will also target you with purify to remove the sacrifice effect.
Post by: burpcow on April 18, 2012, 01:46:03 am
Post by: furballdn on April 18, 2012, 01:48:50 am
This has probably been listed before, but the AI isn't very smart with Nightmare. For example, it decided to nightmare my vampire when I had 20+ darkness quanta.It also decided to nightmare my creature right before playing a ghost.
Post by: burpcow on April 18, 2012, 01:59:33 am
This has probably been listed before, but the AI isn't very smart with Nightmare. For example, it decided to nightmare my vampire when I had 20+ darkness quanta.It also decided to nightmare my creature right before playing a ghost.
Yea, this also reminds me of the AI shockwaving my creature first, and then freezing it.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 20, 2012, 01:22:06 am
I have no explanation for why the AI did not play the tower and pendulum that it drew last turn. Using precogs I know that it had the two shriekers the turn before, and just drew the tower/pend on its last turn. The AIs deck contains silence, black hole and quicksand, so maybe something in the calculations made it think those cards were a threat against itself somehow. The silence in particular makes me think that maybe it mistakenly thought it was silenced last turn.
Post by: eaglgenes101 on April 20, 2012, 01:31:43 am
(http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/2854/wutj.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/685/wutj.jpg/)Possibly to save its quanta, like you hold back pillars when you see quicksands?
I have no explanation for why the AI did not play the tower and pendulum that it drew last turn. Using precogs I know that it had the two shriekers the turn before, and just drew the tower/pend on its last turn. The AIs deck contains silence, black hole and quicksand, so maybe something in the calculations made it think those cards were a threat against itself somehow. The silence in particular makes me think that maybe it mistakenly thought it was silenced last turn.
Post by: furballdn on April 20, 2012, 04:08:54 am
Post by: eaglgenes101 on April 20, 2012, 04:11:28 am
Post by: Elite arbiter on April 20, 2012, 05:24:13 am
Just mentioning that in 1.3 the bug where the AI plays beneficial cards such as Mitosis on your Anti-mattered creatures hasn't been fixed.
Post by: justaburd on April 20, 2012, 01:26:41 pm
For some reason, the ai played that purify on the nymph instead of on me (which would have killed me)
Also, the AI plays Shards of Bravery when it has 2 slots available with fire mark when it should really wait for 3.
Post by: mesaprotector on April 23, 2012, 01:41:10 am
Post by: Tetti on April 23, 2012, 09:41:07 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on April 23, 2012, 11:17:13 pm
Post by: Assassine on April 25, 2012, 02:03:19 pm
When looking for a creature to throw with catapult, the AI uses a same-turn played armagio that still has its skill over older ones that were lobotomized before they could use their ability.
Post by: Gandora on April 25, 2012, 03:42:59 pm
Also, when there's a blessed rustler I personally think that when a flying vamp stiletto meets the field the other blessings shouldn't be stacked on that one rustler. Instead the heal power should be increased by blessing the stiletto.
Edit:
AI had a Rustler with 8 atk and momentum. How comes he plays adrenaline on the rustler with 1 atk?
Post by: TIO on April 26, 2012, 11:50:59 pm
Post by: kimham8a on April 28, 2012, 03:12:44 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 28, 2012, 04:48:48 am
(http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/4048/failay.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/560/failay.jpg/)
Post by: pedzacyzolw on April 28, 2012, 11:25:56 am
(http://i.imgur.com/6QK1m.jpg)
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 29, 2012, 04:52:09 pm
Testing my SoSebow against my new arena deck, and the AI isn't playing inundation even though it would CLEARLY be to its benefit. I have creatures it can kill and it has oodles of quanta and shards of patience, and creatures that would benefit from the flooding. It also held its creatures back with SoP for a very long time; it should have won several turns before this, but last turn was the first that it attacked me, taking half my hp away. (sorry it was cut off, it's 48/100 right now, and AI has 31 :water )
Post by: russianspy1234 on April 29, 2012, 06:52:55 pm
Post by: FIQ on April 29, 2012, 10:24:02 pm
AI never use SoPa (at least I've never seen it doing that, when it clearly had it in hand)
When I antimatter creatures, AI will do *everything* to stop it - including freezing several times without any effect after the first one, Web:ing itself (spiders) though there's no Airbone status, waste every CC he has on an antimattered crawler instead of taking down my dragon. I antimattered Neptune's crawler, he responded with 3 congeals and a shockwave when he could have spared two of them.
I think the AM handling is a regression actually, IIRC the AI didn't do this on 1.27-1.28
Post by: Gandora on May 01, 2012, 07:44:48 am
Post by: furballdn on May 02, 2012, 03:09:31 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on May 05, 2012, 01:25:10 am
Post by: Tirear on May 05, 2012, 07:36:30 pm
Post by: Chapuz on May 06, 2012, 01:08:22 am
Post by: ponnuki on May 06, 2012, 12:03:47 pm
Post by: Chapuz on May 07, 2012, 01:19:07 pm
AI (in an Arena game) played a dimensional shield, then stole my dimensional shield, thus making its previous action less-than-worthless.Yeah, many card combinations haven't been made yet. Not so long ago, freeze+shockwave was put but there must be more conditions.
I had 2 Nymph Queens, one of them with SoR (0 cost skill) and the AI rewinded the 4 :water cost skill Nymph.
Post by: ponnuki on May 11, 2012, 06:01:00 pm
Post by: FIQ on May 11, 2012, 06:12:30 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/yy0C7.jpg)
I was going to lose, so I don't complain on him, but yeah.
Never mind the browser window weirdness, Flash does that sometimes for me.
EDIT: Noes, it reverse timed it after a few turns after it started to infest and have fun in other ways. D:
But still, why did it do that?
EDIT2: ...ok, it happened again.
EDIT3: Oh, I've come to the conclusion that if you're low on HP, AI ignores singularity creation. Still, this (IMO) is very risky, and if it didn't happen to have Reverse Time, I would win that match, and I think this is the case most of the time.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on May 12, 2012, 10:35:20 pm
(http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/1066/wtfcyb.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/196/wtfcyb.jpg/)
Post by: russianspy1234 on May 13, 2012, 12:57:01 am
(http://i46.tinypic.com/30ucr9f.jpg)
Post by: Chapuz on May 13, 2012, 01:43:04 am
Here's a giant pile of fail by the AI, one of the biggest I've seen. (and I've seen a lot :p) With earlier precogs, I knew it had SoSas in hand. After waiting out about 8 turns of SoSa, it didn't play any more of them. It had them in hand for two full turns, and it could have stalled longer and decked me out, but it didn't. No silences were played by me. (I played a precog to make the screenshot better; I know better than to play them when my deck's that low against a stall :p)AI doesn't play more than 6 SoSac in the same game. That's why SoSa deck aren't seen more often in Arena ;)
AI cast purify on my antimattered lobotomized purple nymph:AI doesn't want your antimattered creature to die, less even if it's a nymph. That is used for good, antimattering momentumed dune scorps ;)
By the way, what's that beautiful timebow?
Post by: russianspy1234 on May 13, 2012, 02:10:25 am
Here's a giant pile of fail by the AI, one of the biggest I've seen. (and I've seen a lot :p) With earlier precogs, I knew it had SoSas in hand. After waiting out about 8 turns of SoSa, it didn't play any more of them. It had them in hand for two full turns, and it could have stalled longer and decked me out, but it didn't. No silences were played by me. (I played a precog to make the screenshot better; I know better than to play them when my deck's that low against a stall :p)AI doesn't play more than 6 SoSac in the same game. That's why SoSa deck aren't seen more often in Arena ;)AI cast purify on my antimattered lobotomized purple nymph:AI doesn't want your antimattered creature to die, less even if it's a nymph. That is used for good, antimattering momentumed dune scorps ;)
By the way, what's that beautiful timebow?
That would make sense, except my nymph wasnt damaged or poisoned., and there were plenty of targets that would have been good for the purify.
I am playing a modified version of SGbow
Seperate game:
AI just cast purify on me multiple times. It seemed to happen midcasts of ice bolt.
another game:
AI lobotomized my shrieker instead of my strong momentumed forest specter
(http://i45.tinypic.com/mkk8ky.jpg)
Post by: Belligerence on May 15, 2012, 02:56:52 am
(http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/2712/adrenaspark.png)
I'll go out on a limb and say that this isn't exactly the most efficient use of Adrenaline.
Edit: I suppose with *only* Sparks out, this wouldn't be as bad (even though the Spark would die after the first attack anyway...), but the AI also had a Cockatrice and an Emerald Dragon, neither of which had Adrenaline.
Post by: Chapuz on May 15, 2012, 12:56:38 pm
I had AI Adrenaline an unubuffed Spark. It happened in an Arena game, and it was too quick to screenshot, but I did get the AI to do it again in Trainer.I supose that the adrenaline code searches only for the highest attack creature with adrenaline effect, without looking the HP and poison on the creature. Another thing to improve.(http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/2712/adrenaspark.png)I'll go out on a limb and say that this isn't exactly the most efficient use of Adrenaline.
Edit: I suppose with *only* Sparks out, this wouldn't be as bad (even though the Spark would die after the first attack anyway...), but the AI also had a Cockatrice and an Emerald Dragon, neither of which had Adrenaline.
Post by: ponnuki on May 15, 2012, 09:23:03 pm
Post by: fsk on May 16, 2012, 08:27:55 pm
If the AI is close to victory, it should unburrow its shriekers. The AI used to do this. For example, I have 16 HP and the AI has two burrowed shriekers. It should unburrow them and kill me, rather than dealing only 8 damage and giving me another turn.
The AI will only play Chimera if it leads to a kill this turn. The AI used to play Chimera more often.
The AI should play its boneyard before killing one of my creatures.
The AI should sometimes save its enchant artifact for its weapon or shield, rather than always immediately playing it.
Post by: FIQ on May 19, 2012, 08:02:58 pm
Post by: Chapuz on May 19, 2012, 08:10:36 pm
I suggest that the AI, when considering buffing itself, should foresee exactly what the outcome will be at the end of the turn, i.e. by playing a turn in it's "head". This way, the AI would do less stupid things, I think.Yep. And have a list of priority card and skill order usage.
EDIT: AI cremates ash eater with no other cards in his hand. dafuq?
EDIT 2: I was playing with an Instosis variation and played 2 supernovas in the same turn, generating a singularyty. That turn ended and the singularity gained Vampire skill. What did the AI do that turn? KILL THE SINGULARITY WITH A RAGE POTION lol xD
Post by: Tirear on May 23, 2012, 11:25:06 pm
EDIT 2: I was playing with an Instosis variation and played 2 supernovas in the same turn, generating a singularyty. That turn ended and the singularity gained Vampire skill. What did the AI do that turn? KILL THE SINGULARITY WITH A RAGE POTION lol xD
That's because singularity's high cost outweighs its negative attack. This may sound counter-intuitive, but it is actually a pretty good method of estimate the threat of an antimattered creature. Creatures with powerful abilities, such as purple nymphs, tend to have high costs, and the AI will recognize that 1 healing per turn is not worth letting them live. Creatures whose reason for their high cost is attack power will usually have attack >= cost, so the AI will leave such antimattered creatures alone. This saves the work of determining the exact value of each ability, and I think more kinds of CC could use something along these lines.
The real problem here is that singularity was not made to be played, and it was given a high cost solely to prevent the AI from playing copies received from nightmare. This had the side effect of making the AI assume it was a valuable card. This interaction goes to show why patches to the AI's behavior belong in the code of the AI. Teaching the AI not to play singularities would not only make it possible to lower the cost and solve this interaction, but also help AI decks that generate lots of entropy quanta.
In a similar vein, if you cast momentum on a deja vu* and then use its ability, the AI will never lobotomize the resulting creature, because it does not have an active skill. If the AI were taught to lobotomize momentum (the status), not only would this interaction be fixed, but you could get rid of momentum (the active ability), fixing the asymmetric interaction between momentum (the spell) and luciferin.
* Also works with lycanthropy, or using an unupped mutation to create an abomination, but buffing a deja vu before using its ability is a common strategy.
Post by: Belligerence on May 27, 2012, 03:40:41 pm
I don't normally comment on the AI playing multiple weapons on the same turn (or stealing yours then playing it's own), but this is just sad.
Post by: asiantraceur on May 27, 2012, 09:12:43 pm
Post by: Wizy on May 27, 2012, 09:22:19 pm
I was playing a deck and it chained 2 Shard of Sacrifices...I don't use SoSac so I don't understand its mechanics that well but I believe what that results in is AI loses 63-80 HP without any extra bonus from the extra SoSac?The turns add up. It is an ok play by the AI, that way it loses less non- :death quanta and avoids being countered by possible silences.
In certain situations it is more effective to wait until the previous shard wears off, but that's too much thinking for the AI.
Post by: qwas296 on May 27, 2012, 09:56:56 pm
Post by: asiantraceur on May 27, 2012, 10:50:44 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on May 28, 2012, 02:02:26 am
Post by: asiantraceur on May 28, 2012, 11:44:08 pm
Post by: furballdn on May 28, 2012, 11:46:56 pm
How come shard of bravery does nothing if you have sanctuary out?Sanctuary protects the hand and quanta pools. Shard of bravery forces the opponent to draw. This will change opponent's hand, so sanctuary blocks it.
Post by: asiantraceur on May 29, 2012, 12:00:59 am
Also the AI could have won that turn by deflagging my sundial but instead deflagged my hourglass...
Post by: Erlemar on May 29, 2012, 06:27:06 am
AI played antimatter on my elite otyugh, then put 3 purufy on this otyugh and till the end of the battle tried to kill it with snipe from Eagle's Eye :)
Post by: furballdn on May 29, 2012, 05:34:45 pm
Post by: burpcow on May 30, 2012, 01:50:04 am
AI needs to learn to use cremate on photons. Not to use quint on them. AI, y u no let my clever arena decks work.Yeah, AI also needs to learn not to quint sparks/ball lightnings (without buffs)
Post by: Chapuz on May 30, 2012, 01:36:30 pm
AI needs to learn to use cremate on photons.AI cremates any little creature, even if it doesn't have another creature to play after cremating it :P
Post by: russianspy1234 on May 30, 2012, 01:44:17 pm
Post by: fsk on May 30, 2012, 04:19:42 pm
Post by: FIQ on May 31, 2012, 08:34:42 pm
The AI cast purify on me, even though I had no SoSac! This seems to happen when the AI is at max HPs.Did he have a reflective shield? Purify+reflective shields are buggy.
Post by: furballdn on June 01, 2012, 12:06:24 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on June 03, 2012, 04:55:23 am
Post by: Joe21 on June 08, 2012, 10:02:35 am
Post by: Belligerence on June 11, 2012, 05:37:46 pm
It might not be immediately clear. Destiny hatched an Aether Nymph, and a Mummy (which s/he rewound into a Pharaoh) and has been pumping out Scarabs for 3 turns. Over those 3 turns, Destiny chose to Quint 2 Scarabs, rather than just about any other creature on the field. What?
Post by: furballdn on June 11, 2012, 06:48:00 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on June 18, 2012, 03:23:47 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on June 18, 2012, 06:32:01 pm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/russianspy1234/ros/accblood.jpg)
Post by: furballdn on June 18, 2012, 06:55:16 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on June 19, 2012, 07:58:14 pm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/russianspy1234/ros/nightmare.jpg)
Post by: dragonsdemesne on June 22, 2012, 05:31:18 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on June 24, 2012, 06:15:51 am
Post by: Annele on June 24, 2012, 06:53:09 am
Post by: furballdn on June 24, 2012, 06:54:46 am
If I nightmare ball lightning when the AI has an empty hand, and I have a bonewall, it discards one BL, then on the next turn plays the whole lot.Probably because it only thinks the nightmared cards are suspicious for that one turn, then next turn goes "OH BOY ALL THESE FREE CARDS. LET ME PLAY THEM ALL"
Post by: Annele on June 24, 2012, 07:02:04 am
If I nightmare ball lightning when the AI has an empty hand, and I have a bonewall, it discards one BL, then on the next turn plays the whole lot.Probably because it only thinks the nightmared cards are suspicious for that one turn, then next turn goes "OH BOY ALL THESE FREE CARDS. LET ME PLAY THEM ALL"
Does it do that for GotP as well? I'm too lazy to check.
Post by: Oshawd on June 25, 2012, 04:06:51 pm
Wasnt sure wether this fits in the bug reports or here, but after reading "READ THIS BEFORE REPORTING A BUG!", I think its better fitting here.
I created an Arena-Deck, with Fire Spirits, Lava Golems - a growth Deck. After a few hours i looked how it was doing. It did only lose -_-
Thats why i tested it... and I just discovered that the AI didnt bother to activate the growth abilities of spirits and golems, rendering this whole deck useless.
Is this the AI or a bug? Either way, please fix it ^^
Thanks in advance :)
Post by: Tirear on June 25, 2012, 05:23:47 pm
Hi guys,
Wasnt sure wether this fits in the bug reports or here, but after reading "READ THIS BEFORE REPORTING A BUG!", I think its better fitting here.
I created an Arena-Deck, with Fire Spirits, Lava Golems - a growth Deck. After a few hours i looked how it was doing. It did only lose -_-
Thats why i tested it... and I just discovered that the AI didnt bother to activate the growth abilities of spirits and golems, rendering this whole deck useless.
Is this the AI or a bug? Either way, please fix it ^^
Thanks in advance :)
I just gave the AI a deck of fire spirits and fire pillars in the trainer, and it used their ability on all 15 opportunities before the game ended. Are you sure the AI had enough quanta? The AI will spend all of its quanta on cards if it can, so you need to build your arena deck with enough quanta generation that it can use its abilities as well.
Post by: Oshawd on June 25, 2012, 07:02:17 pm
Quote
I just gave the AI a deck of fire spirits and fire pillars in the trainer, and it used their ability on all 15 opportunities before the game ended. Are you sure the AI had enough quanta? The AI will spend all of its quanta on cards if it can, so you need to build your arena deck with enough quanta generation that it can use its abilities as well.
I tested it again two times. There, the Fire Spirits did use the growth ability. But for some unkown reason, often quanta was left. For example:
AI had 2 Fire Spirits out and had 2 fire quanta. Only 1 Spirit used the growth ability, altough 2 fire quanta was there. I dont really understand why. ?_?
Post by: furballdn on June 25, 2012, 07:11:17 pm
Post by: Chapuz on June 26, 2012, 12:04:53 am
Post by: Annele on June 26, 2012, 12:11:07 am
AI had red and black nymph. I was playing with Instosis in silver, when AI casted Vampire (from the black nymph) to the red one! what, w00t?
I'm pretty sure the AI uses LS on the lowest HP enemy creature, and the highest HP friendly. Unless the Red had put rage on itself...
Post by: jacker on June 27, 2012, 08:37:36 am
Post by: Annele on June 27, 2012, 09:01:16 am
The AI uses shards of sacrifice and just after that puts any shield in :/
I've noticed this too.
Post by: Absol on June 27, 2012, 09:14:08 am
Question. How does AI use any shield (other than Bonewall and Skull Shield) after using SoSa? Where is that quanta from?The AI uses shards of sacrifice and just after that puts [purple]any[/purple] shield in :/
I've noticed this too.
Post by: Annele on June 27, 2012, 09:22:42 am
Question. How does AI use any shield (other than Bonewall and Skull Shield) after using SoSa? Where is that quanta from?The AI uses shards of sacrifice and just after that puts any shield in :/
I've noticed this too.
Might have been played just before. My memory fails me. :-[
Post by: eaglgenes101 on June 28, 2012, 02:06:00 am
The other way around. It plays a shield, then it plays SoSac.Question. How does AI use any shield (other than Bonewall and Skull Shield) after using SoSa? Where is that quanta from?The AI uses shards of sacrifice and just after that puts [purple]any[/purple] shield in :/
I've noticed this too.
Post by: eaglgenes101 on June 28, 2012, 02:44:44 am
Post by: burpcow on July 06, 2012, 11:17:16 pm
Post by: Annele on July 06, 2012, 11:34:25 pm
Post by: furballdn on July 08, 2012, 02:36:06 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on July 10, 2012, 01:03:21 pm
Post by: eaglgenes101 on July 11, 2012, 04:56:43 am
In fact, AI consistently lobos angels before RoL's.
Post by: ponnuki on July 12, 2012, 05:50:00 am
Post by: Laxadarap on July 13, 2012, 07:55:20 pm
Ok, so I was testing my plat deck and I noticed that it drew 2 cards, didn't play anything, then the next turn it played 3 quanta sources (can't quite remember what it was). This ofc bugged me, because it meant that the 2nd turn it only drew 1 card, instead of the 2.
Loaded up a precog/golden nymph deck to check what was happening, and on the 3rd game I got this:
(http://i.imgur.com/i78QM.jpg)
Exact same scenario as the first one.
In my opinion, this probably has to do with the fact that the ai has an decision making engine that takes into account "suspicious cards". A Xeno (I believe) explained it, it finds cards that were nightmared into its hand suspicious generally not playing them right away (you can see this if you play day traitors, ai won't won't immediately play RoL's). Maybe because its acquiring more than 1 copy of the same card, it won't play them right away.
Going back to look at it more, and the ai will play an upped tower and an unupped pillar.
Still looking at it, found it happen with a single pend, disproving my suspicion theory.
(http://i.imgur.com/xWnNR.jpg)
Next game I get this:
(http://i.imgur.com/899iw.jpg)
Basically, Ai drew pend and immortal, didn't play either (note that it had 8 aether quantum at the end of that turn, didn't play a silence either) then double drew with hourglass to get sow and tower, then ended it's turn, leaving a single card slot to mess up dexterity for next turn -.-. From the looks of it, this is quite common, kinda suprised I'm the first to mention it. For the record, the ai had not yet drawn with hourglass in the first two examples.
Post by: ponnuki on July 15, 2012, 10:03:26 pm
Post by: Annele on July 16, 2012, 05:18:57 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on July 21, 2012, 10:08:36 am
Once actually in play, Long Sword is strictly inferior to Vampire Dagger due to vampirism. Unfortunately, the AI didn't see it that way...
Post by: Wizy on July 24, 2012, 07:35:56 am
In one arena game the AI used a SoSa, then I generated a singularity and TUd it, at the end of the turn one of the singularities TUd itself. The healing was higher than the damage, yet the AI kept spamming SoSas and eventually died.
In a different game I had SoSa in my deck, the AI had several SoGs in play. It mindgated a SoSa, used it and got killed by its own SoGs.
Post by: Bloom on July 24, 2012, 08:29:55 am
(http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3097/31501695.png)
Not sure if its been posted but I don't want to read the entire topic, sorry.
Post by: russianspy1234 on July 26, 2012, 05:45:31 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on July 29, 2012, 03:41:07 pm
Post by: Rainbowninja on July 29, 2012, 06:22:06 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on July 30, 2012, 12:31:55 am
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/russianspy1234/patience.jpg)
Post by: Elite arbiter on July 30, 2012, 06:36:33 pm
I would suggest a check for if the creature is airborne first, even if we are to keep the idea of webbing anti-mattered creatures.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on August 01, 2012, 12:49:36 pm
Post by: Appawesome on August 04, 2012, 03:46:12 am
Post by: Annele on August 04, 2012, 08:30:43 am
Post by: eaglgenes101 on August 06, 2012, 03:54:47 am
(http://i.imgur.com/q5Mge.png)
First, the usual lobo priority glitch. (Look carefully for it.)
Second, AI should have fractaled pest in the early game.
Third, it fractaled RoL even when it had more than enough light quanta to supply archangels and pests.
Fourth, it fractaled something even when its field was full.
Post by: Belligerence on August 08, 2012, 05:48:30 pm
Surely if the AI can hold onto a Purify, even with 40+ poison on it, until I play SoSac, it can save Adrenaline for a creature with an attack above 0?
Post by: Belligerence on August 13, 2012, 03:09:49 am
Quite possibly not immediately clear. I was testing a new Arena deck (which is extremely fun to play against :D) when I noticed something: I was using SPlat, I had SoSac up, so quite naturally I was hoping the AI wouldn't draw a Purify. It did. It also didn't hesitate to play it. On the Golden Nymph which it had Raged earlier. What? At the time, playing it on me would have given it a definitive win. D:
This screenshot is a few turns after I noticed it, because for some reason my screenshot program didn't record it the first time I tried to take the picture. So imagine me with about 20 HP and SoSac up, and a few less Nymphs on the field.
Post by: Bloom on August 13, 2012, 01:44:48 pm
Quite possibly not immediately clear. I was testing a new Arena deck (which is extremely fun to play against :D) when I noticed something: I was using SPlat, I had SoSac up, so quite naturally I was hoping the AI wouldn't draw a Purify. It did. It also didn't hesitate to play it. On the Golden Nymph which it had Raged earlier. What? At the time, playing it on me would have given it a definitive win. D:
I've actually noticed this happen to me many times. AI will Purify a creature that can be healed by it, BEFORE using Purify on themselves to remove poison, or their opponent to remove Sacrifice Status. Hopefully this doesn't get patched though, can't tell you how many games I've won where a deck only drew 1 Purify and used it on a creature ;)
I've encountered some more fail AI logic. I'm sure it's well-known but I wasn't able to find it after doing a very brief search.
(http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8608/54098901.png)
Post by: eaglgenes101 on August 14, 2012, 07:21:10 pm
Quite possibly not immediately clear. I was testing a new Arena deck (which is extremely fun to play against :D) when I noticed something: I was using SPlat, I had SoSac up, so quite naturally I was hoping the AI wouldn't draw a Purify. It did. It also didn't hesitate to play it. On the Golden Nymph which it had Raged earlier. What? At the time, playing it on me would have given it a definitive win. D:
I've actually noticed this happen to me many times. AI will Purify a creature that can be healed by it, BEFORE using Purify on themselves to remove poison, or their opponent to remove Sacrifice Status. Hopefully this doesn't get patched though, can't tell you how many games I've won where a deck only drew 1 Purify and used it on a creature ;)
I've encountered some more fail AI logic. I'm sure it's well-known but I wasn't able to find it after doing a very brief search.
(http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8608/54098901.png)
I see that. It doesn't consider buff-multiplying abilities.
Post by: russianspy1234 on August 15, 2012, 04:50:46 am
not exactly the best use of armor.
Post by: furballdn on August 16, 2012, 02:13:59 am
Post by: eaglgenes101 on August 16, 2012, 02:58:13 am
I think there's something inherently wrong with Hermes stacking two heavy armors onto a brimstone eater.Yeah. He needs a bit more patience.
Post by: furballdn on August 24, 2012, 12:24:59 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on August 24, 2012, 12:25:58 am
EP prefers playing fractal'd phoenixes instead of reviving phoenixes.makes sense for future use of fractal. unfotunately, he frequently prefers fractaling ash over phoenix.
Post by: jumpingbeans on August 24, 2012, 04:25:02 pm
Post by: Annele on August 24, 2012, 11:02:13 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on August 30, 2012, 08:41:03 pm
Later (same game) I had a hope shield out and a bunch of RoLs, AI had a psion with mitosis and one without and played adrenaline on the one with mitosis (and thus no psion) but even if there was no shield, it makes more sense to play it on the non mito one so that the "value" is spread out on multiple creatures.
Post by: furballdn on August 31, 2012, 12:43:55 am
AI casts antimatter on my GotP then immediately casts mitosis on it.
Post by: thispersonisagenius on August 31, 2012, 01:09:14 am
I noticed that Otyughs don't eat Malignant Cells, even though they don't poison it (correct me if I'm wrong). Does the AI just think that Cells are "bad" creatures?
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 01, 2012, 11:57:38 pm
Post by: Rainbowninja on September 02, 2012, 12:47:44 am
Post by: Chapuz on September 02, 2012, 02:17:09 am
AI dives its pegasi even though I have Sundial in play and active.it even plays Sky Blitz in sundial turns.
Post by: Rainbowninja on September 02, 2012, 04:28:04 pm
Post by: Remidety on September 03, 2012, 03:08:48 pm
It chooses to use epinephrine on the creature with 0/3 and have no momentum in hand.
With a phase shield up, AI will use epine on a creature without momentum.
With a fire shield up, AI will play epine on a creature without momentum.
furballdn, it sounds like the AI is trolling you with the GOTP mitosis :D
Post by: Fortis on September 05, 2012, 11:08:15 pm
Post by: furballdn on September 07, 2012, 05:50:44 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 08, 2012, 02:20:10 am
Post by: Arwulf on September 08, 2012, 12:36:45 pm
*AI does not use Golden Hourglass even though it's early in the game and it has 11 :time . Also in other situations it sometimes doesn't draw a card even if it can (and would seem very advisable to do so); not sure on the details though.
Post by: Chapuz on September 08, 2012, 03:48:39 pm
*AI does not use Golden Hourglass even though it's early in the game and it has 11 :time . Also in other situations it sometimes doesn't draw a card even if it can (and would seem very advisable to do so); not sure on the details though.If AI had 5 cards or less, it's intended.
Post by: Laxadarap on September 08, 2012, 05:05:47 pm
Post by: Arwulf on September 08, 2012, 07:50:28 pm
Edit: It also had a catapult out. Perhaps that was it's gameplan. Still, it should have first used Nymph's ability on herself (petrification) and then Bas Blood. Also, it never executed the catapultation. It looks like AI is not that good at making choiced :-X
Post by: CuCN on September 09, 2012, 04:30:35 am
Post by: furballdn on September 09, 2012, 06:11:57 am
Post by: choongmyoung on September 09, 2012, 07:07:01 am
Using nightfall even though I played unbuffed deathstalkers. (AI3) - Had only ~2 dolls
Playing panda after summoning creatures. (AI3) - Of course, not the dolls
Using dead/alive skill before summoning vulture. (AI3)
Using liquid shadow on butterflied doll, even though there's another doll. (AI3)
Sacrificing retrovirus even though I played dolltal. (FG)
Playing grav pull to his own armagio. (AI3)
Playing grav pull to my armagio. (AI3)
Using the cards before hastening hourglasses (AI3)
Post by: Rainbowninja on September 09, 2012, 04:19:36 pm
Post by: Rainchild on September 10, 2012, 10:08:25 am
Post by: Arwulf on September 14, 2012, 05:08:41 pm
Edit:
Also, AI (Arena, Silver) plays Phase Shield then immediately steals my DimSh (2 left) while he has no creatures nor weapon. We are both around 90 HP.
Post by: furballdn on September 14, 2012, 11:20:44 pm
Post by: Gandora on September 15, 2012, 08:59:52 am
I had nothing on my field.
(This behavior highly influences the winrate of my arena deck xP)
Post by: Arwulf on September 16, 2012, 09:35:00 pm
Edit: Only when AI's lifetotal gets low (<50) does it kill them off. At this point AI has more than 25 :air in reserve.
Post by: furballdn on September 16, 2012, 09:37:52 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 18, 2012, 05:17:26 pm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/russianspy1234/ros/liquidshadowsac.jpg)
Post by: furballdn on September 19, 2012, 02:22:20 am
He has 3 readied eternities on the field. He constantly rewinds my RoLs. That's fine. What is not fine is that AI seems to ignore rustlers. Even with 75 time and 5 readied eternities the rustler simply will not be targetted.
I have two minor phoenix on the field. AI flies an eternity and then casts SoR on it. It then ends the turn.
Post by: Tirear on September 19, 2012, 03:45:48 am
Testing with flying SoR eternities. AI does some really stupid stuff.
He has 3 readied eternities on the field. He constantly rewinds my RoLs. That's fine. What is not fine is that AI seems to ignore rustlers. Even with 75 time and 5 readied eternities the rustler simply will not be targetted.
Testing in trainer the AI would always rewind rustlers/leaf dragons before RoLs (as expected, since photosynthesis is considered a powerful skill), even after a SoR. I can't figure out how you got these results unless you aren't following proper scientific procedures.
On an unrelated note, the AI is no more likely to target an adrenaline'd scorpion than a regular one. With vanilla creatures and many other skills the AI picks out the adrenaline'd creature perfectly, but it seems that the targeting boost for having adrenaline doesn't stack with the targeting boost for having venom (or other skills that are considering as powerful, like photosynthesis, but it is especially bad when it comes to venom/deadly venom/nuerotoxin because they synergize with adrenaline).
Post by: furballdn on September 19, 2012, 03:50:10 am
Testing with flying SoR eternities. AI does some really stupid stuff.
He has 3 readied eternities on the field. He constantly rewinds my RoLs. That's fine. What is not fine is that AI seems to ignore rustlers. Even with 75 time and 5 readied eternities the rustler simply will not be targetted.
Testing in trainer the AI would always rewind rustlers/leaf dragons before RoLs (as expected, since photosynthesis is considered a powerful skill), even after a SoR. I can't figure out how you got these results unless you aren't following proper scientific procedures.
Really? I've tried at least twice, and I haven't seen the AI rewind my rustlers/leaf dragons at all when testing against my own arena AI. It freely rewinds RoLs (Even RoLs without mitosis over RoLs with mitosis some times).
Post by: Tirear on September 19, 2012, 04:11:10 am
It sounds like you are playing hope in these tests, which makes light emitting creatures much higher priority and using it but not mentioning it in your reports is what I had in mind when I said "not following proper scientific procedures".
Really? I've tried at least twice, and I haven't seen the AI rewind my rustlers/leaf dragons at all when testing against my own arena AI. It freely rewinds RoLs (Even RoLs without mitosis over RoLs with mitosis some times).
Hope making RoL too high priority of a target is already reported here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30783.msg454071/topicseen.html#msg454071) and here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30783.msg392958/topicseen.html#msg392958) in this thread, but those cases are so extreme I think it must have been toned down since then, making it fair game for a report on its new (relatively speaking) state.
Post by: furballdn on September 19, 2012, 04:15:35 am
Ah. Hope. Good point. I remember I had hope up the first game, but am unsure about the second. I think you might have just solved the mystery of that.It sounds like you are playing hope in these tests, which makes light emitting creatures much higher priority and using it but not mentioning it in your reports is what I had in mind when I said "not following proper scientific procedures".
Really? I've tried at least twice, and I haven't seen the AI rewind my rustlers/leaf dragons at all when testing against my own arena AI. It freely rewinds RoLs (Even RoLs without mitosis over RoLs with mitosis some times).
Hope making RoL too high priority of a target is already reported here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30783.msg454071/topicseen.html#msg454071) and here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,30783.msg392958/topicseen.html#msg392958) in this thread, but those cases are so extreme I think it must have been toned down since then, making it fair game for a report on its new (relatively speaking) state.
AI is still a bit dumb when I had the two phoenixes out though.
Post by: choongmyoung on September 19, 2012, 08:52:12 am
Post by: jumpingbeans on September 19, 2012, 07:00:04 pm
Post by: choongmyoung on September 19, 2012, 10:25:27 pm
Playing Instosis against Paradox. He doesn't get many RoLs early, and I have the combo less a shard, so I play it, Chimaera'd it, and dealt him 182 damage. Paradox then decides to TU my Chimaera - not a great move (I had no shield), but manageable. He then TUs his Chimaera again. That was useless.Was that just before you dying? AI's use all possible cards if he ensures that he can win this turn.
Post by: jumpingbeans on September 19, 2012, 11:16:44 pm
Post by: furballdn on September 21, 2012, 05:41:56 am
Plays Pharaoh, plays SoR on Pharaoh, makes one scarab and then ends turn.
I have a ready pharaoh and 2 3|2 scarabs. AI rewinds both scarabs but doesn't touch my ready pharoah.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on September 22, 2012, 04:52:35 pm
Adrenaline on a 0/1 shard of focus when there's an 11/5 momentumed shrieker and I have an otyugh to devour said shard next turn? Probably not a good idea... :)
Post by: jumpingbeans on September 23, 2012, 12:47:32 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on September 25, 2012, 02:41:04 pm
Post by: furballdn on September 26, 2012, 05:36:03 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on September 29, 2012, 05:20:03 pm
Post by: furballdn on September 29, 2012, 06:36:44 pm
In another instance, I saw AI cast mutation on my antimattered creature, turning it into a powerful mutant dragon.
Post by: Belligerence on September 30, 2012, 12:59:19 am
Top left corner. Sundial. AI played a total of 1 SoSac the >entire< game, as well as a total of 2 Sundials. Why is it the 2 Sundials happened to coincide with the 2 turns that SoSac lasts for? Not that I'm complaining!
Post by: molson111 on October 01, 2012, 04:37:57 pm
Post by: Absol on October 01, 2012, 05:20:27 pm
Not sure if this has been noted before, but the AI just played 2 sky blitzes when he had no creatures in the field.2 Sky Blitz how? Blitz 4 SN Blitz? (then it have Sing, technically it's a creature)
Post by: molson111 on October 01, 2012, 06:32:40 pm
Not sure if this has been noted before, but the AI just played 2 sky blitzes when he had no creatures in the field.
Sorry - it was on two consecutive turns.
Post by: russianspy1234 on October 01, 2012, 06:47:31 pm
AI repeatedly flew eternities at me despite me having a ready lobotomizer on the field. it never played another eternity after flying the first one in the same turn, and only got to use reverse time once, when the final eternity was flown the same turn as the shard of focus.
Post by: sinyor on October 01, 2012, 06:53:09 pm
Post by: Tirear on October 01, 2012, 07:35:55 pm
Actually, I seem to recall that Sky blitz does its drain when it targets a creature. With no target-able airborne creatures, there is no quanta drain (base cost still applies).Not sure if this has been noted before, but the AI just played 2 sky blitzes when he had no creatures in the field.2 Sky Blitz how? Blitz 4 SN Blitz? (then it have Sing, technically it's a creature)
As for why the AI would do this, did it have a weapon or any poison counters on you? I don't think the AI knows where its damage is coming from, but if it has nothing at all then it really makes no sense.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 03, 2012, 10:24:10 pm
Post by: Kopiano on October 04, 2012, 10:18:18 am
I had AI Adrenaline an unubuffed Spark. It happened in an Arena game, and it was too quick to screenshot, but I did get the AI to do it again in Trainer.I supose that the adrenaline code searches only for the highest attack creature with adrenaline effect, without looking the HP and poison on the creature. Another thing to improve.(http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/2712/adrenaspark.png)I'll go out on a limb and say that this isn't exactly the most efficient use of Adrenaline.
Edit: I suppose with *only* Sparks out, this wouldn't be as bad (even though the Spark would die after the first attack anyway...), but the AI also had a Cockatrice and an Emerald Dragon, neither of which had Adrenaline.
Hi!
I have searched the topic and found the quoted post relating my issue: coming back to AI usage of adrenaline in a :life Arena deck...
In my deck I put unupped horned frogs to get adrenalized (Oracel card was luciferin, so i hoped to get tons of :light quanta to transform into :life ;D), but the AI uses adrenaline on the rustler (also unupped, with attack 1, no repetative skill in connection with adrenaline!) instead of the horned frog (upped or not, doesn't count).
Here is the Sceenshot, his last draw was placing the adrenalin (so all cratures were already played before):
(http://imageshack.us/a/img189/8872/sc1j.gif)
This way there is no chance for using adrenaline and luciferin on the same creature, which was the Decks strategy. Even without this, to adrenalize a rustler instead of a 3/3 creature is a bad choice of the AI.
Thanks, if u can fix this issue! ;)
Kopiano
Post by: meowww on October 06, 2012, 04:36:07 am
After AI fill its board with Phar then Scarab (Both uped), they start let Scarabs devouring their creatures, then call more Scarabs to further increase their total damage.
It got 3 Phar on the board, so three of the Scarabs start eating. (Till this point it is petty reasonable.)
Then weird things happens, one of the Scarab ate a Phar before it call another Scarab, so now there are an empty space.
(Not a good move since this point, but still more.)
And after that, every turn there are two Scarabs eating, and 2 Phar call 2 Scarabs, so the empty space is here forever.
There is some wild guess below:
As they start doing the "let the Scarabs eating my own creature", they don't change their plan before something make it count its creature again, such like it we kill some of their creature, maybe if some of them dies themself also counts.
1. They count how many Phar can call Scarabs
2. Eat that much
3. Call that much Scarabs
And look like Scarabs eat a Phar at 2. don't make AI count its creature again, so they don't eat one less to fill the space.
Post by: Tirear on October 06, 2012, 04:09:04 pm
There is some wild guess below:Actually, the scarabs simply trim the field to 20 creatures, which leaves enough space for most purposes while still keeping plenty of power around. That the AI initially had 3 pharaohs and could therefore fill the board back up exactly was a coincidence.
As they start doing the "let the Scarabs eating my own creature", they don't change their plan before something make it count its creature again, such like it we kill some of their creature, maybe if some of them dies themself also counts.
1. They count how many Phar can call Scarabs
2. Eat that much
3. Call that much Scarabs
And look like Scarabs eat a Phar at 2. don't make AI count its creature again, so they don't eat one less to fill the space.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on October 09, 2012, 04:44:20 am
Post by: TheAccuso on October 09, 2012, 09:00:29 am
Post by: Chapuz on October 09, 2012, 12:31:08 pm
A.I. played gravity pull on my doll but keeped the spark in its hand(i saw that by precog.), it's like that it doesen't want to damage a doll (wich have passive voodoo skill), but still gave me GP, makes no sense.AI casts GP on your creatures, that's good. AI will only play creatures/fractal/PU if it can kill the doll in that very turn.
Post by: TheAccuso on October 09, 2012, 01:31:33 pm
Ty for the clarification chapuz, STUPID A.I..A.I. played gravity pull on my doll but keeped the spark in its hand(i saw that by precog.), it's like that it doesen't want to damage a doll (wich have passive voodoo skill), but still gave me GP, makes no sense.AI casts GP on your creatures, that's good. AI will only play creatures/fractal/PU if it can kill the doll in that very turn.
Post by: Belligerence on October 12, 2012, 01:22:55 am
Not shown: my dead Damselfly. Why? 'Cuz it's, uhh... dead?
Anyway, AI killed my 3rd Damselfly. Which didn't have Adrenaline, but my first Damselfly had Adrenaline during the AI's turn. This is, quite honestly, the first and only time I've seen the AI target a non-adrenalined creature over an Adrenalined version of the same creature. What gives?
I was so surprised by this that I didn't get a chance to get a screenshot of the AI in the act of killing my innocent, unbuffed Damsel :(
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 13, 2012, 02:02:33 am
Post by: kimham8a on October 13, 2012, 02:03:41 am
AI plays Photon. Then Cremation. Then Lava Golem. Then Soul Catcher. Then another Soul Catcher. And lastly, a Photon. Wut?
Why not?
Post by: Elbirn on October 13, 2012, 02:12:47 am
I think the way the AI works is that it just goes through it's hand, looks at every card, if it can play that card it does, if it doesn't, it skips it. More or less. Hence why it does that.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 13, 2012, 01:54:50 pm
Post by: Chapuz on October 13, 2012, 02:05:55 pm
AI has two Minor Phoenixes, one Lobo'd and one not. AI cremates lobo'd Phoenix.what's the wrong thing about that?
Post by: Cheesy111 on October 13, 2012, 02:06:32 pm
AI has two Minor Phoenixes, one Lobo'd and one not. AI cremates lobo'd Phoenix.what's the wrong thing about that?
Cremating a normal Minor Pheonix leaves Ash. Cremating a Lobo'd Minor Pheonix kills it.
Post by: Chapuz on October 13, 2012, 04:27:04 pm
Lol I read wrong xDAI has two Minor Phoenixes, one Lobo'd and one not. AI cremates lobo'd Phoenix.what's the wrong thing about that?
Cremating a normal Minor Pheonix leaves Ash. Cremating a Lobo'd Minor Pheonix kills it.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 13, 2012, 06:59:14 pm
Post by: Arwulf on October 13, 2012, 10:44:47 pm
after I had just played
Edit: there were no death effect bonus, nor was the AI's hand full or any other reason to play this card.
Post by: Elbirn on October 14, 2012, 04:18:08 am
Post by: furballdn on October 14, 2012, 04:19:32 am
Were there any cards in play that would benefit from a death effect? Vulture, bonewall, graveyard?AI doesn't consider that. It's just stupid, even diving when a sundial is up.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 14, 2012, 12:28:44 pm
Yeah. It also dives when I have Wings up but have already Webbed the Wyrm/Pegasus.Were there any cards in play that would benefit from a death effect? Vulture, bonewall, graveyard?AI doesn't consider that. It's just stupid, even diving when a sundial is up.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 14, 2012, 02:29:07 pm
Post by: kimham8a on October 15, 2012, 01:57:01 am
2. I have 5 hp left, and ai has 20 water quanta and 3 ice lances. Ai lances its two singulairities instead of me, letting me draw miracle and later in the game win.
Post by: russianspy1234 on October 15, 2012, 04:49:48 pm
Post by: Belligerence on October 17, 2012, 10:54:44 pm
AI fractals Wardens over... well, a bunch of different, decent attackers.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 17, 2012, 11:48:01 pm
Later on, the AI has a bunch of RoLs and Deja Vus, including one Deja Vu which has yet to have been split. It casts Luciferin, and then it splits the Deja Vu.
Post by: russianspy1234 on October 18, 2012, 12:57:39 am
(http://i.imgur.com/8ca4o.jpg)
Post by: mycale on October 18, 2012, 02:34:24 am
AI casts purify on a singularity (that I control) randomly.
Post by: Bloom on October 18, 2012, 02:36:13 am
played grav pull on my 0|1 SoFo when it had no creatures and didnt play any.
(http://i.imgur.com/8ca4o.jpg)
Maybe it didn't have any?
Post by: russianspy1234 on October 18, 2012, 06:06:33 am
it shouldnt have played the gravity pull, which allowed me to pump my sofo twice, and use it as a shield and repeated destruction for a while once it finally dd play a couple creaturesplayed grav pull on my 0|1 SoFo when it had no creatures and didnt play any.(http://i.imgur.com/8ca4o.jpg)
Maybe it didn't have any?
Post by: Laxadarap on October 18, 2012, 12:47:29 pm
The AI has several creatures in play, including a 14|14 RoL and some 1|1 RoLs and some [split] Deja Vus. The 14|14 RoL has been webbed, and I have a Wings up. The AI plays Blessing on the 14|14 webbed RoL
Later on, the AI has a bunch of RoLs and Deja Vus, including one Deja Vu which has yet to have been split. It casts Luciferin, and then it splits the Deja Vu.
Thinking that was my deck. Plat right? Why'd you thumbs it down >:(
Post by: PlayerOa on October 18, 2012, 06:35:27 pm
I have SoSa up in play.
Opponent has 10 poison counters.
AI ragepotted his Light Dragon.
AI plays purify. On the Dragon.
Post by: furballdn on October 19, 2012, 03:34:36 am
Post by: Chapuz on October 19, 2012, 03:41:15 am
AI has flying titan. Casts accelerate on it. Next turn casts overdrive then accelerate on it. Two turns later it casts overdrive and accelerate on it. Another turn later it casts overdrive and accelerate on the same titan, then flies two more titans. What the heck AI.In Elements 1.33, Acceleration will be cumulative. It's a sign.
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 19, 2012, 10:34:00 am
I don't think it was yours...pretty sure it was Gold...and pretty sure I thumbsed it up.The AI has several creatures in play, including a 14|14 RoL and some 1|1 RoLs and some [split] Deja Vus. The 14|14 RoL has been webbed, and I have a Wings up. The AI plays Blessing on the 14|14 webbed RoL
Later on, the AI has a bunch of RoLs and Deja Vus, including one Deja Vu which has yet to have been split. It casts Luciferin, and then it splits the Deja Vu.
Thinking that was my deck. Plat right? Why'd you thumbs it down >:(
Post by: Belligerence on October 19, 2012, 01:30:54 pm
Notice the SoFo? Notice how it's at 0|16? That's because it destroyed a tower. Yes, a tower, when there was a perfectly good Arsenic right there. What? Also note that I have another tower in my hand, which I happily play that turn, so that next turn:
(http://puu.sh/1gpBq)
The SoFo can eat that tower too. Instead of my Arsenic AGAIN. Notice how I'm at 2 towers this turn, which sets up the AI for another brilliant move:
(http://puu.sh/1gpBS)
That's right, AI decided to use all 3 uses of SoFo to eat my towers. Instead of a much more threatening Arsenic.
What gives? Every time I see a SoFo, I end up wishing it would eat my towers instead of my Arsenic. Then I make an Arena deck, and it DOES eat my towers instead of my Arsenic :|
Post by: jacker on October 19, 2012, 07:13:57 pm
Post by: jumpingbeans on October 20, 2012, 01:57:52 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/GqoQL.png)
Post by: rickerd on October 20, 2012, 02:06:31 pm
Post by: Gandora on October 22, 2012, 07:22:28 pm
If it does so, no more quanta can be produced for other abilities.
Post by: furballdn on October 23, 2012, 12:18:40 am
I played 2 BB on the AI's two physalia while he had a SoP out. He destroys the SoP instead of keeping it and ending up with 24 extra damage.
I have 3 phoenixes on the field. AI casts plague 3 times.
Post by: TheAccuso on October 23, 2012, 12:47:36 am
Idiocies of the AI today:The AI is sadistic.
I played 2 BB on the AI's two physalia while he had a SoP out. He destroys the SoP instead of keeping it and ending up with 24 extra damage.
I have 3 phoenixes on the field. AI casts plague 3 times.
The AI thought die, die, die!
Post by: Elbirn on October 23, 2012, 01:42:58 am
The AI really needs to start making Water Nymphs/Nymph Queens when given the chance(http://i.imgur.com/GqoQL.png)
The AI won't play a card if it'll decrease a quanta pool to 0. It always wants to have at least 1 quanta. In my observations, at least.
I'd refine the improvement idea into being "Dude. Zanz. Make your AI stop frickin doing that, it's dumb."
Post by: furballdn on October 23, 2012, 01:56:56 am
Post by: Tirear on October 23, 2012, 01:58:02 pm
iirc, AI is just more likely to play cards or activate abilities the more quanta it has. The AI would be more likely to play a lightning if it had 5 :aether as opposed to 2 :aether.Actually, it is only activated abilities that do this not cards (except for bolts). Thus, it tries to save its quanta for physical cards, which often have more effect/quanta then abilities. If it is generating quanta faster than it needs for cards in hand, it will end up with more quanta left over, increasing the odds of activating abilities.
And looking at the screenshot in question, the cards are at the bottom of the screen, indicating that they actually were played. I think jumpingbeans was complaining that it created a life nymph with the tears (for the third time in a row?), where a human would have created a water nymph since they could then use it to create all the life nymphs they want.
Post by: TheAccuso on October 26, 2012, 06:33:48 pm
Post by: eaglgenes101 on October 27, 2012, 05:35:12 am
Post by: Belligerence on October 27, 2012, 07:42:54 pm
(Note that in all my examples, I'm talking about the AI not using it's ability twice on the same turn it used SoR. I know that SoR doesn't grant a double use next turn/turn after/etc)
Post by: dragonsdemesne on October 28, 2012, 08:58:23 am
Post by: Chapuz on October 28, 2012, 05:31:48 pm
AI has a 10/10 elite shrieker (heavy armour) and a 0/3 iridium warden. It played adrenaline on the warden, then burrows the shrieker :p Targeting a 0 attack creature with adrenaline is fairly silly, unless it's a pest/devourer.or a firefly or any creature with bioluminisence, or a gnome. But yeah, that can be improved
Post by: TheAccuso on October 30, 2012, 12:31:19 am
Post by: Belligerence on October 30, 2012, 11:48:12 pm
Happened too fast for me to get a screenie right away, but here's the turn after. Last turn, I had SoSac up, 1 turn left. Using Hourglasses, the AI managed to draw not one, but TWO Purifies. It had 13 poison on itself at the time. It chose to use BOTH Purifies on itself, instead of 1 on me/1 on itself.
Post by: TheAccuso on October 30, 2012, 11:53:15 pm
What da hell of a crazy arena deck have you done there! ;D(http://puu.sh/1kFw6)
Happened too fast for me to get a screenie right away, but here's the turn after. Last turn, I had SoSac up, 1 turn left. Using Hourglasses, the AI managed to draw not one, but TWO Purifies. It had 13 poison on itself at the time. It chose to use BOTH Purifies on itself, instead of 1 on me/1 on itself.
Post by: Laxadarap on October 31, 2012, 02:02:22 am
(http://puu.sh/1kFw6)
Happened too fast for me to get a screenie right away, but here's the turn after. Last turn, I had SoSac up, 1 turn left. Using Hourglasses, the AI managed to draw not one, but TWO Purifies. It had 13 poison on itself at the time. It chose to use BOTH Purifies on itself, instead of 1 on me/1 on itself.
Your grouchyoldfart right? If so, played your deck twice in a row (2nd/3rd games it had). Won first one, lost second.
Post by: Belligerence on October 31, 2012, 02:41:30 am
Your grouchyoldfart right? If so, played your deck twice in a row (2nd/3rd games it had). Won first one, lost second.(http://puu.sh/1kFw6)
Happened too fast for me to get a screenie right away, but here's the turn after. Last turn, I had SoSac up, 1 turn left. Using Hourglasses, the AI managed to draw not one, but TWO Purifies. It had 13 poison on itself at the time. It chose to use BOTH Purifies on itself, instead of 1 on me/1 on itself.
Incorrect, I'm The Last One. Deck is currently 5-0, so you haven't given me a loss... yet.
Post by: Laxadarap on October 31, 2012, 05:03:47 am
Post by: TheAccuso on November 02, 2012, 08:54:55 pm
Post by: Aphrael on November 02, 2012, 09:35:32 pm
Post by: TheAccuso on November 14, 2012, 01:59:21 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on November 14, 2012, 02:20:07 am
AI usead holy light on itself to recover 9 hp with a max hp at 148 instead of killing my only obsidian dragon on the field.
The reason why is because it one time it used Holy Light on its OWN Black Dragon and subsequently killed it. AI does not make that distinction.
Post by: TheAccuso on November 14, 2012, 02:23:49 am
AI should be able to make the distinction between its creatures and attacking ones and AI should be able to play holy light properly, that's why i post in AI improvements...AI usead holy light on itself to recover 9 hp with a max hp at 148 instead of killing my only obsidian dragon on the field.
The reason why is because it one time it used Holy Light on its OWN Black Dragon and subsequently killed it. AI does not make that distinction.
Post by: kimham8a on November 14, 2012, 04:01:25 am
AI played SoR on a paraoah and spammed just 1 scarab during that turn.Yeah, I got that too...
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on November 20, 2012, 04:54:05 pm
Post by: kimham8a on November 21, 2012, 04:14:15 am
Post by: TheAccuso on November 21, 2012, 04:22:24 am
ai doesnt notice impending doom from his sow'd creatures hitting reflective shield and doesnt play miracleShhhhhhhhhhhhhh, don't tell anyone, it is my secret to blast some FG'S.
Post by: andretimpa on November 21, 2012, 01:19:04 pm
Seems to happen every time it has an opportunity.
Post by: Finale on November 22, 2012, 01:20:39 pm
Post by: fsk on November 24, 2012, 04:02:01 am
When the AI has double-draw and multiple eternities in play (flying weapon or crusader), the AI should be able to prevent self-deckout.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on November 26, 2012, 05:56:36 am
(http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/3355/esop.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/84/esop.jpg/)
If your answer was 'should've started attacking with its creature a long time ago', you win an e-cookie.
Post by: andretimpa on November 27, 2012, 02:03:34 am
AI plays Anubis, uses Shard of Readiness in it. It then uses mitosis in it. To make things worse, it proceeds to use another shard of readiness.
It was too fast, but I was using this deck:
(Note that the deck idea is to play Anubis, then mitosis, readiness and then readiness in one of the created copies)
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on November 28, 2012, 01:57:27 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on November 29, 2012, 01:49:32 pm
Post by: TheAccuso on December 04, 2012, 09:47:36 pm
Post by: kimham8a on December 06, 2012, 05:04:54 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on December 12, 2012, 02:06:52 am
Post by: willng3 on December 12, 2012, 03:00:13 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on December 12, 2012, 08:42:29 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/vLDq1.jpg)
Post by: kimham8a on December 14, 2012, 03:26:13 am
Sadly, I still decked out 7 turns later (was using SPlat) :'(
Post by: guillotinement on December 14, 2012, 08:26:51 pm
....hope that somehow helps....
Post by: guillotinement on December 21, 2012, 05:01:02 am
id post a screen shot but haven't figured that out yet...pretty self explanatory though
Post by: shadow303 on December 28, 2012, 11:58:26 am
- AI plays a Seraph
- I hit the Seraph with antimatter
- AI activates the "divine shield" to set the Seraph invulnerable
That doesn't make too much sense to me, maybe it's something to improve on the AI.
Post by: andretimpa on December 28, 2012, 11:56:48 pm
Post by: Chapuz on December 30, 2012, 03:06:33 am
Post by: shadow303 on January 04, 2013, 10:11:57 pm
- AI plays with a Entrophy/Aether duo deck
- AI has a Dissipation Shield up, 12 Entrophy pillars and 75 Entrophy quantum
- AI plays a Dimentional Shield over his Dissipation Shield
.. so I broke through after 3 turns, which would never been possible with the Dissipation Shield up.
He played several Purple Dragons in the last turns, so maybe it was useful to be able to spend the Entrophy quanta, but I still felt it to be somehow a bad AI decision to mention here.
Post by: Cardplayer on January 04, 2013, 11:11:42 pm
Post by: Odii Odsen on January 05, 2013, 05:27:21 am
Post by: Avenger on January 09, 2013, 10:04:05 pm
2. AI opponent casts a protect artifact on it.
...
4. profit!
This happened at least in two games (against random halfbloods).
Post by: TheAccuso on January 09, 2013, 10:13:09 pm
Post by: AvusXIV on January 16, 2013, 12:16:10 pm
AI prefers Hourglasses over Dim Shields. But why in such a situation?
(http://i.imgur.com/Ds1G3.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/zxZla.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/zxZla.jpg)
I know, the AI doesn't *want* to win when possible...
Post by: Skotadi Phobos on January 18, 2013, 06:37:17 am
Post by: shileka on January 18, 2013, 01:48:22 pm
Post by: Chapuz on January 30, 2013, 01:40:47 pm
Post by: andretimpa on February 01, 2013, 12:15:19 pm
Post by: Zarathustra1883 on February 01, 2013, 04:20:54 pm
In addition to andretimpa the AI tries to keep damage output as low as possible when you play SoSac, only Catapult/Trebuchet he fires right away like there is no tomorrow. ?_?
Post by: ElementalDearWatson on February 02, 2013, 08:22:51 pm
Secondly, the AI will waste Shards of Bravery when the player has a Sanctuary out.
Finally, the AI won't use a Cremation on a Phoenix, even though it's often a sensible move.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on February 17, 2013, 07:38:33 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on February 21, 2013, 04:35:44 pm
Post by: russianspy1234 on February 24, 2013, 08:11:13 pm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/russianspy1234/nightmarenymph.png)
Post by: kimham8a on February 25, 2013, 01:03:14 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on March 05, 2013, 05:22:02 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on March 05, 2013, 05:32:57 am
Post by: russianspy1234 on March 05, 2013, 05:35:42 am
AI loves growing creatures while SoSa is up.
thats actually valid in a lot of cases, like if you know they are going to end up at full health anyway.
Post by: AvusXIV on March 06, 2013, 09:30:40 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/BrJEwii.jpg)
The AI could have endured for one more turn - at least. But instead of using the Nymph's heal ability three times for the cost of 9 :light, it plays one more Nymph for the same amount of :light quanta. The AI's damage did obviously not suffice to kill me with the extra creature but I could defeat it by just hitting the space button.
This is of course not the first time I experience that. While testing this arena deck several times I realised that the AI prefers to wait for having enough quanta to play all of the creatures in it's hand - at (afair) all costs...
Post by: jacker on March 16, 2013, 09:08:44 am
Ai didn't removed a stolen SoPa when his creatures could do lethal damage and instead lost of deckout
Post by: dragonsdemesne on March 16, 2013, 11:29:31 pm
Post by: andretimpa on March 17, 2013, 12:44:34 am
Post by: Pella on March 17, 2013, 02:41:40 am
Edit: I also *FREQUENTLY* see the AI putting Adrenaline on a 1atk creature while I have a 1-shield up. If a creature has a skill, like Gnome Finder, I can understand. That's usually not the case, though, when I see this happen. It's just a 1atk niblet that's getting zero through the shield. The AI puts Adrenaline it, and then it gets zero through the shield, four times per turn. Seems to me those 4 :life would be used better elsewhere.
Post by: Narukta on March 17, 2013, 09:13:30 am
Post by: Pella on March 18, 2013, 08:22:07 pm
Post by: blarp on March 19, 2013, 04:03:42 am
Post by: Pella on March 20, 2013, 12:42:24 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on March 20, 2013, 01:37:31 am
AI4 played a normal Skeleton while I had a 1-shield in place. The Skeleton just sat there until the end of the duel. AI had no :time, so the Skeleton could not have been waiting for RT.
Is that necessarily an AI fault? How much room was on the board? If it was the only creature I had, I would say "let's do this!" and just use my skelly.
Also: AI pulls out Armagio. Next turn: Armagio uses Gravity Pull and then Catapults it. Waste of 1 :gravity :F
Post by: Pella on March 20, 2013, 01:50:14 am
Only one other creature on the board before playing Skeleton.AI4 played a normal Skeleton while I had a 1-shield in place. The Skeleton just sat there until the end of the duel. AI had no :time, so the Skeleton could not have been waiting for RT.
Is that necessarily an AI fault? How much room was on the board? If it was the only creature I had, I would say "let's do this!" and just use my skelly.
Also: AI pulls out Armagio. Next turn: Armagio uses Gravity Pull and then Catapults it. Waste of 1 :gravity :F
I'm curious. How would you "use" a 1-atk creature while your opponent has a 1-shield in place? You're obviously not using the Skeleton to deal damage, so what benefit does it give you?
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on March 20, 2013, 02:12:17 am
Only one other creature on the board before playing Skeleton.AI4 played a normal Skeleton while I had a 1-shield in place. The Skeleton just sat there until the end of the duel. AI had no :time, so the Skeleton could not have been waiting for RT.
Is that necessarily an AI fault? How much room was on the board? If it was the only creature I had, I would say "let's do this!" and just use my skelly.
Also: AI pulls out Armagio. Next turn: Armagio uses Gravity Pull and then Catapults it. Waste of 1 :gravity :F
I'm curious. How would you "use" a 1-atk creature while your opponent has a 1-shield in place? You're obviously not using the Skeleton to deal damage, so what benefit does it give you?
It depends on the deck. Did he have :life quanta? (Bonds) Did he have :fire or :darkness quanta? (bye-bye shield) Did he have :entropy quanta? (Pandas or Chaos can make a RT) Did he have :gravity quanta? (Momentum, though it would be a stretch, maybe even Catapult) Did he have :water quanta? (Dry Spell usage) Did he have Luciferins to fuel Hope? Did he have :aether quanta? (Bonebolt if you are desperate)?
If none of these apply, then you have absolutely no benefit. If you do have one of these, then why not. Also, if I know I don't have enough creatures to fill the board, I would pull out a Skeleton just for fun.
Post by: Pella on March 20, 2013, 02:24:32 am
As for me, I withhold all creatures that cannot be effective at the moment they are played. It makes them susceptible to CC while I'm waiting for them to become effective, meaning I potentially receive absolutely no benefit from the quanta spent to play them. IMO, yes, that is a fault by the AI.
Post by: Drake_XIV on March 20, 2013, 03:35:49 am
Post by: whatifidogetcaught? on March 20, 2013, 03:43:04 am
It's more of the AI didn't see a reason to NOT play the Skeleton. Sure there is a shield, but if not played, it would take up room in his hand.
Also, if he didn't have any of those quantum, why WOULDN'T you want the Skeleton to get hit with CC?
Post by: AvusXIV on March 20, 2013, 04:19:10 am
AI4 played a normal Skeleton while I had a 1-shield in place. The Skeleton just sat there until the end of the duel. AI had no :time, so the Skeleton could not have been waiting for RT.
I read the little discussion that followed your post.
In my point of view, the answer is simple: Did this cause any disadvantage to the AI or even made it lose? No. So there is no need to turn the AI into one with human capacities in order to eliminate the flaw you observed ;D
Post by: moehrpi on March 22, 2013, 11:42:42 am
Post by: Pella on March 26, 2013, 01:58:18 am
Edit: In the same duel, AI played Overdrive on its own flying upgraded Titan, then played Acceleration on the Titan the following turn.
Post by: Narukta on March 26, 2013, 09:47:20 am
Post by: destruct on March 26, 2013, 08:37:44 pm
Also AI won't burrow shriekers even when they have earth quanta and I have owls eye or parasite or something like that.
Post by: CuCN on March 26, 2013, 09:00:54 pm
The AI does burrow shriekers, assuming it has the quanta after playing other cards, if you have played CC.
Post by: destruct on March 26, 2013, 10:09:27 pm
Also, I have the shield that blocks creatures with health >5 up, and then the AI will bless his giant frog/blue crawler or something with 3-4 health, making it blocked by my shield.
Post by: Drake_XIV on March 27, 2013, 05:41:56 am
Post by: Pella on March 27, 2013, 05:57:42 pm
Edit: AI hit my Ivory Dragon with a Fire Bolt, followed immediately by a Rage Potion. Obviously, the Rage Potion would have done the job, so why waste the Fire Bolt?
Post by: andretimpa on March 28, 2013, 12:36:50 pm
It doesn't unburrow when it expires, even if you don't play CC -> dumb move
Post by: Fippe94 on March 28, 2013, 05:45:08 pm
Post by: Pella on March 30, 2013, 07:34:24 am
Post by: destruct on March 30, 2013, 03:47:03 pm
Post by: andretimpa on March 30, 2013, 08:00:54 pm
Not an error, but definitely funny. I'm at 3HP. AI has ~10 airborne creatures on the field + 2 or 3 SoFr. Which card does he pull out to make sure he can finish me off? Sky Blitz. :P
There is no kill like overkill.
Post by: Narukta on March 30, 2013, 08:12:07 pm
Not an error, but definitely funny. I'm at 3HP. AI has ~10 airborne creatures on the field + 2 or 3 SoFr. Which card does he pull out to make sure he can finish me off? Sky Blitz. :P
There is no kill like overkill.
LOL
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 06, 2013, 03:28:04 am
Post by: Narukta on April 06, 2013, 05:32:46 am
Plays voodoo doll, BE, LS, BE again
Post by: blarp on April 06, 2013, 07:02:13 am
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 06, 2013, 11:37:08 pm
Post by: CuCN on April 07, 2013, 02:36:59 am
AI just played Shard of Bravery when I had Sanctuary out.Not always bad. It clears some hand space (e.g. so that it can draw 2 cards on its next draw phase)
Post by: Heric the Dark Lord on April 07, 2013, 05:30:35 pm
Two cases:
AI plays Fog, than Gravity, wait a turn, plays fog.
AI has Fire Buckler out, than plays Fire Shield.
Also, One that may be more clever than fail...
Incarnate had two Retrovirii, and I had no creatures. He uses one of their effects.
Not sure if that's a fail, or if he did that just to power the death effects of his. Probably the latter.
Post by: destruct on April 08, 2013, 04:21:48 am
Post by: CuCN on April 08, 2013, 09:50:29 pm
Post by: dragonsdemesne on April 08, 2013, 11:28:50 pm
AI just played Shard of Bravery when I had Sanctuary out.Not always bad. It clears some hand space (e.g. so that it can draw 2 cards on its next draw phase)
This is true, and in fact for the deck it was in (testing my fractal damselfly arena deck with no other fire cards to use that quanta) it was actually smart, but the vast majority of the time it is stupid :p
Post by: AvusXIV on April 09, 2013, 01:05:22 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/9fzV5E1.jpg)
The deck does not contain any cards to produce Aether/Earth Quanta. Yet the AI SoRs Squids first, even though various ability-cost-cards are on the field; and especially even though the AI got just one non-SoRed Squid left out of 4 Squids and 50 :water...
Even more awesome:
(http://i.imgur.com/vSxXbJI.jpg)
Why the hell should I not play SoP but just Purify my SoSac'ed opponent and win? Because the fearless Fire Spectre deserves healing :) Thnx AI.
Post by: Narukta on April 16, 2013, 08:14:01 am
Post by: TribalTrouble on April 17, 2013, 06:36:05 am
edit:
Same thing happens with Graviton Fire Eater, Deja Vu, Forest Spirit and....
Plays Psion and Adrenalines it with Reflect Shield up...
Post by: Pella on April 25, 2013, 04:34:49 pm
AI played Blessing on the existing Deathstalker, then played a new Deathstalker, which remained at attack = 0.
Edit: AI had two Deathstalkers on the field, one buffed, one not. Buffed the already-buffed one instead of the one with 0 attack. Buff the unbuffed one = same amount of damage +1 poison.
Post by: Foraker on April 25, 2013, 04:49:00 pm
Even with a full field of water creatures and SoP out.
Post by: Pella on April 27, 2013, 10:31:08 am
Post by: CuCN on April 28, 2013, 10:44:20 pm
Post by: Gandora on May 01, 2013, 10:32:26 am
As up to now, the AI discards always the card on the bottom (from its perspective).
But in regards of Nightmare a different choice could be made.
1. If the AI doesn't have/produce quanta of the creature's type, discard one of those instead.
2. If the possibility exists to play the received creature... well, play them. If the quanta is not yet avaiable discard one of those as you probably have more than one copy of it (since most players rarely use Nightmare when the AI has only one free card spot).
Post by: Tirear on May 01, 2013, 12:56:10 pm
I think an improvement that should be simple to implement is the discarding choice.Actually, the AI already discards expensive cards and avoids nightmared cards. See here (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32442.msg417132.html#msg417132) for details.
As up to now, the AI discards always the card on the bottom (from its perspective).
But in regards of Nightmare a different choice could be made.
Considering expense in terms of its current quanta pools, like how fractal/nightmare are currently handled, does sound like a good way to improve that though.
Playing instead of discarding is more questionable, as there are very few reasons the AI won't play a creature when it has the quanta to do so (unlike spells, which it will save for a better opportunity). So if that situation occurs, it probably has a good reason not to play the card. If there is a problem in how it decides what not to play, it might be better to tackle that in the original decision rather then forcing it after the fact.
Post by: traceurling on May 19, 2013, 10:28:58 pm
Post by: Pella on May 20, 2013, 07:57:19 pm
AI = Fire/Darkness
AI played Nightfall.
I had several creatures on the field, and they all got buffed. AI had 0 Darkness creatures on the field. At the end of its turn, it had only 1 card in its hand, so it didn't play the Nightfall to unclog itself. It makes no sense to play a card that helps your opponent and doesn't help you.
For the record, the AI did play some Darkness critters later. Couldn't it have held the Nightfall until then, so it didn't hurt itself?
EDITED TO ADD: AI played Quint on a Ball Lightning. Quinted Ball Lightning died at end of same turn.
EDITED TO ADD: While using a Ghostmare deck, AI played a GotP, then immediately played Nightmare on my Forest Spectre. As if that weren't bad enough all by itself, I had more than enough quanta on hand to play one of the Forest Spectres on my next turn.
EDITED TO ADD: AI played Quint on an unbuffed Dune Scorpion.
EDITED TO ADD: AI played Liquid Shadow on its own unbuffed Devourer. The vampire ability returned absolutely nothing to the AI's HP, and the Devourer died in two turns. How can that possibly be considered worth doing?
And why am I the only one updating this thread now?
EDITED TO ADD: AI played Dragonfly and immediately detonated Unstable Gas.
EDITED TO ADD: AI had four Gravy Nymphs in play. I had 3 Aether quanta. AI activated Black Hole four times. The first one made sense; the last three denied me nothing and healed the AI for nothing. The only thing the AI accomplished with the last three was denying 9 :gravity to itself.
EDITED TO ADD: #1: AI played Gravity Force on an Armagio that came into play on a previous turn. #2: AI immediately Catapulted the same Armagio at me.
No one other than me has updated this thread in almost a month. Am I the only player to whom the AI is doing stupid shyte now, or does no one else care anymore?
Post by: dragonsdemesne on June 29, 2013, 02:29:31 am
Post by: Pella on June 29, 2013, 05:09:39 am
Post by: Rutarete on June 29, 2013, 05:31:22 am
Hooray! Someone besides me posted in here. That took only 40 days. :/... It's not like it's a daily thread or anything... no one has to post here
Post by: Pella on June 29, 2013, 05:35:35 am
Post by: dawn to dusk on June 29, 2013, 05:41:38 am
Post by: Pella on June 29, 2013, 06:07:58 am
didnt know this was here lol. anyway, ai stole my vamp stilleto even though it had a vamp dagger in playActually, that's not an error. Even though the AI got a weapon that was less powerful than the one it had, the point of Steal in that case would be to prevent you from using the Stilleto.
Post by: Zergva on July 06, 2013, 11:48:20 pm
Post by: Tirear on July 09, 2013, 02:47:06 pm
The AI shouldn't discard GoTP at the end of the turn, if there are other card in his hands. It chooses randomly (as I checked in the trainer).Actually, it runs a semi-intelligent check (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php/topic,32442.msg417132.html#msg417132) that will never choose GotP to try and find a card to discard. The problem is that it is not guaranteed to pick a card, and cannot be - what would happen with a hand of all GotP? So if that check fails to pick a card then it just grabs a random card. It could run the check 5 times before resorting to complete randomness, but sometimes it is better to eat the damage in order to save some useful cards.
Post by: mafidufa on July 11, 2013, 10:26:22 pm
I play Mirror Shield 8)
AI fractals his Psion and proceeds to play another 10 of them ::)
Post by: Theboss1248 on July 12, 2013, 04:42:25 am
Post by: andretimpa on July 13, 2013, 01:36:17 pm
Post by: Pella on July 20, 2013, 11:21:57 am
AI was playing Devtal. When the AI used Fractal, it targeted a Devourer on my side of the field. Like, what, the Devourers you put in the deck for that specific purpose suddenly aren't good enough, just because I have one? Is mine shinier, or something? :P
Post by: Zergva on July 22, 2013, 02:11:12 pm
Post by: CuCN on July 22, 2013, 02:27:30 pm
Post by: ColorlessGreen on July 22, 2013, 03:06:34 pm
Post by: Zergva on July 22, 2013, 03:37:37 pm
Weird, since my experience with gravity nymphs is that the AI uses them every single turn, even when I have no quanta at all. Did you have a sanctuary protecting your quanta?
I don't really remember :/ I think not, but next time I'll make a screen shot.
Post by: Zergva on July 26, 2013, 02:49:03 pm
1, Why does AI plays spark against Sundial (and I think it's right against Dim. shield too).
2, Why does AI plays spark in the first turn? I know it's not a bug or a fault, but it would be more useful if AI wait till the 2. turn (SoP has more usage if the Sparks not die before the first quanta gain)
I'm just farming in the Arena, but I'm supposed to think that Phase salvager is the same.
(http://i.imgur.com/JdaReXj.png)
Post by: moehrpi on August 14, 2013, 07:31:12 am
Post by: Taglio on August 21, 2013, 12:29:20 pm
i've build an Arena deck based on Vampires and shard of wisdom to increase their attack, but without quintessence (if vampire damage goes spell it doesn't steals life).
Only problem is that AI doesn't plays shard of wisdom if the creatures are not invulnerable - just like before the rewording of SoWisdom.
Thank you
Taglio
PS: this has been posted under AI bugs - and that was a mistake because I did not find this thread first :P
Post by: bluethousandand2 on August 24, 2013, 03:33:57 am
Anyways, tell me what ya' guys think.
I posted this in the bugs section, re-posting here.
Post by: CuCN on August 24, 2013, 03:56:14 am
Post by: mycale on August 24, 2013, 06:15:47 am
Post by: CuCN on August 24, 2013, 02:23:19 pm
Post by: Eagleon on October 23, 2013, 06:02:53 pm
Post by: UndeadSpider1990 on October 29, 2013, 12:06:54 pm
Post by: TribalTrouble on October 29, 2013, 10:00:51 pm
Post by: guillotinement on December 16, 2013, 09:55:49 pm
it summoned a colossal dragon added a heavy armor then summoned otyugh..clearly heavy armor should have went on the otyugh..
it summoned a otyugh used quintessence on it..then summoned another otyugh and used momentum..clearly momentum should have went on the one thats now permanent..
it wont use immolation on phoenix..
speaking of immolation..
it wont give me quantum when i use immolation on a singularity..
Post by: andretimpa on December 19, 2013, 01:13:07 pm
AI starts by playing a Bone Wall.
Further on it plays on the same turn (the initial wall was still up): Dissipation, followed by a Bone Wall, followed by another dissipation
On another turn (dissipation is still up): Bone Wall, followed by a dissipation
Further on, while dissipation is still up, AI decides to switch it to a Bone Wall.
------
In another game it plays on the same turn dim shield, dissipation shield and bone wall (it was a SoSebow)
------
Playing against an air rush with gases. I run out of SoSac and the AI could kill me with an army of fireflies and damselflies. It lights 2 UGs and kills all of its creatures, losing the match.
Post by: irraka on January 19, 2014, 12:08:45 pm
Post by: UndeadSpider1990 on January 20, 2014, 12:17:29 am
speaking of immolation..
it wont give me quantum when i use immolation on a singularity..
This is not a bug. It's a deliberate nerf so that the Singularities produced by nova can't be abused.
Post by: dawn to dusk on January 20, 2014, 08:05:24 am
Post by: Zergva on January 30, 2014, 09:26:39 pm
AI uses dive with a Sundial in game.
Post by: guillotinement on February 03, 2014, 09:06:12 pm
cool thanx..speaking of immolation..
it wont give me quantum when i use immolation on a singularity..
This is not a bug. It's a deliberate nerf so that the Singularities produced by nova can't be abused.
this wasnt that recent but i had ai use purify on me..
besides that..i just made a time/ether arena deck..
when i dueled it..
it brought out two anubis..used Shard of readiness..
then only used anubis skill once..
same duel..
there was a upgraded steam machine..which i had eventually
used overdrive on it..next to it was a lava golem..which just came out..
literally half the attack of the steam machine..n it used parallel universe
on the lava golem..
i forgot to mention on my last post..when it used overdrive then rage potion..
it killed the monster...rage would have sufficed..
Post by: djdj24 on February 17, 2014, 07:37:48 pm
Post by: Zergva on February 19, 2014, 09:59:09 pm
AI plays Adrenaline on Forest scorpion, while a DR shield in play.
Post by: andretimpa on March 10, 2014, 11:23:55 pm
AI just can't decide what to play :P
Post by: bob8willie on March 26, 2014, 02:02:10 am
(dives them over shooting enemy creatures with eagle eye)
Post by: jarozaoz on March 26, 2014, 08:22:00 am
AI decided to RT a scarab...
@EDIT
When my Pharaoh got 3hp, Owl Eye of AI still was attacking my scarabs with 15hp, when they was lover atk than pharaoh...
Post by: Leodip on May 19, 2014, 01:41:48 pm
Post by: andretimpa on June 03, 2014, 10:26:57 am
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7229007/etg screenies/chimeras.png)
Post by: guillotinement on June 04, 2014, 06:22:38 am
summons two monsters..
death stalker and the dune scorpion..only upgrading the death stalker..
and the following turn adding epinephrine to the dune which has no attack still..
and within the same turn of adding epinephrine upgrades the death stalker even more..
it failed to utilize the other creatures..
Post by: Aneninen on June 20, 2014, 12:30:35 pm
Post by: Espithel on June 20, 2014, 01:45:50 pm
It had 2 1 | 1 deja vus out.
It blessed one of them.
It had 1 time quanta left. Then it use deja vu on the 1 | 1 and not the 4 | 4.
.-.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on July 12, 2014, 05:40:43 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/RZrQWqz.jpg) (http://imgur.com/RZrQWqz)
Post by: Espithel on July 20, 2014, 02:23:03 pm
My arena deck would be getting FAR more wins if it played like a human being.
Post by: dragonsdemesne on August 02, 2014, 11:34:14 pm
Post by: StreptoFire on August 22, 2014, 01:08:16 am
And btw, I also saw one using momentum on a photon before immolating it.
Post by: Espithel on August 26, 2014, 07:04:04 pm
Silly AI.
Edit:
(http://i.imgur.com/QASly5d.png)
Silly silly AI.
Post by: Higurashi on September 19, 2014, 09:56:24 pm
Post by: Espithel on October 08, 2014, 02:57:05 am
Which shield would you have picked?
The fact they played two was the problem, really.
Post by: kirbylover314 on October 22, 2014, 02:02:57 am
(http://i.imgur.com/Pd1ERpR.png)
Post by: iDaire on October 22, 2014, 02:57:27 am
What i saw before the spark died was mitosis.
Post by: AP579 on April 20, 2015, 05:48:04 am
(http://i.imgur.com/5JcEXZ8.png)
Post by: Manuel on August 25, 2016, 04:02:10 am
(http://i.imgur.com/X8klSGd.png)
ai use antimatter on my golem, and after a while plays mitosis on the same golem, thinking that mitosis works like tu
Post by: Higurashi on August 25, 2016, 08:38:05 am