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Other Topics => Forum Games => Off-Topic Discussions => Forum Game Archive => Topic started by: Linkcat on August 13, 2020, 08:48:52 pm

Title: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 13, 2020, 08:48:52 pm
Elements Mafia

Started by Mastermind79, Continued by killsdazombies, Implosion, ddevans96, icecoldbro, Demagog, Purity_Riot, Dragoon1140, killsdazombies, 1world24, RavingRabbid, majofa, TStar, killsdazombies, mesaprotector, Regen2k9, Kuroaitou, whatifidogetcaught?, UnderneathTheLens, RootRanger, killsdazombies, Elbirn, ji412jo, dawn to dusk, eljoemo, Zawadx, killsdazombies, theelkspeaks, iancudorinmarian, DoubleCapitals, Dm, Espithel, killsdazombies, skyironsword, Submachine, Coffeeditto, mathman101, Naesala, Ginyu, Linkcat, Solaris, Ryli, killsdazombies, Naii_the_Baf, PlayerOa, and rob77dp.

All of the players in the game are collectively referred to as the Town. The Town is split into two factions. There is a minority faction, the mafia (False Gods), and a majority faction, the innocents (Elementals). The False Gods start the game with the knowledge of who the other members are, and their goal is to kill all of the Elementals. The Elementals start the game not knowing who is a False God and who is a fellow Elemental, and their goal is to kill all of the False Gods.

The game is split into two phases. It generally starts with a Night Phase, in which the False Gods choose one member of the Town to kill. This is called the Nightkill. Also, players may use abilities given to them by their roles during this phase. Following each Night Phase is the Day Phase. During the day, the Town may choose to lynch one player through the use of votes. Each player gets one vote, and the person with the most votes at the end of the day is lynched and removed from the game. This cycle continues until either all of the False Gods are dead, or the number of False Gods is equal to or greater than the number of Elementals at the beginning of a Day Phase. This is called reaching parity.

How to determine who is mafia and who is innocent is entirely up to the players. As a False God your job is to blend into the Town and direct lynches onto Elementals without giving yourself away. As an Elemental your job is to use logic, reason, tells, intuition, and any abilities you may have to determine who the False Gods are and lynch them. An inactive town will easily fall prey to the mafia, so try to generate as much information as possible. In the game of mafia you have two main weapons; your voice and your vote. Use them wisely.

Village - Town
Villager - Innocent
Civ - Innocent
Wolf - Mafia
Scum - Mafia
Alignment - Primary Role
Roll/Rand - Having a role assigned to you
PR/Power Role - Roles that are very useful to the town - usually includes cop and medic
Cop - A role that has the ability to determine the alignment of another player
Medic - A role that has the ability to protect other players from the Nightkill
Shoot - Use an ability that would kill another player
Claim/Roleclaim - Say that you have a specific role
Soft/Softclaim - Hint that you have a specific role
Civvy Central - A group of confirmed innocents
Scummy - Acting like a mafia
Towny - Acting like an innocent
Town-Cred/Town Points - Factors that make it more likely that a player is innocent
Read - How scummy or towny you think someone is
AI/NAI - Alignment Indicative/Non-Alignment Indicative
Wagon/Train - A player that has multiple votes on them
FoS/Finger of Suspicion - Declare that you suspect someone without voting them
Tunnel - Having tunnel vision on a single player
Pocket - Townread someone to get them on your side
Thunderdome - Confront someone as to narrow the possibly lynch to to those two players
Self-Preservation - Vote on the biggest other wagon when you are a leading wagon, this is not a read-based vote unless stated
Hammer - Casting the final vote needed for a lynch
Bus - Throw a fellow mafia member under the bus to get town-cred
OMGUS - Oh My God, U Suck - Voting on the person who voted on you
CFD/Chinese Fire Drill - At EoD, pile votes onto someone who has little to no votes
Breadcrumb - Give hints to your role or actions in a post that you can call back on to give credibility to your claim
Breadpost - Shitpost
EV - Expected Value
EoD/End of Day - The last hours before the end of the day phase
PoE/Process of Elimination - Rank the lynch priority of the remaining players to give the best chance of lynching mafia sooner.
LyLo/Lynch or Lose - Town must lynch correctly or they lose
MyLo/Mislynch and Lose - If town mislynches they lose, but if they No Lynch the game continues
EBWOP - Edit By Way Of Post - Making another post with changes instead of editing a previous one
RQS - Random Question Stage, a common way to start games where one player puts forth a survey of questions for every player to answer
WIFOM - Wine In Front Of Me (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9TRMQwMNnY) - The dilemma that arises from trying to predict whether someone has made an optimal but expected choice, or a suboptimal but unexpected one

General Mafia Rules

1. Do not post, chat, OR PM ANY revealing information if you have been killed/removed from this mafia. You are allowed one death post that contains no information or commentary about the players.
2. You are not allowed to edit or remove your post. Instead, EBWOP will take effect. This means you must post again with the correct fixes. Coded messages are not allowed.
3. Directly quoting or providing proof in any way of any PM sent by the host will result in an instant modkill and referral to the FGO.
4. You are not allowed to directly quote any PM sent by another player, unless you are quoting it to a fellow mafia member confirmed by the host.
5. You are not allowed to request to be modkilled in the thread. If you PM the host requesting to be modkilled, the host must find a substitute or modkill you at the end of the phase.
6. All players' actions should be primarily motivated by winning the game. Throwing the game or outing your teammates for no strategic value is not allowed.
7. The host has the final say in any dispute. Do not impersonate the host.
8. Any flaming/trolling will not be tolerated.
9. Players' actions should be motivated by this game's events solely. You may look at past mafias to determine behaviors for better reads, but keep personal affairs out of the game.
10. Anything said within the context of the game, including promises, bets, etc, stays within the game. Players can lie, deceive, and manipulate, (but not cheat) in any way they like. Slander within the context of the game is usually not meant as a personal offense.
*Any use of the word PM by the host or FGO refers to any method of communication outside of the game thread and the public blab chat.

Breaking any of the above rules may result in a modkill as determined by the host, or a ban from future mafias or forum games in general as determined by the Forum Game Organizer.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 13, 2020, 09:00:24 pm
Elements Mafia: Duel of Fates
Based on Mafia 34 by Elbirn. Heavily modified by Linkcat, Coffeeditto, and killsdazombies.

Game Rules

1. The game will start on Night 0, which will be followed by Day 1. You may post during the Night.
2. The Nightkill is factional and cannot be tracked or roleblocked, but still counts as an ability that targets.
3. If the lynch is tied, No Lynch will occur.
4. You are allowed to vote for No Lynch. You are also allowed to vote for a 24 hour extension. The votes are counted in a separate tally and you may only do one extension per phase.
5. Clearly declaring your intent to vote without using the proper format is a valid way to vote.
6. Town wins if all the Mafia are dead. Mafia wins if they achieve parity at the beginning of a Day.
7. The Day will not end until both the timer has ended and 7 minutes have passed since the last vote was cast or the last vote count was posted. This extension cannot be triggered by the same player twice in a row. If any sort of endless voting loop occurs that affects the lynch, there will be No Lynch. The day will be ended at the host's discretion if there is any vote swapping trolling/juggling, or if they set a hard deadline which cannot be extended.
8. If you do not post for three consecutive phases, or for any 2 Day phases, you will be modkilled.
9. NO COMMUNICATION IS ALLOWED OUTSIDE OF THIS THREAD, EXCEPT FOR PADS PROVIDED BY THE HOST. You may communicate in the official Elements blab chat, but all relevant messages MUST be posted in this thread immediately afterward. Not following this rule will result in the chat being restricted.
10. I reserve the right to make any changes to the ruleset in order to maintain the integrity and balance of the game.

Primary Roles

False Gods

The False Gods start the game as a team. Their goal is to kill all of the Elementals. Each Night, they perform a Nightkill on an Elemental of their choosing. The Nightkill interrupts lower priority targets.

Elementals

The Elementals are the townsfolk of the game. Their goal is to kill all of the False Gods through lynching and the use of abilities.

Secondary Roles

All players will begin the game with the Fate Egg role.

All Secondary abilities are activated by PMing your action to the host during the Night Phase. You may not target yourself with any ability unless specified. If an EoR ability fails, you may use it again on the next Night. If an OU ability fails, you may use it again.

Key:
ER - Every Round.
EoR - Every Other Round.
OU - One Use.
Passive - Triggers Automatically.

Information Roles

Golden Nymph - EoR
Precognition - Target a player. Reveal their Primary role to you. You cannot be protected from the Nightkill.

Psion - ER
Psionic Link - Target a player. Their secondary abilities are revealed to you.

Dragonfly - ER
Fly on the Wall - Target a player. You see who they targeted and who targeted them this Night, regardless of priority. Only sees successful ability uses.

Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.

Firefly Queen - ER
Queen - Target a player. Generate a firefly that follows them. Your fireflies will report back to you each Night with all abilities that they saw successfully activated, but the cute little guys aren't smart enough to tell you whether an ability was used by your target or on your target. Fireflies are unaffected by all abilities that prevent targeting. If a firefly doesn't witness any abilities, it will wander near your target and be caught. The target will be notified if they catch a firefly. Fireflies cannot report higher priority activity on the first Night they follow a player, and will act as not seeing an ability if that's the only thing they would see.

Iridium Warden - ER
Guard - Target a player. They can not be targeted by other players' secondary abilities, and you learn the names of any abilities blocked.


Offensive Roles

If two roleblocking roles with the same priority target each other, both abilities fail. If only one targets the other, the ability of the one that was targeted fails.

Toadfish - OU
Inflate - Target a player. They are now Poisoned.

Otyugh - OU
Devour - Target a player. They die and your role is publicly revealed. If you eat a Toadfish or a player that was Poisoned, you become Poisoned.

Mind Flayer - ER
Psionic Wave - Target a player. They cannot use their ability this Night.

Arctic Squid - ER
Freeze - Target a player. They are now Frozen.

Ghost of the Past - ER
Obsession - Target a player. When you die, even if you no longer have this role, the player you targeted most recently has their secondary abilities replaced with Obsessed - ER - Activates automatically. You can't stop thinking about a dead man.


Defensive Roles

Guardian Angel - ER
Heal - Target any player including yourself. They are protected from the Nightkill and any further Offensive Roles that target them this Night. This ability fails if the target was Healed by a Guardian Angel on the previous Night.

Graboid - OU
Evolve - This Graboid role changes to Shrieker. As long as you have the Graboid role, you are Burrowed.

Shrieker - ER
Burrow - You are now Burrowed. You may not start the game as a Shrieker.
Unburrow - If you are Burrowed, you are no longer Burrowed.

Seraph - EoR
Divine Shield - You cannot be targeted this Night.

Phoenix - OU
Ash - This role automatically activates during the phase you die. If this ability is successful, you can talk after your death.

Anubis - EoR
Immortality - Target any player including yourself. They become Immaterial.

Green Nymph - ER
Adrenaline - Target any player including yourself. They gain Adrenaline.

Amber Nymph - EoR
Unstoppable - Target any player including yourself. They gain Momentum.

Iridium Warden - ER
Guard - Target a player. They can not be targeted by other players' secondary abilities, and you learn the names of any abilities blocked.

Role Roles

These roles do not disappear when you use them. When you die these roles will be revealed along with any others.

Crusader - OU
Endow - Target a player. You gain their secondary ability. Passive abilities trigger immediately. Can be used again if the ability fails.

Vulture - OU
Scavenger - Target a dead player. You gain their secondary role. If they had multiple roles, you gain the one listed last on their death.

"Fun" Roles

Fate Egg - Passive
Hatch - Activates automatically at the start of Night 0, and the start of each Day Phase thereafter. You receive a random secondary role other than Fate Egg in addition to your current roles, and you are disguised as that role if investigated or revealed. You will not receive the same role twice in a game. The role given by Hatch is replaced every time Hatch gives you a new role, but abilities given by Endow and Scavenger will stay.

Status Effects

You are notified when you gain a status effect, except for Poison which notifies you on the start of the Night that you would die. Status effects are permanent, unless it's mentioned otherwise.

Burrowed - You may not vote or be targeted by any ability. Burrowed players do not count towards parity. Voting while Burrowed without Adrenaline will result in a modkill.

Poisoned - You die at the end of the first Night Phase after you were poisoned.

Frozen - The next time you attempt to use your ability, it fails and you are no longer Frozen.

Adrenaline - You ignore the Frozen status, you may vote while Burrowed, and you die immediately when Poisoned. If you have an EoR ability other than Precognition, you may use it as if it was an [ER] ability.

Immaterial - You may not be targeted by any secondary ability. Wears off after death.

Momentum - The activations and effects of your abilities can not be prevented or redirected, unless the target is Burrowed. However, being Frozen or Guarded can still block your ability. Momentum does not help abilities that would normally fail (no consecutive Heals). Ignores Immaterial.

Role Priority

Hatch [Fate Egg]
Evolve [Graboid]
Unburrow [Shrieker]
Psionic Wave [Mind Flayer]
Queen [Firefly Queen]
Divine Shield [Seraph]
Guard [Iridium Warden]
Freeze [Arctic Squid]
Unstoppable/Adrenaline [Amber Nymph/Green Nymph]
Immortality [Anubis]
Heal/Endow/Scavenger [Guardian Angel/Crusader/Vulture]
Obsession [Ghost of the Past]
Ash [Phoenix]
Nightkill
Inflate [Toadfish]
Devour [Otyugh]
Precognition/Psionic Link/Fly on the Wall/Deja Vu [Golden Nymph/Psion/Dragonfly/Deja Vu]
Burrow [Shrieker]

Signup List

1. TheonlyrealBeef - died Night 0, NK. Elemental
2. Linkcat - died Night 1, NK. Elemental
3. PlayerOa survived to end of game. False God
4. Coffeeditto - lynched Day 4. Elemental
5. MasterWalks - died Night 2, NK. Elemental
6. Naesala - died Night 4, NK. Elemental
7. worldwideweb3 - lynched Day 1. Elemental
8. shockcannon survived to end of game. False God
9. iancudorinmarian - lynched Day 2. Elemental
10. kaempfer13 survived to end of game. Elemental
11. killsdazombies survived to end of game. Elemental
12. serprex - died Night 0, devoured. False God
13. moehrpi - died Day 2, modkilled. Elemental
14. Naii_the_Baf - lynched Day 3. Elemental
15. andretimpa - died Night 3, NK. Elemental
16. Calindu - died Night 4, devoured. Elemental

Signups have ended.



Phase Links
Start of Night 0 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302014/#msg1302014)
Start of Day 1 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302158/#msg1302158)
Start of Night 1 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302382/#msg1302382)
Start of Day 2 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302418/#msg1302418)
Start of Night 2 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302528/#msg1302528)
Start of Day 3 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302581/#msg1302581)
Start of Night 3 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302717/#msg1302717)
Start of Day 4 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302775/#msg1302775)
Start of Night 4 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302885/#msg1302885)
End of Game (at end of Night 4) (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302901/#msg1302901)

1. TheonlyrealBeef
2. Linkcat
3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
7. worldwideweb3
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
12. serprex
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 13, 2020, 09:02:08 pm
In.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 13, 2020, 09:21:56 pm
\reserved

(AmIDoingThisRightYet?  :silly:)

No.  >:(

In.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 13, 2020, 09:26:00 pm
In!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 13, 2020, 09:32:23 pm
Changelog

Poison kills after one night instead of two.
Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.
Fate Egg will not give you the same role twice.
Burrow moved to lowest priority.
Dragonfly clarified to only see successful targets.
Firefly priority clarified to only matter on its first night.
AI/NAI added to terminology.
Various wording adjustments and colorizations.

This mafia only

After Night 0 Fate Egg hatches at the start of each Day rather than each Night.
Golden Nymph and Deja Vu independent of alignment.
Part of a balanced breakfast.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 13, 2020, 09:38:25 pm
i am here to play this game
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 13, 2020, 09:45:19 pm
In
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 13, 2020, 09:49:38 pm
In ^_^
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 13, 2020, 11:43:24 pm
In. Doc on me please kthnx.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 14, 2020, 03:15:25 am
1. The game will start on Night 0, which will be followed by Day 1. You may post during the Night.
So there's a nightkill n0 this game, different from last game? Making sure.



Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.
The wording of "any time" has me wondering if this is even after roles change? Or only during the two phases you have it? (Or one n0)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 14, 2020, 04:01:22 am
Vulture is removed from N0.
Shrieker is removed completely.

1. The game will start on Night 0, which will be followed by Day 1. You may post during the Night.
So there's a nightkill n0 this game, different from last game? Making sure.



Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.
The wording of "any time" has me wondering if this is even after roles change? Or only during the two phases you have it? (Or one n0)
Yes to N0 NK.
Only players that are Deja Vu during the current phase (N0, D1/N1, D2/N2, etc.) can communicate.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 14, 2020, 05:42:17 am
cool
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 14, 2020, 06:04:20 am
inb4 reading rules
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 14, 2020, 06:25:14 am
Vulture is removed from N0.
Shrieker is removed completely.

1. The game will start on Night 0, which will be followed by Day 1. You may post during the Night.
So there's a nightkill n0 this game, different from last game? Making sure.



Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.
The wording of "any time" has me wondering if this is even after roles change? Or only during the two phases you have it? (Or one n0)
Yes to N0 NK.
Only players that are Deja Vu during the current phase (N0, D1/N1, D2/N2, etc.) can communicate.
I was going to say something about the graboid/shrieker combo being oddly redundant based on roles changing every day phase, but I held my tongue for that because of Crusader or Vulture being able to effectively utilize it. Was it removed for this clunkiness and not being able to be used by 1cycle graboids?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 14, 2020, 08:24:19 am
After Night 0 Fate Egg hatches at the start of each Day rather than each Night.
How does this work with Graboids inability to vote, the day before or after they were untargetable? Day before seems implied (they already lost the ability again the day after), but that makes it rather meaningless.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 14, 2020, 08:34:14 am
in
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 14, 2020, 09:19:38 am
After Night 0 Fate Egg hatches at the start of each Day rather than each Night.
How does this work with Graboids inability to vote, the day before or after they were untargetable? Day before seems implied (they already lost the ability again the day after), but that makes it rather meaningless.

They'll be burrowed the day before since that's when they'll have the role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: moehrpi on August 14, 2020, 10:10:26 am
Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.

Does Freeze void OU abilities now? Generally speaking.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 14, 2020, 11:42:36 am
In
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 14, 2020, 12:24:10 pm
Shrieker is removed completely from the Hatch ability pool.
Clarification.

Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.

Does Freeze void OU abilities now? Generally speaking.
In essence, yes.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 14, 2020, 05:03:28 pm
Shrieker is removed completely from the Hatch ability pool.
Clarification.

Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.

Does Freeze void OU abilities now? Generally speaking.
In essence, yes.

OU abilities can be used again if they fail as stated in the rules.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 14, 2020, 07:06:40 pm
In

I'm going to explicitly not be around for end of day madness
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 14, 2020, 07:22:37 pm
Shrieker is removed completely from the Hatch ability pool.
Clarification.

Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.

Does Freeze void OU abilities now? Generally speaking.
In essence, yes.

OU abilities can be used again if they fail as stated in the rules.
But this is only true for vulture’d or crusader’d roles?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 14, 2020, 08:58:43 pm
Shrieker is removed completely from the Hatch ability pool.
Clarification.

Arctic Squid and Freeze have been changed.

Does Freeze void OU abilities now? Generally speaking.
In essence, yes.

OU abilities can be used again if they fail as stated in the rules.
But this is only true for vulture’d or crusader’d roles?

In this game, yes, but he said generally speaking when he asked.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: moehrpi on August 14, 2020, 09:57:08 pm
Thanks for the clarification.

In.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 15, 2020, 10:42:55 am
if you evolve as graboid do you get to keep the shrieker role in addition to your other roles?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 15, 2020, 06:51:36 pm
No.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 15, 2020, 07:05:41 pm
In.

Don't know if I'll have the time but Fate Eggs sound like fun and I might be able to slip in during a couple hours each day.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 15, 2020, 07:08:06 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/FS50k8L.png)

I did vote for egg mafia after all, in
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 16, 2020, 07:37:35 am
In
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 21, 2020, 02:17:59 am
Signups have concluded, roles are being distributed. Night 0 will start soon(TM)... hold, please.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 21, 2020, 02:22:44 am
Night 0

There are 3 False Gods and 13 Elementals. Please note that secondary roles are independent of alignment/primary role.


Night 0 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 02:56:12 am
Alright guys, who's got a good role for me to steal?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 03:40:39 am
Well, unfortunately I rolled town again, so time for some town tips I thought of:

I also have a radical suggestion: for someone that rolled the Golden Nymph role to claim. They could be targeted by Crusaders and Dragonflies, Dragonflies will monitor and reveal any mafia with disruptive abilities trying to get Golden Nymph from using theirs. Having them get (Night)killed N0 is a bonus, since every time someone randoms Vulture afterwards, they'll then turn into a cop (or have that option, it's the best option as town, right?).

EoD is 3am for me, so don't get your hopes up on me being on for it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 21, 2020, 03:53:49 am
Torb not on at eod, n-
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 21, 2020, 04:07:25 am
this game is a mess. will put more thoughts later
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 07:55:57 am
The thing about claiming golden nymph is that your ability can be prevented through the nightkill, so its only worth if a town!crusader or town!angel exists. Additionaly due to lack of claimpower it's hard to keep track of people roleblocking. Also i think vulture can only get crusaded roles or fate egg regardless of when the target died.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 07:57:56 am
Also, wait is this actually the eod time that won?! even i am not that dedicated to stay up that late.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 08:06:55 am
It's not the EoD time that won, it's the time that works for the host.

A Fate Egg should have their hatched role listed last, allowing that one to be taken. I don't see why Endow would Endo not-Fate Egg but then Vulture only gets Fate Egg.

The idea of claiming is to not let them get protected, having Golden Nymph in the pool of Vulture abilities is just too good in this setup.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 21, 2020, 08:08:39 am
Yeah EoD won’t happen for me either. Maybe this is a good thing after all? The results of the last vote shifting madness EoD’s haven’t really been positive.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 08:11:46 am
Do we want otys/toadfish to claim? Especially in case of oty its likely for actually correct play to cause an uproar as its going to be revealed the same night.

Regardless i think it a good idea to hold a vote in the night, where otys/toadfish target the "lynchvote". This doubles our wagonomics as well. It also makes townotys actually using their ability (as they should) less devisive and leashes scumotys to potentially target one of their own.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 08:21:25 am
Agree that GNs should claim. I hope there's another one because I really don't want to be the first Nightkill two games in a row.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 08:22:31 am
We'll just do our own European not-EoD vote shifting madness 6 hours early :sillyspin:

Wouldn't vigis not have a huge chance to be roleblocked? Possibly even through the nightkill, since that takes priority over Inflate and Devour. Mafia can even protect a townie this way, in hopes of setting up a mislynch the day after. I'd rather risk a double vig on the same target, than have them claim before their ability has been used, the day after works just as well for claiming, no?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 08:26:29 am
yh, actually if we hold the vote its preferable not to claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 08:28:01 am
although getting roleblocked is actually an indicator of them being town when noone dies, no? but in that case we probably want to lynch their target, so we rather just want the kill to go through.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 08:32:36 am
Toadfish and Otyugh should not claim. You'll find out who I targeted when we get to N1.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 08:37:51 am
Well, if the person to be vigged can block the vig, I could see them do that as either alignment. I could argue it's bad town play since they are likely to just get lynched the next day, but I don't think this would prevent, say w3, from blocking the vig. This tells us nothing about the alignment of the one that would have vigged if he's town. If target and vig are both mafia, you wouldn't see anyone die either. They could pretend to be roleblocked and not use, or use if they can block it just in case someone is watching.

Toadfish and Otyugh should not claim. You'll find out who I targeted when we get to N1.
Soft claim ALL the roles!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 08:50:02 am
Soft claim ALL the roles!

I'm not going to soft claim all the roles, that would be silly. I'll only soft the one that I have. Which in this case happens to be a little on the spooky side.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 10:00:08 am
well you necessarily softed a role that you dont have when you soft 2
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: moehrpi on August 21, 2020, 10:57:13 am
Well, if the person to be vigged can block the vig, I could see them do that as either alignment. I could argue it's bad town play since they are likely to just get lynched the next day, but I don't think this would prevent, say w3, from blocking the vig. This tells us nothing about the alignment of the one that would have vigged if he's town. If target and vig are both mafia, you wouldn't see anyone die either. They could pretend to be roleblocked and not use, or use if they can block it just in case someone is watching.

Toadfish and Otyugh should not claim. You'll find out who I targeted when we get to N1.
Soft claim ALL the roles!

I have all the best words, talking is my strength. So this is not a problem.

n+
TorB

n
rest


I don't fear for Link dying N0, honestly. But he will always make a juicy target.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 21, 2020, 10:58:13 am
shock & I are deja vus
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 21, 2020, 12:27:48 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Crusader and Vulture do not endow or scavenge the Fate Egg role. Vulture would gain the ability listed last in the target's death-post notification. Crusader would gain the ability last 'acquired' by the target.

The thing about claiming golden nymph is that your ability can be prevented through the nightkill, so its only worth if a town!crusader or town!angel exists. Additionaly due to lack of claimpower it's hard to keep track of people roleblocking. Also i think vulture can only get crusaded roles or fate egg regardless of when the target died.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 01:47:53 pm
Well, unfortunately I rolled town again, so time for some town tips I thought of:
  • There is no good reason not to immediately reveal any Golden Nymph result you find, unless you obtained it through Vulture/Crusader.
  • Not voting to hide Graboids identity can be extra helpful now that Graboids are forced to not vote before they are invincible.
  • You can only roll each role once as Fate Egg, this means that claiming every single action will make it easier to deduce your possible roles. So don't go around claiming everything unless you have a good idea on how that helps town.

I also have a radical suggestion: for someone that rolled the Golden Nymph role to claim. They could be targeted by Crusaders and Dragonflies, Dragonflies will monitor and reveal any mafia with disruptive abilities trying to get Golden Nymph from using theirs. Having them get (Night)killed N0 is a bonus, since every time someone randoms Vulture afterwards, they'll then turn into a cop (or have that option, it's the best option as town, right?).

EoD is 3am for me, so don't get your hopes up on me being on for it.

I think it would be interesting for FFQ to target the GN too, in order to have a way to check if the plan went through.

Amber Nymph targetting GN could also get around a mafia!Anubis trying to pass off as a Seraph (getting themselves immaterial to avoid investigation). But then again, a mafia!Anubis could just target GN and combo it with the NK.

Anyway, having more people targetting GN besides just crusaders and dragonflies makes it harder for a scum!dragonfly to find out who our more permanent GN is.

A more aggressive version of the plan is to just have a town!Oty devour the GN. In this case, FFQ and crusader can still do their work, while a scum!dragonfly would fail in trying to find the new GN and as a bonus the vultures can fetch GN too.

Overall I think the plan is +EV for town and I like our odds.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 21, 2020, 02:00:02 pm
Well, Endow hits before nightkill so might be worth it for the Nymph to claim. The scenarios with Crusader and Angel are as following (with the underlying base that the roles are in the hand of town, ofc):

1) Both Crusader & Angel exists: Doc and Crusader on GN, and we have a permanent, incognito GN
2) Crusader exists but not Angel: Crusader gets GN with the likely scenario that the original GN dies. One vanilla Egg dies for a permanent GN, seems reasonable to me
3) Crusader does not exist but Angel does: Angel heals GN so he can't die and we get 1 confirmed affinity. This is what likely would have happened anyway, unless scum lucked out and blindly hit GN (hi w3 :P)
4) Neither Crusader nor Angel exists: GN sails up as a likely NK, which is pretty lame. But scum might be paranoid there is an angel alive, dunno

Scum faking GN might prove to be trouble, but I feel like that's a somewhat risky move, drawing so much attention. I'm just brainstorming at this phase. But I feel like scenarios 1&2 look town-positive in my eyes, scenario 3 is neutral and scenario 4 is scum-positive, so all in all the odds should be in our favour.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 02:06:01 pm
Angel doesn't work on GN tho
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 21, 2020, 02:08:16 pm
Not even when GN is only a temporary Fate Egg role?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 02:09:26 pm
summon rob/Link/someone smarter than me
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 02:14:30 pm
But having GN die is just pro town, since every future town Vulture roll also becomes GN. No need to bother with protection, just the threat of having every future Vulture roll turn another town into cop is all the protection GN needs.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 21, 2020, 02:25:49 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:
A hatched Fate Egg is "disguised as that role if investigated or revealed" --> in a similar vein, a GN secondary cannot be protected from the Nightkill (these phrasings are from the role descriptions with post serving to clarify the intent).

Angel doesn't work on GN tho
Not even when GN is only a temporary Fate Egg role?
summon rob/Link/someone smarter than me

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 21, 2020, 02:43:38 pm
Alright, no worries. The point TorB made about Vultures deemed Angels useless anyway.

So now we're living in a world where claiming GN gives a better chance of staying alive. 2020 never stops surprising huh :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 21, 2020, 02:52:57 pm
What an interesting double edged sword. A question then, is it beneficial to use an otyugh on a GN to ensure they die and set up all future vultures? Or are we living in a world where we would rather a GN dying be a happy accident?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 21, 2020, 02:54:16 pm
So if GN does claim, will mafia actually kill them? The sooner GN dies the sooner we can have multiple GNs. I say GN claims and a kill role kills them off since its unlikely maf will use NK on them.

shock & I are deja vus
You AND shock rolled deja N0? seems unlikely.

I have all the best words, talking is my strength. So this is not a problem.

n+
TorB

n
rest


I don't fear for Link dying N0, honestly. But he will always make a juicy target.

Already townreading someone just because they took charge when signups ran out? isnt this what killed town last game?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 21, 2020, 02:56:08 pm
What an interesting double edged sword. A question then, is it beneficial to use an otyugh on a GN to ensure they die and set up all future vultures? Or are we living in a world where we would rather a GN dying be a happy accident?

So if GN does claim, will mafia actually kill them? The sooner GN dies the sooner we can have multiple GNs. I say GN claims and a kill role kills them off since its unlikely maf will use NK on them.

:ninja:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 03:00:49 pm
What an interesting double edged sword. A question then, is it beneficial to use an otyugh on a GN to ensure they die and set up all future vultures? Or are we living in a world where we would rather a GN dying be a happy accident?

If you consider that there are 15-ish players for 25-ish roles, and that people don't get each role more than once, than a GN in the graveyard sounds excellent for town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 03:02:41 pm
:ninja:

A more aggressive version of the plan is to just have a town!Oty devour the GN. In this case, FFQ and crusader can still do their work, while a scum!dragonfly would fail in trying to find the new GN and as a bonus the vultures can fetch GN too.

true ninjas don't get seen  :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 03:02:59 pm
It's only beneficial to claim as Golden Nymph, while there are no dead Golden Nymphs. Having them stay alive has the benefit of enjoying the same kind of protection next night (it's only for first few nights, after that Vulture GN comes too late and it's better to let the original just do their work), allowing them to claim as well, making them endow-able, too.
Since we also lose the result of the ability usage by having Golden Nymph die, on top of getting killed for claiming not being a good motivator to get people to claim, I would rather have the Golden Nymph have the last say in that.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 21, 2020, 03:06:41 pm
The implications of this line of thinking are wide. If we collectively take a hard stance on this, does that mean if someone claims to have gotten GN night 1 later on they should be sus'd for it? Does that make the otyugh eating a GN a town move? What a strange game.

It's only beneficial to claim as Golden Nymph, while there are no dead Golden Nymphs. Having them stay alive has the benefit of enjoying the same kind of protection next night (it's only for first few nights, after that Vulture GN comes too late and it's better to let the original just do their work), allowing them to claim as well, making them endow-able, too.
Since we also lose the result of the ability usage by having Golden Nymph die, on top of getting killed for claiming not being a good motivator to get people to claim, I would rather have the Golden Nymph have the last say in that.

I think were all just speaking on this plan for n1/2, I dont think this line of thinking is valid after that as you said, because of endow.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 03:19:45 pm
The implications of this line of thinking are wide. If we collectively take a hard stance on this, does that mean if someone claims to have gotten GN night 1 later on they should be sus'd for it?
I think any GN Fate Egg random roll that did not come with an immediate result claim the day after is suspicious, regardless.

There might be reasons to not claim if you're Golden Nymph, but the one that most stands out is -as mafia- to not want town to endow you. So I can support that stance.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 21, 2020, 03:49:33 pm
I like the plan of having the GN claim and die for the greater good.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 21, 2020, 03:57:14 pm
Hm. I can see that being correct. I don't think I ever really considered the idea of killing off our GN before it was just suggested, I think I need a bit to really consider it. There may be more questions in the near future
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: moehrpi on August 21, 2020, 04:30:21 pm
The implications of this line of thinking are wide. If we collectively take a hard stance on this, does that mean if someone claims to have gotten GN night 1 later on they should be sus'd for it?
I think any GN Fate Egg random roll that did not come with an immediate result claim the day after is suspicious, regardless.

There might be reasons to not claim if you're Golden Nymph, but the one that most stands out is -as mafia- to not want town to endow you. So I can support that stance.

You say any but do you mean GN #2+? Not claiming red peek does imply they are town? If GN died that night we see it as a result of the NK. This does not work if there is more than one GN. In which case a permanent GN might be forced to claim in order to see who targeted whom. This is troublesome but

Oh right, town does not see who got targeted. In that case kill GN N0 please.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 04:38:55 pm
It would be hilarious if w3 is the GN  :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 21, 2020, 04:52:35 pm
So if GN does claim, will mafia actually kill them? The sooner GN dies the sooner we can have multiple GNs. I say GN claims and a kill role kills them off since its unlikely maf will use NK on them.

shock & I are deja vus
You AND shock rolled deja N0? seems unlikely.

Oh, I didn't think deja was actually a role in this game. I was just shit posting. Or maybe I was soft hinting why I might be protecting shock from a policy lynch tomorrow
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 04:55:42 pm
well, being a deja is NAI this game anyway
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 21, 2020, 05:25:52 pm
Oh shit we started.

Uhhhhhhhh smarter people than me already seem to have a plan so lets do that? GN suicide?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 21, 2020, 06:33:37 pm
GN Suicide yes. Somone munch linkcat
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 21, 2020, 07:48:00 pm
Ok so the tradeoff is a towncontrolled kill, a peek and the gn claimee almost guaranteed to be town vs all future vultures becoming gn permanently.
That equates to about 3 peeks in cost and leaves us at 11vs3. There is ~50% chance of at least one town!vulture coming tomorrow  which could have up to 3 peeks (night 2,4 and 6), odds later on dont get much worse but result in notably less peeks. Its worth noting that kill roles are probably going to come up left and right, so i expect the game to end by ~n4.
However later peeks are more likely to hit scum (unless things are already going really well), so actually its pretty complicated to determine whether its worth going for it. Its surprising its worth considering at all though.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 21, 2020, 08:03:32 pm
If a Golden Nymph does die this way, you will also notice that it is probably no longer beneficial to random vig. Indeed, even no lynch is something worth considering to increase the cop to mafia ratio. This is because lynches will no longer be town's main way of gathering information: the growing army of cops is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 09:25:27 pm
GN should claim, but as town we should decide not to eat them if they don't want to be eaten, otherwise it's pretty unlikely they'll actually claim. I at least will not be eating them against their will. I'll probably just eat w3 since it will make me laugh the most.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 21, 2020, 10:07:03 pm
I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 21, 2020, 10:43:29 pm
Both nomming or not have its benefits. Nomming gives us more cops down the line, while not nomming gives us a peek and doesn't hamstrings Otys. Leaving it up to the GN seems fair.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 21, 2020, 11:03:12 pm
Alright guys, enough messing around. I finally looked at my role PM. I won't say what it is, but it rhymes with Kind Slayer.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 22, 2020, 01:43:58 am
Alright guys, enough messing around. I finally looked at my role PM. I won't say what it is, but it rhymes with Kind Slayer.
The Rind Player is too powerful a role please nerf
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 03:48:16 am
Do we want otys/toadfish to claim? Especially in case of oty its likely for actually correct play to cause an uproar as its going to be revealed the same night.

Regardless i think it a good idea to hold a vote in the night, where otys/toadfish target the "lynchvote". This doubles our wagonomics as well. It also makes townotys actually using their ability (as they should) less devisive and leashes scumotys to potentially target one of their own.

There's no reason for a scum oty/toadfish to claim here, as they can just as easily hide in the countless other roles assigned. Unless someone manages to catch a lucky dragonfly/psion, there's no way to confirm or deny someone's identity. I'm not opposed to the idea of a lynchvote, but keep in mind that around 1/5 of the members are maf and there's that same chance that one of them is the people that people auto-read as town because of playstyle (TorB, sometimes kae(you)).



Wouldn't vigis not have a huge chance to be roleblocked? Possibly even through the nightkill, since that takes priority over Inflate and Devour. Mafia can even protect a townie this way, in hopes of setting up a mislynch the day after. I'd rather risk a double vig on the same target, than have them claim before their ability has been used, the day after works just as well for claiming, no?
This reads kind of oddly. You would rather trust that vigging roles will out after their target dies than before? I'm not concerned with being roleblocked, as that puts pressure on whoever roleblocked the kill to either out themselves as a roleblocking role or as mafia. There's the possibility that it could be mafia trying to cast suspicion on the agreed kill for roleblocking the outted vig roles, but that would deter roleblocking roles from the GN if we have one.



Scum faking GN might prove to be trouble, but I feel like that's a somewhat risky move, drawing so much attention. I'm just brainstorming at this phase. But I feel like scenarios 1&2 look town-positive in my eyes, scenario 3 is neutral and scenario 4 is scum-positive, so all in all the odds should be in our favour.
A setup like this minimally punishes a fake cop claim. If a scum claims to have rolled golden nymph after someone else claims to have rolled them, or they actually did roll GN, they can fake inno their partner or maf claim the other GN. It's a trade for sure, but i wouldn't put it past some players here even if it's not worth for them in the long run.


A more aggressive version of the plan is to just have a town!Oty devour the GN. In this case, FFQ and crusader can still do their work, while a scum!dragonfly would fail in trying to find the new GN and as a bonus the vultures can fetch GN too.
This only works if we go against the idea of waiting to out who the oty was, as we can't guarantee there's a FFQ in the game unless they out as well, and then we have too many role claims imo.



But having GN die is just pro town, since every future town Vulture roll also becomes GN. No need to bother with protection, just the threat of having every future Vulture roll turn another town into cop is all the protection GN needs.
I agree with this. The optimal move is to have a GN dead ASAP so we can start converting as many vultures as we can as soon as we can. The only issue after that point is cross checking reports somehow, so claims can't hide behind fake reports.



What an interesting double edged sword. A question then, is it beneficial to use an otyugh on a GN to ensure they die and set up all future vultures? Or are we living in a world where we would rather a GN dying be a happy accident?
This depends heavily on whether we want to get a free report but risk losing possible extra golden nymphs. I would rather have a guarenteed kill here with the otyugh also outing beforehand; they should have nothing to fear if they are town.



It's only beneficial to claim as Golden Nymph, while there are no dead Golden Nymphs. Having them stay alive has the benefit of enjoying the same kind of protection next night (it's only for first few nights, after that Vulture GN comes too late and it's better to let the original just do their work), allowing them to claim as well, making them endow-able, too.
Since we also lose the result of the ability usage by having Golden Nymph die, on top of getting killed for claiming not being a good motivator to get people to claim, I would rather have the Golden Nymph have the last say in that.
I would rather not, as we're not guaranteed to have a GN alive tonight and the protection from being a mafia having rolled GN is a little unruly. I think GN should claim now, so we have the maximum potential benefit in the future. To have one possibly faked report does not beat out having multiple cops possibly by n1.



The implications of this line of thinking are wide. If we collectively take a hard stance on this, does that mean if someone claims to have gotten GN night 1 later on they should be sus'd for it? Does that make the otyugh eating a GN a town move? What a strange game.
They should only be sus'd for it if another GN does not come forward well before the deadline. I also assume you mean N0 here. I see no reason why getting it later than N0 would be sus. As far as otyugh eating GN, as of right now, it's NAI but it benefits the town.



So if GN does claim, will mafia actually kill them? The sooner GN dies the sooner we can have multiple GNs. I say GN claims and a kill role kills them off since its unlikely maf will use NK on them.

shock & I are deja vus
You AND shock rolled deja N0? seems unlikely.

Oh, I didn't think deja was actually a role in this game. I was just shit posting. Or maybe I was soft hinting why I might be protecting shock from a policy lynch tomorrow
This is an awkward interaction on both fronts. For one, serprex is just like dumbtelling? or something? here, and for two, MasterWalks seems to have neglected that the rules state...
Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.



GN should claim, but as town we should decide not to eat them if they don't want to be eaten, otherwise it's pretty unlikely they'll actually claim. I at least will not be eating them against their will. I'll probably just eat w3 since it will make me laugh the most.
Agree that GNs should claim. I hope there's another one because I really don't want to be the first Nightkill two games in a row.

Toadfish and Otyugh should not claim. You'll find out who I targeted when we get to N1.

Soft claim ALL the roles!

I'm not going to soft claim all the roles, that would be silly. I'll only soft the one that I have. Which in this case happens to be a little on the spooky side.
Alright guys, enough messing around. I finally looked at my role PM. I won't say what it is, but it rhymes with Kind Slayer.
???



I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
shock & I are deja vus
So, nice soft and hard, but if you really are GN here, it has been discussed and agreed that you are an optimal vighit n0. It's too risky not to have the role available for vultures and to gain permanent GNs, especially because of the possibility of not rolling one again for a while.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 03:48:36 am
am i going to be well known for my chunks of text
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 04:19:24 am
I'm just roleswapping, Coffee. It's fine since Psion's not that useful here.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 05:45:12 am
I actually had to look through the roles to find out Mind Flayer is the role that rhymes with Kind Slayer :sillyspin:

am i going to be well known for my chunks of text
After having some walls of text of my own sometimes, your wall just made me realise they are awful to quote from phone. Maybe I'll respond when I get on my laptop.

Also, whatever happened to w3? Is he even in the game? I know I saw his list on the signups... It's rare to see him have no useless posts ;)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 06:10:47 am
Wouldn't vigis not have a huge chance to be roleblocked? Possibly even through the nightkill, since that takes priority over Inflate and Devour. Mafia can even protect a townie this way, in hopes of setting up a mislynch the day after. I'd rather risk a double vig on the same target, than have them claim before their ability has been used, the day after works just as well for claiming, no?
This reads kind of oddly. You would rather trust that vigging roles will out after their target dies than before? I'm not concerned with being roleblocked, as that puts pressure on whoever roleblocked the kill to either out themselves as a roleblocking role or as mafia. There's the possibility that it could be mafia trying to cast suspicion on the agreed kill for roleblocking the outted vig roles, but that would deter roleblocking roles from the GN if we have one.
If a Golden Nymph does die this way, you will also notice that it is probably no longer beneficial to random vig.
I consider the two plans to be mutually exclusive. Don't forget that Otyugh will also be revealed by system message, so they cannot hide regardless. Role blocking is something that can be done quite silently, however. Since people only keep role blocking roles for that one night, it will be virtually impossible to tell whom did it unless they are caught in the act.

GN should claim, but as town we should decide not to eat them if they don't want to be eaten, otherwise it's pretty unlikely they'll actually claim. I at least will not be eating them against their will. I'll probably just eat w3 since it will make me laugh the most.
Agree that GNs should claim. I hope there's another one because I really don't want to be the first Nightkill two games in a row.

Toadfish and Otyugh should not claim. You'll find out who I targeted when we get to N1.

Soft claim ALL the roles!

I'm not going to soft claim all the roles, that would be silly. I'll only soft the one that I have. Which in this case happens to be a little on the spooky side.
Alright guys, enough messing around. I finally looked at my role PM. I won't say what it is, but it rhymes with Kind Slayer.
???
Linkcat is being silly, it's basically right there in your list of quotes.

After having some walls of text of my own sometimes, your wall just made me realise they are awful to quote from phone. Maybe I'll respond when I get on my laptop.
I still prefer walls over quadruple+ posts, by the way :silly:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 06:32:40 am
Wouldn't vigis not have a huge chance to be roleblocked? Possibly even through the nightkill, since that takes priority over Inflate and Devour. Mafia can even protect a townie this way, in hopes of setting up a mislynch the day after. I'd rather risk a double vig on the same target, than have them claim before their ability has been used, the day after works just as well for claiming, no?
This reads kind of oddly. You would rather trust that vigging roles will out after their target dies than before? I'm not concerned with being roleblocked, as that puts pressure on whoever roleblocked the kill to either out themselves as a roleblocking role or as mafia. There's the possibility that it could be mafia trying to cast suspicion on the agreed kill for roleblocking the outted vig roles, but that would deter roleblocking roles from the GN if we have one.
If a Golden Nymph does die this way, you will also notice that it is probably no longer beneficial to random vig.
I consider the two plans to be mutually exclusive. Don't forget that Otyugh will also be revealed by system message, so they cannot hide regardless. Role blocking is something that can be done quite silently, however. Since people only keep role blocking roles for that one night, it will be virtually impossible to tell whom did it unless they are caught in the act.
wow haha didn't see that otyugh would be revealed yikes
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 07:00:12 am
Also, whatever happened to w3? Is he even in the game? I know I saw his list on the signups... It's rare to see him have no useless posts ;)

I'm Deja Vu with w3, he told me he's been too depressed to post because he finally realized how bad he is at mafia.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 07:02:02 am
Also, whatever happened to w3? Is he even in the game? I know I saw his list on the signups... It's rare to see him have no useless posts ;)

I'm Deja Vu with w3, he told me he's been too depressed to post because he finally realized how bad he is at mafia.
I cc this claim, I'm deja vu with w3 and he said he's waiting to craft the perfect post to take you down.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 08:35:52 am
That's obviously a fake cc, w3 never thinks before he posts.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 22, 2020, 09:18:05 am
ian, do your thing and roll the team for us already
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 10:02:58 am
geez Linkcat gets scummier every game regardless of alignement. oh well, i suppose he's just trolling. Anyway these needless (although most probably not serious) claims made me think whether a nightly (or night1) massclaim would actually be beneficial, as we dont really have to protect gn until one does die or a crusader gn comes up (although at that time it would kinda be too late to protect them through not claiming).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 10:04:38 am
Anyway:

Unofficial nightly lynchvote in case of oty:

shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

I have nothing to go off and killing shock seems like the most protown completely random move.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 10:06:16 am
geez Linkcat gets scummier every game regardless of alignement. oh well, i suppose he's just trolling. Anyway these needless (although most probably not serious) claims made me think whether a nightly (or night1) massclaim would actually be beneficial, as we dont really have to protect gn until one does die or a crusader gn comes up (although at that time it would kinda be too late to protect them through not claiming).
inb4 "I claim fate egg"
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 22, 2020, 10:19:58 am
I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
shock & I are deja vus
So, nice soft and hard, but if you really are GN here, it has been discussed and agreed that you are an optimal vighit n0. It's too risky not to have the role available for vultures and to gain permanent GNs, especially because of the possibility of not rolling one again for a while.

So, I think the discussion hasn't actually been that clear on "optimal" but maybe that's because I'd want some probabilities calculated rather than people trusting the guy who's just trolling everyone by spamming the thread with claims for all the roles

I count 22 roles to roll. There'll be at most 15 people d1, 14 if I were oty target. It'll take 4 days to get 2 checks out of a vulture. Let's say day 2 someone rolls vulture. Day 3 they're GN. Day 4 they know one check. Day 5 they know one check. Day 6 they know two checks

A bit less than 10% of roles are vig. So we can expect a ~3 people to die per day. d1:15, d2:12, d3:9, d4:6, d5:3

But Toadfish shouldn't target me. It's as likely someone rolled oty as it is someone rolled sader

Next exercise, summing up those body counts, d1:15, d2:27, d3:36, d4:42, d5:45

So we expect ~2 vultures this game. But only 1 before d3

This math changes if people decide that vigs should holster. But then you have to do an EV comparison of having good vulture target as opposed to having vigs

PS your face is a dumbtell
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 10:30:00 am
Anyway:

Unofficial nightly lynchvote in case of oty:

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

I have nothing to go off and killing shock seems like the most protown completely random move.
Not sure how much you believe the latter statement to be true, still trying to gauge if you're actually mafia trying to justify town vigs through these votes. Regardless, I think the most likely outcome of a shock vig is a dead town and no info.
I'd mostly just feel bad about killing shock N0 after getting lynched D1 last mafia. It even looks like Linkcat had to edit him into the signup list.

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 22, 2020, 10:38:24 am
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

kaempf's trying to instigate town to vig my check, stay classy
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 10:49:29 am
well gn obv shouldnt target what everyone agrees to be the vigtarget.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 22, 2020, 12:15:18 pm
Mafia team: kdz, TorB, shock
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 22, 2020, 01:44:33 pm
Mafia team: kdz, TorB, shock

S O L V E D G A M E
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 22, 2020, 01:45:09 pm
I think the dice are biased, Ive been rolled every game :c
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 02:33:46 pm
(https://www.memesmonkey.com/images/memesmonkey/b5/b5cb9c7e00e59e745663bcdbcaaf286a.jpeg)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 02:37:46 pm
can crusader target dead people? if not, then we shouldnt really go around killing GN, crusaders are basically same as vulture but on alive.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 02:45:17 pm
can crusader target dead people? if not, then we shouldnt really go around killing GN, crusaders are basically same as vulture but on alive.
They won't be dead yet by the time Crusaders target them, and they won't be GN anymore after that night, regardless of whether they live or die.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 06:13:40 pm
TorB, you need to realize that voting no vig is not just similiar but identical to voting no lynch. My suggestion was to leash any vigs to target a consensus target, even if its their mafiabuddy. it is identical to a lynchvote except potential multiple vigs crossstreaming, a mafiabuddy casting angel on the target and the person themselves rolling vig (valid arguments against it, none of which are adressed with no vig however)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 06:32:15 pm
You're using lynches to get information as town, correct? What kind of information are you hoping to gain from an N0 vig? If someone is about to get lynched, they can make claims about the information they gathered or the suspicions they have and have town accept them as not a mafia ploy when that person dies and flips town. As long as a GN dies tonight or day 1, I still have faith in the potential for a lot of information to be gathered by town without relying on killing people. I might even favor no lynch day 1 if someone dies as Golden Nymph tonight, unless someone has specific information that leads them to believe someone is mafia.

The crucial point is that not lynching people does not necessarily cause the game to go stale with no new info for town on whom the mafia are in this game, while town is being picked off one by one. This is a crucial point on why no lynch is generally bad.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 06:36:01 pm
We have wagonomics all the same; the info is the same as if we lynched someone if people could be arsed to do things. and as serprex mathed gn vulturing on average is not enough to solve the game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 07:05:20 pm
So we got a GN or nah? I mean, I'm a GN, but I'm the kind we deserve, not the kind we need right now.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 22, 2020, 07:23:17 pm
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

Hes been the only one to claim GN, troll or not.

Also, @TORB I dont understand the mental gymnastics youre pulling. There isnt really a strong downside to vigging in a game where no role is permanent.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 22, 2020, 07:28:07 pm
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

To me it seems silly to vig N0. It's in no way a no lynch vote, because for no lynch multiple people have to openly vote and decide on that. Vig N0 gives us little to no information about the possible mafia teams, and it's only good if we actually hit a mafia, but it would be a blind shot.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 07:44:56 pm
Hes been the only one to claim GN, troll or not.
serprex says hi.

Also, @TORB I dont understand the mental gymnastics youre pulling. There isnt really a strong downside to vigging in a game where no role is permanent.
More days to roll the vulture role, more days for GN checks. Speeding up the game with vigs allows for fewer uses of info roles to find mafia. Longer games will lead to more accurate lynches.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 08:02:11 pm
Whyre we voting, I haven’t read rules but has it been changed that you vote at night instead?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:04:57 pm
torb there is no reliable gn claim rn, so you really cant count on that plan. on average the night action only game results in a townloss so we really need to use all the power we can get.

@cal Not enough people can be arsed to vote so this vote isnt representative so ill no lynch is one of the worst reasons to no lynch yet
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 22, 2020, 08:14:41 pm
More days to roll the vulture role, more days for GN checks. Speeding up the game with vigs allows for fewer uses of info roles to find mafia. Longer games will lead to more accurate lynches.

No. If we kill GN N1, then every single vulture roll late in the game will get GN. Why have 1 GN running around wasting time when we can have 4 and get everyone targeted. You cant play firestall in mafia.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 08:18:29 pm
More days to roll the vulture role, more days for GN checks. Speeding up the game with vigs allows for fewer uses of info roles to find mafia. Longer games will lead to more accurate lynches.

No. If we kill GN N1, then every single vulture roll late in the game will get GN. Why have 1 GN running around wasting time when we can have 4 and get everyone targeted. You cant play firestall in mafia.
If you want to vig GN, Link doesn't make sense to me. His current claims aren't worth shit. I'm talking about non-GN vigs in that post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 08:22:43 pm
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

kaempf's trying to instigate town to vig my check, stay classy
well gn obv shouldnt target what everyone agrees to be the vigtarget.
GN should claim, but as town we should decide not to eat them if they don't want to be eaten, otherwise it's pretty unlikely they'll actually claim. I at least will not be eating them against their will. I'll probably just eat w3 since it will make me laugh the most.
I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
Here are multiple instances in which you interacted with serprex, who repeatedly softed that he is GN. You missed this after saying you're hypervigilant to slips last game? How much more reliable does this have to get?


More days to roll the vulture role, more days for GN checks. Speeding up the game with vigs allows for fewer uses of info roles to find mafia. Longer games will lead to more accurate lynches.

No. If we kill GN N1, then every single vulture roll late in the game will get GN. Why have 1 GN running around wasting time when we can have 4 and get everyone targeted. You cant play firestall in mafia.
I think TorB's point here is that the vig should be targetted on a specific claim of GN, not a random vig as kae was suggesting with shock. I firmly believe that a randomvig is not the best idea until we get more information, especially if an otyugh eats a toadfish, and a n0 GN vig should be the only vig for most of the game that we should consider. There are few downsides besides the numbers game. Everything else can be watched or outed by the notifications that come after someone is eaten.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 08:23:04 pm
TorB ninja'd me with his post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:25:31 pm
serprex has joined the trolltrinity of link and shock. You should notice that those people cant be trusted no matter what. i jump at slips from people were that isnt normal.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 22, 2020, 08:26:21 pm
OHHHHH ok. Yes i am against random vigging. Having GN claim now will suck for the GN player as they die right away, but its to helps town and can allow us to just win fast.... however, Mafia can have GN role and that makes sense as to why they arent claiming. Really, it looks scummy af to not claim as town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:27:29 pm
but anyway if you want serp as gnclaim to be eaten vote and argue accordingly. If you are trying to make the same push on me as at the end last game you waste your breath
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 08:31:54 pm
serprex has joined the trolltrinity of link and shock. You should notice that those people cant be trusted no matter what. i jump at slips from people were that isnt normal.
But he's outing as Golden Nymph. The only scenario in which this is not benefical to the town is if the mafia poisons him before otyugh eats him, and that possibly poisons a town otyugh. If he's claiming a role that is going to get vigged, why would he claim it as any other role?

but anyway if you want serp as gnclaim to be eaten vote and argue accordingly. If you are trying to make the same push on me as at the end last game you waste your breath
Your voting system doesn't dictate the actions of the people in this game, and that last line isn't a towny thing to say. I'm not pushing on you as mafia right now, we're in n0. The voting is great in practice, but you're not voting on someone who claimed GN with few downsides to eating them and the way you're talking right now makes it seem like you won't flip either. No need to tunnel n0 my friend.


shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:36:51 pm
uhm, I'm not tunneling? Its just that shock is simply the most detrimental to town on average.
But I do find it suspicious that you are trying to make the same push on me as last game where you knew i was town and thus should be accutely aware that this is nothing unusual for my townplay.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 08:39:13 pm
uhm, I'm not tunneling? Its just that shock is simply the most detrimental to town on average.
But I do find it suspicious that you are trying to make the same push on me as last game where you knew i was town and thus should be accutely aware that this is nothing unusual for my townplay.
I'm not pushing on you.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 22, 2020, 08:41:04 pm
hi
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:42:13 pm
As to why I know serprexs claims cannot be trusted, he was a major contribution to my confusion about shocks role in the game where you died immediately.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:44:14 pm
But honestly i dont mind voting either shock or serprex simply because they just cant stop themselves from messing with town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:45:24 pm
Link is just too good at the game to kill off early as town as he might suddenly decide to play the game properly and become a major asset, hence why i completely ignore his scumminess this and the last game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 08:46:35 pm
But honestly i dont mind voting either shock or serprex simply because they just cant stop themselves from messing with town.
Then vote serprex, the GN claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 22, 2020, 08:46:41 pm
So MW's saying silly things, business as usual, but the "vig GN for a fast win" is not how this works. If y'all going to vig me you better understand exactly how we're playing this out

Someone who isn't going to be dead if this plan goes through should post the numbers of how long things should drag out for an EV positive result. "4 vultures" is not realistic. I would hope that people who are on a card game forum would understand something about RNG but apparently this is a mafia forum now where we go off how we're reading people & bucket me into a trolltrinity when I'm posting numerical analysis
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:51:29 pm
The trolling part are your roleclaims, im fine with your numbers.
However killing of the gn is an about evenish trade, so I'm not sure why we started screaming for their head anyway.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 08:52:30 pm
In fact it might be best not to claim, hoping to bait the nightkill, so we dont have towaste a vigshot.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 22, 2020, 08:56:24 pm
For starters, there is no GN that claimed that found themselves getting killed to be a good idea. I stated earlier that I would prefer to only kill the GN if they agreed it was a good idea. Because honestly?
So MW's saying silly things, business as usual, but the "vig GN for a fast win" is not how this works. If y'all going to vig me you better understand exactly how we're playing this out

Someone who isn't going to be dead if this plan goes through should post the numbers of how long things should drag out for an EV positive result. "4 vultures" is not realistic. I would hope that people who are on a card game forum would understand something about RNG but apparently this is a mafia forum now where we go off how we're reading people & bucket me into a trolltrinity when I'm posting numerical analysis
I have no clue.
Fact: having a dead GN N0 is good for town because all future vultures permanently gain the GN ability.
Is this worth killing a town GN for and missing out on their result? No idea. I think it's fair to state that having them get nightkilled this night is the most town positive nightkill we can get due to vulture thing. But does this really warrant actively vigging them, and what is this based on? Gut feeling? An idea?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 22, 2020, 09:12:55 pm
I'm targeting kaempfer13 tonight.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 09:15:17 pm
FWIW, I don’t think it’s worth killing off GN
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 22, 2020, 09:23:19 pm
My opinions on the current topics:

Random vigging in N0 sounds like a bad idea. I'm in favor of vigging GN if they are okay with that. Regardless, I think any town!GN should step up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 09:29:12 pm
Crusader, Dragonfly, and FFQ should target serp even if we don't eat him, Toadfishes and anyone else that rolled Warden should never target him.

The value of a check is more than just pure numbers. The right check at the right time can alter the course of the entire game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 09:41:26 pm
The merits here are that we can get max 1 report off of a randomly rolled GN. By ensuring that a GN dies tonight, we can maximize the possibility of future reports instead of getting one report which could possibly be on dead anyway. I can run the numbers soon.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 09:43:24 pm
Also, GN will just get roleblocked if not killed, making it just another wasted day without possibly benefiting from maximizing vulture efficiency. Even if there is a dragonfly in play right now, we can’t play with the idea that they’re working in the town’s benefit.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 22, 2020, 09:49:10 pm
So MW's saying silly things, business as usual, but the "vig GN for a fast win" is not how this works. If y'all going to vig me you better understand exactly how we're playing this out

Someone who isn't going to be dead if this plan goes through should post the numbers of how long things should drag out for an EV positive result. "4 vultures" is not realistic. I would hope that people who are on a card game forum would understand something about RNG but apparently this is a mafia forum now where we go off how we're reading people & bucket me into a trolltrinity when I'm posting numerical analysis

Ok yea, 4 vultures was me exagerating. But Mr. Mathmetician, how likely is it that in say 6 rounds we get at least 2 vultures? Heck even 3. 2 GNs is better than 1 GN. The sooner we can have more than 1 GN the better off we are as town. Otherwise, we are just sitting at the chance of someone rolling a GN each round and only getting 1 peek per round. I havent read the rules, but i believe GN is the only role thats locked down to a certain amount rolled? Maybe Deja is too.

For starters, there is no GN that claimed that found themselves getting killed to be a good idea. I stated earlier that I would prefer to only kill the GN if they agreed it was a good idea. Because honestly?
So MW's saying silly things, business as usual, but the "vig GN for a fast win" is not how this works. If y'all going to vig me you better understand exactly how we're playing this out

Someone who isn't going to be dead if this plan goes through should post the numbers of how long things should drag out for an EV positive result. "4 vultures" is not realistic. I would hope that people who are on a card game forum would understand something about RNG but apparently this is a mafia forum now where we go off how we're reading people & bucket me into a trolltrinity when I'm posting numerical analysis
I have no clue.
Fact: having a dead GN N0 is good for town because all future vultures permanently gain the GN ability.
Is this worth killing a town GN for and missing out on their result? No idea. I think it's fair to state that having them get nightkilled this night is the most town positive nightkill we can get due to vulture thing. But does this really warrant actively vigging them, and what is this based on? Gut feeling? An idea?

Yes it is. The chance they hit a maf while everyone is still alive is lower than when people are ded. The sooner we vig GN, the higher chance they targeted a town with their ability.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 09:54:03 pm
well thing is gn is probably also town (at least if they step up) and vig could have hit a scum instead. It about evens out.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 22, 2020, 09:54:55 pm
I havent read the rules, but i believe GN is the only role thats locked down to a certain amount rolled? Maybe Deja is too.

I think the only restriction is that you won't roll the same role more than once, doesn't matter what role it is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 09:59:10 pm
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 10:17:57 pm
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Except now the GN has already outed and will be roleblocked, and could also be mafia faking a report tomorrow, so I am much more comfortable with possibly vigging a maf GN and allowing others to take the role as it comes. We can have future GNs hide after we have one dead, and if they roll GN as their temp role, all the better for us.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 22, 2020, 10:18:57 pm
In my mind, a GN in the grave gives every vulture roll from here on out a permanent GN, which means for waiting one turn you get potentially multiple uses. Does it suck to a kill a gn, yeah probably, but its not like they were guaranteed to be town anyway, but the vultures, who also arent guaranteed to be town, will permanently be GNs, its like we can either take a temporary good thing now, or we can wait 2 night and have unlimited of a good thing. The way I see it is similar to what torb has been saying earlier, the longer we expect the game to go on, the better a n0 golden nymph kill is. I'd say the borderline is n5. If we think the game will go beyond n5, its almost exclusively good, if we think its less then 5, it probably isn't.

For the record, if I was a golden nymph tonight, I would happily offer up for potentially unlimited GN. But this all only works if we take it slowly and don't spam vig shots like kae is trying to justify on shock rn. If that's not the kind of game you all want then this conversation is pretty pointless anyway

So in my mind we either kill of a gn, and then basically drawgo every round until we reach cop inevitability, or we play as normal and a half dozen people die to vig shots.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 22, 2020, 10:23:54 pm
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Except now the GN has already outed and will be roleblocked, and could also be mafia faking a report tomorrow, so I am much more comfortable with possibly vigging a maf GN and allowing others to take the role as it comes. We can have future GNs hide after we have one dead, and if they roll GN as their temp role, all the better for us.

But the GN has not been outed
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 22, 2020, 10:40:24 pm
Well, given that everyone seems to say holster (which I consider stupid) or kill gn claim for vig, i suppose its become a debate of losing a peek + a townie ( rather than also the vigshot which you guys happily want to throw away) for all vultures becoming gn
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 22, 2020, 10:44:27 pm
I'm pro not holstering N0 vig, I just think kaempfer13 should be the target in that case
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 22, 2020, 10:52:38 pm
I'm pro not holstering N0 vig, I just think kaempfer13 should be the target in that case
Lmao, a valid compromise
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 22, 2020, 10:54:54 pm
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Except now the GN has already outed and will be roleblocked, and could also be mafia faking a report tomorrow, so I am much more comfortable with possibly vigging a maf GN and allowing others to take the role as it comes. We can have future GNs hide after we have one dead, and if they roll GN as their temp role, all the better for us.

But the GN has not been outed
Serp has claimed and i addressed this multiple times.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 22, 2020, 11:19:29 pm
Since it's almost deadline, I should mention that I will be using Divine Shield tonight so don't bother NKing me kthx.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 23, 2020, 12:18:52 am
Catching up while I can. Posting thoughts.

Mafia has no real reason to kill GN right now; it's just generating Vulture fodder and that's not good for them at all.

I believe claiming GN ASAP is strictly pro town, especially since it gives opportunity to any Crusaders present right now to get a GN role and mafia can't really get rid of GNs since roles change every night, unless they hit Crusader/Vulture in which case I believe generates more Vulture fodder. Not sure what the ordering of roles is when someone dies; if it was mentioned, please do me a favor and quote it. Also what role(s) Crusader gets when targeting someone with multiple roles. If mafia doesn't kill GN (which I don't think they will) I believe a GN lynch/vig to feed some Vultures N1 should be a good thing. Random vigging I do not agree with, though; vigs should be at least focused to a few people we know to be scum/useful Vulture targets. Random vigs will just mean town loses very quickly.

I think D1 GN hard claim is better than N0 claim, but oh well.

I believe this should be obvious, but I don't think anyone mentioned it and if they did then might as well just ignore me: Vultures and Crusader should target every night.

@shock: I believe this is just you being... well, you, but why claim who you are targetting tonight? I get that for this game because of roles chainging claiming and whatnot has a much lesser value, but still. What do you want to warn/tell us here?

I'm currently reading really fast and having a headache from three consecutive five-hour exams, one more coming up tomorrow. I'll fix whatever the heck this post causes when I'm done with these exams.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 12:19:56 am
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Except now the GN has already outed and will be roleblocked, and could also be mafia faking a report tomorrow, so I am much more comfortable with possibly vigging a maf GN and allowing others to take the role as it comes. We can have future GNs hide after we have one dead, and if they roll GN as their temp role, all the better for us.

But the GN has not been outed
Serp has claimed and i addressed this multiple times.

I don’t think that was a serious claim
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 12:32:20 am
Using a vulture on GN Wastes so much time that it’s unlikely to be more than a one for one trade off. Gn dies N0, vulture uses ability on GN N1 (if anyone even gets vulture), vulture uses GN ability N2, then on cool down for N3. At the end of N3, we’ve gained the same amount of information had we not killed the GN. Yh we can roll multiple vultures, but we can also roll 0 vultures. It’s a gamble that I’m not sure worth going for, considering we can all roll GN once anyways
Except now the GN has already outed and will be roleblocked, and could also be mafia faking a report tomorrow, so I am much more comfortable with possibly vigging a maf GN and allowing others to take the role as it comes. We can have future GNs hide after we have one dead, and if they roll GN as their temp role, all the better for us.

But the GN has not been outed
Serp has claimed and i addressed this multiple times.

I don’t think that was a serious claim
He hasn't retracted yet, is a likely vig target having claimed it and has made multiple posts referencing his PoV regarding being the GN. If he were not being serious, it would have been outted before now.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 01:00:04 am
Night 0 has concluded - hold please, while the bits and bytes are compiled, analyzed, and results posted soon(TM)...

...
...

...


....
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 01:36:20 am
DAY 1

TheonlyrealBeef was nightkilled. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Firefly Queen]

serprex was devoured by Linkcat. He was a False God and a Fate Egg. [Golden Nymph]

DAY 1: Day 1 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 01:37:52 am
Start of Day 1 hatching reports submitted, refer to nearest Inbox location for report data.

2. Linkcat
3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
7. worldwideweb3
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 02:15:20 am
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/fddb772ea4cd6c2e85ed0187a3eef890/tenor.gif)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 02:16:33 am
What a fucking outcome, see the plan worked lmao
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 02:16:50 am
Oh uh, rip in peace trob
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 02:17:26 am
Investigative roles claim last.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 23, 2020, 02:53:48 am
S O L V E D G A M E

On a more serious note, serp's declared intent of protecting shock from a policy lynch on D1 and this post in particular

I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap

just got way more interesting.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 03:04:31 am
S O L V E D G A M E

On a more serious note, serp's declared intent of protecting shock from a policy lynch on D1 and this post in particular

I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap

just got way more interesting.
I was going to point that out, and kae’s semi-protection or divertion from serp, and w3’s saying he doesn’t believe serp. Given kae’s wanting to random vig shock, I think that it’s kind of out of question for them to be the same alignment unless they’re hard bussing.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 03:12:07 am
Lol, i was oty and also targeted serp (because there was no other choice really) oh well anyway thats an unusually good start.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 03:18:53 am
We claiming what we were yesterday? I was Deja but Ill let my other deja reveal themselves if they wish.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 03:34:00 am
Lol, i was oty and also targeted serp (because there was no other choice really) oh well anyway thats an unusually good start.

(https://media3.giphy.com/media/DFNd1yVyRjmF2/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 04:21:34 am
Hey rob, under what circumstances does an oty not get revealed? If they were roleblocked, if the eat didn’t go through or what?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:35:58 am
I got a cryptic "trouble sleeping" (on point) + man in rhe mirror message, so i take it rob chose to give link priority. Personally i would have preferred it if we mauled him both to death.
Anyway i got no system messages beyond that, except for the next role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:40:22 am
First part really sounded like gotp, but i dont think you're supposed to get notified of that until gotp actually dies
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: TheonlyrealBeef on August 23, 2020, 04:56:20 am
You know you're doing things right when you get NK-ed N0? :sillyspin:

That serp flip is hilarious, guess my intuition about mafia GN not claiming was wrong.

Wait, I need to stop posting, I'm already dead :-\
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 05:55:15 am
HOST CLARIFICATION:

A devour resulting in targets death is revealed.

Hey rob, under what circumstances does an oty not get revealed? If they were roleblocked, if the eat didn’t go through or what?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 06:20:36 am
HOST CLARIFICATION:

A devour resulting in targets death is revealed.

Hey rob, under what circumstances does an oty not get revealed? If they were roleblocked, if the eat didn’t go through or what?
Can more than one devour result in the same target's death?
Also, regarding 2 people sending in an ability at the same time, does the person who sent in their action first get priority?

@kae; what led to you deciding to switch your oty target from shock to serp? You didn't change your public vote, and shock said he was using his ability on you (which might be why we don't see your usage).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 06:49:01 am
Does not compute - if you're suggesting someone can die twice, I think it should be obvious "no". Also, time sent on abilities is irrelevant, role priorities are listed for a reason without mention of timing of sending.

Please carry on about the business of the game at-hand, upper management pays the pleebs for work not water cooler chit-chat.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 06:52:13 am
Rob - if 2 otyughs use their ability on the same target, and both abilities go through, will the target appear as having been eaten by both people?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 06:59:25 am
Please carry on about the business of the game at-hand, upper management pays the pleebs for work not water cooler chit-chat.

Okay but our benefits kinda suck, when are we getting dental? I could just go to w3 but I'd like my mouth to stay in a somewhat recognizable state.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 23, 2020, 07:18:09 am
Coffee-
A player can die once. The announcement includes the reveal about the devouring if an Otyugh kills someone. It would be unfortunate if a situation developed requiring a docking of pay - back to work!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 07:41:23 am
People who supported GN kill after serp softed:
Coffee
MW
andre
kdz
Naii

Before:
iancu
moe
Nae

Didn't address directly:
Oa
Cal
shock

Said a lot about but did not commit to one side:
kae

Against:
w3

I'd put my vote on w3 right now but sadly I rolled Graboid.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 07:43:35 am
I'm much more interested in hearing what kae has to say about these transgressions, and possibly hearing what role shock targeted kae with last night.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 07:50:20 am
I didn’t even believe serp was GN lol
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 08:59:37 am
Rob- can you just answer the question? If 2 otys (obv same priority) target the same person what determines the announcement.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 09:10:23 am
There is a reason i stayed up extra long and went on and on about  vig leashing, because peole here hate correct vig play and lynch any missing vig. I was the only one supporting shockvig (wth even is going on) halfofficial votes were unuseable and about  half the players each (some both) supported gn kill or holszering. Serprex was the only choice and my last post males that clear.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 09:15:23 am
Also rob if an ability targets a person that dies before its priority could a dragonfly on them see that they zargeted the person?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 09:23:34 am
Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 23, 2020, 09:46:18 am
Wow, nice hit on serp right there. +towncred for Link.

Anyhow - I was anubis last night but didn’t use my ability. What a lame role
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 10:07:39 am
Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.

shock targetted u so either he blocked or has info on u
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 10:09:35 am
Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.

shock targetted u so either he blocked or has info on u

according to shock, i should clarify.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 10:17:51 am
Multiple Devour actions targeting the same person is decided by RNG.

Of the abilities that have lower priority than the Nightkill, only Inflate and Devour are unable to resolve on a dead target.

Whether you were roleblocked or your ability could not resolve for another reason, you should have simply gotten a message saying that your ability failed. There's no distinction between the different causes.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:21:33 am
I feel like noting that if serp hadnt flipped scum I would have eyed Linkcat with great suspicion (despite me choosing the same action) as his leadup was horrible. he said a gn shouldnt be devoured against their will and encouraged use of abilities on serp that he knew would fail.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:22:41 am
Anyway this is +ev

shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

his literally only post is "i roleblock kaemp durr"
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:34:52 am
Out of the people that wanted gn dead I townread all except coffee. This isnt (just) personal vendetta. as loud as he was about it, this is consistent with his needless bus on dc last game and him tmiing scumroles and trying to lynch people based on not automatically scumreading those roles.
As hard as he is trying to appear scum, Linkcat is obv town.
I believe w3 that he had no idea that serp was actually gn and thus townread him as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 23, 2020, 10:35:37 am
I feel like noting that if serp hadnt flipped scum I would have eyed Linkcat with great suspicion (despite me choosing the same action) as his leadup was horrible. he said a gn shouldnt be devoured against their will and encouraged use of abilities on serp that he knew would fail.
But yours weren’t much better, as you said you would devour shock?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:40:58 am
Link one of my rulequestions was if damselfly can see an oty whose ability failed to resolve due to dead target.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:41:19 am
Well, given that everyone seems to say holster (which I consider stupid) or kill gn claim for vig, i suppose its become a debate of losing a peek + a townie ( rather than also the vigshot which you guys happily want to throw away) for all vultures becoming gn
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:42:51 am
Also my numerous posts about asking for majority vote to decide vigtarget
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 10:49:03 am
This probably sounds really dumb because im voting shock for policy, but i think serp would have townpeeked shock regardless of shock's alignement. For scum!shock it would be the only way to live, for town!shock it would mean he becomes unlynchable and thus can continue playing solitaire in a round of scat, which is obviously bad for his teammates.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 23, 2020, 11:59:34 am
I feel like noting that if serp hadnt flipped scum I would have eyed Linkcat with great suspicion (despite me choosing the same action) as his leadup was horrible. he said a gn shouldnt be devoured against their will and encouraged use of abilities on serp that he knew would fail.

Not really, of the suggested abilities only Dragonfly would fail (check the priorities). That doesn't seem too important because FFQ could have still confirmed the plan went through (if torb hadn't died). About killing GN, serp was acting a tad defensive, so maybe Link got curious how he'd flip.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 12:01:52 pm
I feel like noting that if serp hadn't flipped scum I would have eyed Linkcat with great suspicion (despite me choosing the same action) as his leadup was horrible. he said a gn shouldn't be devoured against their will and encouraged use of abilities on serp that he knew would fail.

I lied.

Don't understand the second part, Sader, Dragonfly, and FFQ all would have resolved on serp.

Anyway this is +ev

shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

his literally only post is "i roleblock kaemp durr"

Not down for policy two games in a row, we can do it again next time.

I believe w3 that he had no idea that serp was actually gn and thus townread him as well.

W3 may be stupid but he's not stupid, it's an easy play for him to make for this exact reason.

Link one of my rulequestions was if damselfly can see an oty whose ability failed to resolve due to dead target.

Read Dragonfly.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 12:05:16 pm
U guys are reading too much into me, it’s not worth the time. I’m just a towny w bad roles
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 12:06:50 pm
What was your N0 role?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 12:08:44 pm
Phoenix
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 23, 2020, 12:11:51 pm
Read Dragonfly.

Hmm, missed the regardless of priority thing
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:25:37 pm
yh but their value is decreased by this. ffq doesnt report on dead people damselfly confirms the public announcement ::) etc
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:27:19 pm
ok the etc was sader and that would be correct for sure, so nvm
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:27:57 pm
but still you are devaluing the other 2 by making their reports useless even if you dont stop them
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 12:33:23 pm
Dragonfly catches roleblocks, FFQ catches Warden, and they both help confirm Sader claims.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:40:02 pm
oh well its not worth the time to argue with someone that just has to be town about this. But still, there are so many trolls and mechanicanalphabets here, why do you have to make things worse when you really should know better?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 12:40:16 pm
Phoenix

Hi don’t ignore my claim kthnx bye
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:42:11 pm
one thing i cant stop myself from saying is we dont actually want people to know who the saders are unless they were forced to claim
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 12:47:22 pm
Phoenix

Hi don’t ignore my claim kthnx bye
Hi dont divert from relevant discussion when your roleclaim is inconsequential kthx bye
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 23, 2020, 12:53:53 pm
@w3  As someone who fake claimed phoenix 2 mafias ago, this sounds awfully convenient to me (or maybe RNG just hates you, who knows?)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 12:58:37 pm
@w3  As someone who fake claimed phoenix 2 mafias ago, this sounds awfully convenient to me (or maybe RNG just hates you, who knows?)

It was acc nice of rob to give me Phoenix, I was essentially unkillable. Sad I didn’t get nked
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 23, 2020, 01:00:15 pm
@w3  As someone who fake claimed phoenix 2 mafias ago, this sounds awfully convenient to me (or maybe RNG just hates you, who knows?)
Absolutely not
Seems like he was just unlucky
Happens to everybody
;)

For real though, while phoenix was like one of the only possible fake claims to escape with that time, in this scrambled egg breakfast there are an awful lot of roles that can be fake claimed, and especially N0. I'm not reading too much into it yet tbh
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 01:01:07 pm
one thing i cant stop myself from saying is we dont actually want people to know who the saders are unless they were forced to claim

If they're town then it only helps for them to know. If they're mafia they won't listen to me anyway.

Phoenix

Hi don’t ignore my claim kthnx bye

Well now I'm glad I didn't vig you n0, then you'd never shut up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 02:46:50 pm
You wont believe it guys, but hard claim fate egg. I know, sounds crazy. Three fate eggs in one game amiright?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 02:50:27 pm
People who supported GN kill after serp softed:
Coffee
MW
andre
kdz
Naii

Before:
iancu
moe
Nae

Didn't address directly:
Oa
Cal
shock

Said a lot about but did not commit to one side:
kae

Against:
w3

I'd put my vote on w3 right now but sadly I rolled Graboid.
I'd like to pull this back front and center, I think it was an important post

Im inclined to want to lynch w3, but I don't really mind playing this slowly and doing the cop army strat torb mentioned as a possibility. I know that no voting is a cardinal sin, but I think we should at least consider it in this specific circumstance. I believe there is some validity in it, but I understand the primal desire to rise above others and murder w3
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 23, 2020, 03:03:22 pm
My current stance is that the ones who avoided the topic are slightly more suspicious than people like w3. Yeah, I do realize I might have drawn a short stick here, as I'm kinda in that group as well, but not really much I can do about it now is it. serp pulling up the numbers gives w3's stance a bit more credibility in my book, but then again, serp flipped scum GN and probably just wanted to survive a potential vig.

As for no lynch... dunno, a bit conflicted there. I'm fine with lynching any of non-GN-supporters at this current game state, unless anyone has some N0 juice that can point towards something.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 23, 2020, 03:26:56 pm
Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.

Multiple Devour actions targeting the same person is decided by RNG.

Of the abilities that have lower priority than the Nightkill, only Inflate and Devour are unable to resolve on a dead target.

Whether you were roleblocked or your ability could not resolve for another reason, you should have simply gotten a message saying that your ability failed. There's no distinction between the different causes.


Okay, can we get some sort of clarification here? Because this is pretty important and I don't take lightly to someone immediately placing blame on me, especially since I did not have a role blocking role last night. So the only options here are:

1.) kaempf got that message because he RNGed second devour, and therefore since Linkcat already killed, his action failed
2.) someone else roleblocked kaempf for real, probably to frame me, since I said I was going to target kaempf
3.) kaempf is lying for some reason. The only that I can think of is to get an easy lynch on me and avoid providing wagonomics on others, which he knows is a safe play and unlikely to hurt his town cred even if I flip town.


So yeah, either kaempf or rob really needs to clarify some stuff here.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 23, 2020, 03:54:56 pm
Should investigative roles claim what they have seen last night? Or should they wait for more claims from everyone and only claim if they spot a lie?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 04:01:45 pm
You know, we could solve the crisis by just killing kae

Should investigative roles claim what they have seen last night? Or should they wait for more claims from everyone and only claim if they spot a lie?
If you hit red as a gn yes, if you just peaked at someones role/useage id hold it until it becomes important
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:03:18 pm
Exploring the wait for everyone to become vulture exploit:
This bans vigshots and roleblocks and allows lynches only when someone claims a red check. Here we will assume that all town players follow the policy. For simplicity's sake I will assume noone rolled vulture yet and therefor no nightkill dodges happen either. Starting now we have 9 nights+ any scumkill to go (- scum vigging, but with the policy in place only toadfishs could hope to get away with it). In night 9 on average 45% of players will have become vulture and this is completely ignoring crusader which has roughly the same odds (but many of them will come live when its not easy to hit a vulture)!

Yep, actually this is a valid strategy surprisingly. So if we want to go resident sleeper i didnt want to solve anyway, we can absolutely go for it and have a somewhat above 50% of winning!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:05:45 pm
oh i forgot roling gn regularly. So yh residentsleeper strat is optimal, if we didnt even wanna play anyway. We have to agree to commit to it though otherwise it gets much worse.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:08:20 pm
Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.

Multiple Devour actions targeting the same person is decided by RNG.

Of the abilities that have lower priority than the Nightkill, only Inflate and Devour are unable to resolve on a dead target.

Whether you were roleblocked or your ability could not resolve for another reason, you should have simply gotten a message saying that your ability failed. There's no distinction between the different causes.


Okay, can we get some sort of clarification here? Because this is pretty important and I don't take lightly to someone immediately placing blame on me, especially since I did not have a role blocking role last night. So the only options here are:

1.) kaempf got that message because he RNGed second devour, and therefore since Linkcat already killed, his action failed
2.) someone else roleblocked kaempf for real, probably to frame me, since I said I was going to target kaempf
3.) kaempf is lying for some reason. The only that I can think of is to get an easy lynch on me and avoid providing wagonomics on others, which he knows is a safe play and unlikely to hurt his town cred even if I flip town.


So yeah, either kaempf or rob really needs to clarify some stuff here.
All i know is that rob told me a lot of things i wasnt supposed to see and that i was roleblocked. If it wasnt you than I'm 90% sure it was scum blocking me (with you it's rand, but this time around you arent even contributing, hence I wouldnt miss you at all)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:11:12 pm
derp i forgot its 12vs2 now so we have 10 nights guaranteed without vigs and lynches.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:16:32 pm
The reason why it's so good is because the chance of rolling vulture increases every night that you dont get it and gives existing vultures more nights on average as well, hence why it is worth it if we keep it up consistently.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:18:10 pm
so
no lynch(1)kaempfer13

do you guys seriously want lynchlog when only 7 players voted btw?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:19:51 pm
*6 2 of which already flipped
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 04:38:40 pm
so
no lynch(1)kaempfer13

do you guys seriously want lynchlog when only 7 players voted btw?

I didnt think that was a real vote, just a feeling the room out for vig shots, which I dont think would have swayed anyone from firing anyway.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 04:41:50 pm
no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

i love a no lynch, esp in a rob hosted mafia.  how ironic.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 23, 2020, 04:46:49 pm
ok we dont need more votes than that for graboid covber if we choose this plan
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 04:50:18 pm
I think i'd like to hear from a wider range of people before I put my full support behind this plan. I know torb was fairly firmly on board, but I'd like to hear from some other voices. For now though I tentatively place my support.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 10:07:18 pm
FWIW, I don’t think it’s worth killing off GN

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks

serp and w3 didnt want to kill GN. serp flipped scum. w3 prob scum.
we are in the lead after a great N0, no lynching will just inch us closer to losing. Lynching based on reads at least has a higher chance of hitting a maf and closing the game. 
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 10:12:13 pm
Out of the people that wanted gn dead I townread all except coffee. This isnt (just) personal vendetta. as loud as he was about it, this is consistent with his needless bus on dc last game and him tmiing scumroles and trying to lynch people based on not automatically scumreading those roles.
As hard as he is trying to appear scum, Linkcat is obv town.
I believe w3 that he had no idea that serp was actually gn and thus townread him as well.
This is much different this game, as bussing DC last game was only beneficial to the town last game in a numbers sense. This game, there are no benefits to bussing serprex especially having known he actually was Golden Nymph. I was also one of the supporters of this plan, not the person to have come up with it (who flipped town as well). I'm not sure what the last part of your message means, but I am as scummy/town as Link for trying to gain credit with a devour of the GN n0. It's not beneficial to mafia at all but Link could be playing the hard bus game as much as you think I was, my friend.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 10:12:41 pm
Tfw u believe that 2 of the mafia will say the same point strongly :facepalm:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 10:39:05 pm
We are not doing ResidentSleeper, this is supposed to be a fun game.

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - MasterWalks, Linkcat

You wont believe it guys, but hard claim fate egg. I know, sounds crazy. Three fate eggs in one game amiright?

I counterclaim, checkmate broski.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 10:46:16 pm
Thats fair, one of the major cons i had been mulling over is how truly boring this game would become. Though as mentioned before the delicious irony of robs game becoming a novote fest is tempting.

We are not doing ResidentSleeper, this is supposed to be a fun game.

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (2) - MasterWalks, Linkcat

You wont believe it guys, but hard claim fate egg. I know, sounds crazy. Three fate eggs in one game amiright?

I counterclaim, checkmate broski.

Damn, well I guess this is over, its been a fun game. Hopefully the other imposter can get it done, I'll spam lights for you <3


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (3) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killsdazombies
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 23, 2020, 10:47:30 pm
no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Naesala

Bandwagoning with Link because they're a big smarty smart and kaemp talks a lot but says little.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 23, 2020, 10:48:06 pm

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala


Forgot to write zombies name oops.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 23, 2020, 10:50:18 pm
Wait are we actually killing off w3 now?

serp and w3 didnt want to kill GN. serp flipped scum. w3 prob scum.

This is kind of a thin reason for bandwagoning, imo
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 10:51:11 pm
There is a reason i stayed up extra long and went on and on about  vig leashing, because peole here hate correct vig play and lynch any missing vig. I was the only one supporting shockvig (wth even is going on) halfofficial votes were unuseable and about  half the players each (some both) supported gn kill or holszering. Serprex was the only choice and my last post males that clear.

Well, given that everyone seems to say holster (which I consider stupid) or kill gn claim for vig, i suppose its become a debate of losing a peek + a townie ( rather than also the vigshot which you guys happily want to throw away) for all vultures becoming gn
This is not indicative of a decision in any direction, it only represents remorse for not being able to vig shock without looking scummy and a reluctant comparison between options of outcomes.


Oh lol, rob just  messaged me that i was roleblocked and he sent me the wrong message. Cmon dude who's gonna believe me that? I know its angly, but you have to confirm that as it caused major confusion.
Still waiting on rob to confirm this.


I feel like noting that if serp hadnt flipped scum I would have eyed Linkcat with great suspicion (despite me choosing the same action) as his leadup was horrible. he said a gn shouldnt be devoured against their will and encouraged use of abilities on serp that he knew would fail.
This is just self-contradictory.. You're scumreading someone else for choosing to do something that you yourself also purportedly did. So you're admitting that the two scenarios here are that one of you bussed or you only townread Link for hitting mafia? That also goes against how you keep posting about town interpereting vig roles, and how you believe they should not be alignment indicative based on how their target flips.


This probably sounds really dumb because im voting shock for policy, but i think serp would have townpeeked shock regardless of shock's alignement. For scum!shock it would be the only way to live, for town!shock it would mean he becomes unlynchable and thus can continue playing solitaire in a round of scat, which is obviously bad for his teammates.
This is a valid point, in that serp's wanting to check shock would have resulted in an inno. Towncred for bringing this to light, but only as is juxtaposed against my other points. The pushing on shock over and over like I am with you is interesting though, because you don't have much to work off of with him.


Okay, can we get some sort of clarification here? Because this is pretty important and I don't take lightly to someone immediately placing blame on me, especially since I did not have a role blocking role last night. So the only options here are:

1.) kaempf got that message because he RNGed second devour, and therefore since Linkcat already killed, his action failed
2.) someone else roleblocked kaempf for real, probably to frame me, since I said I was going to target kaempf
3.) kaempf is lying for some reason. The only that I can think of is to get an easy lynch on me and avoid providing wagonomics on others, which he knows is a safe play and unlikely to hurt his town cred even if I flip town.


So yeah, either kaempf or rob really needs to clarify some stuff here.
This is a pretty solid post and raises more questions for robrules and for kae's claim. I townread this for having outed all feasible possibilities other than shock lying.


Should investigative roles claim what they have seen last night? Or should they wait for more claims from everyone and only claim if they spot a lie?
I would out it now, to be honest. Roles switch every night and it may narrow who can be what role, but with the possibility to roll vulture or crusader and get GN i see this as a minimal issue. The roles switching is more incentive to have that slight protection. I would be wary of fake claims.


derp i forgot its 12vs2 now so we have 10 nights guaranteed without vigs and lynches.
derpclear not granted


I think i'd like to hear from a wider range of people before I put my full support behind this plan. I know torb was fairly firmly on board, but I'd like to hear from some other voices. For now though I tentatively place my support.
I agree with this but am tentatively against NLing; i would also like to hear why you have switched to voting w3 so readily after having asked for more opinions and only hearing that of Link's.

I would like to hear from Naii, Calindu, ian, MasterWalks and moe in general, less fillerish content from Nae, w3 and to an extent andre, and opinions about the lynches from shock.

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 10:51:26 pm
oh nice oa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 23, 2020, 10:59:02 pm
I switched so readily because the point of "Enjoyable game" vs "Autowin" is one that carries a lot of weight, if only because it will make everyone have a much better time, and, will allow dead players to get back into a new game ASAP. Extending a 6 cycle game into 10 or something is an extra week of waiting and watching.

I still think there is a valid conversation on which is best in terms of winning the game, but its no contest as to which is the more enjoyable. Plus I already said I would kill w3.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:02:07 pm
I switched so readily because the point of "Enjoyable game" vs "Autowin" is one that carries a lot of weight, if only because it will make everyone have a much better time, and, will allow dead players to get back into a new game ASAP. Extending a 6 cycle game into 10 or something is an extra week of waiting and watching.

I still think there is a valid conversation on which is best in terms of winning the game, but its no contest as to which is the more enjoyable. Plus I already said I would kill w3.
I agree that the former is true and valid. I wasn't thinking from the perspective of a dead person, because that's not me yet mb. I want to ask you, why do you want to kill w3 and do you think that having the conversation about optimal strategy is valuable if you've just conceded to the more enjoyable way?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 11:13:07 pm
I started typing a full read list, but dont have enough actual reads on people to make it any substance so here is a half-assed one.

N+
shockcannon- actually being useful imo but not active enough. Im willing to believe he didnt block kae.

Calindu- is pushing for info roles to reveal. probably doesnt have much for reads or had an info role and doesnt want to be the only one sharing. Either way, wanting more info in the public is towny.

N
Linkcat- Is using the fun format game to have fun. If i was confident enough in Mafia id do the same. gonna be hard to get an actual read i think.


N-
Kaempfer13- Wants to lynch on principle then wants to no lynch. I think hes trying to be a torb from last game and deeptown. But he contradicts himself wayyyyy too much and rambles too much for me to heavy scum read him.

Coffeeditto- I dont townread you whatsoever. I dont scumread you. But my read on you is important so im putting it here.

V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.

jcj- always scum

I cannot figure out where to put Oa. probably N for now. Everyone else i have no reads on.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 11:13:42 pm
Wow that train got momentum super quick o.O mafia be Tryna lynch me ASAP
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 11:17:11 pm
V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK GN Vig. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.

EBWOP
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 11:17:53 pm
V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK GN Vig. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.

EBWOP

I didn’t want NK either, dw
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:20:48 pm
N+
Calindu- is pushing for info roles to reveal. probably doesnt have much for reads or had an info role and doesnt want to be the only one sharing. Either way, wanting more info in the public is towny.
So far, he only asked a question and hasn't said anything else that benefits the town as a whole. Asking if info roles should reveal is more scummy than not, as he could possibly be setting himself up for a fake report.

Coffeeditto- I dont townread you whatsoever. I dont scumread you. But my read on you is important so im putting it here.
Is this because we were Deja Vu partners last night and i tried to help you to be less universally scumread? I'm wondering what your reasoning is here. Maybe because I hadn't revealed that yet? Not sure why you did.

V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.
Not a strong read beyond echoing what others have already said.
Beyond what I mentioned, it seems like you're only putting people of interest who are already read by others, and Cal. Could be a team in the making? Not sure.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 11:21:02 pm
Aaaaaaaa tfw Ure getting lynched for saying that GN shouldnt be killed aaaaaaaaaaa imma sleep and when I wake up, these votes better be off smh
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:21:27 pm
N+
Calindu- is pushing for info roles to reveal. probably doesnt have much for reads or had an info role and doesnt want to be the only one sharing. Either way, wanting more info in the public is towny.
So far, he only asked a question and hasn't said anything else that benefits the town as a whole. Asking if info roles should reveal is more scummy than not, as he could possibly be setting himself up for a fake report.

Coffeeditto- I dont townread you whatsoever. I dont scumread you. But my read on you is important so im putting it here.
Is this because we were Deja Vu partners last night and i tried to help you to be less universally scumread? I'm wondering what your reasoning is here. Maybe because I hadn't revealed that yet? Not sure why you did.

V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.
Not a strong read beyond echoing what others have already said.
Beyond what I mentioned, it seems like you're only putting people of interest who are already read by others, and Cal. Could be a team in the making? Not sure.

EBWOP for formatting
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:21:52 pm
Aaaaaaaa tfw Ure getting lynched for saying that GN shouldnt be killed aaaaaaaaaaa imma sleep and when I wake up, these votes better be off smh
Give us a reason not to end with you being the lynch other than memery.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 23, 2020, 11:22:33 pm
Aaaaaaaa tfw Ure getting lynched for saying that GN shouldnt be killed aaaaaaaaaaa imma sleep and when I wake up, these votes better be off smh
Give us a reason not to end with you being the lynch other than memery.

First find a good enough reason to lynch. Innocent until proven guilty q.q
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 11:23:13 pm
What was your role shock?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:25:41 pm
What was your role shock?
Not shock here, but possible roles he could have been were Golden Nymph, Psion, Dragonfly, Firefly Queen, Iridium Guardian, Ghost of the Past(!), Guardian Angel and Crusader. If we are to believe both kae and shock, the most likely role was GotP.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 23, 2020, 11:26:20 pm
Wait, nevermind, I won't believe you anyway.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 11:34:08 pm
N+
Calindu- is pushing for info roles to reveal. probably doesnt have much for reads or had an info role and doesnt want to be the only one sharing. Either way, wanting more info in the public is towny.
So far, he only asked a question and hasn't said anything else that benefits the town as a whole. Asking if info roles should reveal is more scummy than not, as he could possibly be setting himself up for a fake report.
Yea shoulda left cal off the list. I just saw his post about sharing intel while i was typing out the list.

Coffeeditto- I dont townread you whatsoever. I dont scumread you. But my read on you is important so im putting it here.
Is this because we were Deja Vu partners last night and i tried to help you to be less universally scumread? I'm wondering what your reasoning is here. Maybe because I hadn't revealed that yet? Not sure why you did.
No, me tunneling is pretty sterotypical of me. I would be surprised if i was scumread for tunneling someone. Now, you pointed out to me that serp also claimed GN. This is why i dont scumread you. I dont townread you because in that same pm your referencing, you referenced (inception) the post where you quoted me and pointed out we shouldnt vig GN unless GN hardclaims. That COULD put you in the same boat as W3 and serp.
Beyond what I mentioned, it seems like you're only putting people of interest who are already read by others, and Cal. Could be a team in the making? Not sure.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 11:36:18 pm
Beyond what I mentioned, it seems like you're only putting people of interest who are already read by others, and Cal. Could be a team in the making? Not sure.

probably because these are the only people of interest? everyone else has less than 5 posts including signup post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 23, 2020, 11:40:25 pm
MW, I would like you to reread through and let me know which PM I sent that said I didn't want to vig unless someone hardclaims. I just read through all of them and the closest thing is asking your opinion on whether or not Link is GN before he started spouting all roles, and agreeing with your scumread on serp.


I started typing a full read list, but dont have enough actual reads on people to make it any substance so here is a half-assed one.

N+
shockcannon- actually being useful imo but not active enough. Im willing to believe he didnt block kae.

Calindu- is pushing for info roles to reveal. probably doesnt have much for reads or had an info role and doesnt want to be the only one sharing. Either way, wanting more info in the public is towny.

N
Linkcat- Is using the fun format game to have fun. If i was confident enough in Mafia id do the same. gonna be hard to get an actual read i think.


N-
Kaempfer13- Wants to lynch on principle then wants to no lynch. I think hes trying to be a torb from last game and deeptown. But he contradicts himself wayyyyy too much and rambles too much for me to heavy scum read him.

Coffeeditto- I dont townread you whatsoever. I dont scumread you. But my read on you is important so im putting it here.

V
worldwideweb3- serp and w3 both didnt want NK. w3 is also still alive so hes doing too good.

jcj- always scum

I cannot figure out where to put Oa. probably N for now. Everyone else i have no reads on.
Beyond what I mentioned, it seems like you're only putting people of interest who are already read by others, and Cal. Could be a team in the making? Not sure.

probably because these are the only people of interest? everyone else has less than 5 posts including signup post.
Calindu has 3, while killsda and andre have over 5 (17 and 16 respectively). In fact, they have both posted more than you.


Also, you're tunneling me? That's what this is?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 23, 2020, 11:54:56 pm
MW, I would like you to reread through and let me know which PM I sent that said I didn't want to vig unless someone hardclaims. I just read through all of them and the closest thing is asking your opinion on whether or not Link is GN before he started spouting all roles, and agreeing with your scumread on serp.
The one where you said im pushing too hard referenced your post about wanting a hardclaim. I cant quote your PM here as that against rules iirc. But it was the lat PM you sent. Sad we didnt get to say goodbye :'( was lonely after rob said i couldnt pm anymore.

Also, you're tunneling me? That's what this is?

What? No. I'm tunneling w3. I put you on the list because you didnt claim deja and just wanted a breadcumb in case you choose not to claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 12:04:52 am
I switched so readily because the point of "Enjoyable game" vs "Autowin" is one that carries a lot of weight, if only because it will make everyone have a much better time, and, will allow dead players to get back into a new game ASAP. Extending a 6 cycle game into 10 or something is an extra week of waiting and watching.

I still think there is a valid conversation on which is best in terms of winning the game, but its no contest as to which is the more enjoyable. Plus I already said I would kill w3.
I agree that the former is true and valid. I wasn't thinking from the perspective of a dead person, because that's not me yet mb. I want to ask you, why do you want to kill w3 and do you think that having the conversation about optimal strategy is valuable if you've just conceded to the more enjoyable way?

Valuable from a theory standpoint, but I meant valid not valuable. By valid, I mean that it should still be on the table, and I do think it is the "best" option but in this case I don't believe best is most enjoyable. Plus the more I thought about it the more I realized I would just use it as an excuse to check out.

As for the w3, he pushed back against the GN kill, which in the moment seems fine, but under the hindsight of a dead mafia member, it makes me uneasy. Further, W3 plays like scum anyway, so I don't mind the kill, and lastly, I just want to. If someones going to die, it may as well be a person that went against a (Hindsight) mafia kill. But obviously I can be swayed by something of substance
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 24, 2020, 01:33:42 am
MW, I would like you to reread through and let me know which PM I sent that said I didn't want to vig unless someone hardclaims. I just read through all of them and the closest thing is asking your opinion on whether or not Link is GN before he started spouting all roles, and agreeing with your scumread on serp.
The one where you said im pushing too hard referenced your post about wanting a hardclaim. I cant quote your PM here as that against rules iirc. But it was the lat PM you sent. Sad we didnt get to say goodbye :'( was lonely after rob said i couldnt pm anymore.

Also, you're tunneling me? That's what this is?

What? No. I'm tunneling w3. I put you on the list because you didnt claim deja and just wanted a breadcumb in case you choose not to claim.
tbh i wanted to send a pm about being sad we wouldn't be able to chat any more but it was an hour before deadline, so :/

as far as my pm correspondence with you goes, i referred you to my last post, that being this post:

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

kaempf's trying to instigate town to vig my check, stay classy
well gn obv shouldnt target what everyone agrees to be the vigtarget.
GN should claim, but as town we should decide not to eat them if they don't want to be eaten, otherwise it's pretty unlikely they'll actually claim. I at least will not be eating them against their will. I'll probably just eat w3 since it will make me laugh the most.
I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
Here are multiple instances in which you interacted with serprex, who repeatedly softed that he is GN. You missed this after saying you're hypervigilant to slips last game? How much more reliable does this have to get?


More days to roll the vulture role, more days for GN checks. Speeding up the game with vigs allows for fewer uses of info roles to find mafia. Longer games will lead to more accurate lynches.

No. If we kill GN N1, then every single vulture roll late in the game will get GN. Why have 1 GN running around wasting time when we can have 4 and get everyone targeted. You cant play firestall in mafia.
I think TorB's point here is that the vig should be targetted on a specific claim of GN, not a random vig as kae was suggesting with shock. I firmly believe that a randomvig is not the best idea until we get more information, especially if an otyugh eats a toadfish, and a n0 GN vig should be the only vig for most of the game that we should consider. There are few downsides besides the numbers game. Everything else can be watched or outed by the notifications that come after someone is eaten.
i understand how you may have been confused by my intent here, but I was vying for the vig of someone claiming GN, not a randomvig/vig outside of GN claim. The hard claim vs soft is beside the point of the post.

mb on the tunneling thing.



I switched so readily because the point of "Enjoyable game" vs "Autowin" is one that carries a lot of weight, if only because it will make everyone have a much better time, and, will allow dead players to get back into a new game ASAP. Extending a 6 cycle game into 10 or something is an extra week of waiting and watching.

I still think there is a valid conversation on which is best in terms of winning the game, but its no contest as to which is the more enjoyable. Plus I already said I would kill w3.
I agree that the former is true and valid. I wasn't thinking from the perspective of a dead person, because that's not me yet mb. I want to ask you, why do you want to kill w3 and do you think that having the conversation about optimal strategy is valuable if you've just conceded to the more enjoyable way?

Valuable from a theory standpoint, but I meant valid not valuable. By valid, I mean that it should still be on the table, and I do think it is the "best" option but in this case I don't believe best is most enjoyable. Plus the more I thought about it the more I realized I would just use it as an excuse to check out.

As for the w3, he pushed back against the GN kill, which in the moment seems fine, but under the hindsight of a dead mafia member, it makes me uneasy. Further, W3 plays like scum anyway, so I don't mind the kill, and lastly, I just want to. If someones going to die, it may as well be a person that went against a (Hindsight) mafia kill. But obviously I can be swayed by something of substance
I can agree with the first part.

As for the second about w3, this is just echoing what everyone else has said in a more elaborate fashion. However, I agree that this is adequate reasoning to lynch w3, but will withhold from voting on him until MW persuades me with more reads or reasoning.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 24, 2020, 04:44:48 am
I would like to hear[...], less fillerish content from Nae, [...]

I'm about as good at mafia as I am at elements.

Feel free to ask me questions though, I'll answer them. But I don't have any information yet so I'm just plowing along with whoever seems to have a good idea that isn't talking in circles. I think kaemp is scummy and that's about it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 24, 2020, 05:12:36 am
Did you learn anything from your N0 role?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 05:39:42 am
Since we already analysed who took which stance regarding killing the GN, I decided to reread N0, focusing on serp's posts and other posts that give context to his interactions. The following wall are the ones I found more interesting and my thoughts on them



Do we want otys/toadfish to claim? Especially in case of oty its likely for actually correct play to cause an uproar as its going to be revealed the same night.

Regardless i think it a good idea to hold a vote in the night, where otys/toadfish target the "lynchvote". This doubles our wagonomics as well. It also makes townotys actually using their ability (as they should) less devisive and leashes scumotys to potentially target one of their own.

This post was made before any talk about eating the GN came up and makes me inclined to believe kae really was an Oty.

shock & I are deja vus

Mostly a meme

So if GN does claim, will mafia actually kill them? The sooner GN dies the sooner we can have multiple GNs. I say GN claims and a kill role kills them off since its unlikely maf will use NK on them.

shock & I are deja vus
You AND shock rolled deja N0? seems unlikely.

Oh, I didn't think deja was actually a role in this game. I was just shit posting. Or maybe I was soft hinting why I might be protecting shock from a policy lynch tomorrow

Serp playing dumb a bit and again going after shock

I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap

Third post, softs GN.Still talking about shock

I'd prefer not to be eaten so that town can know whether or not to lynch shock asap
shock & I are deja vus
So, nice soft and hard, but if you really are GN here, it has been discussed and agreed that you are an optimal vighit n0. It's too risky not to have the role available for vultures and to gain permanent GNs, especially because of the possibility of not rolling one again for a while.

Coffee could be preparing to bus here? Seems a bit early for this tho, so I think this is more likely to be genuine.

Anyway:

Unofficial nightly lynchvote in case of oty:

shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

I have nothing to go off and killing shock seems like the most protown completely random move.

kae proposes a policy vig on shock. The idea here is clearly to try to get traction and justify eating shock. There were some talks about random vigging at this point, so this becoming a thing seemed plausible at the time. To me it indicates kae and shock are not w/w

So, I think the discussion hasn't actually been that clear on "optimal" but maybe that's because I'd want some probabilities calculated rather than people trusting the guy who's just trolling everyone by spamming the thread with claims for all the roles

serp starts spouting some math to convince us to not vig GN.

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

kaempf's trying to instigate town to vig my check, stay classy

Serp seems to be doubling down on the "defending shock thing". At the point this was made it seemed less plausible that a kaemp vig decision would take off, so I'm not reading a lot into this

Hes been the only one to claim GN, troll or not.
serprex says hi.

torb there is no reliable gn claim rn, so you really cant count on that plan. on average the night action only game results in a townloss so we really need to use all the power we can get.

@cal Not enough people can be arsed to vote so this vote isnt representative so ill no lynch is one of the worst reasons to no lynch yet

kae seems to be waiting for a hard claim here. Maybe he doesn't want having to eat his scumbuddy? (in which case he'd just holster)

serprex has joined the trolltrinity of link and shock. You should notice that those people cant be trusted no matter what. i jump at slips from people were that isnt normal.

but anyway if you want serp as gnclaim to be eaten vote and argue accordingly. If you are trying to make the same push on me as at the end last game you waste your breath

These seem a bit exagerated. That last line (I put in bold) also seems uncalled for.

As to why I know serprexs claims cannot be trusted, he was a major contribution to my confusion about shocks role in the game where you died immediately.

kae trying to discredit serp's softclaim doesn't look that good after the flip

So MW's saying silly things, business as usual, but the "vig GN for a fast win" is not how this works. If y'all going to vig me you better understand exactly how we're playing this out

Someone who isn't going to be dead if this plan goes through should post the numbers of how long things should drag out for an EV positive result. "4 vultures" is not realistic. I would hope that people who are on a card game forum would understand something about RNG but apparently this is a mafia forum now where we go off how we're reading people & bucket me into a trolltrinity when I'm posting numerical analysis

serp comes short of hardclaiming and tries to convince us not to vig him.

I'm pro not holstering N0 vig, I just think kaempfer13 should be the target in that case

This could very well be serp trying to distance himself from kae
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 05:48:55 am
My take away from this wall of text is:

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 24, 2020, 05:57:31 am
HOST CLARIFICATION:
7. The Day will not end until both the timer has ended and 7 minutes have passed since the last vote was cast or the last vote count was posted. This extension cannot be triggered by the same player twice in a row. If any sort of endless voting loop occurs that affects the lynch, there will be No Lynch. The day will be ended at the host's discretion if there is any vote swapping trolling/juggling, or if they set a hard deadline which cannot be extended.
Day extensions in this manner will be limited to a maximum of 30 minutes past the scheduled deadline.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:12:13 am
I didn’t even believe serps GN claim tf, I never said don’t kill serp. I said we shouldn’t kill any GNs. GNs change every round, my statement wasn’t applicable to just serp, it was to all of us who will be GNs at some point.

Also there’s no way That as a mafia, in defending another mafia on N0. Id bus them so hard and let them die LOL.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 08:17:39 am
My takeaway from the recent events:

n+
Linkcat
Coffeeditto
andretimpa

n-
Naesala
MasterWalks

Rest are at n. Linkcat I've already spoken about, Coffee and andre make points which align a lot with my own. Nae is a gut feeling of a weird vibe, and while I don't necessarily believe MW is scum, I'm not really a fan of his tunneling, keeping in mind he couldn't have learned anything from his role (deja).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 24, 2020, 08:26:41 am
Alright, since it seems no one wants to post their findings, I'll post mine.

I was damselfly and targeted serprex. He got targeted by TorB, Link, kae and andre, and he targeted shock.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:32:30 am
Poor Andre keeps getting mafia?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 24, 2020, 08:58:25 am
Alright, since it seems no one wants to post their findings, I'll post mine.

I was damselfly and targeted serprex. He got targeted by TorB, Link, kae and andre, and he targeted shock.

If true then kae is lying about being Otyugh since Dragonfly wouldn't see it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 09:43:06 am
wtf Link, you forgot your own rules. damselfly sees attempted targeting and i was blocked.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 09:45:06 am
wait it has been changed? well looks like rob fucked that up too. AT THIS POINT YOU HAVE TO ADMIT IT ROB, STOP SCREWING ME OVER WITH WRONG SYSTEM MESSAGES!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 09:46:19 am
it is beyond me how people scumread me for my interaction with serp btw, when i clearly meant to eat him and pretty much went against his intention with shock.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 09:47:38 am
also Link there is an ogi reason why you should know im not lying
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 24, 2020, 09:54:10 am
wtf Link, you forgot your own rules. damselfly sees attempted targeting and i was blocked.

wait it has been changed?

It was always intended that way, Oa just ruled it differently in 73. I noted in the changelog that the ability was clarified.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 24, 2020, 12:25:23 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

An erroneous action-result message has been discovered, and also corrected. During action-processing activities, incorrect paperwork (results) made it past the editing department review. Pay has been docked commensurate with the impacts of the oversight.

To be clear, Dragonfly only sees successful actions - as stated in the role, included in the rules changelog, and recently stated in the thread/this post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 12:47:19 pm
alright, so anyway once calindu posts it should be clear that no insights conflicting with my claim exist (legacy messages that have been errataed are supposed to be ignored, so we are not supposed to use this as prove of my action)

quick reads
vv
timpa
one of the first people to push for killing gn
link
i absolutely detest the way he plays this, but eating scum!serp after setting himself up to do anything but that just has to mean he's town

n+
w3 I still toneread him as towny, my tonereads arepretty bad though and he hasnt put up anything of real impact so eh
nae Also toneread, just doesnt seem to have gotten any tips on how to play this game from potential teammates

n
Coffee He did push for gn  and serp kill, which under most circumstances would make me townread him. It is perfectly consistent with the way he played his last scumgame though, where he would use his tmi to push for lynches on scumroles and anyone defending them as well.

n-
shock serps obsession with him means that scum thought shock being alive would benefit them. shock is in fact so bad at the game that that doesnt necessarily mean that he is actually scum. But I see absolutely nothing of his usual townplay either except for target kaemp no matter what lol. He wasnt trying to conway any information in riddles or plain text at all. He can die.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 12:52:37 pm
Hot take:

Kae holstered and Cal is trying to cover him up. The only reason serp never denied being GN is that Cal could confirm him targetting shock as well as giving mafia a POE for any permanent GN that would arise from this. All the rest is cheap theater.

S O L V E D G A M E
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 12:54:26 pm
kdz also townread for considering the autowin scenario
mw also pushed for gnkill so townlean other than that i havent noticed anything unusual except for his n1 being more coherent than usual which is explained by the deja claim.
rob scum

oa n for now, will have another look.

wait moe is in this game?

calindu n+ eversoslight townlean for sharing his info early

ian and naii need more

naii however townlean per default cause supporting gn kill while early bussing doesnt seem his style. I remember him being relatively late to the party though so he couldve just jumped the bandwagon.

I think at most 1 scum jumped on the gnkill bandwagon. Just gutfeeling.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 12:56:46 pm
andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 12:57:43 pm
But he said S O L V E D G A M E
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 12:59:41 pm
andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.

I still think there is a chance you are town, just didn't had time to process how things stand after rob's clarification.

The info Cal revealed warrants a lynch by principle imo
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 01:00:27 pm
after rereading i have to give moe and ian the same treatment as naii, where they supported gn kill and provided nothingbeyond that yet and the later the timing the less credit they get for it (but still some).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 01:05:45 pm
Andre you haven’t said what u targetted serp with
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 01:06:36 pm
To clear up, I don't see a world where potentially giving a POE consisting of only 2 people (me and you, assuming the oty story is you covering up having been sader) on a silver plater to mafia is a town move.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 01:07:06 pm
Previous post @kae
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 24, 2020, 01:07:53 pm
andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.

I still think there is a chance you are town, just didn't had time to process how things stand after rob's clarification.

The info Cal revealed warrants a lynch by principle imo

The info previously revealed is wrong, serp got targeted by TorB, Link and andre only.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 01:08:49 pm
andre i am oty and was roleblocked. This is truth and should be confirmed in the future.
I dont want andre to claim btw.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 01:09:08 pm
*was oty*
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 01:10:16 pm
andre cant give us any info that we dont have yet, so he should sty silent about his n0 role
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 24, 2020, 01:18:34 pm
alright, so anyway once calindu posts it should be clear that no insights conflicting with my claim exist (legacy messages that have been errataed are supposed to be ignored, so we are not supposed to use this as prove of my action)

quick reads
vv
timpa
one of the first people to push for killing gn
link
i absolutely detest the way he plays this, but eating scum!serp after setting himself up to do anything but that just has to mean he's town

The funny thing about this is that I meant what I said when I said it, then I looked at my role PM and saw that I actually was Oty and serp was the claim and I was like, nah I'm feasting tonight.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 24, 2020, 01:32:14 pm
andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.

I still think there is a chance you are town, just didn't had time to process how things stand after rob's clarification.

The info Cal revealed warrants a lynch by principle imo

The info previously revealed is wrong, serp got targeted by TorB, Link and andre only.

This makes it even worse
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 24, 2020, 01:37:52 pm
But I see absolutely nothing of his usual townplay either except for target kaemp no matter what lol. He wasnt trying to conway any information in riddles or plain text at all. He can die.

Someone’s trying way too hard to get me lynched. Also, are you sure you want to make those claims?  ;)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 01:41:34 pm
well then, what did you target me with? You claim to be innocent but havent given any hint in that direction.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 02:03:13 pm
andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.

I still think there is a chance you are town, just didn't had time to process how things stand after rob's clarification.

The info Cal revealed warrants a lynch by principle imo

The info previously revealed is wrong, serp got targeted by TorB, Link and andre only.

This makes it even worse
How so? Its predicably what the fix was going to be.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 24, 2020, 02:11:39 pm
Did you learn anything from your N0 role?

Me? No. I had a useless role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 24, 2020, 03:26:00 pm
Current vote tally

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 04:01:46 pm
no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

Placing my vote on MW for time being, I don't like the fact that www3 is the only wagon alive at this point
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 05:02:43 pm
no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
still nothing from him
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 05:54:01 pm
Considering that the guy that roleblocked me knew I was telling the truth and should have defended me, I'm certain whoever roleblocked me is scum.
*glares at shock*
anyway who could have done it? None of the dead players.

Cal clears Link and andre from that suspicion.
mw and coffe support each others deja claim.
w3 has the weakish phoenix claim. He technically could have done it.
Nae: i mean roleblocking qualifies as useless role for town. not entirely clear either i suppose.
 this leaves
3. PlayerOa
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
11. killsdazombies
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
 and the 2 above mentioned dont have particularly strong alibis.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 05:58:38 pm
As I've previously stated, I was Anubis last night and did not use my ability on anyone. Guess you'll just have to take my word for it, unless I got a Psion check.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 06:02:36 pm
Isn't a psion check just sorta useless since you have a new role now?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 06:02:56 pm
Oh you meant last night. I'm a stupid head
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 06:03:12 pm
Isn't a psion check just sorta useless since you have a new role now?
Well yeah I mean if I got one last night
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 06:04:14 pm
Oh you meant last night. I'm a stupid head
Is this the point where I should say "derpclear not granted"? :-*
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 06:04:46 pm
Oh you meant last night. I'm a stupid head
Is this the point where I should say "derpclear not granted"? :-*

Wasn't a derpclear, I just have beans for brains.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 06:15:49 pm
Well, i mean personally i think its shock already im just underlining why I want him to claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 24, 2020, 06:48:53 pm
Multiple Devour actions targeting the same person is decided by RNG.

Of the abilities that have lower priority than the Nightkill, only Inflate and Devour are unable to resolve on a dead target.

Whether you were roleblocked or your ability could not resolve for another reason, you should have simply gotten a message saying that your ability failed. There's no distinction between the different causes.

Isn't it possible that no one role blocked you? Stop tunneling. Also, why would I say I'm targeting you, then roleblock you, but then say I didn't have a roleblocking ability? I'm probably getting framed, or MORE LIKELY we take Linkcat's post into account and you just got RNGed second devour and so you got a system message that could mean roleblock or could not mean it. Not to mention, rob has clearly messed up system messages already so who knows what actually happened.

I tend to think you're town when you start playing the game very poorly and tunneling on certain players, but this is like beyond a desperate attempt to get me lynched. You keep calling me out for not acting normal but it's you who's acting unnaturally, trying to justify devouring me N0 and then voting no lynch day 1.
I've been playing the exact same I always have, and if you think otherwise, you haven't been paying enough attention. In fact, the most off-brand move I've made so far is choosing to defend myself from your accusations, and for that reason I'm no longer addressing your posts.

As far as role claiming, I owe you nothing, and it doesn't affect you. I'm sure at least 1-2 people visited me last night but you don't see me lynch voting them until they tell me. Lastly, at least one other person should already know my role. So maybe try asking around.


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 06:52:41 pm
Hi, my name is MasterWalks and i guess im a parking lot.

Everything kae has done has left a sour taste in my mouth. He wants to kill shock on policy. Then he wants to no lynch. Then he wants to kill shock because there is no way any of the other 6 people who havent claimed coulda role blocked you. There are whole pages where people (mostly coffee) tear apart everything youve said just to figure out what is total non sense and what makes sense. You say you are surprised i was "coherent" first round, but bruh, youre just mumbling through this.
Not sure if i wanna fully scum read you yet, but you have me perplexed.

Coffee, not sure what else you want me to say. Get your vote off me.

Naesala, if you had a useless role, then tell us what that role is. I promise, if its a blocking role no one will care because kaempf has completely lost his marbles. Also, you are the chamber where echoes happen. Bring us an original idea plz.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 06:53:45 pm
Quote from: shockcannon
Lastly, at least one other person should already know my role. So maybe try asking around.


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Rob? Your mafia partner? :silly:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:03:26 pm
no its not possible noone blocked me because i got a message specifying such a few hours late and you still havent given me any reason to believe it wasnt you and it is a very shockmove. If your role can be proven by someone other than host or your mafiapartner you have nothing to fear if you actually claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 07:11:23 pm
So lets say kae was actually role blocked by shock. I still wouldnt scumread shock. No one coulda known you were oty, nor that you were going to target serp, nor that serp was GN Maf (besides other maf).

Would i be surprised if shock blocked you? No. Would it make a difference if he did? No
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:13:09 pm
yes it does, because he would have known earlier than anyone else that calindus statement was off and also specifically claimed to not have done so.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:14:41 pm
also the "holes" shock and coffee are poking in my statements are reading a scumread into mere observations (eg coffee assuming i scumread link when i said i would have scumread it if serp wasnt scum)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 07:18:01 pm
So lets say kae was actually role blocked by shock. I still wouldnt scumread shock. No one coulda known you were oty, nor that you were going to target serp, nor that serp was GN Maf (besides other maf).

Would i be surprised if shock blocked you? No. Would it make a difference if he did? No

Honestly u say all this but tunnel me for saying that we shouldn’t kill GN q.q time to get your vote off me walks
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:19:28 pm
shock do you know or assume people visited you?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 07:20:47 pm
So lets say kae was actually role blocked by shock. I still wouldnt scumread shock. No one coulda known you were oty, nor that you were going to target serp, nor that serp was GN Maf (besides other maf).

Would i be surprised if shock blocked you? No. Would it make a difference if he did? No

Honestly u say all this but tunnel me for saying that we shouldn’t kill GN q.q time to get your vote off me walks

Im giving kamepf an insanity plea here. Im lynching you because of basic mathmatics. Then, when you flip mafia, Calindu is next in the tunnel.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:26:26 pm
Also there are absolutely no roles that give both insight into a role and who it belongs to other than deja vu, so if thats what it was you may as well say so.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:27:03 pm
Otherwise you are just bullshitting again or openly admitting to having a mafiapartner.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 24, 2020, 07:39:44 pm
Also there are absolutely no roles that give both insight into a role and who it belongs to other than deja vu, so if thats what it was you may as well say so.

MW was Deja Vu last night with Coffee:

Also, you're tunneling me? That's what this is?

What? No. I'm tunneling w3. I put you on the list because you didnt claim deja and just wanted a breadcumb in case you choose not to claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:44:09 pm
Okay, i truly did lose my marbles. It did say "abilty failed", but between the angry back and forth between me and rob all i remembered was that rob had no problem deciding whose devour goes through and that my ability was stopped.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:46:53 pm
i dont think there is a limit to the number of deja vus, just that they come in pairs each.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 07:50:18 pm
i dont think there is a limit to the number of deja vus, just that they come in pairs each.

Oh can i get host clarification on this? Coffee and I wondered the same thing and we tried to hint at it earlier but no one clarified. 
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 24, 2020, 07:57:55 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Unsuccessful ability usage receives same system message regardless of the reason.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 07:59:41 pm
nvm upon reread it seems as though there is supposed to be one group of dejas at a time just like in the fringe scenario of egg becoming deja last game. i thought the process was to randomly roll a partner each time someone obtains the deja role this game due to the way the fineprint was worded.
Probably best to wait for host clarification. Also what happens if one player who is the only one that never was a deja vu would become deja?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 24, 2020, 08:04:36 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Please read carefully the Deja Vu role - it already resolved the current question about the role.

i dont think there is a limit to the number of deja vus, just that they come in pairs each.
i dont think there is a limit to the number of deja vus, just that they come in pairs each.

Oh can i get host clarification on this? Coffee and I wondered the same thing and we tried to hint at it earlier but no one clarified. 

Deja Vu - Passive
Deja Vu - You may communicate with your fellow Deja Vu by PM at any time, even if your ability is blocked. If a player Hatches into a Deja Vu, there will be at least one other player with the same role. A player's alignment has no impact on whether or not they receive this role.
at least - so 0 or 2 required, 2+ possible.

(Doing this post from a phone really sucks)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:06:01 pm
So lets say kae was actually role blocked by shock. I still wouldnt scumread shock. No one coulda known you were oty, nor that you were going to target serp, nor that serp was GN Maf (besides other maf).

Would i be surprised if shock blocked you? No. Would it make a difference if he did? No

Honestly u say all this but tunnel me for saying that we shouldn’t kill GN q.q time to get your vote off me walks

Im giving kamepf an insanity plea here. Im lynching you because of basic mathmatics. Then, when you flip mafia, Calindu is next in the tunnel.

If I flip town, will you say you’re really really really bad at mathematics?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:14:38 pm
Btw I dont like either of the topwagons fyi.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:18:04 pm
When are we setting the European deadline?/when are European people placing their final votes
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:18:34 pm
townreads that I will keep for a while (excluding extraordinary circumstances) are timpa, link and kdz.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 08:22:49 pm
Btw I dont like either of the topwagons fyi.
I'm game at changing, who are your candidates other than shock?

When are we setting the European deadline?/when are European people placing their final votes
The sooner the better?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:30:32 pm
coffee and i have a hate boner for eachother and I do see similiarities to his last game, I'm not sure how much of this is emotionally tainted though. Also I dont think there is a chance that would gain traction with how loudly he screamed for serps death.

shock ticks off all the boxes for me at the moment  uncooperative✓ could have roleblocked me✓ didnt take a stance on gn matter✓ not trying to help town✓ serp thought it a good idea to claim a result on him ✓

Next I was going to look were the other people that didnt address the issue, but thats you who suggested doing so in the first place and calindu who was forthcoming with his roleclaim, so i kinda townread that too.

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:34:26 pm
not feeling mw, w3 or Nae as previously stated. So next place to look would be the people who pretty much checked out after they supported the gnkill, way after it became a major topic. this would be ian, naii (technically nae, but she gives the lhf vibe) and moe iirc.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:39:41 pm
so yh i think those 5 are my candidates for today. I will not even tiebreak if its someone else (unless new stuff comes up)as resident sleeper actually is the mathematically correct play as i found to my great surprise.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 08:39:59 pm
coffee and i have a hate boner for eachother and I do see similiarities to his last game, I'm not sure how much of this is emotionally tainted though. Also I dont think there is a chance that would gain traction with how loudly he screamed for serps death.

shock ticks off all the boxes for me at the moment  uncooperative✓ could have roleblocked me✓ didnt take a stance on gn matter✓ not trying to help town✓ serp thought it a good idea to claim a result on him ✓

Next I was going to look were the other people that didnt address the issue, but thats you who suggested doing so in the first place and calindu who was forthcoming with his roleclaim, so i kinda townread that too.
I'm townreading Coffee at the moment, I'm not putting my vote on him as of now. shock is a different story, and while I know you two have... history, I have no real reason to scumread him yet. I'd rather kill him than Coffee though, but in a scenario where those two are the only other options I'm definitely sticking to MW.

..and as I'm hitting post, you're up there with another one huh

not feeling mw, w3 or Nae as previously stated. So next place to look would be the people who pretty much checked out after they supported the gnkill, way after it became a major topic. this would be ian, naii (technically nae, but she gives the lhf vibe) and moe iirc.
Nae and MW on the other hand are lynches I can get behind, but yeah I agree it's tough to draw any real juice out of them, especially Nae, for now. On w3 I agree, not feeling anything either direction. I just don't like how his wagon gained this much speed without any real content backing it. ian and Naii are ok targets, I guess. moe I see hasn't logged in in >48 hours, not sure what to make of that.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:42:14 pm
so yh i think those 5 are my candidates for today. I will not even tiebreak if its someone else (unless new stuff comes up)as resident sleeper actually is the mathematically correct play as i found to my great surprise.

Is resident sleeper = no lynch?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 08:43:48 pm
i would set the european vote deadline to in ~2 hours.
yh resident sleeper=no lynch... forever until red check.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 08:45:41 pm
so yh i think those 5 are my candidates for today. I will not even tiebreak if its someone else (unless new stuff comes up)as resident sleeper actually is the mathematically correct play as i found to my great surprise.

Is resident sleeper = no lynch?
Yeah. I know I'm kinda neglecting it at this stage, and while I do see why kaempf is bringing up, there are too many possible scenarios in play that can fuck it up, with all these roles changing hands, so I'm not really getting the vibe. Not to mention we have notoriously unpredictable people like w3 and shock in the game. Maybe that's reason enough to kill them? :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 08:46:32 pm
so yh i think those 5 are my candidates for today. I will not even tiebreak if its someone else (unless new stuff comes up)as resident sleeper actually is the mathematically correct play as i found to my great surprise.

@MW fight who’s math is better
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 09:01:50 pm
If I flip town, will you say you’re really really really bad at mathematics?

Ill say that no matter what alignment you flip.

@Oa, why would you rather leave your vote on me? You scumreading me? If so, why? I thought i was just a parking lot.

w3 is my first choice for lynch. After that, Calindu. If w3 flips town then ill clear cal. As far as non-mathematically chosen scum, kae seems off but is admitting his mistake but still cant shake off his shock parasite. shock is probably rolling now as he has been able to get under your skin for the last 3 years. 
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 24, 2020, 09:03:31 pm
@Oa, why would you rather leave your vote on me? You scumreading me? If so, why? I thought i was just a parking lot.
Lack of better options, tbh. I'm not scumreading you per se, but as of my reads list you're a n- in my book, mostly due to what I view as meaningless tunneling.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 24, 2020, 09:09:33 pm
I need to respond to all of these, but before then, you are a parking lot that I am okay with receiving an organized demolition, MW. Someone has to be the first lynch. If you can point out why someone is a better lynch than you to me, I'll flip.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 09:10:24 pm
mw, why would you clear cal if w3 flips town? Does the same apply vice versa?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 09:13:45 pm
I’m about to sleep cause it’s been a long day. Hopefully y’all find a good enough lynch, or come w me on no lynch train. If there’s anything you wanna ask me for the day, do it ASAP
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 24, 2020, 09:15:18 pm
I’m about to sleep cause it’s been a long day. Hopefully y’all find a good enough lynch, or come w me on no lynch train. If there’s anything you wanna ask me for the day, do it ASAP
If not you and not no lynch, who right now would you want lynched?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 09:21:34 pm
I’m about to sleep cause it’s been a long day. Hopefully y’all find a good enough lynch, or come w me on no lynch train. If there’s anything you wanna ask me for the day, do it ASAP
If not you and not no lynch, who right now would you want lynched?

There isn’t really a suitable lynch candidate rn hence I’m on no lynch. If I am forced to lynch (aka gun on my head), I’ll go with ian/MW. I wouldn’t lynch Andre link Oa kaemp shock coffee cal moe just now. The ones I haven’t mentioned are also lynchable.

But as I said, only if gun against head. I don’t see a suitable lynch target rn and I haven’t read the thread in detail to analyse it so I can’t go around lynching on my gut feeling after post analysis.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 24, 2020, 09:44:56 pm

...

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

I believe this is the current vote count, and with 4 in favor of your death you could say the gun IS against your head
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 09:47:28 pm

...

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

I believe this is the current vote count, and with 4 in favor of your death you could say the gun IS against your head

But I can no lynch and am not forced to lynch someone. Others can hope on to no lynch too
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 09:58:39 pm
@Oa, why would you rather leave your vote on me? You scumreading me? If so, why? I thought i was just a parking lot.
Lack of better options, tbh. I'm not scumreading you per se, but as of my reads list you're a n- in my book, mostly due to what I view as meaningless tunneling.

Fair. Might be meaningless but honestly i think its the best lead we got. And yea im tunneling, but I can be persuaded to vote someone else.

mw, why would you clear cal if w3 flips town? Does the same apply vice versa?

Because that means my theory on GN vig is false. Yea sure, vise versa. I might be more inclined to Cal as w3 is actually posting. But W3 didnt want to lynch GN, and no lynch helps maf more than town and he believes in no lynch.. So im basing this on his opinions.


Y'all give me a better option. This tunnel has exits. Shock is really not a better option. Kae might be an option but thats just because he seems confused and he normally doesnt. So based on my mathematical theory of (serp+w3+cal)/ N= Mafia; the team is W3, Cal, Serp

N= not wanting to vig gn
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 10:05:54 pm
MW this is a very unusual case where consistently no lynching is actually correct, because the number of gns around disproportionally increases over time. by the time we reach lylo this way over 70% of players will likely have had at least one peek.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 10:09:46 pm
MW this is a very unusual case where consistently no lynching is actually correct, because the number of gns around disproportionally increases over time. by the time we reach lylo this way over 70% of players will likely have had at least one peek.

Ok. I will admit not thinking of the GNs increasing.
But wouldnt that be more important later in the game? shouldnt we be lynching now before the GN numbers grow? Actual questions, im not arguing.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 10:11:05 pm
MW this is a very unusual case where consistently no lynching is actually correct, because the number of gns around disproportionally increases over time. by the time we reach lylo this way over 70% of players will likely have had at least one peek.

Ok. I will admit not thinking of the GNs increasing.
But wouldnt that be more important later in the game? shouldnt we be lynching now before the GN numbers grow? Actual questions, im not arguing.

If u lynch now on some bad reads where the person is not too likely to be maf, you’re decreasing number of future Potential GNs
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 10:13:28 pm
well it would be best to stick to the plan all the way through. A hybrid might be worse than either approach. Since we dont really have a clear poe right now an earlier lynch is slightly worse, as it decreases the number of people that can become gn. But i would say stick to one approach.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 24, 2020, 10:19:47 pm
There’s no point in no lynching for a lot of days in a row. But on Day 1, there’s often not enough info to warrant a lynch, coupled w the GN stuff it’s just better to hold out but up to yall, I’m out now for the day.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 24, 2020, 10:22:54 pm
no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

I see train on w3, I hop on.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 10:28:22 pm
If u lynch now on some bad reads where the person is not too likely to be maf, you’re decreasing number of future Potential GNs

Uhh, this is backwards ass thinking and if you truly believe this then we wont be lynching anyone until people hardclaim GN, then we hope it wasnt a maf spreading misinformation and we have to extend the game by another day just to kill them.

well it would be best to stick to the plan all the way through. A hybrid might be worse than either approach. Since we dont really have a clear poe right now an earlier lynch is slightly worse, as it decreases the number of people that can become gn. But i would say stick to one approach.

I get ya. I do believe in a hybrid tho. I think lynching up until D3 and then No Lynching unless we get hard GN claims.


I am very against this mindset of no lynching= more GNs. Didnt scum!serp M A T H E M A T I C A L L Y prove that getting up to even 4 active GNs is pretty slim?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 10:30:14 pm
that was assuming 2+people die per day
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 10:35:01 pm
also your approach doesnt make any sense. lynching now and then no lynching slims down the pool of people that can become gn fast as well as the number of kills scum has to make. stopping doesnt make sense at all. If hybrid then no lynch first.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 10:49:10 pm
welp its about time for me to hit the sack. I dont think i will set an alarm to 3am.
I cant say I got the feel that w3 is scum (and mw isnt a viable alternative), but its not really enough for a proper defense of him. Momentum of trains also means less than usual with a town to scum ratio of 6:1, otherwise i would point out he got traction too easily. Such as it is even if topwagon is scum, there would only be one person with vested interest in defending them and that person would probably be too demotivated to post at all.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 24, 2020, 10:57:37 pm
also your approach doesnt make any sense. lynching now and then no lynching slims down the pool of people that can become gn fast as well as the number of kills scum has to make. stopping doesnt make sense at all. If hybrid then no lynch first.

You are assuming we dont hit a Mafia. Theres plenty of games where we have lost GN N1 and still are able to lynch just fine. Imagine hitting mafia tonight. We are down to 1 mafia left.

welp its about time for me to hit the sack. I dont think i will set an alarm to 3am.
I cant say I got the feel that w3 is scum (and mw isnt a viable alternative), but its not really enough for a proper defense of him. Momentum of trains also means less than usual with a town to scum ratio of 6:1, otherwise i would point out he got traction too easily. Such as it is even if topwagon is scum, there would only be one person with vested interest in defending them and that person would probably be too demotivated to post at all.

I did not expect my vote to start a wagon. And it does make me very uneasy that it did gain so much traction quickly. Even with low ratio.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 11:12:11 pm
Odds of hitting mafia is 2:13, so less likely than beating torb in trials.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 24, 2020, 11:14:50 pm
I suggest carefull optimism even if lynching is isually correct in spite of the odds. (Same argument apply for anyone wlse obv)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 25, 2020, 12:45:16 am
so who we flipping to fellas
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 25, 2020, 12:59:49 am
w3? More like w3ak
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 25, 2020, 01:00:09 am
Day 1 has come to a close - performance reports will be prepared by the Assessors Department. Hold, please.

Final Vote Count:
no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 25, 2020, 01:04:26 am
NIGHT 1

worldwideweb3 was lynched. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Arctic Squid]
Severance pay, if owed, will be mailed to last know address on file with accounting (accounting department not responsible for checks mishandled by postal services).

NIGHT 1 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 25, 2020, 01:04:55 am
Start of Night 1, remember to inform your immediate supervisor of all planned night activities. Department daily manpower projections will not be postponed.

2. Linkcat
3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 25, 2020, 01:05:32 am
Angel on me please.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 25, 2020, 01:16:08 am
so who we flipping to fellas
yeah
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on August 25, 2020, 01:21:58 am
Where, O death, is your victory? Where, O death, is your sting?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 25, 2020, 01:30:04 am
Unfortunately W3s flag of peace only found purpose in lining his casket.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 25, 2020, 01:40:06 am
I'm bad at math
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 25, 2020, 01:56:55 am

Naesala, if you had a useless role, then tell us what that role is. I promise, if its a blocking role no one will care because kaempf has completely lost his marbles. Also, you are the chamber where echoes happen. Bring us an original idea plz.

Green Nymph.

I don't have any original ideas. I'm bad at this game. I'm gonna support the idea that I like the best and vote with my gut.

(technically nae, but she gives the lhf vibe)

LHF? Looking to Have Fun? Luckily holding fireflies? Lose her friends? No really, what's this mean XD you guys throw out so much slang.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 25, 2020, 02:05:20 am
Laminated Hardwood Flooring

It means you're easy to walk over.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 25, 2020, 02:20:15 am
Laminated Hardwood Flooring

It means you're easy to walk over.

I find this hilarious. I'm sorry but I'm totally using this now.

Okay nae, I'll ask questions then.
Who did ya target, if anyone, with Nymph? Probs yourself I assume.
Do you scumread Kae at all for seemingly losing his damn mind? Or do you think that makes him more towny?
Do you feel like revealing who you are targeting tonight if it will help us to read back on it later?
Do you have reads on anyone that someone else hasn't brought up?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 25, 2020, 03:06:24 am
@Nae lhf=low hanging fruit

or what Link said, that works too  :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 25, 2020, 07:26:30 am
I'm bad at math
(https://pics.me.me/the-risk-i-took-was-calculated-but-man-am-i-29685393.png)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 25, 2020, 01:28:22 pm
Obv it doesnt directly affect me personally anymore, but whats our stance on vigging now? no vig, up to the owner or public vote? because I still like the last option and if we refuse to no lynch we may as well vig too.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on August 25, 2020, 01:46:17 pm
I wish I could say that this was partially my fault, but you're all just awful at this game. Like, really, really, really bad.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 25, 2020, 02:32:32 pm
Obv it doesnt directly affect me personally anymore, but whats our stance on vigging now? no vig, up to the owner or public vote? because I still like the last option and if we refuse to no lynch we may as well vig too.

With serp dead as GN I'd say we should refrain from vigging; GNs will increase over time and killing anyone will reduce the potential to get another GN. But then again, it depends on whether we want to win or we want to have fun. If we're aiming for fun, then I agree with vig-target voting. Definitely not up to the owner of the ability, though.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 25, 2020, 03:01:25 pm
Laminated Hardwood Flooring

It means you're easy to walk over.
Hell yeah I am


Okay nae, I'll ask questions then.
Who did ya target, if anyone, with Nymph? Probs yourself I assume.
Do you scumread Kae at all for seemingly losing his damn mind? Or do you think that makes him more towny?
Do you feel like revealing who you are targeting tonight if it will help us to read back on it later?
Do you have reads on anyone that someone else hasn't brought up?

You assume right.
I think people who talk way too much are generally scummy, so yes, I think Kaemp is scum. I think I said that once maybe.
I'm targeting myself again
Coffee also talks a lot and says little. Link seems pretty cool.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 25, 2020, 03:53:49 pm
Because that means my theory on GN vig is false. Yea sure, vise versa. I might be more inclined to Cal as w3 is actually posting. But W3 didnt want to lynch GN, and no lynch helps maf more than town and he believes in no lynch.. So im basing this on his opinions.


Y'all give me a better option. This tunnel has exits. Shock is really not a better option. Kae might be an option but thats just because he seems confused and he normally doesnt. So based on my mathematical theory of (serp+w3+cal)/ N= Mafia; the team is W3, Cal, Serp

N= not wanting to vig gn

I'll be honest with you, I totally missed the post about serprex being GN, just like I forgot to vote D1, I just felt that vig N0 with no info is bad, totally missed the fact that we actually had info.
Last game I didn't really post either, and look, I turned out to be town.
You are pretty bad at math.

Hi, my name is MasterWalks and i guess im a parking lot.

Everything kae has done has left a sour taste in my mouth. He wants to kill shock on policy. Then he wants to no lynch. Then he wants to kill shock because there is no way any of the other 6 people who havent claimed coulda role blocked you. There are whole pages where people (mostly coffee) tear apart everything youve said just to figure out what is total non sense and what makes sense. You say you are surprised i was "coherent" first round, but bruh, youre just mumbling through this.
Not sure if i wanna fully scum read you yet, but you have me perplexed.

Coffee, not sure what else you want me to say. Get your vote off me.

Naesala, if you had a useless role, then tell us what that role is. I promise, if its a blocking role no one will care because kaempf has completely lost his marbles. Also, you are the chamber where echoes happen. Bring us an original idea plz.

I don't really like your scumread on kae, it just feels random as hell, since he did confirm he targeted serp N0.
I also really dislike pushing Nae to reveal like that. The only reason I pushed people to reveal is because I had an investigative role and wanted to catch people lying.

I'm more interested in andre's role, since he successfully targeted serp N0 and I do not see him mentioning his role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 25, 2020, 06:11:13 pm
Coffee also talks a lot and says little. Link seems pretty cool.
your opinion is that Link talks less and says more than I do in this game?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 25, 2020, 06:12:03 pm
I'll be honest with you, I totally missed the post about serprex being GN, just like I forgot to vote D1, I just felt that vig N0 with no info is bad, totally missed the fact that we actually had info.
Last game I didn't really post either, and look, I turned out to be town.
You are pretty bad at math.
This is a terrible cover. In fact just saying that makes me light read you. "Look at me! I am the exact same as last game and I wasnt scum then, so i must not be scum this game!" cmon cal.

I don't really like your scumread on kae, it just feels random as hell, since he did confirm he targeted serp N0.
I also really dislike pushing Nae to reveal like that. The only reason I pushed people to reveal is because I had an investigative role and wanted to catch people lying.

I'm more interested in andre's role, since he successfully targeted serp N0 and I do not see him mentioning his role.

I specifically said i dont scum read kae in the same message you quoted. Everything ive pointed out about kae has nothing to do with his target, but rather his ramblings. He even said he was confused and lost his marbles.

Im pushing nae because they havent said much of anything. The more people who talk the more info we have to work with. Good or bad. If you wanna argue why i pushed Nae and not shock, ian, moe, or Naii then yea we can go back and forth on that. But im just trying to get some content here.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 25, 2020, 07:01:45 pm
I'm more interested in andre's role, since he successfully targeted serp N0 and I do not see him mentioning his role.

I was Green Nymph. The reason why I targetted him is in my first post about the Golden Nymph plan (in yellow)

Well, unfortunately I rolled town again, so time for some town tips I thought of:
  • There is no good reason not to immediately reveal any Golden Nymph result you find, unless you obtained it through Vulture/Crusader.
  • Not voting to hide Graboids identity can be extra helpful now that Graboids are forced to not vote before they are invincible.
  • You can only roll each role once as Fate Egg, this means that claiming every single action will make it easier to deduce your possible roles. So don't go around claiming everything unless you have a good idea on how that helps town.

I also have a radical suggestion: for someone that rolled the Golden Nymph role to claim. They could be targeted by Crusaders and Dragonflies, Dragonflies will monitor and reveal any mafia with disruptive abilities trying to get Golden Nymph from using theirs. Having them get (Night)killed N0 is a bonus, since every time someone randoms Vulture afterwards, they'll then turn into a cop (or have that option, it's the best option as town, right?).

EoD is 3am for me, so don't get your hopes up on me being on for it.

I think it would be interesting for FFQ to target the GN too, in order to have a way to check if the plan went through.

Amber Nymph targetting GN could also get around a mafia!Anubis trying to pass off as a Seraph (getting themselves immaterial to avoid investigation). But then again, a mafia!Anubis could just target GN and combo it with the NK.

Anyway, having more people targetting GN besides just crusaders and dragonflies makes it harder for a scum!dragonfly to find out who our more permanent GN is.

A more aggressive version of the plan is to just have a town!Oty devour the GN. In this case, FFQ and crusader can still do their work, while a scum!dragonfly would fail in trying to find the new GN and as a bonus the vultures can fetch GN too.

Overall I think the plan is +EV for town and I like our odds.

This is also exactly why I reacted like this about your info

andre i cant tell if you are joking, but it seems clear to me that cal and i are not a team.

I still think there is a chance you are town, just didn't had time to process how things stand after rob's clarification.

The info Cal revealed warrants a lynch by principle imo
that is, I was crowding GN a little to make a Sader harder to track down

Your info on the other hand just told mafia that me and kae (if he was roleswapping Oty) were the only possible candidates for a Sader!GN (which was the whole point of the plan), your follow up reduced the POE to just me. That info should have only seen the light of day as a CC to someone faking to be Sader!GN, since no disruption to the plan happened (like a warden for example). This tells me that you are either scum or really bad at this.

The only silver lining of the way the plan went down is that at least we can get Vulture!GN now
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 25, 2020, 08:46:04 pm
welp, unfortunate we didnt get a gnsader, but at least that makes calindus claim not backfire as badly.
Considering calindu would have been within his right to assume i was lying about my role with the incorrect information he was given, there was nothing wrong with his motivation to claim. It is what it is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 25, 2020, 09:20:14 pm
This is a terrible cover. In fact just saying that makes me light read you. "Look at me! I am the exact same as last game and I wasnt scum then, so i must not be scum this game!" cmon cal.

But this has been your motivation of voting in a previous mafia, "Oh look, Calindu plays similar to the way he played in a mafia game, so he must mafia".

Im pushing nae because they havent said much of anything. The more people who talk the more info we have to work with. Good or bad. If you wanna argue why i pushed Nae and not shock, ian, moe, or Naii then yea we can go back and forth on that. But im just trying to get some content here.

I don't argue about your push on Nae, I'm just not sure why your push was pretty much asking for a role reveal.

This tells me that you are either scum or really bad at this.

Why would I ever claim my info if I were mafia? Wouldn't it have been infinitely better to just keep it shut and not reveal my info if I were mafia, since I would know only you could know I targeted serp? I didn't force anyone to reveal with my own reveal, I just think getting the info out early can help in this type of setup.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 25, 2020, 10:06:09 pm
Coffee also talks a lot and says little. Link seems pretty cool.
your opinion is that Link talks less and says more than I do in this game?
Yeah.

Before you ask, when Link says random silly things, its clear that they're random silly things. That doesn't count towards how much he talks.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 25, 2020, 10:16:07 pm
This is a terrible cover. In fact just saying that makes me light read you. "Look at me! I am the exact same as last game and I wasnt scum then, so i must not be scum this game!" cmon cal.

But this has been your motivation of voting in a previous mafia, "Oh look, Calindu plays similar to the way he played in a mafia game, so he must mafia".
Actually, i was killed last game for acting differently.

Im pushing nae because they havent said much of anything. The more people who talk the more info we have to work with. Good or bad. If you wanna argue why i pushed Nae and not shock, ian, moe, or Naii then yea we can go back and forth on that. But im just trying to get some content here.

I don't argue about your push on Nae, I'm just not sure why your push was pretty much asking for a role reveal.

ya a role reveal for last round, because with Fate Eggs, why wouldnt we be claiming? And the question as to who they are targetting tonight, i made sure to word in a way that they should only reveal that if it will help to go back on. They apparently thought it might help.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 26, 2020, 03:18:39 am
To be fair, when asking for info roles to out nobody said not to claim extra targets on serp, so I give Cal a pass on that one. And Cal, the reason you would claim as mafia is so nobody questions how mafia knew to kill andre.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 26, 2020, 09:29:29 pm
Ded thread ded town
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 27, 2020, 12:28:20 am
Theres just nothing to say really, as long as the other vultures dont get NK'd tonight its an easy win.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 27, 2020, 12:40:30 am
One of the previous two posts is an incorrect assessment, and for once it's not MW.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 27, 2020, 12:50:24 am
What a twist
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 27, 2020, 12:59:59 am
v
Coffee
kdz
MW

n+
Naii
kae
andre

n
Nae
Oa
Cal

n-
iancu
moe
shock
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 27, 2020, 01:00:06 am
Night 1 has concluded - hold please while the bits and bytes are compiled, analyzed, and tabulated. The results will be posted soon(TM)...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 27, 2020, 01:01:15 am
DAY 2

Linkcat was nightkilled. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Anubis]

DAY 2: Day 2 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on August 27, 2020, 01:17:24 am
One of these days I'll make it to Night 2.

One of these days...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 27, 2020, 01:18:05 am
Start of Day 2 (through Night 2) hatching reports submitted, refer to nearest Inbox location for new ability instructions.

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 27, 2020, 02:15:20 am
Surprised that mafia was bold enough to target linkcat after a public ask for doc. They must have rolled anubis or link must have tapped himself and hoped the bluff would be enough
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 02:30:50 am
Ah crap now I have to find someone else to listen to.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 02:31:33 am
In other news: I have no other news.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 27, 2020, 02:49:28 am
I considered waiting to share, but I suppose I'll go first and then info roles can maybe catch something. So, my ability failed last night, which means someone role blocked me or I hit an immortal.

I consider both to be pretty indicative of a mafia, especially given this particular fate egg game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 27, 2020, 02:51:18 am
It could also be mafia making sure the next NK cannot be prevented.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 02:56:19 am
@shock did you target me?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 27, 2020, 03:20:17 am
I accidentally clicked post before finishing my previous post.

I was Anubis last night. I didn't use it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 27, 2020, 05:27:00 am
@shock did you target me?

Yes
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 09:21:20 am
Except for coffee I find Links final readlist very agreeable, ian and shock are imo the most suspicious based on several things (and on top ofthat they are useless for town in general), I will wait until we parsed what shockcannons ability failing means though before i make a push.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 10:14:50 am
@shock did you target me?

Yes

Then I can safely say there's another possibility you may have missed.

@kae shock's claim makes perfect sense to me, if that helps you.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 10:50:47 am
alright, I'll take it he's being truthfull then. with the exception of 1 role he could have had that is kinda towny tbh.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 11:18:21 am
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 11:26:56 am
I suppose I should say why i dislike ian so much again.
He was in the group of people that saw that everyone already wanted gn dead and then agreed to not go against the grain, then pretty much vanished except for his vote on w3 thats also kinda bad.
Why noping out of thread after agreeing with gnkill is suspicious when serp was scum: It was pretty much decided at that stage that serp was going to die if there was an oty, so there pretty much was no other choice left anymore but to agree. having a partner die so early decreases motivation to post, while seeing a scum die early as town should increase motivation to post.
There was also no point in voting w3 when he did, other than preventing the last shred of chance of a vote swing (less wagonomics, plus no chance of swinging to scum).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 11:34:09 am
Nvm that his townplay in general is so bad/low effort, that there is no reason for him to deviate an inch from it when he rolls scum.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 27, 2020, 12:40:51 pm
Quote
having a partner die so early decreases motivation to post, while seeing a scum die early as town should increase motivation to post.

woooooooooooo, mafia died, get rekt serp, wooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Does this make me seem more towny now? That argument makes no sense whatsoever.

Btw, who did you target last night, kae?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 27, 2020, 12:41:34 pm
Also, I vote on w3 every opportunity I get.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 01:36:01 pm
Is there a reason you want to know if I used a targeting ability last night?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 27, 2020, 01:38:06 pm
I asked first.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 01:39:14 pm
Also, I vote on w3 every opportunity I get.
And that is just terrible play.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 01:40:53 pm
Alright, Im assuming you are getting at a dragonfly claim; i successfully targetted timpa with an ability that has higher priority than anubis.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 01:41:24 pm
or at least rob didnt tell me that it failed.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 01:58:53 pm
Anyone else targetted me? You guys seem to love me :sillyspin:
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 01:59:39 pm
Also, this got me curious on shock's role last night.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 02:04:59 pm
@kae Also, would I know if you targetted me?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 02:11:38 pm
yesish; you should have gotten a notification revealing the role that i used (+i wouldnt roleblock one of my biggest townreads anyway and upon closer inspection i already gave away that i got no info so there is only 2 possibilities anyway)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 02:19:48 pm
Ok, this checks out.

Something else I'm curious about:
@Cal, did you target anyone?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 27, 2020, 05:01:05 pm
Ok, this checks out.

Something else I'm curious about:
@Cal, did you target anyone?

I targeted myself.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 27, 2020, 05:52:14 pm
Was dragonfly last night. Nae told the truth.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 27, 2020, 05:58:02 pm
Deja reporting from last cycle - I'm fine with revealing my partner if he wants to.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 06:01:17 pm
Ok, I'm currently on momentum and immaterial. I also psion'd Cal last night. It's possible, but not easy to test his claim later on.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 06:03:46 pm
Also, after thinking a bit I think it was a scum Anubis, probably to secure a NK
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 27, 2020, 06:05:54 pm
Ok, I'm currently on momentum and immaterial. I also psion'd Cal last night. It's possible, but not easy to test his claim later on.
Did you get both of these statuses tonight?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 06:07:16 pm
Ok, I'm currently on momentum and immaterial. I also psion'd Cal last night. It's possible, but not easy to test his claim later on.
Did you get both of these statuses tonight?

Yes
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 27, 2020, 06:32:08 pm
Ok, I'm currently on momentum and immaterial. I also psion'd Cal last night. It's possible, but not easy to test his claim later on.
Did you get both of these statuses tonight?

Yes
Hm okay, interesting. I'm not sure if going on a witch hunt for the Anubis is correct play, but are there any better leads now? Mathematically kaempfer is 50/50 to be Anubis. I'd like to see more discussion on our next lynch target tbh, and I'd feel bad for starting a wagon on such thin ground (read: w3 last day). I'm game with lynching anyone on n or n-, maybe even n+ if there comes up some convincing stuff. I'm pretty convinced andretimpa is town following the recent events. Updated readlist below:

v
andretimpa

n+
kdz, moehrpi, Coffeeditto

n
kaempfer, Naii, shock

n-
Naesala, MW, Calindu, iancu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 27, 2020, 06:33:16 pm
Well andretimpa could in theory have immortalized himself, but I guess his claimed Psion check on Calindu could clear him from that
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 27, 2020, 06:37:39 pm
v
Coffee
kdz
MW

n+
Naii
kae
andre

n
Nae
Oa
Cal

n-
iancu
moe
shock

v
andretimpa

n+
kdz, moehrpi, Coffeeditto

n
kaempfer, Naii, shock

n-
Naesala, MW, Calindu, iancu

Right before death Linkcat List compared to very alive Oa List. Dunno if this means anything.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 06:48:28 pm
@Oa I will post his role later. I think it's better that more people weigh in first.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 27, 2020, 06:50:09 pm
@Oa I will post his role later. I think it's better that more people weigh in first.
Yeah I agree with that
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 27, 2020, 07:12:42 pm
There's a lot of people who aren't talking and that's allowing things like Anubis to go off safely and hidden. I will acknowledge that it's technically possible I was Anubis and gave andre immortality, but I'm hoping someone can confirm me with their info. I was psion this past night, and looking to confirm a couple theories I had.

Also @Oa:

I actually think we definitely should go on a witch hunt. It's very possible if everyone shares their info we can catch someone in a lie or maybe even flat out find the mafia Anubis. Right now there are 4 possible candidates:

1.) myself. I could be faking my role and saying my ability failed when in reality I'm just the Anubis
2.) andre. He could be lying about his visit and gave himself immortality
3.) kaempf. He said he targeted andre.
4.) someone else.

Options 2 and 3 seem unlikely and very risky on the respective players parts' UNLESS there's some mafia on mafia interactions going on.
Option 1 I obviously know to be 100% false but I suppose I currently have no alibi from anyone else.
Option 4 seems likely, and we need to get people to start talking.


Also @kaempf:

Now that we've made it past two nights I'll have you know my role from night 1 is hidden in one of my first couple posts. I don't remember which one and I don't feel like checking. Probably won't convince you of anything, but it's there for anyone else. Probably irrelevant anyways because it's still quite likely that kaempf's ability just failed because of the double devour situation.


I think I've caught a major slip up by a certain a player. I need the next night to confirm something though. If I find what I'm looking for I should have this game solved the following day.

@mafia
You better get me lynched today or kill me the next night otherwise the :fire will burn brightly and its fuel will be you.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 07:36:52 pm
Was dragonfly last night. Nae told the truth.

What truth did I tell? Please elaborate.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 07:45:14 pm
Also I knew andre got momentum before he declared it. I cant even think of a way I'd know that other than doing it myself, which i did (technically roleswapping with a mafiapartner is possible, but why would I do that?)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 27, 2020, 08:15:33 pm
Was dragonfly last night. Nae told the truth.

What truth did I tell? Please elaborate.

That you were going to target yourself.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 08:43:21 pm
There's a lot of people who aren't talking and that's allowing things like Anubis to go off safely and hidden. I will acknowledge that it's technically possible I was Anubis and gave andre immortality, but I'm hoping someone can confirm me with their info. I was psion this past night, and looking to confirm a couple theories I had.

Also @Oa:

I actually think we definitely should go on a witch hunt. It's very possible if everyone shares their info we can catch someone in a lie or maybe even flat out find the mafia Anubis. Right now there are 4 possible candidates:

1.) myself. I could be faking my role and saying my ability failed when in reality I'm just the Anubis
2.) andre. He could be lying about his visit and gave himself immortality
3.) kaempf. He said he targeted andre.
4.) someone else.

Options 2 and 3 seem unlikely and very risky on the respective players parts' UNLESS there's some mafia on mafia interactions going on.
Option 1 I obviously know to be 100% false but I suppose I currently have no alibi from anyone else.
Option 4 seems likely, and we need to get people to start talking.


Also @kaempf:

Now that we've made it past two nights I'll have you know my role from night 1 is hidden in one of my first couple posts. I don't remember which one and I don't feel like checking. Probably won't convince you of anything, but it's there for anyone else. Probably irrelevant anyways because it's still quite likely that kaempf's ability just failed because of the double devour situation.


I think I've caught a major slip up by a certain a player. I need the next night to confirm something though. If I find what I'm looking for I should have this game solved the following day.

@mafia
You better get me lynched today or kill me the next night otherwise the :fire will burn brightly and its fuel will be you.
I dont get why you would put up a riddle containing your role but refuse to claim. Anyway all i found was a "cool" indicating arctic squid in your first post (but that was before you were assigned a role, so that doesnt help) and you declaring that someone already knows your role (which is either bullshit, a random guess you have no way of knowing, or admitting to a maf partner).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 08:47:33 pm
Also i actually thought that psion use on timpa is one of the scummier roles to use, due to calindus report n0 (actually i need clarification on how fate egg works, does it override psions ability to find all secondaries, by masking it as that nights ability? and can only that role also be crusaded?). However, anubis and shock are obv not aligned (and i believe him that anubis wasnt him) and anubis use is the more questionable of the 2 for sure.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 08:47:45 pm
Was dragonfly last night. Nae told the truth.

What truth did I tell? Please elaborate.

That you were going to target yourself.
Ah, okay, yes. I'm a little confused though, I was under the impression dragonfly was slower than Anubis. I guess "regardless of priority" means dragonfly is actually first in priority rather than "regardless off the order they happened". Seems weird but okay.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 08:54:41 pm
wtf is up with everyone getting anubis. Also using it in general tends to be bad, as it makes it impossible to alignement check or protect the target from the nightkill. dont use Anubis.
Now, I'm not holding it against nae, mw confirms that she wasnt the one targeting timpa and reading the role its drawbacks arent immediately obvious, so i would believe her if she said she had the best intentions. Still she's impossible to alignement check in the future, so that already makes it more attractive to lynch her; not really a priority though and a pretty thin reason to do so unless we already have a lot of clear town, which we dont.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 08:59:30 pm
wtf is up with everyone getting anubis. Also using it in general tends to be bad, as it makes it impossible to alignement check or protect the target from the nightkill. dont use Anubis.
Now, I'm not holding it against nae, mw confirms that she wasnt the one targeting timpa and reading the role its drawbacks arent immediately obvious, so i would believe her if she said she had the best intentions. Still she's impossible to alignement check in the future, so that already makes it more attractive to lynch her; not really a priority though and a pretty thin reason to do so unless we already have a lot of clear town, which we dont.
If it helps, I'm Phoenix now. You could lynch me and it wouldn't matter. I was just covering my butt vs. future poison because I'm adrenalined.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 27, 2020, 09:03:03 pm
Someone wanna make a spreadsheet of what everyone has claimedand what status effects they have? Cuz ive already forgotten what everyone was N0
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 09:29:03 pm
Public roleclaims
me: n0 oty failed to kill serp
n1 gave momentum to andre

moehrpi: cosplays as skeleton, modkill approaching

Naii: n0 if it was claimed i missed it
n1 Anubis, claims no use

ian: n1 implied dragonfly, no real claims

cal: n0 dragonfly on serp; saw andre and dead town target serp
claims targeting self n1

shockcannon: claims to have claimed sth n0
n1 psion on andre failed due to anubis on andre

nae: n0 green nymph self
n1 anubis self

Oa: n0 anubis on noone
n1 deja with someone

kdz: no claims

MW: n0 deja with coffee
n1 dragonfly on nae

timpa: n0 green nymph on serp
n1 psion on calindu

coffee: n0 deja
no claim n1
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 27, 2020, 09:29:19 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Successful Psionic Link reports all of the target's current secondaries that are not Fate Egg.

Most recent secondary ability is gained on a successful endow.

-snip- i need clarification on how fate egg works, does it override psions ability to find all secondaries, by masking it as that nights ability? and can only that role also be crusaded? -snip-
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 27, 2020, 09:33:44 pm
so moe, naii, ian, kdz, coffee (and technically shock) could have done it, one of them was partners with oa, pretty much all other claims back each other up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 27, 2020, 10:14:15 pm
A HOST ERROR HAS BEEN CORRECTED.

Please carry on with your day's work, and don't forget expense reports are due every 2nd Friday of the 3rd month after 3-month look ahead manpower projections are formally input to the database.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 27, 2020, 10:27:23 pm
A HOST ERROR HAS BEEN CORRECTED.

Please carry on with your day's work, and don't forget expense reports are due every 2nd Friday of the 3rd month after 3-month look ahead manpower projections are formally input to the database.
A bit confusing without context; is the error something we can know about?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 27, 2020, 10:36:36 pm
If it helps, I'm Phoenix now. You could lynch me and it wouldn't matter. I was just covering my butt vs. future poison because I'm adrenalined.

Actually, I think you can still be useful, if we lynch you I'd rather it wasn't today.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 27, 2020, 10:58:10 pm
Hello, I wanted to pop in before i have the ability to be more active and reflect upon all that has happened, but I was Firefly Queen on MW last night and I got a message back saying something like Fly on the Wall.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 27, 2020, 11:21:32 pm
Hello, I wanted to pop in before i have the ability to be more active and reflect upon all that has happened, but I was Firefly Queen on MW last night and I got a message back saying something like Fly on the Wall.

Dragonfly has the ability of "Fly on the Wall". I was Dragonfly last night
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 28, 2020, 12:21:26 am
Hello, I wanted to pop in before i have the ability to be more active and reflect upon all that has happened, but I was Firefly Queen on MW last night and I got a message back saying something like Fly on the Wall.

Dragonfly has the ability of "Fly on the Wall". I was Dragonfly last night
oh dude nice
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 12:23:20 am
Ah, okay, yes. I'm a little confused though, I was under the impression dragonfly was slower than Anubis. I guess "regardless of priority" means dragonfly is actually first in priority rather than "regardless off the order they happened". Seems weird but okay.

So;
It appears the handler of the paperwork in the upper management pulled a 'U.S Government' and redacted things by changing the backing of the font color to black. A little copy and paste and was able to see right through the redacted parts and found Nae targeted themself! Call me MasterHacker now not MasterWalks thanks!

sorry, havent had to RP in a while.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 28, 2020, 12:42:09 am
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/031/197/visible.jpg)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 01:31:48 am
In layman's terms, Anubis is faster than dragonfly therefore I shouldn't have seen you use your ability.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 28, 2020, 01:33:32 am
In layman's terms, Anubis is faster than dragonfly therefore I shouldn't have seen you use your ability.
Is that what Rob screwed up? Rob, can I get a confirmation?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 28, 2020, 02:23:53 am
Did you catch a firefly then, mw?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 03:45:26 am
Did you catch a firefly then, mw?

No.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 28, 2020, 06:48:55 am
Before i jump to conclusions, make sure to ask rob if thats correct. Coffee strongly indicazed that your ability was the only one he saw.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 28, 2020, 12:58:33 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Firefly Queen ability wording should specify "successful" ability uses (rather than activated). Failed abilities are not intended to be considered for Firefly reports.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 02:39:45 pm
Well, this means MW should have caught something, no?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 02:51:56 pm
I have caught a firefly now
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 03:13:20 pm
This clears Coffee in a more convincing way then
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 28, 2020, 03:15:24 pm
So bad timing here but my internet is out for the foreseeable future, so you get mobile posts from now on (apparently my line had a hole in it and flooded?) So some thoughts. With linkcat and torb out our two most influential voices are out. I think linkcats read list was pretty decent. I admit it does include me as towny but even if I was further down I still agree with it in general. Its a little hard to follow this firefly nonsense from mobile, but it doesn't really seem to be getting anywhere as far as I can tell. I'd like to shift gears a little and try and hear some read lists/reads in general from people. Im typing up one myself but mobile might take a bit. Also, I'd like some low posters to talk. Seems sus to me thst the two people who force others to talk are dead and the silent crowd is quite large (myself included)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 04:44:08 pm
We still going with the no lynch plan?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 28, 2020, 05:24:21 pm
We still going with the no lynch plan?
Feels a bit odd to me considering we lynched yesterday - I’ll flesh out a vote in a couple of hours if nothing has happened, or are we actually pulling the uno reverse?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 28, 2020, 05:43:40 pm
kae, why would you give andre momentum?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 28, 2020, 05:48:42 pm
We still going with the no lynch plan?

Nah. Its the right way to win, but this game is supposed to be a memefest. If we drag this on for like a month I'll lose my mind
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 28, 2020, 05:53:35 pm
Nah, we're just still waiting for the remaining claims. We are very close to finding anubis with at most 3 people without alibi iirc; plus im in switzerland during Weekend so little Internet
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 28, 2020, 05:54:19 pm
kae, why would you give andre momentum?
so he cant get blocked duh
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 06:24:27 pm
kae, why would you give andre momentum?
so he cant get blocked duh

Uh, someone besides kae wanna tell me why i shouldnt find this scummy af?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 06:44:50 pm
I'd like to shift gears a little and try and hear some read lists/reads in general from people. Im typing up one myself but mobile might take a bit. Also, I'd like some low posters to talk. Seems sus to me thst the two people who force others to talk are dead and the silent crowd is quite large (myself included)

I second these ideas. I'll have to time to flesh in 1~2h, but this is my list so far

v
Coffeeditto / MasterWalks

n+
shockcannon / killsdazombies / Naesala

n
PlayerOa / kaempfer13 / Naii_the_Baf

n-
iancudorinmarian / moehrpi / Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 06:45:12 pm
EBWOP

flesh out'
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 28, 2020, 09:02:04 pm
If someone tells me what v/N+/N/N- specifically mean I'll give my thoughts, sorry again for not knowing my slang (though I have a general idea)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 09:03:45 pm
v
Coffeeditto / MasterWalks

I'm in part trusting Link here, but the whole damselfly interaction seemed town to me

n+
shockcannon

As I said in a previous post, the way serp put shock in the spotlight sounds really dangerous if they were a team. The way he acted today seems to make sense for town, tho I'd still like to know what he targeted me with

killsdazombies

The way he seemed to ponder torb's plan before jumping in seems more townleaning to me. His playstyle is the same as the last games, keeping his cards close to the chest. For the first days I see no problem with letting him do that.

Naesala

Volunteered to be a lynch once she realized we couldn't check her (an offer I'd take, but not today). Seems like legitimately confused town.

n
PlayerOa

I'm keeping Oa here until we finish clearing him up, but I'm more inclined to believe him being deja (I was a bit paranoid about him having claimed to be Anubis in n0 due to rolling it in n1, but that seems too risky to combo with a deja claim)

kaempfer13

I had him at n- due to his interaction with serp (I commented that in a previous post), but his behaviour today shaked a bit of my suspicions.

Naii_the_Baf

He could be lying about not having used Anubis, but that'd be a ballsy move tbh

n-
iancudorinmarian
ian seems sus by default, it's a trait he kinda shares with w3. His behaviour has been rubbing me the wrong way

moehrpi
no content, heading to a MK

Calindu
this is still due to him spilling his damselfly beans in D1
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 28, 2020, 09:04:36 pm
If someone tells me what v/N+/N/N- specifically mean I'll give my thoughts, sorry again for not knowing my slang (though I have a general idea)
Basically, vv > v > n+ > n > n- > w > ww
V is villager, w is wolf. N is neutral. The further to the left the more townread
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 09:05:24 pm
If someone tells me what v/N+/N/N- specifically mean I'll give my thoughts, sorry again for not knowing my slang (though I have a general idea)

v   = you think someone is town
n+ = more likely town than not
n   = on the fence
n-  = more likely mafia than town
w   = you think someone is mafia
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 28, 2020, 09:09:01 pm
Thank you both~ Will work on that shortly.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 28, 2020, 09:28:59 pm
V
Coffee/MW - I agree that this most recent interaction seems pretty convincing. I was a little concerned MW was lying about checking me but I think rob's recent post about error is saying that that was his fault, so yeah, this reads pretty clean to me with that considered.
Shockcannon - Serp's interactions with him night one seem awfully ballsy if he isn't town. Saccing a mafia AND giving us access to our plan for GN-Vulture abuse is a really crazy strat

N+
kdz :I can't get a strong read, but kdz has been active without blathering, while not giving up too much, which sounds like decent defensive play that supports town.
andre: I'm getting general good vibes and like kdz they've been active without talking in circles.

N:
Oa: I have no strong feelings either way
Moe: If they don't do or say something soon they'll be modkilled, which seems like distracted/inactive towny more than mafia. If they post before they're modkilled, I'd slide this to N- unless the post was convincing.

N-:
Kaemp: They've gone with the plan but is talking wayyyyyy too much, threetimes more than the next most active poster, and a lot of it is spinning wheels and talking in circles. If we were going to lynch, I'd be voting for them.
Naii: Relatively inactive, claiming Anubis when odds seem relatively unlikely, 'accidentally' hit post and didn't update for half an hour...don't like it
ian: Inactive and triggerhappy
Cali: Inactive, pithy answers

In defense of myself: I'm clearly rusty with mafia and an idiot, offered myself up to die, and have been transparent with my information. I should hope that supports me as a towny, even if I'm not a particularly useful towny.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 09:31:55 pm
If someone tells me what v/N+/N/N- specifically mean I'll give my thoughts, sorry again for not knowing my slang (though I have a general idea)

V= Definitely Town

N+= Neutral but slight town read

N= Full Neutral

N-= Neutral but slight scum read

W= Definitely Mafia
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 28, 2020, 09:32:31 pm
Wow super late on that one ^
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 28, 2020, 09:42:56 pm
Are there  any votes yet at all?
Anyway im all out of time, so put my vote on ian. I wish we could get those other claims, but he is one of the candidates and I already explained what i dont like.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 09:47:24 pm
I don't think we'll get any claims from moe or ian. I'm okay with letting kills off the hook.

vote count:

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 28, 2020, 09:57:19 pm
i'm back for another hot second. rob told me the i didn't see any ability used so yeah there's that
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 28, 2020, 10:04:11 pm
Ill make it easier, I did not target anyone with my role last night
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 28, 2020, 10:05:09 pm
I’ll make it even easier - moe was my deja vu partner
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 28, 2020, 10:06:44 pm
Well, that claim carries more weight then mine, but as I was about to say, just saying my role or what I did doesnt really clear me, and there is no one who can back up what I did/say i did, so lets not assume everyone who said their role or what they did or didn't do is totally truthful here, okay
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 28, 2020, 10:53:42 pm
Well, unfortunately moe is about to get MK'd (he needs to post in D2), so I don't think we'll be able to confirm Oa's claim.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 28, 2020, 11:54:24 pm
Naii: Relatively inactive, claiming Anubis when odds seem relatively unlikely, 'accidentally' hit post and didn't update for half an hour...don't like it

I figured someone would notice this sooner or later.
I do have a reason, but justifying that at this point sounds like scum compulsively trying to get out of suspicion. The reason is similar to why I didn't try to give a reason earlier. Might as well say this now, since it's been given attention.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 12:17:39 am
Way too quiet imo, lets get a second wagon going

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - amdretimpa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 12:34:10 am
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - amdretimpa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 12:35:13 am
I know ian is always silent, but well, he was on linkcats n- and well someone has to die.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 12:51:47 am
Most boring EOD ever
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 01:00:26 am
Well, RIP in pepperoni, ian
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 29, 2020, 01:00:41 am
Day 2 has come to a close - please remember that the break room is a privilege.  Your mother does not work here - it is YOUR responsibility to clean up after yourself. THANK you!

Please hold until further notice...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 29, 2020, 01:06:07 am
Final votecount:
iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

NIGHT 2

iancudorinmarian was lynched. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Psion]

moehrpi was modkilled for inactivity (Game Rule #8). He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Psion]

NIGHT 2 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 29, 2020, 01:07:42 am
Start of Night 2, remember to inform your immediate supervisor of all planned night activities. Department daily manpower projections are due to your immediate supervisor by close-of-business..

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 01:07:57 am
Some grade A wagonomics on this one.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 01:08:04 am
Interesting they were both psions, I wonder what the odds are of that
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 01:09:14 am
Sorry, its really hard to post meaningfully via mobile. I have someone coming by tomorrow to look at the line, hopefully itll be fine then but idk
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 01:15:45 am
Rare triple post, but in an effort to encourage people to speak, I want to see at least a meme or something insightful from every player or "Something" might happen to them. I've been feeling rather peckish and I need "Something" to sate my appetite


"Something"
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 29, 2020, 01:31:24 am
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/86/868746f9d71d16efb7497c8d7d72d427b4b351c281b893033430db78a2ed193a.jpg)

As for insightful, mafia should totally kill me, because I'm ashking for it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 29, 2020, 02:26:49 am
Rare triple post, but in an effort to encourage people to speak, I want to see at least a meme or something insightful from every player or "Something" might happen to them. I've been feeling rather peckish and I need "Something" to sate my appetite


"Something"

V̶̢͒̈́̍͌ͅỎ̶̰̈̚͝Ṙ̶̙̺̄͠͝Ḙ̴̘͛

I have nothing of value to add. I think Oa and Naii should be hit with some info roles. I do not have an info role tonight.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 29, 2020, 02:32:52 am
Andre was calindu anubis? If thats why you dont trust him it would have been crucial to share.
Cmon kdz i cant meme on phone while im aeay from home, dont do anything stupid because of that.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 29, 2020, 02:45:08 am
I think Oa and Naii should be hit with some info roles.

You won't get much info out of me this night— besides, someone else already knows my current role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 29, 2020, 03:01:38 am
I could almost do the wagonomics from phone (xcept the part where i add my greens). I get waiting with the vote for claims, but looks like most folk didnt even intend to vote. Cmon guys a 2 vote wagon never lynches scum.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 03:23:20 am
@kae he was Amber Nymph
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 03:25:47 am
btw, we could test Cal's claim by having him target Nae, depending on what he rolled this night.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on August 29, 2020, 03:35:19 am
btw, we could test Cal's claim by having him target Nae, depending on what he rolled this night.
Which claim?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 29, 2020, 03:58:00 am
btw, we could test Cal's claim by having him target Nae, depending on what he rolled this night.
Which claim?

That he targetted himself. He should have momentum, so he should be able to target someone immaterial.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: iancudorinmarian on August 29, 2020, 07:12:09 am
wow
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 29, 2020, 07:53:31 am
Upon rethinking i really think its Oa. Sure he exposed himself twice to getting rolecoped or traced, but e.g. aint it convenient that his dejapartner was the guy who wouldnt log in. Also why would you slowroll that other than wanting to avoid suspicion in the moment?
Additionally there is some  delicious irony in that, given that  andre pulled the same move in the mafia hosted by oa and oa considered it a good move.
Maybe naii just seems to obv a choice to me plus i just dont think he'd do that and kdz i townread. Everyone else has an alibi backed by another person, except shock, but i got the impression he was telling the truth.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 29, 2020, 08:25:48 am
moe had hard drive trouble. Sure, it might seem convenient, but he considered getting himself modkilled, which I tried talking him away from. Didn’t want to interfere too much with that, figured he’d at least try to get in a post here. Maybe slowrolling was a wrong move but whatever, hindsight is a nice thing

I even was anubis in N0, so it’s literally impossible it could have been me.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on August 29, 2020, 10:21:45 am
btw, we could test Cal's claim by having him target Nae, depending on what he rolled this night.

Seems pretty silly to me you want to test if I have momentum or not tbh, you know my role and it is a good effect to have, why would I not use it on myself?
I also can't target anyone tonight, so the whole plan kind of doesn't work.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 29, 2020, 03:19:43 pm
The mafia are hiding in a sea of inactivity at this point. We just need some meaningful discussion and reads.

I'll be posting the read list by the end of today, and I'd at least like some thoughts from everyone else. As we can see, without the handful of influential voices driving conversation things are rather dead. This isn't the old mafia where we can win via pms and role use. Given how random everything is solving is a little tricky, so we need to be active and communicate our thoughts. Again, read lists and everyone who can vote needs to. Also, any red checks should be reported immediately
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 29, 2020, 04:23:00 pm
I'm targeting coffee tonight.
Within the earth lies the secrets of the elements.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on August 29, 2020, 10:14:00 pm
I’m targetting shockcannon tonight.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 29, 2020, 10:34:55 pm
Basic Read list:

N+
Coffee
Shock

N
Nae
andre
kdz

N-
Oa
kaempf
Naii
Cal
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 29, 2020, 10:56:18 pm
Only small changes to my readlist from a couple of days ago - these have been some dull days in topic:

v
andretimpa

n+
kdz, Coffeeditto

n
kaempfer, shock, MW, Calindu

n-
Naesala, Naii

v
andretimpa

n+
kdz, moehrpi, Coffeeditto

n
kaempfer, Naii, shock, MW, Calindu

n-
Naesala, MW, Calindu, iancu, Naii

While I'm not happy with kaempfer's arguments, considering how far off they are, it does look like a genuine attempt at solving, and I'm almost willing at putting him at n+. The MW/Cal/Naii swaps are mostly due to Anubis likelyhood. Although I yet again want to reiterate that giving timpa immaterial does not always necessarily compute to being scum.

Additionally there is some delicious irony in that, given that  andre pulled the same move in the mafia hosted by oa and oa considered it a good move.
lol. Was an OK move in 73 due to serp being confirmed town and an obvious healer target. I still found it a bit.. ballsy, tbh. Led to a witch hunt that took timpa down and Ge0 with him. This is a completely different game tho... If I were scum, I would have been veeeery careful on throwing immaterial around, due to paranoia from the exact same scenario you're trying to shame me on. The narrative is good, I'll give you that, but unfortunately in this case it's wrong and only a red herring that will lead us nowhere
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 30, 2020, 08:53:03 pm
Nah letting us hunt for the culprit and potentially mislynch people for that reason alone is def a scummove. There is no point deflecting from anubis at this point in time.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 30, 2020, 08:55:42 pm
Nah letting us hunt for the culprit and potentially mislynch people for that reason alone is def a scummove. There is no point deflecting from anubis at this point in time.
Alright then, I gotta admit I've lost track, what's the pool of possible Anubises?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 30, 2020, 09:55:13 pm
It's only me, I believe. Made a check on everyone's claims.

Here is what I gathered, jfr:
Oa: Deja Vu
kae: Amber Nymph
andre: Psion
Naii: Anubis
Cal: Amber Nymph
MW: Dragonfly
kdz: No targets, dunno role
Coffee: FFQ
shock: Blocked, dunno role
Nae: Targeted self, dunno role
Link was town Anubis.
Oa claimed moe was Deja; moe hadn't so much as logged in so it doesn't matter anyway.
ian wasn't scum but he could also have been Anubis.

Nae has an alibi, shock sorta, kdz not really.

I could be confused between current roles and previous ones since some early claims are mixed in with the posts I'm basing myself on, so do correct me if you find a mistake.
Someone could be lying (must be, in fact, but I can't prove that right now).

Will post a readslist in a bit.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 30, 2020, 10:32:55 pm
No explanation = no real read.

v
andre: Put on immaterial; really don't think scum would make other scum immaterial. Self immaterial could maybe make sense as scum, but Cal has been online and didn't refute the Psion check.

n+
Nae: Don't really think she's scum, not entirely sure she's town either. Alibi for Anubis checks out, so n+.
MW/Coffee: Role interaction.

n
Oa: Besides the moe Deja partner thing (which I don't really find leaning any way), nothing has really stood out to me.
Cal

n-
kae: Amber Nymph usage; do you have a reason for giving andre─ or anyone for that matter─ momentum, or was there some post I'm not aware of justifying this?
shock: Few posts, but besides the targeting ones (which could very well be crumbs for later use), I don't find him scummy tbh. Didn't actually say his target N1 and claimed D2 to have targeted andre.

w
kdz: Lynched ian with a very flimsy excuse (although it could also be not wanting to extend the game too much), doesn't really have anything going for him regarding the Anubis topic.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 30, 2020, 10:44:58 pm
He was just a low poster, much like yourself, that had a vote, and it would break a tie. Call it what you want, but its not like anyone else is stepping up to bat this game, plus I've been actively trying to encourage people to talk more. I was already in the towns good graces for the most part, so I felt comfortable enforcing an essentially random execution. Besides, why would a mafia make a move at all? When the town is inactive, there is very little reason for a mafia to promote, and demonstrate activity. Easier to hide in a silent crowd then speak out from it.

Frankly, everyone who voted yesterday has a + bump in my book for actually participating, and everyone who didn't has a mark against them.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 30, 2020, 11:02:11 pm
shock: Few posts, but besides the targeting ones (which could very well be crumbs for later use), I don't find him scummy tbh. Didn't actually say his target N1 and claimed D2 to have targeted andre, so n-.

EBWOP just in case. I'm kind of contradicting myself without noting this.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 30, 2020, 11:39:46 pm
@Naii

tbh I would have switched from Cal if the vote remained tied. I also remember you being around EOD (at the time there was a single vote from kae on ian). If you thought our reasons for lynching ian were flimsy you should have at least spoken up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 12:24:42 am
I'm targeting coffee tonight.

I’m targetting shockcannon tonight.

I'm not targetting anyone tonight :sillyspin:

Also, to encourage more posts, remember that crumbing can be useful later on in the game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 12:49:11 am
A quick update to my reads, in case I croak (might have been the reason for the Anubis after all)

v
I'm not noticing anything out of the ordinary on his play, which is telling since iirc we haven't seen scum!MW. I'd expect at least some change in his gameplay. His damselfly interaction with Coffee seems very genuine.

Considering everything I have gathered, I'm fairly confident that kdz is town. You guys should listen to him and start to actually play the game.

n+
The main factors at play so far are his interactions with serp (see my previous read). D2 interactions seemed townie to me. I'd recommend shock doesn't push his secrecy too much, if you can share an information, sharing will likely help town.

He is above n mostly due to his interactions with MW. He is not at v, because his scumstyle is still fresh in my memory and I see some similarities (might just be he always plays like this).

Her confusion seems genuine, not faked. I think it would be safe to get her lynched at some later point due to her being uncheckable, but we have some people more likely to be scum in the mean time.

Is actually trying to participate, which is more than a lot of us (just keep the double/triple posts in check, this is not a competition for the highest post count :sillyspin:).

n
Someone more cynical than me would likely say that Oa's claim of being deja with the guy that disappeared, plus the timing of it is convenient. The only scenario where he was the Anubis is if he claimed to be Anubis in n0 due to rolling it in n1 (thus setting his alibi early on). I'm not placing him lower because comboing that with a deja claim is very risky (I can see much easier ways to implement this alibi as scum).

n-
This might be tunneling on my part. I'm willing to go for a different lynch today.

Could very well be lying about not having used Anubis. His reads are fairly missaligned with mine too, which raises me an eyebrow.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 31, 2020, 01:00:03 am
Night 2 has concluded - hold please while the bits and bytes are compiled, analyzed, and tabulated. The results will be posted soon(TM)...

Please hold until further notice...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 31, 2020, 01:39:31 am
DAY 3

MasterWalks was nightkilled. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Otyugh]

DAY 3 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on August 31, 2020, 01:39:42 am
Start of Day 3, hatching reports (for Day 3 through Night 3) are submitted, refer to nearest Inbox location for your new ability assignments.

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
14. Naii_the_Baf
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 01:44:28 am
That feels like a strange kill
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 01:58:04 am
That feels like a strange kill

It was probably because pretty much everyone townread him, but I agree with the sentiment.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 12:07:15 pm
@shock/coffee did anything interesting came out from targetting each other?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 31, 2020, 01:10:17 pm
Seeing andretimpa survive surprises me. inb4 deepwolf

It's only me, I believe. Made a check on everyone's claims.

Naii: Anubis
Is this a straight up admit to being Anubis, or did I misunderstand your post? If so, admitting to it is not really something I see scum would do... but the move itself is pretty damn scummy. Some WIFOM shit right there. Reminds me a bit of the Coffee vigging d2d situation last game. Placing my vote on Naii for time being.

Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 01:25:39 pm
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Even without the ian lynch thing he's the only one without an alibi of sorts on the Anubis topic (besides me), which still places him at w in my list.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 01:27:58 pm
It's only me, I believe. Made a check on everyone's claims.

Naii: Anubis
Is this a straight up admit to being Anubis, or did I misunderstand your post? If so, admitting to it is not really something I see scum would do... but the move itself is pretty damn scummy. Some WIFOM shit right there. Reminds me a bit of the Coffee vigging d2d situation last game. Placing my vote on Naii for time being.

Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa

I claimed Anubis at the very start of D2 as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 31, 2020, 01:33:34 pm
It's only me, I believe. Made a check on everyone's claims.

Naii: Anubis
Is this a straight up admit to being Anubis, or did I misunderstand your post? If so, admitting to it is not really something I see scum would do... but the move itself is pretty damn scummy. Some WIFOM shit right there. Reminds me a bit of the Coffee vigging d2d situation last game. Placing my vote on Naii for time being.

Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa

I claimed Anubis at the very start of D2 as well.
Right, I had somehow completely missed that post. Well then kdz, ball's over to you I guess

Talking about kdz...
Frankly, everyone who voted yesterday has a + bump in my book for actually participating, and everyone who didn't has a mark against them.
While I didn't vote myself, I can agree with this sentiment.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 01:34:52 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

As I said in my reads, I'm willing to vouch for kdz being town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 05:15:27 pm
Mobile - I was a seraph and used divine shield. Hence I didn't target anyone with my role. I tried to soft pull a nk by saying the game was an easy win if the OTHER vultures don't die, hopefully implying to mafia I was a vulture.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 05:19:28 pm
For clarity, we are talking about n1 right?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 05:23:34 pm
I think so
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 31, 2020, 05:24:00 pm
For clarity, we are talking about n1 right?
Yup, trying to hunt down the Anubis which made andretimpa immaterial. Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it? Because if not, then someone's lying not wanting to take responsibility for making him immaterial.. and that is a bad bad thing to lie about
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 05:25:38 pm
Good. Then yes, seraph and used divine shield. Hence the attempted bait.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 05:26:02 pm
Just a little hard to follow some logic trains via mobile
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 05:56:25 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on August 31, 2020, 06:19:39 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.

Well has everyone role usage been confirmed? Its pretty easy to lie in this fate egg game. I dont think we live in a world where a town uses anibus
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 31, 2020, 06:23:57 pm
I need to a few specific players to talk first so I can get the last pieces I need of the puzzle, but a big post will be coming soon from me. I'll share all my roles in it also, but if you want a sneak peak, I have bread crumbed all my roles already. Goodluck finding them though, I made it hard. :P
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on August 31, 2020, 06:24:22 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.

Well has everyone role usage been confirmed? Its pretty easy to lie in this fate egg game. I dont think we live in a world where a town uses anibus
Well that's the problem - there's no way we can confirm anything of that now, and it's just words vs words. I'm pretty pissed I got deja paired with the one guy who had hard drive trouble and couldn't confirm, so there's that alibi...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 06:27:48 pm
I need to a few specific players to talk first so I can get the last pieces I need of the puzzle, but a big post will be coming soon from me. I'll share all my roles in it also, but if you want a sneak peak, I have bread crumbed all my roles already. Goodluck finding them though, I made it hard. :P

waiting warmly for it
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 06:41:13 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.

It's possible that it was ian as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 06:46:05 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.

It's possible that it was ian as well.

Last I checked ian was town. He also played in a game as scum where Anubis to dodge doctors was used heavily.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 06:50:31 pm
Is there any chance that a now-dead player could have done it?

That involves Link having a stroke and thinking it was a good idea to do it, but it is a possibility.

It's possible that it was ian as well.

Last I checked ian was town. He also played in a game as scum where Anubis to dodge doctors was used heavily.

Regardless of his alignment he could have performed the action given the circumstances, however unlikely it is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on August 31, 2020, 07:02:46 pm
Okay, my scumread on kdz doesn't really hold anymore.

I'm currently considering a scenario where kae/Cal are w/w.

We are yet to see a reason for the N1 Amber Nymph usage from kae's part. andre was given momentum, so an Amber Nymph was definitely used. His psion check on Cal returned Amber Nymph as well. Cal did not counter it, so we can somewhat safely assume it is true. That means that if Cal is lying and targeted andre, then an Anubis!kae could use it as a cover to claim Amber Nymph as well.

It's even better because I was Deja Vu with Calindu last night, so it couldn't be proven previously.

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 07:38:26 pm
kae/Cal is a scenario that I did entertain earlier tbh. Seems a bit risky tho.

There's also the fact of Cal revealing info that would defeat part of the purpose of the N0 plan and MW's last readlist

Basic Read list:

N+
Coffee
Shock

N
Nae
andre
kdz

N-
Oa
kaempf
Naii
Cal
that has kae and Cal as scumleans (+ MW being townread by everyone). Tho if I were scum I'd have just ignored the list altogether (very easy to write it off as MW being wrong)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on August 31, 2020, 09:25:11 pm
GG!

Going back to school. Gotta get better at M A T H E M A T I C S
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 09:30:54 pm
The reason i targeted timpa rather than myself with amber nymph was because i confidently townread him and je could have had a usefull ability that might need help going through, while mine was well amber nymph. Why is that so hard to understand?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 09:41:52 pm
Giving andre 2 buffs as scum just isnt worth period, even if the team was exactly me +cal, not to mention i never approved of the anubis play as a good move in mafia 63, should have just killed serp immediately and used anubis to ensure no heal occurs, withoutletting serp report becoming immortal.
Although now that you mentioned it, giving both of us an alibi while initiating a phantom hunt would have been a brillant move if we really were a team; except for the part where cals alibi completely hinges on town!timpa rolecopping him and otherwise being included in the hunt
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 11:11:29 pm
Public roleclaims
me: n0 oty failed to kill serp
n1 gave momentum to andre

moehrpi: cosplays as skeleton, modkill approaching

Naii: n0 if it was claimed i missed it
n1 Anubis, claims no use

ian: n1 implied dragonfly, no real claims

cal: n0 dragonfly on serp; saw andre and dead town target serp
claims targeting self n1 (amber nymph)

shockcannon: claims to have claimed sth n0
n1 psion on andre failed due to anubis on andre

nae: n0 green nymph self
n1 anubis self

Oa: n0 anubis on noone
n1 deja with moe

kdz: claims seraph n1

MW: n0 deja with coffee
n1 dragonfly on nae

timpa: n0 green nymph on serp
n1 psion on calindu

coffee: n0 deja
N1 ffq on mw no result
I think it unlikely that scum  would both end up having no alibi. As such i think exactly of kdz,oa, shock and naii is scum. But it might actually be better to look at it the other way around. Who would be sure to have an alibi? This would be the info roles and buffers targeting people other than themselves. Out of the unflipped people that leaves myself, coffee and timpa(nvm obv cant be him even though he had an info role).
So if that theory is correct a thunderdome between me and coffee actually has a higher chance of success.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 11:13:53 pm
Welp, i suppose thats sure to get me lynched given where peoples reads are at, but if it is coffee its worth so long as he gets lynched the next day
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 11:15:16 pm
Ebwop: exactly  1 of oa,kdz, shock and naii
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on August 31, 2020, 11:23:31 pm
It would be nice to hear from coffee tbh. He's gone pretty quiet lately.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on August 31, 2020, 11:40:20 pm
No pressure, but I actually really do need Coffee to share about his night actions before I post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on August 31, 2020, 11:45:04 pm
New record  in multiposts probably, soz. But yh, fmpov it either has to be a pair of bumbling idiots that both risked themselves on a rolehunt or precisely oa+coffee, where oa set up a selfsufficient alibi at the start of day1 (he did know anubiswas his next role so could claim having it earlier and formulate that plan as early as that), knowing coffee would be able to prove his innocence and thus making us tear through people that got less fortunate with their roles.
I suppose everyone else might find teams involving me that make sense as well, but I dont get distracted by that and we have plenty of lynches left.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 01, 2020, 12:07:36 am
Now that I saw your public roleclaims list, kae, I think I never claimed my N0 role. I was Seraph N0.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 12:29:09 am
@kae You make a compelling argument. I'd really love to hear coffee's thoughts on this.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on September 01, 2020, 07:34:26 am
I have just finished moving back into college, and will be more active again. As far as my night actions went last night, I had intended to target shock with my Iridium Warden but didn't send in the PM so I didn't.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 01, 2020, 09:16:13 am
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 01, 2020, 09:22:00 am
Little curious that coffee and oa sat on mw together day1 (this doesnt actually help my point at all, in fact scum is more likely to spread their votes out, i just find it interesting)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 09:45:47 am
Given the timing of the votes it can very well just be a way to stay out of the main wagon. Tho if I were scum I'd have gone with MW + another unsuspecting townie (or even a minor bus).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 01, 2020, 01:15:57 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

I wanted to let him have a chance to contribute before voting him, but I have work until near deadline now, so i ought to place my vote now.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 03:06:55 pm
Toss my vote on cali for now, I'd like to hear them speak.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 03:10:18 pm
This is the correct vote count (kae missed Naii switching votes)

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 01, 2020, 04:28:26 pm
Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, andretimpa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 04:37:40 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Just want to avoid any train running loose before Coffee shows up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 04:39:30 pm
Also

No pressure, but I actually really do need Coffee to share about his night actions before I post.

I have just finished moving back into college, and will be more active again. As far as my night actions went last night, I had intended to target shock with my Iridium Warden but didn't send in the PM so I didn't.

Ball's on your court, shock
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 01, 2020, 05:54:52 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Just want to avoid any train running loose before Coffee shows up.
FYI we EU people can't stall all the way until deadline, I'd like to discuss and hopefully conclude voting within 3 hours if possible.

Naii is still my top choice for lynch, solely because he's in my view much more likely to have immaterialized timpa than anyone else around. I gotta admit, though, that I'm liking his posts more and more.

Calindu seems like a decent lynch for me as well, but we're not really learning much if we lynch him, are we? Just the good ol' chance of can-be-hiding-scum

Coffee is an interesting case - I understand I'm under suspicion of being w/w with him. If he rolls mafia, then good, only one more to go. Doesn't change the fact I'm not maf myself though, but if me dying is a result of hitting scum!Coffee then it's a no-brainer, really - I'd happily bow down as a consequence of the trade-off. And if he's town, then kaempfer's theory will be confirmed false, which at least is slightly better for town as I know it's not the path to how we're winning this game, since I already know it's not true. But to reiterate myself once again, I townread Coffee and I'd much rather board one of the other trains.

TLDR:
Lynch priority imo: Naii > Cal > Coffee
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 05:57:57 pm
Are 24h extensions still a thing?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 06:01:53 pm
Just in case

extension (1) - andretimpa

I think we'd benefit from more time, given the latency in these conversations.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 01, 2020, 06:18:05 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

Game Rule #4, as outlined in your "New Employees Handbook: Welcome to Corporate Utopia" guide, specifies that once per phase a 24h extension might be granted. To clarify for the nosey Nancy's among us, this is once per day+night phase (combined) and requires more votes in favor of extension than votes against extension.

Are 24h extensions still a thing?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 01, 2020, 06:19:05 pm
Extension (2) - andretimpa, PlayerOa

sure
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 06:19:26 pm
@rob Thank you corporate overlord
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 01, 2020, 06:39:17 pm
HOST CLARIFICATION:

This is a utopian corporation. How do you know? Because we say so. Your understandable yet regrettable error is corrected below.

Remember, a day off is only valuable to the company if you work an extra day on the previous or subsequent weekend. Thank you for your time.

@rob Thank you corporate overlord equal
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on September 01, 2020, 07:08:57 pm
Okay, my scumread on kdz doesn't really hold anymore.

I'm currently considering a scenario where kae/Cal are w/w.

We are yet to see a reason for the N1 Amber Nymph usage from kae's part. andre was given momentum, so an Amber Nymph was definitely used. His psion check on Cal returned Amber Nymph as well. Cal did not counter it, so we can somewhat safely assume it is true. That means that if Cal is lying and targeted andre, then an Anubis!kae could use it as a cover to claim Amber Nymph as well.

It's even better because I was Deja Vu with Calindu last night, so it couldn't be proven previously.

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf

I am struggling to find logic in your post, it's like you did not read my whole 9 posts. I did pretty much confirm I am Amber Nymph, as I said I can't target anyone so I can't confirm. And I even argued why I would even target anyone by myself with that?
Also, we were Deja Vu's, so you can confirm the fact that I couldn't target anyone for my claim to be verified.

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 01, 2020, 07:40:05 pm
You seem to not grasp exactly what I'm saying, Calindu.

You couldn't target anyone last night, that much is true. But that is only relevant because when asked to prove you had momentum you were a Deja; in other words, that you wouldn't be able to prove it until you got a new role. Remember this assumes you and kae are w/w; so you wouldn't be "by yourself", as-is. Plus, you would have revealed your information since when andre asked you who your Amber Nymph target was (before his psion claim) it was kinda random; in other words suspicion could have arised that he had information on you. Furthermore, he specifically asked "did you target anyone?" which kind of implies andre knew you had a targeting role.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Coffeeditto on September 01, 2020, 08:15:02 pm
Extension (3) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto

i need more time to lay down my thoughts than the next 5 hours.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 01, 2020, 08:18:18 pm
Extension (4) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto, Naii_the_Baf
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 01, 2020, 08:20:03 pm
Naai, if you really want to tunnel the specific scenario where cal and i roleswapped odds are not bad that calindu can mechanically prove or disprove this in the future, as he's gonna get a targeting role eventually; not gonna be possible if you lynch him immediately though. Tunneling him based on that fringe scenario and not waiting for an obvious opportunity to verify it is unwise (and i hate that it takes cals supposed partner to point this out to you)


Extension (5) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 01, 2020, 08:36:06 pm
You make a good point on waiting a bit before pushing on, kae. My vote will remain on Calindu for now, but I'm willing to vote someone else if I am persuaded to, or it becomes necessary.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 08:47:24 pm
I'm fine with an extension as well. Please cast my vote for extendo, if not solely because my internet will be fixed tomorrow :)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 08:50:58 pm
I'm fine with an extension as well. Please cast my vote for extendo, if not solely because my internet will be fixed tomorrow :)

Extension (6) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 01, 2020, 09:00:50 pm
Extension (6) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala

Still waiting on shock's big reveal
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 01, 2020, 09:01:21 pm
Extension (7) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala

EBWOP 7 not 6
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 01, 2020, 09:01:32 pm
REGARDING PHASE EXTENSION:

A determination will be made at 3 hours before deadline. Currently votes are 7-0 in favor of extending.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 01, 2020, 09:12:46 pm
Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon

This vote could go on kdz also and I'll switch if people would rather lynch kdz first. Writing up follow up post now.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 01, 2020, 10:07:16 pm
Jury is now in session.

Players on trial for their crimes:
kaempfer13
killsdazombies

Evidence:
To gain trust, I'll start by sharing all night actions and info gathered thus far (which is technically nothing, but nothing can sometimes be even more valuable).

N0 - Ghost of the Past
This role was breadcrumbed in my very first post.
I'm targeting kaempfer13 tonight.

If you had clicked on quote on this post, you would have noticed that at the end of the sentence there are two random colors with no text. Yellow and dimgray, the respective colors for time and darkness. The only role that has ties with time and darkness would be ghost of the past due to its usage in ghostmare. I did in fact target kaempfer. Partially for the memes, partially because I had already started to suspect some odd play out of him. First, we have the fact that he pushed quite hard for a no vig scenario. Second, it felt like he was being a little more aggressive than normal and looking to establish control a lot earlier, with more assertive statements rather than questioning from the past. Now, this means absolutely nothing because N0 reads are absolutely worthless in my opinion and I will always believe that. But it was more than enough to justify using ghost of the past on him, especially because I knew there was a high chance he would try to policy lynch me and I wanted to spite him. Terrible town play? Maybe. But at least if I go down, he's useless for the rest of the game so maybe he'll think twice before randomly lynching me.

N1 - Psion
I breadcrumbed this here:
Lastly, at least one other person should already know my role. So maybe try asking around.
Obviously, I had no way of knowing if someone knew my role. But what's the only role that does let people know other roles? Well it's psion. Psion has 5 letters, "so maybe try asking around" has 5 words. No other role in the game has 5 letters.
I did indeed use this role on andretimpa. There was some discussion about how Calindu (if i recall) messed up by giving away that andre targeted serprex and was potentially a crusader turned golden nymph. I figured it was possible andre gave out a fake role to hide this potential scenario and I wanted to check for GN in case I rolled crusader soon after and could grab a GN with 100% certainty. It potentially increases my odds of GN by 50% because now I can roll vulture, GN, OR crusader.

However, I will acknowledge that this is a potential mafia move because knowing if andre is GN or not would let mafia know if they need to kill him immediately or not. But then why would my theoretical teammate waste an anubis on andre as well? I'm going to use Anubis to get a guaranteed kill on someone if I already plan on killing them, not a conditional kill that only happens if a player happened to have had a role. Also, lowkey, I'm pretty sure using Anubis on a town to guarantee a kill that's pretty much always going to go through anyways, and on someone who isn't even close to a confirmed town is just such a bad play for mafia. I won't waste my time ranting, but the latter part of this post is going to talk about who the mafia Anubis is, because that's a real lead and we should witch hunt this, because it's all we really have besides "our feelings," which we know are not always 100% accurate, and are sometimes -500% accurate.

N2 - Iridium Warden
This was breadcrumbed here:
I'm targeting coffee tonight.
Within the earth lies the secrets of the elements.
If you click quote on the post, you will notice that a sentence is written in transparent color. The message reads, "Within the earth lies the secrets of the elements."
The only roles that are earth creatures are graboid, shreiker, and iridium warden. Iridium is an element on the periodic table, hence the word "elements at the end of the sentence. "Lies the secrets" indicates that I lied about my visible statement, meaning that I did not target coffee. I, in fact, targeted no one as I wasn't planning to block anyone, but I did want to see if anyone would react to this post, either by commenting or through night actions. It appears that Coffee forgot to use his ability. I was hoping others would share their roles first because I was curious if anyone visited either me or coffee last night, expecting me and coffee to visit each other. Luckily, this lack of info is irrelevant to my revelations so I don't mind posting now. It's also quite likely, that this bait did not result in anything noteworthy.
Now we get to the juicy stuff. So the only real thing we have to work off is that fact that someone gave andretimpa immaterial N1, which I'm going to assume is simply a 100% mafia move. The only way I see this being made by a townie, is if that townie is me, and unfortunately it's not, which makes this situation a little bit harder to decipher.

Now someone brought up this idea of kaemp lying about his action and his teammate being the one who gave momentum. I actually thought this was completely ridiculous and what would be the point, but then I started to see something. There is a scenario where this is actually useful. Each player has a different aura about them and certain actions/comments will be more believable if said by a different person. So I could see a scenario where kaempf + teammate decided that they would remain hidden better if kaempf were the one to give momentum, while the teammate was the one to lie about their role.

So who is the other mafia? Well, I'm pretty inclined to believe it's kdz. KDZ claims to have been seraph and used divine shield n1. Now this is a bold claim, because it's very easily confirmable by someone else having tried to target kdz. Obviously that didn't happen. Now it's very possible, KDZ is getting unlucky and was really seraph, but this is possible the most suspicious looking role for a mafia Anubis to have claimed.

You might be saying, all my claims are ridiculous and have nothing else backing them except a potential scenario that is just as likely as any other? Well good thing we have more evidence. If we look at lynch logs, we have kaempf and kdz taking out ian on day 2. They knew no one was voting, and couldn't believe their eyes when they get a free lynch for only 2 votes. They eliminate a silent player who gives away 0 info by dying, while keeping all the prime suspects in play. Additionally, there's almost no repercussions for this lynch. They can blame it on afk town or breaking a tie vote, or literally anything. Additionally, now that we have some sort of concrete evidence we can insert our feelings and see if they match up.

Well, kaempf aggressively tried to get me lynched day 1 and it took me a while to figure out why. Policy lynch just didn't feel right. Last mafia game, kaempf actually tried to save me when I was being policy lynched for using Rita. So what's going on here? Well I think it's because I said I targeted kaempf n0 and was not willing to share my role. He kept prying for my role despite getting 0 system messages and I get the feeling he was worried I put a fly on him. This would let me see his N1 activities that he had been planning. Hence the aggressive push to get me killed and constant prying for me to share my role.

It's also possible that kaempf actually was amber nymph n1. He could use it on the same target that his teammate was giving immaterial. If he thought I was watching his actions, then he would be cleared from guilt by using a non-Anubis move on the same target that got immaterial.

Now is this all speculation and potential BS? Sure, but it's one heck of a case and I at least had fun writing it and coming up with the idea. Is it believable? I'd argue it's more believable than any other arguments so far, since those all seem to be based solely on reads, so I'm going with it until someone gives me something better.
Verdict:
GUILTY

Something that's uncomfortable is the amount of players who have claimed Anubis straight up. Like, there's been an unusual amount. These are potential suspects as well, who could be claiming their role correctly in case someone used psion on them, but are lying about usage, since they realized they did not get caught.
Watchlist:
PlayerOa
Naii_the_Baf
anyone else who claimed Anubis (I think there was 1 more)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 01, 2020, 10:42:32 pm
EXTENDED 24HRS.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 10:45:43 pm
As much as I love your Masterposts shock, I am saddened I didn't even get a spotlight in my own accusation post.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 01, 2020, 10:52:05 pm
@shock The other one that claimed Anubis is Nae, but MW + rob derping messages confirms that she targetted herself.

About the rest of the evidence, try rereading things assuming kdz is town. The people in your watchlist sound much more believable as a potential partner for kae. I'd rather sort kae on D4 tho.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 10:53:05 pm
Seriously though, idc much about kae, but placing a vote well before eod to break a tie on a player I historically have voted for because I dislike their style of play is pretty flimsy evidence. Idc much about kae, they just happened to vote on a person I was fine with killing. And how ballsy would I have to be to gamble on 0 people targeting me night 1 to fake a Seraph claim. I demonstrated an attempt to soft bait, which is about as crumbed as a seraph should post. I just wish you had anything I could actually argue with, but so far your major condemnation is that I voted in a round where no one else bothered to cast a vote. Why would the mafia put a spotlight on themselves? It doesn't make sense.

Also, OOC, aren't hidden messages banned? I thought we had this come up before and it was considered akin to a coded message, but forgive me if I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 01, 2020, 11:04:13 pm
It's not in this mafia's rules and it's also technically not hidden.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 11:08:35 pm
It's not in this mafia's rules and it's also technically not hidden.

Still ooc - Fair enough, Maybe I'm remembering something from somewhere else. My long term memory has been garbage lately.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 01, 2020, 11:32:35 pm
OOC:

@kdz

That was mafia 72─ shock got modkilled for hiding a message in bbc. That rule was set by the host (Ginyu), not as a general mafia rule, so it's particular to that mafia and not global.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 01, 2020, 11:34:44 pm
OOC:

@kdz

That was mafia 72─ shock got modkilled for hiding a message in bbc. That rule was set by the host (Ginyu), not as a general mafia rule, so it's particular to that mafia and not global.

Ah okay, thank you
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 01, 2020, 11:57:24 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

I've been reading Kaemp as scum all game, shock seems to have a good case. I'm not convinced about kdz, but shock's write up seems pretty strong otherwise.

Also, a transparent reminder; I have adrenaline, so the vote isn't tied at 2's. And yes, I had Anubis, claimed I targeted myself, and that's confirmed by rob mistake and MW.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 02, 2020, 12:14:35 am
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

I've been reading Kaemp as scum all game, shock seems to have a good case. I'm not convinced about kdz, but shock's write up seems pretty strong otherwise.

Also, a transparent reminder; I have adrenaline, so the vote isn't tied at 2's. And yes, I had Anubis, claimed I targeted myself, and that's confirmed by rob mistake and MW.

I dont think adren affects the voting
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 02, 2020, 12:17:18 am
I dont think adren affects the voting

Oh, I misread. My bad.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 02, 2020, 01:38:17 am
HOST RULING:

Refrain from using message encrypting or obfuscating methods in your posts. You may breadcrumb hints or clues but use of formatting to hide or bury messages such as excessive spoilers, timers, tiny font, unreadable color (including invisitext and the like) is forbidden.

Abstain from such activity\posts - at host's discretion players will receive at most one warning and\or be modkilled for breaking this rule.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 02:04:54 am
Something that's uncomfortable is the amount of players who have claimed Anubis straight up. Like, there's been an unusual amount. These are potential suspects as well, who could be claiming their role correctly in case someone used psion on them, but are lying about usage, since they realized they did not get caught.

Keep in mind Dragonfly and FFQ are a thing too. The reason I claimed Anubis so early into D2 as opposed to waiting a bit before claiming was because Anubis activity happened, and Psion or either aforementioned roles may exist. I would rather both claim on my own and do it as soon as possible, as a later claim could have well put me under more fire than I already am in for just claiming the scummy role. I did so before knowing everyone's targets/roles as well; it's kinda stupid to risk it so much when anyone could have gotten either of those and targeted you, no? I find Anubis claims more credible the sooner they were made.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 02:18:19 am
EXTENDED 24HRS.

DAY 3 has concluded.

A timer update would be nice as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 02, 2020, 03:44:41 am
Timer extended as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:35:24 am
shock your case is so ridiculous I really dont feel like addressing it. But  I will point out some flaws, as you really seem to believe it.
re: kdz and me taking a free lynch: this necessarily means that naii is town so why would we even care? in fact naii is the better choice for lynch as there is absolutely no hope of ian clearing himself ever through nonmechanical means.
First part is pretty much just you justifying your role usage, so at most id have to address your flymsy n0 read that was probably fueled by me pushing for an early vig on someone where i wouldnt regret it (since i did get oty n0 and except for the resident sleeper scenario where gn dies n0 and vultures accumulate over time its better to use all the townkp (kp=killpower)you get; now that did happen and i only figured out the next day that that very nonstandard play is actually mechanically optimal; hence my 180 on pushing for noone to die the following day); still wouldnt regret it considering your post.
2nd part other than ian lynch is just you asserting that i roleswapped with my mafiapartner, who necessarily got amber nymph then and in case of not cal also lied about their role. Incidentally the only candidates for that scenario are also the people that could have been anubis in the first place, so I'm not sure why you are taking that extrastep in the first place.
Agreed that naii and oa are prime candidates for anubis.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:44:27 am
@shock did you target me?
I accidentally clicked post before finishing my previous post.

I was Anubis last night. I didn't use it.
Something that's uncomfortable is the amount of players who have claimed Anubis straight up. Like, there's been an unusual amount. These are potential suspects as well, who could be claiming their role correctly in case someone used psion on them, but are lying about usage, since they realized they did not get caught.

Keep in mind Dragonfly and FFQ are a thing too. The reason I claimed Anubis so early into D2 as opposed to waiting a bit before claiming was because Anubis activity happened, and Psion or either aforementioned roles may exist. I would rather both claim on my own and do it as soon as possible, as a later claim could have well put me under more fire than I already am in for just claiming the scummy role. I did so before knowing everyone's targets/roles as well; it's kinda stupid to risk it so much when anyone could have gotten either of those and targeted you, no? I find Anubis claims more credible the sooner they were made.
Hold up. Look at the timing of those posts. Naii had no way of knowing anubis would be rolehunted at the time that he claimed it, unless he is the culprit after all (and he wanted to claim it even earlier). he might have slipped here.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:46:07 am
I guess sometimes the obvious is just correct after all
Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:57:08 am
readlist:
v
andretimpa

n+
calindu
nae

w
coffee

Anubis candidates (these are pretty volatile as i think exactly one of them is scum, obv i am talking about the anubis that did target timpa so nae is clear from that)
v
killsdazombies
n+
shockcannon (yh he actually is back inside his townmeta; trust me I would have kept on pushing him if his psion claim didnt feel honest; doesnt change the fact he's a good policy lynch at any stage of the game other than lylo or him being mechanically cleared)
n-
PlayerOa (yh this is pretty much based on my theory that is probably equally wild as shocks assertions, but at least it is strategically sound, while any of my potential partners would end up taking the fall when oa could be teamed with coffee)
w
Naii_the_Baf I suppose he's just the anubis after all.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:59:27 am
I suppose I should say that oa is at at least n+ if one of the other candidates flips scum.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 02, 2020, 10:27:45 am
Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Correcting the vote count. Nae had switched from Naii to kae
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 12:26:22 pm
Hold up. Look at the timing of those posts. Naii had no way of knowing anubis would be rolehunted at the time that he claimed it, unless he is the culprit after all (and he wanted to claim it even earlier). he might have slipped here.

Wrong. I claimed anubis AFTER shock said his ability failed. Since I had one of the roles that could make an ability fail, I claimed. It's true that I couldn't have known that exactly Anubis would be the role hunted, but I did know it was one of the (four, I think?) possibilities.

I considered waiting to share, but I suppose I'll go first and then info roles can maybe catch something. So, my ability failed last night, which means someone role blocked me or I hit an immortal.

I consider both to be pretty indicative of a mafia, especially given this particular fate egg game.

I accidentally clicked post before finishing my previous post.

I was Anubis last night. I didn't use it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 12:33:51 pm
This post (right after shock's post of his ability failing, mind you) is when I considered immortality as one of the roles that could be hunted. Shock did mention he could have hit an immortal as one of the possibilities so I went and claimed.

It could also be mafia making sure the next NK cannot be prevented.

Again, couldn't have known it would be Anubis, but immortality remained a possibility and tbh I don't think role blocking abilities ever see much use outside of particularly strong ones like Anubis, especially in this game since Anubis sticks to its target while other roles are a one-night thing.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 12:57:17 pm
hm, alright. i can see how you could have acted swiftly even if you learned it just then.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 01:08:03 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) -andretimpa, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

back to coffee then. Ofc i still consider shock and kdz townier than naii, so its still between him and oa for me, but i no longer think he sealed who it was by slipping.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 02, 2020, 04:06:06 pm
a four way tie. how spicy
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 04:13:56 pm
I've been thinking; it might be possible that a Crusader turned Anubis could be the culprit and is hiding behind their random role. Of course, it's only possible if the Crusader hit Anubis N0, and used the ability N1, which is fairly unlikely.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 02, 2020, 04:16:13 pm
A thought. Couldn't a mafia Naii just be trying to get out in front of an anubis witch hunt? Claiming early gives you a barrier of safety in that a mafia anubis probably would always lie, but in game where literally anyone can check you any time randomly, it could be a line of play. I dont know if that line of thought exists beyond a tinfoil but I wanted to bring it up nonetheless
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 04:39:10 pm
It's a pretty decent line of play imo; and tbh I would have claimed regardless of alignment, even without the Fate Egg ruleset. Only difference is that for this game it is safe to claim roles as long as it isn't Crusader nor Vulture. No one wants to be lynched/NK'd/whatever unless it proves valuable, as town or as scum.

I'd be in favor of lynching me if knowing my alignment would provide valuable information for town, which I don't think is the case right now. I've gotten pretty useless roles so far as well; I have pretty much no information besides what I can gather from the thread. It's not like I can go and say "Hey I have this info lynch me to prove I'm town and it's true" or something either.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 02, 2020, 05:03:26 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Following my gut, but I'd still love to hear from coffee.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 02, 2020, 08:28:58 pm
I'm going to sleep very soon... and if nothing changes I don't see myself switching from Naii, tbh. Any last minute discussions before I'm leaving for the day?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on September 02, 2020, 08:43:43 pm
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 02, 2020, 08:48:52 pm
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Lynching Coffee is an interesting case because if he flips town, kaempfer's theory of Coffee/me as w/w can be debunked for good. If he flips mafia, though, I seem to be in a bad spot due to said theory - but I'd happily bow down as a consequence of hitting scum.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 08:53:07 pm
I mean I suppose coffee wagon just doesnt happen (as does oa wagon), so yh

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

other than timpa hating his roleclaim and naii having a theory about me and cal w/w what are even the reasons people are voting calindu?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 09:14:25 pm
lol, i just realized that in my response to shock i made a mistake. The counterwagon to ian wasnt naii but calindu; anyway calindu is def townier than ian was and I dont actually get how he could become leadwagon when he is proven not anubis and not an ideal partner for any likely anubis either.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 02, 2020, 09:20:46 pm
Put me on naii, internet still not fixed. Apparently there is a beehive in my roof where the line is :)))))))) I'm having a great time.

I just wanted to put some pressure on cali to get them to talk, theyve talked a bit now so I'm willing to relax it, and naii is a train I would rather ride on.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 02, 2020, 09:40:18 pm
Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

Self-preservation.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 10:08:08 pm
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Lynching Coffee is an interesting case because if he flips town, kaempfer's theory of Coffee/me as w/w can be debunked for good. If he flips mafia, though, I seem to be in a bad spot due to said theory - but I'd happily bow down as a consequence of hitting scum.
Why is this a priority for you? you said earlier that you townread coffee as well, so all this serves is to make you look better (actually regardless what coffee flips considering you would bus him on a whim if w/w), which is actually really scummy tbh. Its obv very hard to actually get votes on you as is, so town!you should be happy with that and focus on actually solving the game. If you dont think lynching coffee will bring us closer to the solution then dont suggest it.
I appreciate the support, but I have to question your motivation is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 10:13:50 pm
I think its possible to missunderstand my post, so let me reformulate how I see your town!point of view:
Scenario 1: Coffee is town. Lynching him is bad for town in that case and only upside is that you are (probably) even less likely to get lynched.
Scenario 2: Coffee is scum. Looks like you fully expect to get lynched in that case. While that would be a good trade after all, youd actually need to believe it to be true to have a decent motivation to speculate on it.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 02, 2020, 10:15:42 pm
Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

okay, I'll leave Cal alone for now
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 10:19:01 pm
as in scenario 2 is actually worse from a townies point of view than hitting scum completely at random as that doesnt get a townie lynched in succession, so you need to be at least as confident that coffee is scum than anyone else in order for it to actually be a good idea in your situation if you are town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 02, 2020, 10:23:37 pm
Anyway i dont feel like putting in extraeffort to save myself and will go to bed now. in case you do lynch me pls dont let the thread die completely and pls look into the people I suspect. else I'll be around obv.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 03, 2020, 01:00:18 am
Day 3 has come to a close - Management regrets to inform you that the copier is out of order, budget restrictions will prevent repairs until the 1st quarter of the next fiscal year. Thank you

Please hold until further notice...
And refrain from posting until the "Start of Night #" post, forthcoming


Final vote count:
Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 03, 2020, 01:07:06 am
NIGHT 3

Naii_the_Baf was lynched. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Ghost of the Past]

NIGHT 3 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 03, 2020, 01:07:32 am
Start of Night 3, remember to inform your immediate supervisor of all planned night activities. Department daily manpower projections are due to your immediate supervisor by close-of-business.

The Department of Internal Grievances has received numerous complaints about the 3rd floor break room microwave being used to prepare fish at lunch today. Please consider your co-workers well-being when planning your mid-day office food consumption. Keep in mind Statute 13-7.3(a) subsection (iii) of the "Rules & Regulations of Our Workplace, a Corporate Utopia" governing violations related to creating hazardous working conditions within the workplace - this includes the actions cited by these complaints. Our cooperation in this matter makes the office a safe place for all of us.

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
15. andretimpa
16. Calindu
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naii_the_Baf on September 03, 2020, 01:15:46 am
I told you I wasn't the Anubis you were looking for.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 03, 2020, 07:56:05 am
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Lynching Coffee is an interesting case because if he flips town, kaempfer's theory of Coffee/me as w/w can be debunked for good. If he flips mafia, though, I seem to be in a bad spot due to said theory - but I'd happily bow down as a consequence of hitting scum.
Why is this a priority for you? you said earlier that you townread coffee as well, so all this serves is to make you look better (actually regardless what coffee flips considering you would bus him on a whim if w/w), which is actually really scummy tbh. Its obv very hard to actually get votes on you as is, so town!you should be happy with that and focus on actually solving the game. If you dont think lynching coffee will bring us closer to the solution then dont suggest it.
I appreciate the support, but I have to question your motivation is.
So, first of all, I didn't suggest anything. This was a plain response to Calindu's request on moving the votes over to Coffee, which I never did. Secondly, I don't necessarily want to lynch Coffee. I've been (slightly) townreading him throughout the duration of this whole game, and while I don't believe he's scum, I can't ignore the fact there's a slight chance he is. The only scenario I can see myself lynching Coffee in, with todays game state, is self preservation tbh. So please don't imply killing Coffee is a priority for me when it's the opposite.

Naii flipping green surprises me. How did Ghost work with Fate Egg, again? Does it replace the Fate Egg role, or just the latest secondary for one cycle, or only potential Crusader/Vulture grabbed roles?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 03, 2020, 07:58:15 am
Wait nvm guess this was the role he received at the start of the day and subsequently he can't have used it yet
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 09:19:19 am
It replaces all of them; a vulture gn, crusader sth, fate egg+ nightly role becomes a wet towel as soon as the gotp dies even after their role has changed. If you have no way of making an educated guess about the targets alignement its a kinda scummy role to use (shockhate intensifies).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 09:47:26 am
Updating roleclaims (only displaying alive and relevant dead ones):
Public roleclaims
me: n0 oty failed to kill serp
n1 gave momentum to andre
n2 no claim

Naii: n0 if it was claimed i missed it
n1 Anubis, claims no use
n2 deja cal

cal: n0 dragonfly on serp; saw andre and dead town target serp
claims targeting self n1 (amber nymph)
n2 deja naii

shockcannon: gotp on me n0
n1 psion on andre failed due to anubis on andre
n2 iridium warden holstered

nae: n0 green nymph self
n1 anubis self
n2 no claim iirc

Oa: n0 anubis on noone
n1 deja with moe
n2 no claim iirc

kdz: claims seraph n1
no other claims iirc

MW: n0 deja with coffee
n1 dragonfly on nae failed (mostly confirming naes self targeting), caught coffees firefly confirming his claim

timpa: n0 green nymph on serp
n1 psion on calindu
n2 no claim

coffee: n0 deja
N1 ffq on mw no result
n2 no claim

Anubis suspects:
Tier 0 cleared by dead town:
Coffee, Nae

Tier 1 cleared (completely) by other living players:
Calindu

Tier 1.5 cleared mostly by living players:
timpa: do I believe its him? no. Could it be? yes. He simply requires an accomplice that knew Calindus role n1. This would be a psion fakeclaiming their target (and role unless shock) or Calindu himself. Its a longshot ofc.

kaempfer13: timpa confirms he got targeted by momentum. Possible accomplices are again calindu and people lower on this list.

Tier 2 (cleared by self claim):
shockcannon: He knew beforehand that timpa wasnt targetable (or he was blocked but obv it wasnt the latter), which is easily explained by his psion targetting failing. If he or his partner were the Anubis he'd also know this though.

Oa: moe never confirmed his deja claim, nor was his n0 anubis claim confirmed. either would be clearing him ofc, but as things are all it does is that if he lied he exposed himself to psion twice and dragonfly once, which is a small risk to take.

kdz: claimed seraph n1.

I dont feel like tinfoiling a calindu+timpa world and I know its not me, hence I will only examine people in Tier 2.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 09:50:05 am
oh yh forgot to mention the world where timpa and I are a team, lol  :P
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 03, 2020, 11:01:19 am
oh yh forgot to mention the world where timpa and I are a team, lol  :P

(https://www.kindpng.com/picc/b/502/5026979.png)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 03, 2020, 03:56:33 pm
N2 I claimed Phoenix
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 06:54:27 pm
true, i forgot; not really relevant for now I think though so i will not make an ebwop until another night with claims comes or more mistakes come up.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 03, 2020, 07:36:08 pm
The tempered forest speaks with strong barks.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 07:45:52 pm
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Not voting:

moehrpi
Naii_the_Baf
andretimpa
Calindu

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

Not voting:

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
16. Calindu
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, andretimpa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa


Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Extension (7) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala  people not caring for an extension (or absent before decision): shockcannon, calindu

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) -andretimpa, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf
Not voting: Coffeeditto
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 03, 2020, 07:49:20 pm
The tempered forest speaks with strong barks.
Shall i add your green nymph claim?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 03, 2020, 07:58:11 pm
The tempered forest speaks with strong barks.

grabboid, got it
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 03, 2020, 11:27:24 pm
The tempered forest speaks with strong barks.

grabboid, got it
Clearly mindflayer
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 04, 2020, 11:57:18 am
@kdz
Considering your n1 claim, did you target anyone in n2? I think it might help me decide my target tonight.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 04, 2020, 12:04:30 pm
I targeted myself
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 04, 2020, 12:43:15 pm
KInda boring, but thanks. I'll look elsewhere then.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 04, 2020, 02:32:35 pm
I know, I know. My fate egg role rolls have been uhhh very defensive as of late.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 04, 2020, 11:42:56 pm
Alright I’m pretty sure there’s exactly 1 mafia between Naesala, Coffeeditto, and killzdazombies. The other 1 is among the rest.
In case I die I’ll post my read list and I would suggest voting out kaempf first because he’s a noob and the mere sight of him will make the rest of you noobs as well.

V:
shockcannon - if I’m mafia, you all have already lost. Also I would never kill off TheonlyrealNoob. I’d leave him, kaempf, and MW until the very end when it’s 4 of us going into the night phase. This is when they realize I’m actually the mafia. And then I high roll otyugh like the skilled mafia player I am and slice and dice torb and MW, leaving kaempf alone in the village with only me to talk to. After which he will inevitably decide to lynch himself, and that’s how I win. Also while I’m ranting let me talk about how cowardly this mafia Anubis is. I know one of you is lying and trying to hide and you’re lucky you’ve gotten away so far. But don’t think for one minute you’re safe. I’m coming for you to teach you how a real mafia Anubis does things. And that’s claim Anubis and say out loud that you targeted Andre. You think I’m 2x master of fire because I hide my decks and strays from my opponent. No I shove it in their face and crush them anyways like the noob they are. Imagine worrying about torb so much that you kill him off N1 and then have to use Anubis to secure kills. Lame. Lame. Lame. This game is about to end because I finally have a useful role. And if you’re worried then  go ahead and kill me tonight. I know you won’t because you’re too scared about my cryptic message. Maybe I rolled seraph. Maybe I rolled angel. Well I’ll tell you exactly what I rolled. I rolled unlimited power and I’m going to shove it up your Anubis until you you’re immaterial from the pain because all your nerves are gone. In fact, you never even had nerves to begin with. So goodluck. Go ahead. Kill me, this is your last chance before I rally the other town noobs in this game and lead them to victory.

N:

Calindu - almost put him in W but I realized I have nothing. Honestly, not worth wasting oxygen discussing Calindu. I’d recommend letting this creature stick around while ignoring any sounds that come out. If we reach Lynch or Lose, this is our target.

W:
kaempfer13 - super sus. Unusual play. Tunneling on lynching me early. Questionable momentum usage on Andre. If mafia and left alone, then very dangerous due to his control over conversation

andretimpa - last time I thought he was town because he almost died by lynch day 1. This time I’m not falling for that trap. Easily had his mafia buddy give him immaterial. Questionable for other reasons I won’t share yet.

Naesala - classic noob pretending to be pro acting as noob but still actually noob because I can see right through the disguise. Flies under the radar and gets away with very questionable night action usage. Like highly questionable.

PlayerOa - claims Anubis. Posts too many read lists, when read lists are essentially useless in a fate egg game.

Coffeeditto - You’re really good at always seeming suspicious. Sometimes you talk a lot and sometimes you don’t. You gotta pick a style and go with it. Like kaempf picks the noob route, Nae picks the naive route, Torb picks the detective route, and MW picks the living meme route. You gotta choose. Lack of choice is simply the choice of the I’m always suspicious route.

Kdz - “I used divine shield.”
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 05, 2020, 12:03:27 am
Imagine mafia wasting a NK on shock
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 05, 2020, 01:00:03 am
Night 3 has concluded - hold please while the bits and bytes are compiled, analyzed, and tabulated. The results will be posted soon(TM)...

Please refrain from posting until further notice...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 05, 2020, 01:04:42 am
DAY 4

DAY 4 has concluded.

andretimpa was nightkilled. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg [Seraph] and also a Golden Nymph.

Please refrain from posting until further notice...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 05, 2020, 12:11:07 pm
Start of Day 4, hatching reports (for Day 4 through Night 4) are submitted, refer to nearest Inbox location for your new ability assignments.

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
16. Calindu


Please Note, this phase includes a slightly extended timer due to delays in the opening of the thread for Day 4. Thank you for your cooperation.

All current employee's PTO balances have been credited with 11 hours to compensate for lost time due to recent management delays. Please forgive any inconvenience caused by the lost time.

You may now post!!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 05, 2020, 01:17:24 pm
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 05, 2020, 01:20:03 pm
Wait what? If andretimpa was immaterial, wouldn't using divine shield have the net total of one consequence, which is rebounding the nightkill? Why the heck wouldn't he have used it then? Was he not immaterial after all and roleblocked, maybe?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 02:40:39 pm
momentum+roleblock is possible also timpa being silly I guess. or rules changing to not count nightkill as targeting
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 02:46:17 pm
Anyway now that timpa is dead i can go ahead and say i never believed his green nymph claim when he was so upset with calindu which is the real reason why i gave him momentum (and would have killed him then and there if i were scum)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 03:07:22 pm
By roleblock I do not mean mindflayer btw, but rather iridium warden or squid, as momentum would prevent the former
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 03:09:00 pm
Actually wtf, seraph outprioritizes those. timpa should not have died period.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 03:13:46 pm
Even momentumed squid the night before should just block the hatch ability, right?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 03:21:00 pm
oh, does the unprotectable clause of gn override seraphs targeting immunity?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 05, 2020, 03:31:37 pm
oh, does the unprotectable clause of gn override seraphs targeting immunity?
Wait that actually makes tons of sense
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 03:50:24 pm
the clause does specifically say cannot be protected from the NK, I guess that extends to everything
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 07:01:20 pm
well, kdz, shock and oa: Pretty absurd scenarios aside (with timpa dead town i think only calindu + me is left and Linkcat or ian screwing up majorly) each one of you has a 50% chance of figuring out who the Anubis was (except for the guy that is). i think at this point we are committed to that rolehunt, so I really need your thoughts on this.

Speaking of 50%; please make it so that your combined efforts at least amount to my post number today; we cant win if I'm the only one posting/solving.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 07:28:21 pm
Speaking of 50%; please make it so that your combined efforts at least amount to my post number today; we cant win if I'm the only one posting/solving.

You post 6 one sentence thoughts in a row. Don't disguise it as anything else.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 07:30:39 pm
Further, the insistence on pressing other people to fight among themselves raises more then 1 red flag for an issue you are not as far distanced from as you make out to be.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 07:34:19 pm
actually I am, timpa did confirm he got momentum and I knew beforehand so either me or my partner was amber nymph if I am mafia.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 07:36:42 pm
also what do you mean insistence? I've been waiting for 3 days for meaningfull content from anyone not timpa without nudging anyone and i can only remember shock posts (which at least tried to get somewhere)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 07:52:52 pm
You're right, I was a little mad at your implication that your 1 sentence posts were actively solving anything. Insistence was the wrong word, but I find it sketch that you're trying to position a three way thunderdome when were 2 lynches away from a loss. I'll concede that you knew andre got momentum, and that distances you enough. My memory isn't what it used to be, and before you mentioned it it was totally gone from it.

I'll collect and post my thoughts in a second. This mobile shit is a fucking nightmare to play this game. I'll turn ona hotspot and try and collect my thoughts on pc.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 08:47:22 pm
Cards on the table. This is everything I know.

First Role : Amber Nymph - Target : None - Night ended before I could send it in. Thought I had another day. I'm stupid, sue me.

Second Role : Seraph - Target : None (myself?)

Third Role : Green Nymph - Target : Myself - Already claimed this, figured if I got vulture I could snag a good EoR ability, a poison would just be an unfortunate incident.

Fourth Role : Pheonix - Hence why I said my roles have been defensive.

Fifth Role :  I'll keep it to myself for now

I cannot confirm being targeted except for one night. That person is alive, and knows who they are.

Some thoughts
Andre, a now confirmed town GN, has backed me up A LOT. I'd wager they momentumed through my Seraph shield and green checked me. This obviously means nothing coming from me, but looking back at his read lists I jumped to V around n1/2. You can find credit in that if you want, or not Idc.

kaempfer13 - You have positioned yourself as something akin to the speaker for town, but as I stated before, your post count is inflated to hell. You have posted thoughts that I generally agree with, but they come in a 6 post burst, and it seems as though you are trying to claim all 160 posts or so of yours have been active solving. We both know thats not the case, and acting as such raises my suspicion. That being said, andre wasn't looking to make a move against you, and I'm willing to listen to them for now. Plus you voted in the round where literally 3 people voted.

PlayerOa - The most compelling thing about oa so far has been their reason for voting coffee. You yourself kae mentioned that the reasoning for this vote was... Odd.
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Lynching Coffee is an interesting case because if he flips town, kaempfer's theory of Coffee/me as w/w can be debunked for good. If he flips mafia, though, I seem to be in a bad spot due to said theory - but I'd happily bow down as a consequence of hitting scum.
Why is this a priority for you? you said earlier that you townread coffee as well, so all this serves is to make you look better (actually regardless what coffee flips considering you would bus him on a whim if w/w), which is actually really scummy tbh. Its obv very hard to actually get votes on you as is, so town!you should be happy with that and focus on actually solving the game. If you dont think lynching coffee will bring us closer to the solution then dont suggest it.
I appreciate the support, but I have to question your motivation is.
So, first of all, I didn't suggest anything. This was a plain response to Calindu's request on moving the votes over to Coffee, which I never did. Secondly, I don't necessarily want to lynch Coffee. I've been (slightly) townreading him throughout the duration of this whole game, and while I don't believe he's scum, I can't ignore the fact there's a slight chance he is. The only scenario I can see myself lynching Coffee in, with todays game state, is self preservation tbh. So please don't imply killing Coffee is a priority for me when it's the opposite.

Naii flipping green surprises me. How did Ghost work with Fate Egg, again? Does it replace the Fate Egg role, or just the latest secondary for one cycle, or only potential Crusader/Vulture grabbed roles?
He claims self preservation here, but I don't think there was any real solid pressure on oa at all. Pressure from cali is almost nonexistent in the grand scheme of things given their 11 post count. I do however, believe their claim of Dejavu with moe on n1. If you insist on a thunderdome I dont think Oa should be a part of it. That doesn't mean I dont want to lynch oa, just not for that reason.

Coffeeditto - Recently AFK because of college.

Naesala - immortality claim checked by mw, and was confirmed.

shockcannon - An unusually quiet shock. They haven't even pursued their master plan, and while concocting some sort of plan is in their "Town playbook" They havent actually followed up on it at all. A flash in the pan without a vote or even a push.

Calindu - Doesn't post as usual, but also posted to say that not posting is something a town cali does which is annoying and sus. Further interesting is this post where cali pressured andre to claim a crusader hit.
This is a terrible cover. In fact just saying that makes me light read you. "Look at me! I am the exact same as last game and I wasnt scum then, so i must not be scum this game!" cmon cal.

But this has been your motivation of voting in a previous mafia, "Oh look, Calindu plays similar to the way he played in a mafia game, so he must mafia".

Im pushing nae because they havent said much of anything. The more people who talk the more info we have to work with. Good or bad. If you wanna argue why i pushed Nae and not shock, ian, moe, or Naii then yea we can go back and forth on that. But im just trying to get some content here.

I don't argue about your push on Nae, I'm just not sure why your push was pretty much asking for a role reveal.

This tells me that you are either scum or really bad at this.

Why would I ever claim my info if I were mafia? Wouldn't it have been infinitely better to just keep it shut and not reveal my info if I were mafia, since I would know only you could know I targeted serp? I didn't force anyone to reveal with my own reveal, I just think getting the info out early can help in this type of setup.
...
I'm more interested in andre's role, since he successfully targeted serp N0 and I do not see him mentioning his role.

Goals:

I want more posts from Cali, Nae and Shock

Coffee gets a pass for moving, I hope it goes well for you mate.

From cali I want : anything

From nae I want : A general take, it can be surface level, I just want some thoughts

From shock I want : Something not cryptic or dumb like putting the entire town into W

If coffee has the ability to I want : The thoughts you had when you voted  for the extension, and if those thoughts have changed since both flips.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 05, 2020, 08:48:26 pm
Back to mobile before I eat up all my data this month.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 05, 2020, 09:04:34 pm
From nae I want : A general take, it can be surface level, I just want some thoughts

I'm about to start having a good time if people wanna help me out with that.

I think given andre had GN we can trust that, in general, the people andre was supporting are possibly people he's read.

I know I'm town. I can't prove I'm town. The closest I can provide is that I've been honest and upfront 100% of the time. I do as asked as I am doing now. I'm just not good at the game.

Coffee seems like a safe bet, but with them busy with college it's hard to get much to go on off of them.

KDZ and Oa seem to have had andre's general support but I don't know if he cleared either of them. They're both moderately helpful without going balls to the wall posting whatever.

Calindu is unhelpfully quiet an obtuse.

kaemp and shock are both annoyingly boistrous. Kaemp posts a thousand posts that say nothing, with just enough helpful info sprinkled in to make him seem towny, but I think he's scum and my gut has said scum for awhile. What trust I had in shock went away when they went full cryptic fingerpointing claiming themselves as already won and everyone else as mafia. Not helpful.

My gut says W: Kaemp/Calindu. But I don't trust anyone but coffee at this point.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 09:14:14 pm
I suppose it doesnt hurt to claim it at this point anymore as its drawback has worn off, i healed kdz n2 (since healing andre wouldnt work that was my nextbest townread at the time). It looks like andre breadcrumbed ffq on kdz.
Amusingly I'm also deja vu with shock today (he hasnt logged in yet though or didnt care)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 09:31:34 pm
tbf to Oa he never actually did vote coffee and calindu pinged him asking to jump on coffee, to which he gave that somewhat odd response.
It's still a pretty bad reason to be sort of enthusiastic about a potential coffee lynch, but I should also ask calindu why he singled out oa as the switcher in that post:
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
even if he wanted specifically someone from the naii train to switch with him why wouldnt he ask nae?

Also that post is either effective distancing or just not w/w.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 09:39:26 pm
oops this was the votecount at the time so ignore the bit about Naii train

Quote
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

still odd to require specifically oa to switch, especially since timpa switching back to coffee would have the bigger impact overall and he acts like the votes on me were set in stone or the people dont exist?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 05, 2020, 10:20:18 pm
No point in using deja vu when we can just talk to each other here. Since you now think I’m mafia again (which haven’t you always) and I also think (know) you’re mafia, there’s really no point is us talking. So I’ll address everyone else. I plan on voting kaempf again unless one of you can truly convince me that someone is a better lynch.

I will admit it’s more likely that kaempf isn’t Anubis, but doesn’t mean that he didn’t just give Andre momentum to gain town cred, knowing that his partner gave andre immaterial and they could just kill him at a later time.

Also right now, the two people pressuring me are kdz (who wants me to talk more even though I’ve given way more substance in my few posts than anyone else so far) and kaempf (who is telling me that I must be mafia in deja vu PMs). It’s funny because these are the exact two who I called out a whole day/night cycle ago as quite likely to be the remaining two mafia.

Also it appears everyone’s down now to chase down this mysterious Anubis, which I will remind everyone was my plan from the start. So if you’re dense enough to agree with my plan but then think that I’m the mafia then my words aren’t going to be enough to stop you from doom.

So either realize that my reads are not that far fetched or convince me that someone else is more likely to be mafia using real evidence. And if kdz and kaempf start ramping up the pressure on me, then I’ll feel even more certain about my guesses.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 10:45:35 pm
So either realize that my reads are not that far fetched or convince me that someone else is more likely to be mafia using real evidence.
You've been given such and havent provided said thing yourself. Heck even if you are town your complete unwillingness to learn, reevaluate and actually adress what people are saying makes you a mandatory lynch period.
I wasnt gonna give oa a sense of security too early in case he was scum after all, hence why i told you in pm rather than in thread, but i guess its out now.
Also even if you believe in that world, kdz is the lynch that is mechanically correct at this point in time.
Also I cant believe you're not willing to talk to me in pms when you are allowed to. Seems like the thing town!you would want to get as much out of as possible. Afraid to give yourselves away further?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 10:46:17 pm
and no I will not bow to your demands of ceasing to scumread you.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 10:52:43 pm
also remember that andre got a peek and thanks to me its impossible it was prevented, obv it didnt hit scum, but in case that player is alive it may impact your reads a lot. kdz claims it was him (i thought it was mw for some reason but i have to take a proper look at before and after n1 reads of timpa). I will go to bed before I look at that, but it really isnt sth that should be ignored and the more opinions we have on that the better.
I am very sure he didnt check me though considering his waffling about me and i figure he would have claimed in case it was calindu, so that narrows things down a bit.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 10:54:59 pm
@shock The other one that claimed Anubis is Nae, but MW + rob derping messages confirms that she targetted herself.

About the rest of the evidence, try rereading things assuming kdz is town. The people in your watchlist sound much more believable as a potential partner for kae. I'd rather sort kae on D4 tho.
Hm, actually I didnt have to search long for a potential breadcrumb from timpa. Obv he wanted to let your supposed mafia team win.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 10:57:22 pm
so according to you I've either been bussing oa or andre actually checked someone else or the team is actually calindu and i
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 05, 2020, 11:23:51 pm
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

As I said in my reads, I'm willing to vouch for kdz being town.
Ok yh, he really wasnt even subtle, I actually feel dumb for ever thinking someone else was his target.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 05, 2020, 11:41:19 pm
Wow. Kaempf actually provided real evidence. Fine I’ll admit it does seem likely that kdz is town then. For this one day you have graduated from noob status. Congrats. Took you long enough.

Ok so that does make kaempf less likely to be mafia also but not impossible and I’m still not clearing him. So Oa, coffee and nae are way more sus to me now.

Ok I have to rethink.


New lengthy post coming soon.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 06, 2020, 12:15:56 am
Dunno how I'm sus when I've both been compliant, honest, and volunteered myself for lynch when I had Phoenix.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 06, 2020, 12:22:59 am
Oh Nae, don’t you know?

The tempered forest ALWAYS speaks with loud barks.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 06, 2020, 12:39:18 am
Oh Nae, don’t you know?

The tempered forest ALWAYS speaks with loud barks.

Yeah and the perverse hotyugh is telling the truth.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 06, 2020, 10:21:19 am
Ok so I was out of town yesterday, time to try to catch up

lmao at kaempfer and shock rolling Deja with each other. When's the marriage?

So either realize that my reads are not that far fetched or convince me that someone else is more likely to be mafia using real evidence.
You've been given such and havent provided said thing yourself. Heck even if you are town your complete unwillingness to learn, reevaluate and actually adress what people are saying makes you a mandatory lynch period.
I wasnt gonna give oa a sense of security too early in case he was scum after all, hence why i told you in pm rather than in thread, but i guess its out now.
Also even if you believe in that world, kdz is the lynch that is mechanically correct at this point in time.
Also I cant believe you're not willing to talk to me in pms when you are allowed to. Seems like the thing town!you would want to get as much out of as possible. Afraid to give yourselves away further?
Pardon if I've missed something here, but where did I get involved in this?

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

As I said in my reads, I'm willing to vouch for kdz being town.
Ok yh, he really wasnt even subtle, I actually feel dumb for ever thinking someone else was his target.
Knowing timpa was GN.. yeah this would be as good as a confirmation for me, but the timestamp of timpa's post made me curious, so I dived a bit into his claims. This was posted during D3, where he would have had three night phases to grab GN; N0, N1 and N2. For timpa to have received a green peek on kdz within D3, he would have needed to grab GN N0 or N1 to have enough time to use his ability. He was confirmed to have targeted serp N0 (http://elementscommunity.org/forum/forum-games/elements-mafia-75-by-rob77dp/msg1302295/#msg1302295), where he claimed green nymph - I guess this is the part where timpa hid a Crusader role so he could grab serp's GN.

TLDR: very believable that timpa got GN confirmation on kdz being town before D3 given he lied about Green Nymph role, which seems like a legit move to me. There's like no way kdz isn't town now.

v
Considering everything I have gathered, I'm fairly confident that kdz is town. You guys should listen to him and start to actually play the game.

Dunno how I'm sus when I've both been compliant, honest, and volunteered myself for lynch when I had Phoenix.
I appreciate the honesty and willingness to listen to town, but this feels a bit off to me - if you're town, why would you ever want to die the martyrdom without having the chance to drag scum with you, or at the very least confirm someone/something? Let's be honest, how much would a dead-but-still-speaking Naesala help us long term?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 06, 2020, 11:07:32 am
I still think exactly 1 of the people that could be anubis is scum. So at this point its you vs shock unless you want to tinfoil me and Calindu world (which I obv wont).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on September 06, 2020, 12:23:11 pm
oops this was the votecount at the time so ignore the bit about Naii train

Quote
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

still odd to require specifically oa to switch, especially since timpa switching back to coffee would have the bigger impact overall and he acts like the votes on me were set in stone or the people dont exist?

Well, it's pretty hard to get someone who believed the whole game so far I was scum, ever since I dumped my info, to switch, even more since he had his vote on me. It was mostly self preservation, since I was ready to join a Naii or Coffee wagon, but not a kae wagon. Also for the votes on you, I don't see myself ever getting shock to switch by just requesting like that, so I could only request Nae to switch, but I trusted you and Oa the most at that point.

Here's my list on order of least likely to be scum to most likely to be scum:

kdz >> kae = Oa = shock > Nae = Coffee
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 06, 2020, 12:35:13 pm
@cal thoughts on anubis? nae and coffee are both confirmed to not have done it, so either you believe a towny did it and remained silent about it or you have to readjust your reads.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 06, 2020, 04:47:57 pm
Dunno how I'm sus when I've both been compliant, honest, and volunteered myself for lynch when I had Phoenix.
I appreciate the honesty and willingness to listen to town, but this feels a bit off to me - if you're town, why would you ever want to die the martyrdom without having the chance to drag scum with you, or at the very least confirm someone/something? Let's be honest, how much would a dead-but-still-speaking Naesala help us long term?

I'm not saying it'd help town. It was more a show of dedication and willingness, which I should hope shows I'm town. I realized I'd made a goof and was willing to die for it if town judged it necessary. Even if I wasn't phoenix, I'd have admitted my wrong and explained the error and hope not to be killed.

I think it's more important we find the Anubis that targeted andre than me, who's confirmed to have Anubised myself. The number of Anubis is incredibly high already, and them both being mafia seems very unlikely.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on September 07, 2020, 09:44:18 am
@cal thoughts on anubis? nae and coffee are both confirmed to not have done it, so either you believe a towny did it and remained silent about it or you have to readjust your reads.

I agree that it's unlikely town!Oa did it, but I wouldn't put it past town!shock to do it. That said, I didn't say that I consider those in the middle region to be very towny, I only consider kdz as almost confirmed town. That said, I think one of the mafia is Nae/Coffee, but not both of them.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 10:43:34 am
Let's see if an update to lynchlog gives me insight:
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Not voting:

moehrpi
Naii_the_Baf
andretimpa
Calindu

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

Not voting:

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
16. Calindu
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, andretimpa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa


Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Extension (7) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala  people not caring for an extension (or absent before decision): shockcannon, calindu

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) -andretimpa, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf
Not voting: Coffeeditto
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 10:48:01 am
Oh boy confirmed pure wagon on calindu does look bad especially as a potential partner to Oa (since he set up joining both coffee and naii wagon), but as anyones partner really.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 10:56:50 am
Oa+ Cal would also help explain MWs death considering his last reads, though I wouldn't want to read too much into that, but it felt odd how he was brushed off as just too townread, while he really wasnt.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 11:03:44 am
looks like I've gone full circle.
Anyway, I already townread kdz before examining timpa crumbs, so i have no doubts there and i really dont feel like it's Naesala, so I fully expect scum to be  exactly 1 out of Calindu or Coffee + 1 out of shock and Oa. Finally I'll put work into a big post examining the 4 possible combinations, which will obv take a long time (lunchbreak included).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 07, 2020, 02:07:53 pm
TBF, I put my vote on cali primarily to pressure them into speaking. Cali is def in my top 3 sus bois, but that vote was not an actual attempt to kill.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 07, 2020, 02:16:13 pm
Think I'm gonna try to have my final vote placed within 4-5 hours for our Eu Bois

I thinkkkkk my order is Shock -> Oa ---> cali---> Rest, but I don't necessarily think the top 3 contain both mafia.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 07, 2020, 02:52:05 pm
Waiting on shock and kaemp's massive posts, but that said, I'm placing a tentative vote on Calindu.

Calindu (1) - Naesala
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 07, 2020, 06:53:18 pm
I'd like to see that master post from shock, but baring that I think I'll place my vote on them. Gonna post in an hourish, just want to think a little more
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 07:06:30 pm
Obv seen from my perspective knowing that I'm town:
I suppose I have no mechanical reason to townread naesala, but she just doesnt give off the vibe that she's getting any help or trying to keep someone alive in particular.
I also hold on to my assumption of mafia!anubis (technically Link could in fact have done it, but that really wouldnt have been a smart move and I think higher than that of him)

Starting of with the scenario where shock is the Anubis:
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Not voting:

moehrpi
Naii_the_Baf
andretimpa
Calindu

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

Not voting:

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
16. Calindu
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, andretimpa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa


Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Extension (7) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala  people not caring for an extension (or absent before decision): shockcannon, calindu

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) -andretimpa, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf
Not voting: Coffeeditto

Wagonomics assuming shock is scum:
N0 votes would imply a calindu partner, given that both shock and serp were in eversoslight danger and a partner was already on me. Day 1 and 2 wagonomics seem pretty much unusable as none of the suspects other than calindu maybe were in remote danger. day 3 looks sorta bad for Calindu regardless of partners, though shock didnt really seem to try and save him.
As to Coffee i cant really find much in terms of wagonomics since he's not voting. In other communities not voting is sus per default, but here its unfortunately almost normal especially for Coffee. His constant reassurance that he would eventually do sth, yet doesnt, certainly is suspect though. This applies regardless of partner though, at most i could infer that its not calindu since he never tried to help him out but my Anubis assumption already covers that.

Now let's analyze posts:
serp: okI will not bother quoting here, it's all about how he insisted shock would be his gn target, even if he's agreed upon as the best lynch. as i said before this can sorta go either way, although i do think it points more towards scum than town that was already expected to be unhelpfull.
I find the volume of his posts unusually low for him. Half ot it is mostly useless roleclaiming, although i do find 2 of them noteable.
For convenience I'll quote the parts of his reveal instead of the unusable initial posts:

To gain trust, I'll start by sharing all night actions and info gathered thus far (which is technically nothing, but nothing can sometimes be even more valuable).

N0 - Ghost of the Past
This role was breadcrumbed in my very first post.
I'm targeting kaempfer13 tonight.

If you had clicked on quote on this post, you would have noticed that at the end of the sentence there are two random colors with no text. Yellow and dimgray, the respective colors for time and darkness. The only role that has ties with time and darkness would be ghost of the past due to its usage in ghostmare. I did in fact target kaempfer. Partially for the memes, partially because I had already started to suspect some odd play out of him. First, we have the fact that he pushed quite hard for a no vig scenario. Second, it felt like he was being a little more aggressive than normal and looking to establish control a lot earlier, with more assertive statements rather than questioning from the past. Now, this means absolutely nothing because N0 reads are absolutely worthless in my opinion and I will always believe that. But it was more than enough to justify using ghost of the past on him, especially because I knew there was a high chance he would try to policy lynch me and I wanted to spite him. Terrible town play? Maybe. But at least if I go down, he's useless for the rest of the game so maybe he'll think twice before randomly lynching me.

I dont doubt this tbh. Terrible play yet at the same time it mechanically discourages me from lynching him. Not enough to stop me though so long as I am decently confident he's scum

N1 - Psion
I breadcrumbed this here:
Lastly, at least one other person should already know my role. So maybe try asking around.
Obviously, I had no way of knowing if someone knew my role. But what's the only role that does let people know other roles? Well it's psion. Psion has 5 letters, "so maybe try asking around" has 5 words. No other role in the game has 5 letters.
I did indeed use this role on andretimpa. There was some discussion about how Calindu (if i recall) messed up by giving away that andre targeted serprex and was potentially a crusader turned golden nymph. I figured it was possible andre gave out a fake role to hide this potential scenario and I wanted to check for GN in case I rolled crusader soon after and could grab a GN with 100% certainty. It potentially increases my odds of GN by 50% because now I can roll vulture, GN, OR crusader.

However, I will acknowledge that this is a potential mafia move because knowing if andre is GN or not would let mafia know if they need to kill him immediately or not. But then why would my theoretical teammate waste an anubis on andre as well? I'm going to use Anubis to get a guaranteed kill on someone if I already plan on killing them, not a conditional kill that only happens if a player happened to have had a role. Also, lowkey, I'm pretty sure using Anubis on a town to guarantee a kill that's pretty much always going to go through anyways, and on someone who isn't even close to a confirmed town is just such a bad play for mafia. I won't waste my time ranting, but the latter part of this post is going to talk about who the mafia Anubis is, because that's a real lead and we should witch hunt this, because it's all we really have besides "our feelings," which we know are not always 100% accurate, and are sometimes -500% accurate.
Half of this breadcrumb is a flat out lie, so I'm not sure how he expected people to guess that. If it is an actual breadcrumb its at least as likely to actually indicate a buff used on someone else, as it comes with a notification specifying what role targeted you. Low and behold:Anubis.
N2 - Iridium Warden
This was breadcrumbed here:
I'm targeting coffee tonight.
Within the earth lies the secrets of the elements.
If you click quote on the post, you will notice that a sentence is written in transparent color. The message reads, "Within the earth lies the secrets of the elements."
The only roles that are earth creatures are graboid, shreiker, and iridium warden. Iridium is an element on the periodic table, hence the word "elements at the end of the sentence. "Lies the secrets" indicates that I lied about my visible statement, meaning that I did not target coffee. I, in fact, targeted no one as I wasn't planning to block anyone, but I did want to see if anyone would react to this post, either by commenting or through night actions. It appears that Coffee forgot to use his ability. I was hoping others would share their roles first because I was curious if anyone visited either me or coffee last night, expecting me and coffee to visit each other. Luckily, this lack of info is irrelevant to my revelations so I don't mind posting now. It's also quite likely, that this bait did not result in anything noteworthy.

This would support a shock+coffee world as it would shield coffee from people getting info on him. This is assuming he actually did use it on Coffee. It's possible he did use it like so and found noone targeted coffee anyway and decided that unless someone dragonflied him it would be less scummy if he claimed he didnt even attempt to roleblock people. A lot of assumptions in order to get anything out of this though. Its also odd how coffee claimed the same role and usage.




There's a lot of people who aren't talking and that's allowing things like Anubis to go off safely and hidden. I will acknowledge that it's technically possible I was Anubis and gave andre immortality, but I'm hoping someone can confirm me with their info. I was psion this past night, and looking to confirm a couple theories I had.

Also @Oa:

I actually think we definitely should go on a witch hunt. It's very possible if everyone shares their info we can catch someone in a lie or maybe even flat out find the mafia Anubis. Right now there are 4 possible candidates:

1.) myself. I could be faking my role and saying my ability failed when in reality I'm just the Anubis
2.) andre. He could be lying about his visit and gave himself immortality
3.) kaempf. He said he targeted andre.
4.) someone else.

Options 2 and 3 seem unlikely and very risky on the respective players parts' UNLESS there's some mafia on mafia interactions going on.
Option 1 I obviously know to be 100% false but I suppose I currently have no alibi from anyone else.
Option 4 seems likely, and we need to get people to start talking.


Also @kaempf:

Now that we've made it past two nights I'll have you know my role from night 1 is hidden in one of my first couple posts. I don't remember which one and I don't feel like checking. Probably won't convince you of anything, but it's there for anyone else. Probably irrelevant anyways because it's still quite likely that kaempf's ability just failed because of the double devour situation.


I think I've caught a major slip up by a certain a player. I need the next night to confirm something though. If I find what I'm looking for I should have this game solved the following day.

@mafia
You better get me lynched today or kill me the next night otherwise the :fire will burn brightly and its fuel will be you.




This sorta implies oa shock not w/w.

Alright I’m pretty sure there’s exactly 1 mafia between Naesala, Coffeeditto, and killzdazombies. The other 1 is among the rest.
In case I die I’ll post my read list and I would suggest voting out kaempf first because he’s a noob and the mere sight of him will make the rest of you noobs as well.

V:
shockcannon - if I’m mafia, you all have already lost. Also I would never kill off TheonlyrealNoob. I’d leave him, kaempf, and MW until the very end when it’s 4 of us going into the night phase. This is when they realize I’m actually the mafia. And then I high roll otyugh like the skilled mafia player I am and slice and dice torb and MW, leaving kaempf alone in the village with only me to talk to. After which he will inevitably decide to lynch himself, and that’s how I win. Also while I’m ranting let me talk about how cowardly this mafia Anubis is. I know one of you is lying and trying to hide and you’re lucky you’ve gotten away so far. But don’t think for one minute you’re safe. I’m coming for you to teach you how a real mafia Anubis does things. And that’s claim Anubis and say out loud that you targeted Andre. You think I’m 2x master of fire because I hide my decks and strays from my opponent. No I shove it in their face and crush them anyways like the noob they are. Imagine worrying about torb so much that you kill him off N1 and then have to use Anubis to secure kills. Lame. Lame. Lame. This game is about to end because I finally have a useful role. And if you’re worried then  go ahead and kill me tonight. I know you won’t because you’re too scared about my cryptic message. Maybe I rolled seraph. Maybe I rolled angel. Well I’ll tell you exactly what I rolled. I rolled unlimited power and I’m going to shove it up your Anubis until you you’re immaterial from the pain because all your nerves are gone. In fact, you never even had nerves to begin with. So goodluck. Go ahead. Kill me, this is your last chance before I rally the other town noobs in this game and lead them to victory.

N:

Calindu - almost put him in W but I realized I have nothing. Honestly, not worth wasting oxygen discussing Calindu. I’d recommend letting this creature stick around while ignoring any sounds that come out. If we reach Lynch or Lose, this is our target.

W:
kaempfer13 - super sus. Unusual play. Tunneling on lynching me early. Questionable momentum usage on Andre. If mafia and left alone, then very dangerous due to his control over conversation

andretimpa - last time I thought he was town because he almost died by lynch day 1. This time I’m not falling for that trap. Easily had his mafia buddy give him immaterial. Questionable for other reasons I won’t share yet.

Naesala - classic noob pretending to be pro acting as noob but still actually noob because I can see right through the disguise. Flies under the radar and gets away with very questionable night action usage. Like highly questionable.

PlayerOa - claims Anubis. Posts too many read lists, when read lists are essentially useless in a fate egg game.

Coffeeditto - You’re really good at always seeming suspicious. Sometimes you talk a lot and sometimes you don’t. You gotta pick a style and go with it. Like kaempf picks the noob route, Nae picks the naive route, Torb picks the detective route, and MW picks the living meme route. You gotta choose. Lack of choice is simply the choice of the I’m always suspicious route.

Kdz - “I used divine shield.”
First half is just wifom+I'm still alive anyway. Killing mw actually looks 100% like a shock kill, although I suppose its believable he would consider torb+link nk "too easy".
Putting the entire town in w unless he or Calindu are town, whilst giving a noncommital read on cal. I suppose this implies being teamed with cal.

I'm not sure what made me think his n1 claim was honest other than how swiftly he started the hunt on the role I suspect he had now. There really isnt much there and trying to frame other people fits shocks playstyle much better than Oa's tbh.
Also he hasnt yet followed through with his promised big post but pot meet kettle I suppose.
I found his readiness to share his info towny (especially when he forwarded the corrected info) tbh, until he asked timpa to claim after i directly discouraged that.
I see some not w/w posts with town and an awkward exchange with Oa, but that's not relevant for this scenario.
It's weird how he actually posts sorta similiar to shock since day1with his preemptive claims. It's also odd how he completely stopped posting other than that and promising future posts that never come since he's resting on an early serp push (and as i said before his "not actually push"-on me was identical to the end of last game.
What was your role shock?
Not shock here, but possible roles he could have been were Golden Nymph, Psion, Dragonfly, Firefly Queen, Iridium Guardian, Ghost of the Past(!), Guardian Angel and Crusader. If we are to believe both kae and shock, the most likely role was GotP.
Potentially trying to cover for a partner?

Actually yh, its entirely possible that he pushed me in the first place because I wanted to murder both of his partners
Ofc the argument that coffee as anubis partner would have a watertight alibi stilll aplies as well.

I wanted to be fair and do both in one post, but this is taking too damn long.

Speaking of which: extension(1)kaempfer13

For now i convinced myself that it is shock again, but I'll work on that Oa post before a final verdict.

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 08:11:15 pm
Same assumptions as above, except I'll assume Oa scum:

shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (1) - TheonlyrealBeef
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks

shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13
No vig (2) - TheonlyrealBeef, Calindu
kaempfer13 (1) - serprex
Linkcat (1) - MasterWalks
serprex (1) - Coffeeditto
shockcannon(1) kaempfer13

no lynch(1)kaempfer13

no lynch(2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (1) - MasterWalks


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, Killdazombies, Naesala

no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (1) - Coffeeditto


no lynch (2) - kaempfer13, worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa

no lynch (1) - worldwideweb3
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (4) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13


no lynch (2) - worldwideweb3, shockcannon
worldwideweb3 (5) - MasterWalks, Linkcat, killsdazombies, Naesala, iancudorinmarian
MasterWalks (2) - Coffeeditto, PlayerOa
shockcannon (1) - kaempfer13

Not voting:

moehrpi
Naii_the_Baf
andretimpa
Calindu

iancudorinmarian (1) - kaempfer13
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

iancudorinmarian (2) - kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa

Not voting:

3. PlayerOa
4. Coffeeditto
5. MasterWalks
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
9. iancudorinmarian
13. moehrpi
14. Naii_the_Baf
16. Calindu
Naii_the_Baf (1) - PlayerOa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
killsdazombies (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (1) - Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, andretimpa
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, andretimpa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa


Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Extension (7) - andretimpa, PlayerOa, Coffeeditto,Naii_the_Baf, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala  people not caring for an extension (or absent before decision): shockcannon, calindu

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Naesala, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (1) - shockcannon

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (1) -andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) -andretimpa, kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Calindu
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
Coffeeditto (1) - kaempfer13
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (3) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13
Calindu (3) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (2) - shockcannon, Naesala

Naii_the_Baf (4) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies
Calindu (1) - andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf

Naii_the_Baf (5) - PlayerOa, Calindu, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, andretimpa
kaempfer13 (3) - shockcannon, Naesala, Naii_the_Baf
Not voting: Coffeeditto

Wagonomics discussion: Not much reason for scum to care for the n0 vig other than serp which already got rolling and stopping it would cast too much suspicion on them. Again d1 and 2 pretty useless. Honestly, if Calindu is scum I look much more suspicious than Oa, as he just parked on Naii, only his response to calindu requesting the switch to coffee was odd.

Postinvestigation:
coffee and i have a hate boner for eachother and I do see similiarities to his last game, I'm not sure how much of this is emotionally tainted though. Also I dont think there is a chance that would gain traction with how loudly he screamed for serps death.

shock ticks off all the boxes for me at the moment  uncooperative✓ could have roleblocked me✓ didnt take a stance on gn matter✓ not trying to help town✓ serp thought it a good idea to claim a result on him ✓

Next I was going to look were the other people that didnt address the issue, but thats you who suggested doing so in the first place and calindu who was forthcoming with his roleclaim, so i kinda townread that too.
I'm townreading Coffee at the moment, I'm not putting my vote on him as of now. shock is a different story, and while I know you two have... history, I have no real reason to scumread him yet. I'd rather kill him than Coffee though, but in a scenario where those two are the only other options I'm definitely sticking to MW.

..and as I'm hitting post, you're up there with another one huh

not feeling mw, w3 or Nae as previously stated. So next place to look would be the people who pretty much checked out after they supported the gnkill, way after it became a major topic. this would be ian, naii (technically nae, but she gives the lhf vibe) and moe iirc.
Nae and MW on the other hand are lynches I can get behind, but yeah I agree it's tough to draw any real juice out of them, especially Nae, for now. On w3 I agree, not feeling anything either direction. I just don't like how his wagon gained this much speed without any real content backing it. ian and Naii are ok targets, I guess. moe I see hasn't logged in in >48 hours, not sure what to make of that.
Naii_the_Baf (2) - PlayerOa, Naesala
Calindu (2) - Naii_the_Baf, killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (2) - kaempfer13, andretimpa

Just want to avoid any train running loose before Coffee shows up.
FYI we EU people can't stall all the way until deadline, I'd like to discuss and hopefully conclude voting within 3 hours if possible.

Naii is still my top choice for lynch, solely because he's in my view much more likely to have immaterialized timpa than anyone else around. I gotta admit, though, that I'm liking his posts more and more.

Calindu seems like a decent lynch for me as well, but we're not really learning much if we lynch him, are we? Just the good ol' chance of can-be-hiding-scum

Coffee is an interesting case - I understand I'm under suspicion of being w/w with him. If he rolls mafia, then good, only one more to go. Doesn't change the fact I'm not maf myself though, but if me dying is a result of hitting scum!Coffee then it's a no-brainer, really - I'd happily bow down as a consequence of the trade-off. And if he's town, then kaempfer's theory will be confirmed false, which at least is slightly better for town as I know it's not the path to how we're winning this game, since I already know it's not true. But to reiterate myself once again, I townread Coffee and I'd much rather board one of the other trains.

TLDR:
Lynch priority imo: Naii > Cal > Coffee
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Lynching Coffee is an interesting case because if he flips town, kaempfer's theory of Coffee/me as w/w can be debunked for good. If he flips mafia, though, I seem to be in a bad spot due to said theory - but I'd happily bow down as a consequence of hitting scum.
As I said before, bad reason to be enthusiastic about the possibility of a lynch; that said he never did vote him. At that point i interpreted as Oa knows coffee is town and wants to use it to clear himself. its also possible he was going for a mortons fork move, where even if coffee was lynched, people would think he'd never suggest that move if he was actually scumpartners with coffee,
@kae: Switch with me on Naii, I really don't believe you are mafia and I don't want to vote on you. It's unlikely I'll be able to be online before the deadline as well.
I'm also willing to switch on Coffee if Oa switches with me.
Mentioned before how I found this interaction odd.
oh nice oa
This post throws me for a loop tbh; i dont even know what it is supposed to mean, only recent post from oa was that w3 wagon was thin.
Honestly other than that and coffee being optimal anubis partner i got nothing here.

Yh, while Oa would have made the much smarter framing plan, i dont really have much else on him.
Back to suspecting shock+Coffee.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 08:23:40 pm
I'm gonna give 2 hours for shock to respond or an extension to go through, then I'll vote shock or use the extratime.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 07, 2020, 09:06:18 pm
I think were just gonna extend into oblivion if we extend now. If people were going to post they would have already

Put my vote on shock, baring a huge post im fine with this
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 07, 2020, 09:54:43 pm
kae seems more and more genuine to me now. Not comfortable on sheeping him yet, but shock/(Coffee/Cal) w/w seems at least like a sensible theory to me if nothing else. If I've understood this correctly, if a mafia!anubis targeted andretimpa it has to be either me or shock, from my point of view it's must be shock. Coffee is one I did townread a lot early, almost to the point of tunneling him as town, but kaempf theories + recent inactivity is making me a but leery. Nae has always been somewhat sus to me, but might just be me tunneling, idk. Just a gut I guess. kdz is like always town. Cal.. no idea. :-\

Anubis situation makes me lean towards shock for today's lynch, at least we're not policy lynching him this time lol. Seems like it's either scum!shock or town!anyone, where the first alternative is the by far most sensible one. But tbh I might be willing to accept trains on anybody but me, kaempfer or kdz at this point should a convincing statement show up.

Disagree with kdz statement on extending into oblivion. Thoughts from shock and Coffee are highly appreciated at this point

Extension (2) - kaempfer13, PlayerOa

Calindu (1) - Naesala
shockcannon (2) - killsdazombies, PlayerOa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 07, 2020, 10:25:40 pm
Fine, toss me on an extension as well

But I dont like it
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 07, 2020, 10:35:46 pm
Extension (3) - kaempfer13, PlayerOa, killsdazombies

Calindu (1) - Naesala
shockcannon (3) - killsdazombies, PlayerOa, kaempfer13

good night
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 07, 2020, 11:43:46 pm
24 HOUR EXTENSION of Day 4.

Timer is updated to show that Day 4 has concluded.

Extension (3) - kaempfer13, PlayerOa, killsdazombies
No Extension (0) -
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 08, 2020, 12:01:40 am
Extension (3) - kaempfer13, PlayerOa, killsdazombies

Calindu (1) - Naesala
shockcannon (3) - killsdazombies, PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Coffeeditto (1) - shockcannon



I had a big post ready but I found a flaw in one part and so I'll just summarize. But coffee has basically gotten off scotch free despite posting nothing, and especially in a game where the mafia made such a big deal to kill off the talkative players first. I hate to admit it, but kaempf may actually be town, and it's quite unfortunate that he still continues to tunnel me. I really don't have a way to confirm myself as not Anubis, if no one else had any night actions to check me, but I was one of the first ones to post about my night action for N1. I have also always been open to sharing night roles since every mafia ever, and I was the one who started the conversation about Anubis. I know it's not past me to start a witch hunt when the witch is me, but really?

Anyways, I'll vote Calindu if I have to, but like I said, I think it's less likely that it's him.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 10:03:53 am
So what was the flaw in that big post, seems like those things still apply?
Also what was that master plan that required people to think you're  scumreading me (just deja vu things)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 08, 2020, 04:30:56 pm
Well I wanted to bait some people into voting certain ways. But it hasn't worked because some people just haven't voted. Which in one sense, means my plan doesn't work because I didn't get the reaction I wanted, but as result I got a different reaction, in that there was no response. And no voting when we're just 1 lynch away from lynch or lose is pretty suspicious to me. It's as if the mafia don't care what happens here and since no one is pressuring them they have no reason to draw attention with a misplaced vote.

So I really really would like to put some pressure on Coffee and Calindu so they at least vote, even if its one me. If I die, then there'll be 2 mafia and 3 town at the start of the next day phase and you'll have to make some crazy guesses because we have 2 afk players that aren't getting any attention and aren't punished for not voting when it matters most.

So I guess i'll swap to Calindu, but I really think Coffee is more likely. However, I did say that Calindu would be my preferred target at lynch or lose, and if I get lynched then it's basically the same thing, so I suppose I can just vote him now. But I would really like some help pressuring them so they at least speak.

I don't want to be lynched for nothing. Let's at least get some information out of my death if it has to be me.


Calindu (2) - Naesala, shockcannon
shockcannon (3) - killsdazombies, PlayerOa, kaempfer13


Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 08, 2020, 06:46:36 pm
Ok I just had a revelation. So the votes last night were almost official.

If I'm mafia, then it should have been pretty easy to save me with only 3 votes for me, and Nae voting for Calindu. The only way where it's not possible is if Nae and I are both mafia, which I think is pretty impossible and I think everyone agrees with that. So either my teammate is kaempf, Oa, or kdz bussing me, or it's afk Coffee or Calindu. Either way, I find it pretty farfetched that the mafia would just let the lynch on me happen when not even half the remaining players think I'm mafia.

Which should be a MASSIVE signal to everyone that I'm likely NOT the mafia, and it's two others who had 0 reason to switch up the votes to save me. Having me lynched doesn't really narrow too much, and it keeps both the afk players alive as potential set up targets for the following day's lynch (assuming they're not both mafia).

Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Calindu on September 08, 2020, 07:28:54 pm
Calindu (2) - Naesala, shockcannon
shockcannon (3) - killsdazombies, PlayerOa, kaempfer13
Coffeeditto (1) - Calindu

I think it's more likely to be Coffee or Nae atm, and I think it's better to find the non-anubis mafia first, as then it's easier to find the last one.

I don't agree with shock's last post though, as your mafia partner and you voting on me would make it at best 3-2 (assuming you have been bussed). If I vote, then it becomes 3-3 and there would still be someone who didn't vote. If you die here because of Coffee voting (assuming Coffee/shock not w/w, because otherwise it's not that easy to save you), or Nae switching, and flip mafia, it kind of becomes evident who the last mafia is.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 08:37:40 pm
Uh shock, what happened to looking for Anubis? are you afraid of the necessary conclusion of when oa flips town?
I agree that a partner of either of you what be within Calindu and Coffee.
About ease of saving you it absolutely doesn't apply; 1. the extension was announced before you came active 2. if your partner is calindu there would be no point in that 3. if your partner is coffee I'm not sure he was even active 4. it would just tie the votes, leaving the decision to calindu and also exposing your partner
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 08:42:57 pm
even dumber unless you were bussed, at which point your partner would have explaining to do, calindu would have to choose between himself and you and I think he has basic common sense
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 08, 2020, 09:19:24 pm
Ok so I just realized Coffee is actually in real danger of getting modkilled (no posts N3, D4, N4). Lemme run some numbers real quick here

Key: Start of phase | no modkill (v/w) | modkill (v/w)
D4 | 5/2 | 5/2

if town gets lynched today
N4 | 4/2 | 4/2
D5 | 3/2 | 2/2
N5 | 3/1 or game over
D6 | 2/1

if scum gets lynched today
N4 | 5/1 | 5/1
D5 | 4/1 | 3/1
N5 | 3/1 | 3/1 (If we lynch town D5, ofc. If we lynch scum then it's gg at this point. No lynch at 3/1 is pretty much a given)
D6 | 2/1 | 2/1

These numbers tell me that - mathematically - Coffee might actually be the correct lynch (inb4 I'm bad at maths meme). If we lynch a town that is not Coffee, and Coffee stays inactive (which is not a first tbh), it's game over. If we lynch scum, however, a Coffee modkill is pretty much irrelevant as we'd want to no lynch at 3/1 unless someone gets a red GN peek. Then there's always the chance that Coffee is inactive scum, which is the edge case that in my view makes this strat viable. If we lynch Coffee now we're at least guaranteed not to lose due to a modkill, but then again, he can always show up and render all of this speculation useless :sillyspin: I realize I'm just rambling around now, but this might actually be something to consider

Thoughts, kae and kdz?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 08, 2020, 09:35:30 pm
Calindu (2) - Naesala, shockcannon
shockcannon (2) - killsdazombies, kaempfer13
Coffeeditto (2) - Calindu, PlayerOa

forgot to update my vote in between all the maths
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 09:36:48 pm
I do expect coffee to show up eventually, but i suppose i am down to lynch him as well.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 08, 2020, 10:15:31 pm
Yeah, I think coffee dies in 3ish hours due to modkill, since that'll be two day phases in a row of inactivity correct?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 10:24:25 pm
oh damn, he hasnt posted in 8 days, so he has been completely inactive for longer than i thought
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 10:27:41 pm
even so he still has the night phase left to come active
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 08, 2020, 10:46:51 pm
I don't think so, isn't the rule
"8. If you do not post for three consecutive phases, or for any 2 Day phases, you will be modkilled."
Isn't he gone at the end of this phase?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 08, 2020, 10:47:58 pm
Oh no, hes gone at the end of Night phase
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 10:50:24 pm
yh, its kind of the worst time for town!coffee to die, as we cant predict whether itll happen or not
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 08, 2020, 11:13:39 pm
Calindu (2) - Naesala, shockcannon
shockcannon (1) - killsdazombies
Coffeeditto (3) - Calindu, PlayerOa, kaempfer13
let's not take any chances while I go to sleep myself; I was already going to vote him anyways even without modkill maths
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 08, 2020, 11:31:36 pm
Put me on coffee then. For maths sake
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 09, 2020, 12:29:56 am
Calindu (1) -  shockcannon
Coffeeditto (5) - Calindu, PlayerOa, kaempfer13, kdz, Naesala

Frustrated that this was mandatory. Fingers crossed we get lucky and he flips scum.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 09, 2020, 01:56:39 am
Day 4 has come to a close - please remember to get manager pre-approval for any overhead hours prior to submitting timesheets. Your time is valuable - when you're efficient, the company is efficient. Be efficient.

Please hold until further notice...
And refrain from posting until the "Start of Night #" post, forthcoming


Final vote count:
Calindu (1) - shockcannon
Coffeeditto (5) - Calindu, PlayerOa, kaempfer13, killsdazombies, Naesala
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 09, 2020, 02:35:01 am
NIGHT 4

Coffeeditto was lynched. He was an Elemental and a Fate Egg. [Dragonfly]

NIGHT 4 has concluded.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 09, 2020, 02:36:27 am
Start of Night 4, remember to inform your immediate supervisor of all planned night activities. Department daily manpower projections are due to your immediate supervisor by close-of-business.

The Officer of Employee Well-being would like to take this opportunity to remind you that the common area refrigerator will be cleaned out Friday afternoon. Please label all items you wish to keep - unlabeled and/or expired items will be discarded without further notice. Also, keep in mind consuming undercooked meat poses a health risk and foodborne illness events are a top-15 leading cause of missed work days. Your health is our health!

3. PlayerOa
6. Naesala
8. shockcannon
10. kaempfer13
11. killsdazombies
16. Calindu

You may resume posting!!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 09, 2020, 07:28:35 am
Aw, man! I guess its calindu+shock then, but perhaps i need to reevaluate.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 09, 2020, 04:04:47 pm
Aw, man! I guess its calindu+shock then, but perhaps i need to reevaluate.
Could shock+Nae be a sensible team as well? Otherwise I agree with you
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 09, 2020, 09:00:09 pm
I suppose I cannot safely exclude any team that doesnt contain kdz or myself. I still townread Nae though.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 01:00:02 am
Night 4 has concluded - hold please while the bits and bytes are compiled, analyzed, and tabulated. The results will be posted soon(TM)...

Please refrain from posting until further notice...
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 01:10:50 am
Naesala was nightkilled. She was an Elemental and a Fate Egg [Vulture] and also a Mind Flayer and Otyugh.

Calindu was devoured by shockcannon. He was an Elemental and a Ghost of the Past and Golden Nymph.



GAME OVER.
The False Gods have achieved parity with the Elementals and have won the 75th Elements mafia game!!

Congratulations to serprex, shockcannon, and PlayerOa who successfully avoided detection to stay alive long enough to win! Better luck next time, town.

3. PlayerOa - FALSE GOD
8. shockcannon - FALSE GOD
10. kaempfer13 - Elemental
11. killsdazombies - Elemental



You may now post!!... about the game, all players and anyone now allowed to post in the thread.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 01:12:35 am
Citing 4th quarter earning dip, I have been handed my pink slip by the 75th Elements Mafia Board of Managers. I am now a work-a-day peon the same as the rest.

:)

Good game all! I enjoyed hosting and hopefully all had a fun time in the game.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on September 11, 2020, 02:01:59 am
Exactly as planned

For real tho, I had decided I'd check shock N0 if I rolled GN beforehand. So either I keep hush on roll or I instead try to see how well I can play as if I were town. If I hadn't died N0 I'd've bussed shock D1. So Oa needed to use Anubis on shock to protect him from my peek. Also considered Oa targetting me to block vig, then I can't be checked so we enter the most drawn out WIFOM while people wonder why I'm not NK. In the end Oa holstered

Curious how many vigs holstered, could we get a role log? MW wasn't going to holster his oty roll. Y'all not no lynching D1 was pretty bad
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Submachine on September 11, 2020, 02:44:48 am
In

Am I late?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 02:45:57 am
The Deadpad is here:
Deadpad for Mafia 75 (https://pad.riseup.net/p/Mafia75DomainOfTheDeceased)


And here is the Gdoc spreadsheet I used to try my best to track the MYRIAD of actions, interactions, and events of the game:
Mafia 75 Host Worksheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DEOEdpIlysJ_c0RlmTymRxfPDXyUQgj0my-t2jRcGc0/edit?usp=sharing)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: shockcannon on September 11, 2020, 03:27:51 am
 8-)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 11, 2020, 03:43:01 am
Link's 4d chess move didn't work.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 11, 2020, 03:52:07 am
Bleh
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 11, 2020, 03:52:41 am
2 Townies getting mod killed really didn't do us any favors.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 04:05:57 am
2 Townies getting mod killed really didn't do us any favors.
*1 (moe, who I hear had hard drive issues...?)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: killsdazombies on September 11, 2020, 04:08:55 am
Well coffee was to be modkilled at the end of night
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on September 11, 2020, 04:13:25 am
GG!
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Naesala on September 11, 2020, 05:01:25 am
Well coffee was to be modkilled at the end of night
Yeah, I count coffee as being modkilled. Worse, he was modkilled and we had to spend our phase voting on him, not that voting for a different target necessarily would have been mafia.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: PlayerOa on September 11, 2020, 05:44:36 am
Hah, it worked! This was pretty fun, ngl.

Lmao, so it was Linkcat... Because we never immaterialized andretimpa :sillyspin: almost cost us shock, but luckily we could use Coffee’s potential modkill in our favour.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on September 11, 2020, 07:51:38 am
I hate all of you.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: rob77dp on September 11, 2020, 12:12:47 pm
And now access to the Mafia chat pad too! (Thanks to shock/Oa/serp for letting us see inside the secret lair of the winning team.)
Mafia 75 Mafia pad (https://pad.riseup.net/p/mafia75galaxybrains)

The Deadpad is here:
Deadpad for Mafia 75 (https://pad.riseup.net/p/Mafia75DomainOfTheDeceased)


And here is the Gdoc spreadsheet I used to try my best to track the MYRIAD of actions, interactions, and events of the game:
Mafia 75 Host Worksheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DEOEdpIlysJ_c0RlmTymRxfPDXyUQgj0my-t2jRcGc0/edit?usp=sharing)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 11, 2020, 01:19:34 pm
Some lessons for town:

I did understand Link's reasoning, but he had to nearly draw it for me :sillyspin:. Basically, since I was likely GN there's no stopping the NK (no need for Anubis), but immaterial still protects from blocking, psion and vig.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: andretimpa on September 11, 2020, 01:20:21 pm
Also, gotta remember that town actually needs to play to win.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: DoubleCapitals on September 11, 2020, 04:49:27 pm
... we'll never hear the end of this.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 11, 2020, 05:11:44 pm
I maintain that using Anubis under any circumstances is scummy. Even if the target cant be saved from the nk anyway, inability to verify their alignement is just too big a drawback. In order for it to ever be actually worth using you need a guarantee that noone will attempt to use gn on them or it needs some kind of buff such as doesnt prevent gn or protects from the next nk.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 11, 2020, 05:16:07 pm
And with how inactive town was it was pretty much the only lead since you didnt breadcrumb
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on September 11, 2020, 05:32:12 pm
Town was inactive cause u lunched me
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 11, 2020, 05:56:54 pm
Nvm that scum using anything but psion on potential sader!gn instead of just the nk is silly, so you're only protecting from psion and dumb town
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on September 11, 2020, 06:10:10 pm
Imagine wasting a GN check on timpa
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on September 11, 2020, 08:13:34 pm
Checking a GN is worthless, they'll be NK'd no matter what. There's no downside.

Had Oa pegged from N2, but put Nae over shock. Turns out he plays mafia pretty much the same as town, so that's good to know.

Best player poll is up. Feedback on this setup is also appreciated.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 11, 2020, 09:34:18 pm
Actually in many setups it is worth checking gn, we're just so used to it being guaranteed town (which it isnt here). also, you are assuming everyone understood timpa was gn and thus wouldnt feel the need to investigate before hand, in which case he wouldnt survive since that would extend to mafiamembers. Also regular info roles may not be important but other than psion are more protown than not.
And shock did play different, it took him a while to figure out that not being as irratating as usual actually gave him away and then he abandoned the rolehunt for no reason, also I think he was even more ignorant of reason than before. Only 2 things stopping me from continously scumreading him were that he seemed at odds with anubis and that oa was also sorta scummy ... go figure.
Admittedly, i started pushing shock initially just because I needed a good target for oty when there was no info yet, but then he was also more subdued than usaul like he was facing a situation he wasnt used too.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 11, 2020, 09:42:18 pm
So the message i received n0 was actually intended for me, just contained information I wasnt supposed to have? Also imagine how different the game would have been if the rand picked me
(or I didnt give into pear pressure and just nommed shock lol)
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on September 11, 2020, 10:11:23 pm
Let's say I didn't target andre and someone checked him this game. No matter what happens, he still gets killed on N3. What would have been gained? Nothing. Andre being immaterial forces checks on other people, all of which would have been useful other than MW and kdz.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 12, 2020, 10:13:39 am
You are assuming that immortality automatically redirects checks, when it really prevents them; perhaps if you had claimed your target what you said would apply, but you didnt.
Even if everything you said applied, in order for it to accomplish anything at all, the mafia must have been fooled, which (statistically) means villagers have been fooled, at which point your ability use is completely inexplicable to them and a witch hunt inevitable the moment someones ability fails (because roleblocking is even harder to justify then random vig).
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: kaempfer13 on September 12, 2020, 10:15:23 am
Heck, I almost got lynched for giving momentum, an undeniably usefull status, to timpa.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Submachine on September 12, 2020, 07:07:22 pm
I was not following too closely, so can someone summarize who are the top competitors for best player in this mafia?
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: MasterWalks on September 12, 2020, 07:28:19 pm
I was not following too closely, so can someone summarize who are the top competitors for best player in this mafia?

Shock and Oa stayed relatively scum read free.

Kae played well and was kinda town leader late game but got caught up on an already-dead anubis and became narrow minded.

Linkcat made some plays that are over my head as far as long term thinking. Might wanna read the pages after the game ended to catch up on that part.

Ian, Cal, Naii, Moe were all pretty inactive. Coffee to but only in the late game.

torb and serp pretty much died too early to vote them as good players.

nae and kdz layed low but chimmed in enough and played average town.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: Linkcat on September 12, 2020, 08:02:56 pm
I was not following too closely, so can someone summarize who are the top competitors for best player in this mafia?

Don't vote unless you read the whole thing.
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: serprex on September 12, 2020, 10:16:39 pm
I was not following too closely, so can someone summarize who are the top competitors for best player in this mafia?

Don't vote unless you read the whole thing.

Or just use your 3 votes on the 3 players who won

Linkcat's a fair vote too. He was the best player for scum team
Title: Re: Elements Mafia 75 - by rob77dp
Post by: worldwideweb3 on September 13, 2020, 02:15:31 am
I was not following too closely, so can someone summarize who are the top competitors for best player in this mafia?

worldwideweb3 had a great game. So great that MW didn’t even mention him in his post
blarg: Elbirn,Linkcat,Coffeeditto,killsdazombies,TheonlyrealBeef,PlayerOa,MasterWalks,Naesala,worldwideweb3,shockcannon,iancudorinmarian,kaempfer13,serprex,moehrpi,Naii_the_Baf,andretimpa,Calindu,moehpri