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Offline AkrilothTopic starter

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- https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264108#msg1264108
« on: May 16, 2017, 09:08:01 am »
This has been removed by the author.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2020, 11:33:26 am by Akriloth »

Offline dragtom

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264119#msg1264119
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2017, 02:11:35 pm »
For the sane people.
Spoiler for Hidden:
                                                                       
:fire :life Hello People! This is a new deck that I recently made, It's a Fire/Life deck and I am looking for advice to improve it. Also this deck is NOT the most new player friendly.
Hover over cards for details, click for permalink
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5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c7 5c7 5c7 5c7 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c9 5c9 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f3 5f3 5f3 5f3 5f3 5f3 5f5 5fb 5fb 5fb 5fc 5fc 5fc 5fc 5fc 7di 7di 7di 8po

Something different about this deck and other duo-decks is that usually in duo-decks you have a primary element, which is your team's main offensive pivot, and then a secondary element to support the deck to make a single strategy work out however, even though this deck has a primary (Fire) and a secondary (Life) element, you are going to be playing both of these elements separately and simultaneously. What that means is that even though you will have both the elements (Fire & Life) in the same deck you are going to be using two separate strategies simultaneously for each colour. Keep in mind, though, that this does not mean that there is no support in this deck, you will still have 'Heal' cards for support but that is it.

As for the two strategies that you are going to be playing:

-First with the Fire element, is quite simple, it's of course purely offensive. Your main cards are going to be the 'Fire Spirits' and the 'Phoenixes'. The reason I chose these two monsters instead of 'Dragons' to be the main offensive strength of the deck is for their abilities. The 'Fire Spirit' has unlimited potential and the extra +2/+0 can become a problem for your opponent very quickly and for such an ability a cost of 2 Fire quanta ( 2 for calling the monster and 1 additional each turn for getting +2/+0) is quite low and as for the 'Phoenix' It is cheaper to call then the 'Dragons' and unlike 'Dragons' have a really nice ability for reviving them after they are destroyed and the ability cost is very low as well.

-Now for the second strategy. It's the infamous Mitosis/Adrenaline/Scorpion strategy. You are going to be calling out 'Forest Scorpions' and using 'Mitosis' on the first one you call, from there you can keep creating more 'Scorpions' and using 'Adrenaline' on them (Be sure,though, not to use 'Adrenaline' on the same 'Scorpion' that you used 'Mitosis' on). The 'Poison' from these 'Scorpions' will stack up very quickly and before long not even shields will be able to save your foe. Other than that the 'Forest Scorpion' is very cheap (3 Life quanta) and there is no cost for the ability.

These are the two strategies that are going to be used Simultaneously. There are 'Heals' for support in the deck as well.

The reason for making this deck was to try and make a deck which is, both, good for early game and end game.
This deck is also useful against the decks which can destroy low 'HP' monsters instantly, in such a case 'Poison' will be useful and also great against decks with alot of shields, in which case the 'Scorpions' will not attack and there will be no 'Poison' damage, so the aggressive Fire approach will be useful here.

Please give me advice on how I can improve this deck to make it better, Tips+Criticism will be very helpful.
I apologise for the long text and thank you in advance.
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Offline Aves

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264122#msg1264122
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2017, 03:01:48 pm »
Welcome to the community!

This thread might work better in the deck help section.

Unfortunately, any advice I'd be able to give would kind of go against the founding principle behind the deck. The reason that you mostly see 30 card decks around (not all, but they're the clear majority) is for the sake of efficiency. The more options you have, the greater the versatility you try to put in a deck, the less well it does at each of the things you tried to put in. 12 dragons and 36 pillars will almost certainly have an inferior win rate to 6 dragons and 18 pillars. This is because the more cards there are in a deck, the less likely it is that you're going to draw the "main idea" or "win condition" of your deck. This is made even worse when you have two different elements, as there's an increased chance of you not drawing enough of the right quanta to power the cards you have. To paraphrase the classic Scaredgirl, simpler = better.



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Offline elephants

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264142#msg1264142
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2017, 01:09:38 am »
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5bs 5bs 5c2 5c2 5c7 5c7 5c8 5c8 5c9 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5de 5f3 5f3 5f5 5fb 5fc 5fc 5fu 5fu 5fu 5fu 7di 8po


heres a 30 card version of the deck with pendulums instead of pillars and additional shards of bravery. It works pretty well.

Offline Mr Muffin

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264146#msg1264146
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2017, 02:21:20 am »
Quote from: Akriloth
-First with the Fire element, is quite simple, it's of course purely offensive.

If this is true (it's not due to the rage potions in there) then fire isn't need at all as life deals damage very well by itself. The strategy I see in this deck other than raw damage is poison and stalling with heals and rage potions. To improve upon this strategy (I'll talk about other possible strategies later) the deck should be smaller and simpler as Aves said. With fire being reduced to rage potions only means that lightning could do a better job so something else needs to come from fire for it to be useful. Deflagration fits this role because forest scorpion based decks are weak to many shields and deflagration takes care of most of them. The rage potions and deflagrations can be powered off mark of fire and a few life pendulums depending on how many deflagrations and rage potions are in the deck. 6 heals is overkill in my opinion so -1 or 2 and put in a druidic staff if you have it. Make the deck 30 cards or as close to 30 as you can. All these cards may be hard to fit in a 30 card deck. The exact build is up to you to perfect but here's a suggestion.
Spoiler for deck:
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5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c5 5c7 5c7 5c7 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c9 5c9 5c9 5f6 5f6 5fb 5fb 5fb 8po
Yes it's over 30 cards because these are a lot of different cards in the deck so the strategy isn't great. Here's a life fire strategie that should be better.

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5bt 5fb


These are obviously just the key cards you can build the rest of the deck.

Emerald dragon- Resilient damage that can get a bonus from rage potion.
Rage potion- CC and bonus damage when it's a good idea to use it on your dragons.

Other card choices are optional (deflagration is good). Another way to go is just life rush with deflagrations splashed in. I prefer mono life rush over this though.

I hope this was somewhat helpful.

Offline CactusKing

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264147#msg1264147
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2017, 06:07:15 am »
You've made a sixty card duo deck, one that special because it has absolutely no synergy between the two chosen elements. 60 cards is only recommended for very long stalls, with deckout being a common primary win condition. Using the maximum amount of cards does not make your deck better, it makes it less reliable.
People play more than one element for one of two reasons;
1. The second element has a useful combo with the other, or
2. The second element provides something important that the other lacks.
In this deck, there are no viable combos between fire and life (which was apparently on purpose?). The only thing fire provides here that life can't is creature control in the form of three rage pots and a fire shield. Chances are you won't even draw those in time to save you with such a large deck and no draw power.

Do you have any performance stats on this deck?
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Offline CactusKing

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264151#msg1264151
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2017, 07:52:04 am »
I mean win:loss ratio, against whatever ai you use this for.
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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264152#msg1264152
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2017, 07:56:38 am »
Honestly, the best bet is to get a whole lot of Shards of Gratitude. Cuz while Life as an element can be played without any means of regeneration, it's not as efficient without SoGs, Bonds or even Staves. After that you can just chuck in a bunch of Phoenixes, Adrenalines, maybe even some Fire Spectres on the way and you should be good to go.

Honestly, who plays 60 card decks that doesn't include any efficient stalling?
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Offline CactusKing

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264187#msg1264187
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2017, 10:30:23 am »
I mean win:loss ratio, against whatever ai you use this for.

The Win:Loss ratio is around 5.4 (360 wins:66 losses) AI2 and Bronze Tournament
AI2 is a joke, both in difficulty and in reward, and most of the decks in bronze have one hp, so such a big deck is just going to slow you down.
Good job with recording of stats though, I would usually only go for 100 games, but more games = higher accuracy
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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264275#msg1264275
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2017, 02:44:22 pm »
Hi :)

So I think you should try different variations of the deck with just 30 cards. I tried literally just halving everything and came up with this:
Spoiler for Hidden:
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5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5c2 5c2 5c2 5c7 5c7 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c9 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f3 5f3 5f3 5f5 5fb 5fc 5fc 5fc 7di 8po

I mean, that's literally exactly the same deck just half the size, so your % chances of drawing each card are more or less the same. Seems kinda pointless, but if you start playing variants of the deck you'll see how it makes a difference. Like, I just removed 3 of the 6 scorpions; but suppose you STILL wanted 6 copies even in the 30-card version, you'd have a double chance of drawing them.

Personally, I think you should use more of fire's spells to support the life creatures, rather than the other way round. Fire is top-rate at removing enemy creatures, and Deflagration is your only way to get rid of pesky weapons and shields (you absolutely must have at least one!).

I went for a stall-tactic rather than offensive:
Spoiler for Hidden:
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5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5c8 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f0 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f4 5f6 5f6 5fb 5fb 5fb 8po

Poison them slowly, blow up every scary creature they have, then finish them off with firebolt damage.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 03:14:35 pm by UndeadSpider1990 »
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Offline FlameandFury

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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264291#msg1264291
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2017, 01:45:09 am »
Here's my shot at making a life/fire rush deck :)

 
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5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bs 5bu 5bu 5bu 5bu 5bu 5bu 5c0 5c0 5c0 5c0 5c0 5c0 5fu 7ee 8po


Like what people have said, you should limit your deck size to 30 cards for a rush deck. This one utilizes 2 Shards of Bravery for extra draw power splashed onto a normal life rush. It's quite good at farming AI3 and arena.



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Re: The Purgatory Garden (Fire/Life Deck) https://elementscommunity.org/forum/index.php?topic=64583.msg1264292#msg1264292
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2017, 01:50:02 am »
@FlameandFury I would use another bravery or two in place of some pillars
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