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Offline rob77dp

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260951#msg1260951
« Reply #1908 on: March 21, 2017, 12:58:41 AM »
I find it hard to believe that town!Coffee doesn't get some push one of the last couple days by Criminals... He has been scumread and voted to mid-range lynch-territory more than once but never was lynched. Combining this with the Luna/Coffee stuff (which I find hard to believe that a Criminal!Luna did the take-a-town-down-with-her fancy-play move some have posited) I have a growing scumread of Coffee.

I want to read some alternative takes on why Criminals would let Luna eat a lynch if town!Coffee is sitting there scumread by active players AND is the BG. It just doesn't make sense to me _unless_ Coffee is Criminal.
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Offline Solaris

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260952#msg1260952
« Reply #1909 on: March 21, 2017, 01:23:53 AM »
crim coffee is the only world that makes sense to me now, the "aw fuck" seemed way too hard of an emotional appeal that wasn't necessary to try and give towny vibes because he knew he was under scrutiny from a few.

Offline JonathanCrazyJ

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260953#msg1260953
« Reply #1910 on: March 21, 2017, 01:27:21 AM »
Yeah, I am starting to feel fairly confident UTA is intel given his wanting a mass roleclaim. Also, his plan of keeping coffee alive regardless of alignment is kind of genius, because it keep HIM alive, but doesn't necessarily stop the mafia's endgame, as they know who NOT to attack.

Lynching coffee next day sounds good to me.
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Offline Solaris

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260954#msg1260954
« Reply #1911 on: March 21, 2017, 01:31:20 AM »
killsdazombies (2) - robdp77, Solaris
Submachine (1) - mathman101
DoubleCapitals (4) - UTAlan, JonathanCrazyJ, killsdazombies, Coffeeditto

In the interest of preservation of KDZ. Still think a Sub lynch is a better idea.

in that world, this post is interesting to me, especially since KDZ hardclaims Doctor beforehand.

Now, you may be thinking "But Solaris! Doctor save townies! Doctor good!"

Doctor isn't faction locked. A doctor that controls the nightkill can afford to "protect" targets who won't get hit by the NK (YMMV on things like Hitman, they exist but honestly aren't the most threatening thing if town is holding them and using properly), and get town vibes for it... without actually helping town, aside from the Hitman addendum.

I'm pretty sure the Coffee/KDZ criminal world is the world we live in. And these are the hands we're given.

Offline Solaris

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260955#msg1260955
« Reply #1912 on: March 21, 2017, 01:32:56 AM »
To add to my earlier argument actually, it would be unwise for a maf to cling to their partner and constantly call them innocent. An argument against this could be, "Why did you scumread Lu then?" Because she was scummy.
WIFOM here doesn't help anything, tell it like it is, don't go for the "it would be unwise for a maf to cling to their partner and constantly call them innocent."

Offline rob77dp

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260956#msg1260956
« Reply #1913 on: March 21, 2017, 01:47:18 AM »
When was the last time Coffee pushed an original scumread of his?

When was the last time kdz pushed an original scumread of his?
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Offline Solaris

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260957#msg1260957
« Reply #1914 on: March 21, 2017, 01:51:23 AM »
When was the last time Coffee pushed an original scumread of his?

When was the last time kdz pushed an original scumread of his?
can check, don't ask this question to me because I believe I've scumread everyone in this game at least once

Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260958#msg1260958
« Reply #1915 on: March 21, 2017, 02:31:27 AM »
When was the last time Coffee pushed an original scumread of his?

When was the last time kdz pushed an original scumread of his?

You'd have to go back a dozen or so mafias for that, because it happens rarely, if ever.

Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260959#msg1260959
« Reply #1916 on: March 21, 2017, 02:33:54 AM »
I dont push my scum reads, unless im positive they are scum. And this is why

I declare rob 100% mafia, lets kill him. The mafia sees this, and they kill me during the night. the next day they make sure to mention, "lets look back at who KDZ suspected!" someone picks up the scum read on rob, and calls for robs head because of it. Shouting out information I haven't confirmed is asking to A, be nightkilled and B, have a lynch pushed on someone that I'm not sure is mafia.

Offline rob77dp

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260960#msg1260960
« Reply #1917 on: March 21, 2017, 02:36:41 AM »
I dont push my scum reads, unless im positive they are scum. And this is why

I declare rob 100% mafia, lets kill him. The mafia sees this, and they kill me during the night. the next day they make sure to mention, "lets look back at who KDZ suspected!" someone picks up the scum read on rob, and calls for robs head because of it. Shouting out information I haven't confirmed is asking to A, be nightkilled and B, have a lynch pushed on someone that I'm not sure is mafia.
Dude, seriously, you can push a scumread without it being "100%". You can even lynch a player you are not sure is scum but do suspect is scum. That is a fundamental aspect of playing this game as town - reading people and solving by pushing on those you read/feel/think are scummy.

Is this really your stance - that you only want to push people you are 100% sure are scum? That is a very very very rare situation indeed so I'm curious how it is you expect to vote on and lynch scum?
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Offline killsdazombies

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260961#msg1260961
« Reply #1918 on: March 21, 2017, 02:42:50 AM »
I might be misunderstanding you, I take "pushing a scum read" to mean making a scum read on someone, and voting on them with certainty. I'll make votes where I find logic and scummy behavior, but starting my own votetrain is a rarity often unfound with me.

I interpreted your statement as the most extreme kind of scumreading, which for me, is found mostly with proof or solid logic, if you just mean "Have a read and mention it" then yeah, I do that a bit (especially this mafia, since i dont really /enjoy/ being perpetually afk) but you wont find certainty in my statements.

So basically, if a player seems scummy, and another player starts a train on them with decent logic, often a restatement of things I have seen or thought, I'll toss my vote with it; but for me to START the train, I either need to have logic I can't find many, if it all a fault in, solid proof (IE if I was cop) or a vote in self defense (though the last is one i am weary of)

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Re: Elements Mafia 68 - by Kuroaitou http://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64236.msg1260962#msg1260962
« Reply #1919 on: March 21, 2017, 02:45:37 AM »
Starting a train, or making a read with certainty is a sure fire way to get night killed, and have your actions manipulated post-death, which is why I avoid it constantly, in all games, regardless of what side I'm on. You can go back to the last 20 mafias, and you wont find me starting a train unless I'm a cop, Im voting in self defense, I have an almost unreasonable amount of proof, or occasionally, as mafia (though, I don't recall doing it, as mafia seems vaguely familiar, so I wont discount it without looking back)

 

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